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431 Comments
- inactive, on 06/24/2008, -14/+143So, the Republicans have had control for a decade. How's it going?
- evil-doer, on 06/25/2008, -3/+80yet they want to start a war with iran, which would be 100 times the ***** that iraq is.
- eastwood24, on 06/24/2008, -16/+89Greenspan has been saying this same 50/50 recession probability line all year. Inflation is the worst kind of tax. When will people learn that fiat currency (not backed by a tangible good) is not sustainible.
- relic180, on 06/24/2008, -6/+74Is the Digg headline for this article... I don't know... a little too much?
Sure Bush is a piece of ***** and he's helped his corporate buddies at every turn to ***** consumers/taxpayers over... but the article is about the sub-prime market's negative impact on the economy that could result in a recession. It doesn't even mention anybodies name except Greenspan's. - chriswastaken, on 10/27/2009, -4/+68Oh it's going alright. . . My father's oil businesses are going well. His brother's factory is doing very well. (they build tanks) . . . .
It's been great for us.
/end sh*tty truth - TheCarDude, on 06/24/2008, -4/+55"When tha sh*t goes down ya better be ready"
- coldkodiak, on 06/25/2008, -6/+53Its only sustainable so long as everyone trusts each other and people run legit buisness.
Gold isn't really worth anything either remember... it has no more practical value than dollar bills, it just has a measure of trust that is universally accepted.
If there's no food, you can't eat your gold, and gold won't build you a home if noone is around to do it for you that will take your gold.
An economy that holds itself to the gold standard isn't practical for the pace of the global economy, not to mention gold is a limited resource... a bottleneck that will someday dry up, and then you'll have nothing to back your currency against. - inactive, on 06/24/2008, -15/+52blogging as a career is recession-proof :)
- VgRasta, on 06/25/2008, -5/+38I have a hard time pronouncing words with asterisks.
- sockpuppets, on 06/25/2008, -8/+38visit mine at http://www.clownpenis.fart
- ileftfark, on 06/25/2008, -1/+291. Too little too late.
2. If Greenspan had this kind of "foresight" years ago, we wouldn't be in the kind of situation we're in now (economies tend to trend and he was pumping the housing bubble like no other). - shinelikeitdoes, on 06/25/2008, -3/+29i assume its like when people spell "skate" with sk8.
i guess that word is "shasteriskt" - PabloMac, on 06/25/2008, -2/+26And the ads, too.
- inactive, on 06/25/2008, -0/+23What are the odds that you'll die?
- flavioribeiro, on 06/25/2008, -5/+28Greenspan used to be a decent economist back in the 50's and 60's. He defended the gold standard and observed that housing can't appreciate indefinitely without a gimmick. Then he became the Fed chairman and gradually threw these beliefs out the window.
Greenspan saying the US is in the "brink of recession" is about as trustworthy as Bush claiming that the economy is "fundamentally sound". - Wargalas, on 06/25/2008, -22/+45And Democrats have had control over the Senate for a year and a half, promising to end the war in Iraq, end the "culture of corruption", lower taxes, cure cancer, and all sorts of other lies during their 2006 campaign. How's that going?
- Denneval, on 06/25/2008, -5/+28***** you, Katherine Harris.
- inactive, on 06/25/2008, -6/+29Funny, I didn't see the word Bush once in the article.
Shouldn't we have waited until the Huffed version of this story came out? - 55mph, on 06/25/2008, -0/+23Greenspan orchestrated the housing bubble in this country and he knows it. He's a lying sack of ***** when he says the data doesn't support sticking him with the blame.
Prices rose globally to reflect Inflation.
Our bubble was credit inspired and Greenspan was at the center of the storm. It was his job to monitor his member banks. Now he says he's not to blame? *****!!
The first time he saw "NO INCOME VERIFICATION" Loans in 2002, he should have put on the brakes. He went public at that time celebrating the American dream, a home for every family, knowing full well that the variable rate products were going to bite many of us in the azz. - StripeyMagee, on 06/25/2008, -4/+27You don't see many 'W' stickers on suv bumpers anymore.
Burn baby burn! - inactive, on 06/24/2008, -8/+30Right now old Bush is just praying for the rapture to take him before the people can have a swing at him.
- chicoer2001, on 06/24/2008, -9/+30Soon Bush will try and scare us with terrorism scares.
- synack, on 06/25/2008, -1/+21When I was your age, gas only cost $5 a gallon!
- ajb2015, on 06/25/2008, -1/+20but when you do, you really have to wonder...
- Betrayal, on 06/25/2008, -1/+20Greenspan ***** smartass better shut up. He was responsible in contributing to where we are now.
- ElTomacco, on 06/25/2008, -2/+20Agreed. Buried for misleading title.
- wafla, on 06/25/2008, -2/+19Dems need a filibuster-proof majority, which they don't have. The Republicans are filibustering EVERY piece of legislation. They are filibustering 4x more than the Democrats did, when the Republicans were warning about the "nuclear option" 2 years ago. There is NOTHING getting through.
Mississippi Republican Trent Lott invented this strategy: "Lock down the congress with filibustering, and then next election run on a do-nothing congress."
Forewarned is forearmed. - Denneval, on 06/25/2008, -3/+20A drunken coke-head mistakenly became the leader of the free world – twice – while I watch my home close in escrow for 49¢.
Thnx Bush admin. BFF - Seldon2639, on 06/25/2008, -2/+19You are completely correct. Also, not for nothing, but a gold standard only works if everyone else plays by the same rules. Much of the banking crisis which preceded the Great Depression was Hoover's attempt to maintain the gold standard while most foreign currencies began to float. Most of the huge economic gains made in the last 50 years were done *after* Nixon took us off of Bretton Woods.
Gold is entirely a "fiat currency" as well. All currency is based on the assumption that I can take this currency (be it a dollar, pound, franc, or even solid hold-it-in-my-hand gold) in exchange for something I provide, and trade it to someone else for what I need. It's why beads could be used as currency if we all accepted a standard value.
Everything is only worth what people are willing to pay for it. If we tie the dollar to gold, the value of gold (which has no inherent value aside from what we ascribe to it) will fluctuate just as much.
In point of fact, since the American economy (or any economy, for that matter) *does* have an inherent value to it (we do create goods and services, after all), it's safer to tie currency to the economy itself, rather than a commodity.
If you're gonna quote straight from the Ron Paul website, at least do some background research. Don't just spout off that a "fiat" currency is unsustainable without research into whether a backed currency has done any better. - MelvinSchlubman, on 06/25/2008, -5/+22Yes, the Dems have been do-nothing cowards. You may disagree, but I consider that to be at least not as bad as the neocons who've been responsible for most of the damage.
- com2, on 06/25/2008, -3/+20Until the advertisers stop paying for the adds because they cant afford them.
- jeexbit, on 06/25/2008, -3/+19This is nothing, just wait. Oh, and the economy has been completely broken (and *****) for a long time, it is simply getting to the point where is is not possible to hide it anymore. I pity the next president who has to try to clean up this mess - I'm not entirely sure it is even possible at this point, at least not in the short term (10-20 years?)
- joeanon, on 06/25/2008, -7/+22Not it's not you idiot. Businesses are always hit hard by recessions.
Only certain sectors are safe. Such as entertainment because more people sit at home unable to travel or buy things.
Just go look at how the great depression affected businesses.
Advertising goes down quick in a recession because it's only half proven to work in the first place.
This will be a world wide recession if energy keeps going up if it's not already.
The idiots/wealthy are just buffered from the effect at first, and then the down keeps falling, energy keeps going up, food with it and businesses have to restaff with local because traveling is too expensive, insurance is too expensive and people are in general demoralized and unwilling to make investments.
The rich will horde their money and the poor will starve, resort to crime and minimalize their needs.
It's ALL bad for most businesses. However, yet some will prosper, but only certain sectors, not companies of a certain size, that's ridiculous.
You'd be surprised how fast a businesses goes under when their clients drop of suddenly and unexpectedly.
You're position you thought was so secure is just GONE like that.
You're house you though was so valuable... is worthless because it's no built to modern green standards.
You're car you so proud of, just costs too much to drive. It makes a nice specialty item, but the resale value will plummet.
I kind of hope McCain wins just so American's can remember what bad times really are.
If you think it ends there... wait until the poor just start taking what they want, burning businesses and rich homes and the rest of the world turns to total ***** as food and water become scarce.
If you compound the possibilities of and dead end energy policy with the potentials of climate change. This could be a downward spiral which has no end in sight.
As it stands.. there is no end. Oil productive is permanently in decline. We cannot achieve the productivity of years past without cheap energy. The world is set for recession unless we pull a new energy model out of our asses.
You don't think so... watch and learn. The model is simple. OIL is the only portable energy we had... it's running out.
ALL business depends on transport and energy.
It's that simple... cost a rising and there is no solution in sight.
This is just the beginning folks. Until we find a real leader with real energy policies... we are *****. Oil is the heart of modern society from fuel to plastics to cosmetics.
Most of you are looking at trends and stats... not just using logic and common sense to realize this model is not sustainable and that means long term woe for the human race.
This NOTHING like we've ever faced before.
Moving money around just isn't a real job. Buying goods from China and calling yourself a businessmen just isn't a real job.
We need people who actually want to work and produce things, people who have fresh ideas not just circular profit models.
We need leaders with economic and scientific expertise.
Wait until people see their homes devaluing because of rising utility costs and no end in sight. They are going to ***** themselves, as most of their 'nest egg' is probably in their home's value and the stock market. Both of which are in rather significant decline.
It's going to be the same everywhere. On top of that climate change might bring disasters unrecorded yet by mankind along with new baceteria and viruses.
Who cares WHY the climate is changing... it is and that means looming disaster. - coldkodiak, on 06/25/2008, -2/+17Anti-Depressants on the rise.
- sockpuppets, on 06/25/2008, -5/+19http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boobies
- flavioribeiro, on 06/25/2008, -0/+14Are you trying to be sarcastic?
Americans better have something more substantial than hope. - peticsu, on 06/25/2008, -0/+14Bush didnt get the majority of the electoral vote in 2000 *****...
- altgeeky1, on 06/25/2008, -0/+13A veto-proof majority requires 2/3rds of Congress.
Do the Democrats have 2/3rds?
(/me looks for the calculator... realizes it isn't needed, and so shouldn't you).
When the Democrats control 66 Senate seats, THEN you can crow. Until then,
You've just been busted in an absolutely black and white lie. You're hurting America. Please stop. - joeanon, on 06/25/2008, -2/+15Currency can be backed by anything really, but it might be safer to have stuck with the gold standard.
Keep in mind though, someday we might make gold like we do diamond and THEN WHAT.
Basing your currency on a commodity sounds good until you realize that commodities can decline in value also.
Instead of all that BS... how about we just have responsible government that is held accountable for it's corruption and criminal activities.
Problem solved.. You may not know it, but we've had oil substitutes since the 70s.
It doesn't really matter if the currency is based on gold or pocket lint. It will still decline when you put 10 trillion in debt against it and you're offering no return on that investment.
Foreign investors see that and consider the US a risk and POOF the currency declines regardless of being backed because your debt is still leaning on the currency.
If you just TAXED instead of BORROWING this would probably not have happened.
If we stopped being China's bitch... it would also help.
If we stopped throwing emergency rate cuts out.. it would help.
Much of the housing crisis happened because of the emergency rate cuts RIGHT on the natural decline of the housing market. We artifically extended new home construction beyond what the market could bare and housing is a huge investment so the inflation you cause is enormous. - Risingashes, on 06/25/2008, -1/+14Economics: Money under the current system is valued at a speculative rate. It's value changes depending on how much speculators believe it to be worth compared to other currencies.
When countries run trade surpluses (they give out more than they take in) that country ends up with foreign currency. If they run trade surpluses continually this leads to a large foreign stockpile of money. Eventually this pile of money becomes so large that they cannot trade a reasonable amount of this stockpile without greatly devaluing this currency. This has happened for Japan, China, and a few other Asian nations.
Under the current system the government can print money which it can use to pump in to the economy. When someone spends money that wouldn't otherwise be spent it circles through the economy- what this means is that instead of $5 just being worth $5, that $5 is spent somewhere and that somewhere gives a fraction to it's workers and a fraction to it's suppliers etc and those proportions are spent- and then distributed and then spent.
The amount of times that amount cycles in a short time is called the multiplier effect and this can cause an injection to save an economy from an extended depression as this multiplier also works in reverse (as people worry about the economy they begin to hoard money- each dollar they don't spend takes fives times that from the economy making the situation worse and making people less confident which will make them hoard more money).
Under the gold standard you make every currency worth a set amount. This means that currencies can never appriaciate or depreciate in value- something that simply isn't feasible in today's economy.
The gold standard worked because countries traded on equal terms, silk for fur- rugs for beads. The gold standard in action today would do two things- make those who won gold incredibly rich and then destroy the economy of every nation of Earth.
Anyone who supports the gold standard does so because it sounds like a good idea and the majority of people don't have the economic understanding to know why it's a horrible idea. Anyone who speaks against it is labeled as 'in the pocket' of the people who want to enslave the world etc etc.
The problem here isn't 'the gold standard'- the problem is that the US government and the US federal reserve have grossly mismanaged their economic roles. Don't blame a system that is working perfectly for every other country in the world just because you are run by incompetent and corrupt bureaucrats and politicians. - Hangly, on 06/25/2008, -3/+15The ADD's got distracted and forgot.
- dexter411, on 06/25/2008, -9/+21No... they had control from 1994 - 2004. It was going well up to that point, actually.
- chieffan, on 06/25/2008, -0/+11Can't Greenspan just go away. He never admits his recommendations for rate cuts led to these stupid builder incentives and drove up housing prices.
- MildApplause, on 06/25/2008, -9/+20He should be impeached. Even though it's the end of the term, we need to set a message that if you make poor decisions, even if you're The President, you will be held responsible for them, and there will be a legal consequence.
- JohnSteel, on 06/25/2008, -4/+15The gold standard isn't pratical anymore. There just isn't enough gold to go around. The US has a population of over 300,000,000. You need a LOT of gold to supply everybody with enough gold that they have an ammount lerge enough to trade everyday items with. If you can't supply the gold to everybody who demands it then your gold backed money is worthless. A recession can easily turn into a depression or worse when the banks can't supply people with the gold they will demand.
- biotch, on 06/25/2008, -0/+10To be fair... The Dems have been filibustered by the republicans on a vote for an Iraq withdrawal.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2007-07-17 ... - psychokila, on 06/25/2008, -0/+9WOOOSH!
hey i think something just went over your head - coldkodiak, on 06/25/2008, -3/+12have a slight obsession?
http://digg.com/users/ExplosivesWTC - coldkodiak, on 06/25/2008, -0/+9Guess the question is, what tangible good do you back your currency against?
- flavioribeiro, on 06/25/2008, -5/+13"An economy that holds itself to the gold standard isn't practical for the pace of the global economy, not to mention gold is a limited resource... a bottleneck that will someday dry up, and then you'll have nothing to back your currency against."
That doesn't make any sense. "practical for the pace of the global economy"? You'd be trading electronic gold certificates, so the pace wouldn't be any different.
As long as you don't destroy the gold, it won't dry up either.
As you said, the problem with fiat money is that people don't play by the rules. By far the biggest cheater is the government, which cheats by creating more money -- an act which would be called counterfeiting if done by anybody else. -
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