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Israel must end siege of Gaza before 'total collapse'

dailystar.com.lb — The Palestinians have the right of access to food, fuel and medicine. The inhumane action by the Israelis would make the living conditions of the Palestinian people even more unbearable

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  • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -47/+88It is important to remember that the Israeli administration only relieved the blockade for 1 day. The international protest needs to be continual until the matter is resolved.
    • mikelieman, on 01/24/2008, -9/+23Doesn't it seem like the best, easiest solution is to just give Gaza back to Egypt and let them deal with the headaches?
      • PatNolan, on 01/24/2008, -16/+18Why, so the Arabs can attack them again? Lest we forget the bulk of Palestine was swallowed up by the Arab neighbors not the Israelis.
        • mmmmmbiscuits, on 01/24/2008, -6/+21We forget a lot. The sovereignty of almost EVERY country in the region (Iraq, Israel, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq) dates to colonial mandates from the 1920's/30's/40's. How often do you hear these ignorant digg Jew-haters whining about what a mistake it was to create Jordan?
      • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -14/+14Who's is it to give?
        • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -14/+12Shh you are slowly getting to the root cause of problems. Better stop it before they really get angry.

          • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -10/+19@Waiting:
            Notice how Mikelieman said "give Gaza _back_ to Egypt". Operative word: _back_. It was Egypt's until 1967. They were offered it back and refused it. Yes...slowly we get to the root of the problem.
          • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -14/+7@Foopirata

            I wasn't even referring directly to the Israeli thing - much more generic statement about cause and effect. Not surprised it was missed. Especially by the usual suspect and their lemmings.
          • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -8/+16Riiiiiight.....of course you were being philosophical, querying the general state of man and universe while pondering on the secrets of causality. It just _happened_ to be in the context of a discussion on a totally different subject. Gee, how could we miss that. Me and my lemmings are amazed, we declare, amazed at your profound grasp of humanity and its ways of thinking. We are humbled by your teachings, and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.
            On other news, your explanation sucks. Try another.
          • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -11/+2@Foo

            once again you show your class, or lack therein.

            It does have a lot to do with this issue in so much as everything is cause and effect and when you start to ask what caused such and such - you start to see who the real terrorists are(They are on both sides - and are using the citizens' fear and distrust of the other side to further their own goals - that isn't philosophical - that is what is happening everywhere in the world - it is just seeming;y a racial thing when it is shown of Israel - strange huh?)

            But it wasn't meant to be "directly referred to" - if only I had written that - ohh wait...

            You sir are a hate filled fool, with very little redeeming quality. Both in your approach, and your willingness to see both sides. That makes you so much more a like what you claim to hate. Sad - but hatred does tend to warp people.

            Have a nice day.
          • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -1/+10"You sir are a hate filled fool, with very little redeeming quality" - coming from you...a compliment. I really don't want to be counted among those you seem to admire and support.
            Bad company.
      • Iconoclast25, on 01/24/2008, -4/+24Mike, Israel *TRIED* to give Gaza back to Egypt after the 1967 war and Egypt DID NOT WANT IT. These nutjobs are simply too rabidly crazy for anyone to assimilate and Sadat was too smart to subject his nation to them. I bet Mubarak is equally astute.
        • andydumi, on 01/24/2008, -0/+7Israel tried this morning to say Gaza is now Egypt's problem and responsibility, and Egypt all of a sudden starts enforcing the border somewhat...
          Its not anyone's to give, and Egypt most definitely does not want it if it was.
      • geekee, on 01/24/2008, -0/+6Yes, Egypt doesn't want it
        http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080124/ap_on_re_mi_ea ...
        "This is a wrong assumption," Hossam Zaki, the official spokesman for Egypt's Foreign Ministry, said of Israeli hints that it was thinking of giving up administration of Gaza, including supplying electricity, now that the Palestinian territory's southern border with Egypt is open.
    • Tangaroa, on 01/24/2008, -17/+33> The international protest needs to be continual until the matter is resolved.

      1. Stop the rocket attacks.
      2. Israel restores aid to previous levels.
      3. Matter resolved.

      The international protests should be against the terrorist attacks that drew Israel to restrict the border and enact trade sanctions. Protesting Israel's response while ignoring the attacks that brought on the response sends the message that it is fully acceptable to launch terrorist attacks because "we hate the Jews and want to kill them all", to paraphrase Hamas's raison d'etre.
      • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -22/+12There are terrorists on both sides, with 1.5 million Gazans and a fair few Israelis stuck in the middle.
        • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -11/+13Slogans, slogans, slogans.
          • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -11/+5Like divide and conquer?

            or is that a motto?
          • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -6/+9It is actually both a policy and a strategy. And the relevance of that comment is....what?
            Albionshores is good at giving slogans. Not at proposing viable solutions.
            You are a great apologist. But not a very good debater.
            See how that works?
        • geekee, on 01/24/2008, -1/+13Israel doesn't intentionally target civilians. Hamas does. Israelis are NOT terrorists. In fact, Hamas hides among civilians, making it more likely that civilians are accidentally killed.

          Your rhetoric is empty and meaningless.
      • Daedalus81, on 01/24/2008, -7/+4When Israel places sanctions on them it INCREASES support for Hamas. I know you'd like to think they have all the information they need to make an educated decision, but they don't. When things like this happen Hamas gets to paint the picture.
        • str3ama, on 01/24/2008, -2/+3self-fulfilling prophecy/cycle..
          Israel:They're attacking us.
          Palestine: Well they're attacking us.
          Israel: We're attacking because you're attacking.
          Palestine: We're attacking you're attacking.
          {repeat ad-nauseum until UN intervention or Israel takes over what's left of Gaza}
    • principle, on 01/24/2008, -5/+22Exactly why any government should support a militant organization bent on destroying it?
    • jacen6678, on 01/24/2008, -1/+7Where are all of the Palestinian peoples' Arab "brothers" now? The oil rich Sheiks? The fat corporates building islands for luxury vacations? Money like that could buy alot of airdropped supplies. Perhaps the rich Arabs benefit from the conflict and don't care about the Palestinians...
      • Albionshores, on 01/25/2008, -4/+1Because if they started dropping supplies militant zionists would cry that everybody was ganging up on Israel again and empowering Hamas and play into that little PR trap and the other thing is they shouldn't have to and they don't need to because all the aid is already on hand it is just not being allowed in by the Israeli administration and so they instead go through international channels such as the EU and the UN (which they have) and then publicly announce their support through the media (which they have) & THE THIRD THING IS THAT ISRAEL HAS CLAIMED PALESTINIAN AIRSPACE AND IT WOULD MORE THAN LIKELY NOT GET CLEARANCE, BE SEEN AS A THREAT, AND ESCALATE TENSION IF NOT LEAD TO WAR!
        • foopirata, on 01/25/2008, -0/+4
          Sheesh, you don't need to shout. We hear your lies when they're not in caps as well.

          Your first point: "that little PR trap". Israel has in the past facilitated the transfer of Arab-originated help for the Palestinians. Google is your friend. And nothing says "that little PR trap" like staging an nonexistent crisis, and that Hamas knows oh so well, it is known by all now.
          Your second point: " the aid is already on hand it is just not being allowed in by the Israeli administration" - twice in as many weeks explosives and bomb-making material have been found among the "international aid", labeled as flour and sugar. That doesn't seem to bother you.
          Your third point: "Israel has claimed Palestinian airspace". Israel has not claimed anything. There is an embargo in place, and during embargos, your airspace is closed. Flights from Jordan get cleared over Israel all the time. Flights from Lebanon have enjoyed the same courtesy at times.
          Ah, the bliss of ignorance and sloganism, eh, Albi-baby?
  • mutiger, on 01/24/2008, -60/+68I really wish the media would stand up to criticize Israeli terrorist attacks of Palestinian (and Lebanese and other) civilians; i also wish they'd publish some of the textbook propaganda taught in Israeli schools...
    • Zecchetti, on 01/24/2008, -37/+37There are too many high ranking Zionists in our "free" media machine
      • flogistan, on 01/24/2008, -18/+20Yes, I think being a stand up guy in this situation is called getting fired.
      • Tangaroa, on 01/24/2008, -18/+14> There are too many high ranking Zionists in our "free" media machine

        The Jews control the media? That old Nazi slur? Disgusting, and with +10 diggs.
        • pintomp3, on 01/24/2008, -9/+11not all zionists are jews and not all jews are zionists. there are many christian zionists. check out CUFI.
          • SuperMoses, on 01/24/2008, -1/+2@chouch: His point was that not all Jews are Zionists. I thought that was pretty evident.
        • SuperMoses, on 01/24/2008, -5/+4Dugg down for confusing Jews with Zionism. It's even racist to think all Jews are Zionists
      • rizzo2008, on 01/24/2008, -8/+1Heil Hitler!
        • Carburetor, on 01/24/2008, -1/+4Even if you're a troll, a real person wrote these words.
          People like you are the main reason this world looks like crap.
          • rizzo2008, on 01/24/2008, -3/+1I was making a satirical comment about the "Jews control everything" paranoia
          • SuperMoses, on 01/25/2008, -0/+2@rizzo2008: He said zionists, not Jews. Zionists are people with a political agenda. It is no different than saying "there are too many high ranking neo-cons in our free media machine"
    • Vodka2389, on 01/24/2008, -11/+39How do you know what's being taught in Israeli schools? Or did you just pull that out of your ass? I lived in Israel for 9 years and there isn't any "textbook propaganda" in schools. In fact, nobody is more critical of Israel than the Israeli media.
      • Tangaroa, on 01/24/2008, -15/+25He is just being a tool. Here are the backstory facts behind this comment:

        * The Palestine Liberation Organization (known commonly in the West as "the Palestinians") is a terrorist organization formed in the 1960s for the purpose of taking over Israel, kicking out the Jews, and establishing an Arab state to be called "Palestine" in Israel's place. They are known for intentionally targeting and killing Israeli civilians as a means of gaining fame and recognition.
        * Lebanon is home to Hezbollah, a group which shares the PLO's tactics and agenda regarding Israel.
        * Jordanian and later PLO textbooks were chock full of racist tripe about Jews and were designed to indoctrinate Arab children into a race war against Israel to finish off what was started in 1948.

        All three of these facts are held by Israel as reasons why Israel is morally superior to its enemies. Israel does not murder civilians and does not have race-hatred indoctrination in its textbooks. The parent poster is using a turnabout type of propaganda: take those things that Israel condemns its enemies for, and accuse Israel of the same (whether true or not, in this case not). Hence the decrial of nonexistant "terrorist attacks of Palestinian (and Lebanese and other) civilians" and "textbook propaganda taught in Israeli schools". The poster is carrying water for racist, genocidal terrorist movements that want to kill all the Jews.

        (Extra credit: Take note of how often Israel is accused of being "racist" or "genocidal". Now compare this to how often actual racist and genocial organizations, with racism and calls to genocide in their speeches and writings, are accused of being "racist" or "genocidal". Draw a conclusion. Do not cite said speeches and writings as your ultimate primary source.)

        That little two line post also implements just about every propaganda technique in the ThinkQuest list of propaganda techniques:
        http://library.thinkquest.org/C0111500/proptech.ht ...

        * Assertion of fact whether true or not, in this case not.
        * Selective ommission of crimes against Israel.
        * Glittering generalities, although an antonym to "glittering" might be more appropriate in this case, in describing Israel's regular activities as "terrorist".
        * Lesser of two evils implied by the selective omission noted above.
        * Name calling - terrorist! terrorist! nyeah nyeah nyeah!
        * Pinpointing the enemy.
        * Simplification / Stereotyping.
        * and most importantly, Transfer of the crimes of Israel's enemies onto Israel.

        The poster is using propaganda techniques on behalf of Israel's terrorist enemies. It logically follows that the post is terrorist propaganda. Since said terrorist enemies have a stated agenda of wanting to wipe out the Jews, and the post warped the truth quite severely to support groups with an agenda of wiping out the Jews, it could be argued that the post is also anti-semitic, which might not be evident to someone not aware of the context in which it was written.

        That post, being terrorist propaganda and arguably anti-semitic, has +15 diggs as of this writing. Something is wrong with the Digg community.
        • ubuwalker31, on 01/24/2008, -1/+5Most cogent reply to blatant anti-semitic propaganda that I have read on digg in ages...good work!
        • sifuchar, on 01/24/2008, -1/+5Dugg for well-explained and supported truthiness
      • notque, on 01/24/2008, -16/+10That isn't true, i read the Israeli media. Further, there is textbook propaganda in Israel, just as there is here concerning the native Americans, and Columbus.
        • RonnyN, on 01/24/2008, -6/+11Maybe you can share it with the rest of us then.
        • Carburetor, on 01/24/2008, -1/+6I'd be glad to see this.
          Proof?
    • RonnyN, on 01/24/2008, -11/+28Actually, there is absolutely no propaganda taught in Israeli schools. The contrary is true.
      From a very young age, Israeli kids are taught to love their neighbors, and respect them.

      I'm sure the same happens in Palestinian schools. Oh wait...they are the ones we see at ages 9, 10, and 11 carrying rocket-propelled grenades in the streets of Gaza and the West Bank. I guess that's how you extend your hand in peace.

      One of the components making the emblem of the state of Israel is an olive branch-a known symbol of peace. It was there since the state was formed. It is in the nature of every Israeli to live and let live.

      I find it amusing that you're categorizing Israel as a terrorist state.
      How many Palestinian terror organizations do you (we) know of?
      Let's talk again when Israel is in that list.
      • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -14/+12RONNY - that is simply incorrect. Tell me you haven't seen the pics of the Israeli kids writing on the bombs that were to be dropped on Lebanon(I think it was them - Israel seems to bomb a lot of people don't they?). Sweet, beautiful kids absolutely being indoctrinated in the same hate as the other side does to their children. It is sad all the way around.

        But it is being done on both sides. Both sides are to be blamed and both sides have a responsibility to their citizens.
        • RonnyN, on 01/24/2008, -5/+13I did see the pictures. See my comment above. I know for a fact that they are manipulated.
          There's not a lot I can say while writing on DIGG, but suffice is to say that I have experience both in the Israeli educational system, and the military there...
          It's obviously your choice what you believe. I suggest you start by counting the number of Palestinian terror organizations.

          Oooh! I also have a site!
          http://www.mideastnewswire.com/archive/me_rights_a ...
          • str3ama, on 01/24/2008, -5/+2"Actually, there is absolutely no propaganda taught in Israeli schools."
            O RLY? Come on..that's a load of BS, every country instils at least a little bit of propaganda. Does the national anthem play at the beginning of the day in elementary/high schools? I bet it does if it's anything like over here..

            And while they may not teach them to hate, I'm sure the media and politicians do a good job of convincing them who's the "good guys" and whos' the "evil terrorists". Same goes for Palestine - same crap, different pile.(as the saying goes..no offence intended)
        • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -4/+4@Ronny - Then by all means lets see the evidence that they are faked. If they are, I would like to know.

          I am sorry if I can't simply state so and so is a terrorist. From my estimation that is a wholly simplistic metric. Oppressed people tend to fight back more than those people who are freer. Therefor it is not only logic, but expected, should a population be oppressed that they would have more militant sides to their society.

          Same was true with Ireland while they felt oppressed by the English. Same thing happens everywhere. Merely to say "Look how many terrorists they have" could just as easily be re-worded look how oppressed those people are. One is merely the effect of the other. Both ways.

          I'll await your evidence of the forgery on the pics. Specifically the one with the kids writing on the bombs. I doubt you'll have it, but I do hope I am wrong. Kids doing that is just sick. Those that are teaching them that are also sick - but those that, if true, try and defend it are the sickest of the bunch.
          • str3ama, on 01/24/2008, -1/+2well said.
          • sifuchar, on 01/24/2008, -1/+2NOT well said. The difference between a terrorist and an "oppressed people fighting back" is the targeting of civilians to instill terror (hence the name) rather than military targets to weaken the enemy's capabilities. Get it? Imagine you're feuding with your neighbor because he keeps mowing over your petunias, do you dismantle his lawn mower or kill his dog? One is effective at achieving your goals and nobody gets hurt, the other just makes you a dog-killer.
          • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -0/+1Sif - then explain what were the American revolutionaries? They too targeted civilians loyal to the British EMpire. Speak to me.

            The reality is, and always have been, one mans terrorists is another's freedom fighter. I am certainly not defending suicide bombers that will kill their target and a dozen other people - but I fail to see the difference between that and bombing a city for the terrorist hiding in one house.

            I am sure that also will be lost on those defending this - but truly no death is a good death. Regardless of Israeli or Palestinian. Muslim or Christian. Buddhist or Hindu. In a word - people.

            Yet, here we are - and all I asked for was evidence of what he claimed (doctored photo's)- and here we sit, sans evidence, with the defense of the indefensible continuing.

            The Jews were punished for a select few Jews that took advantage of the financial markets when Germany tanked. Sad to see those that claim the advantage of those that were so horribly treated for the actions of the few - do the exact same thing to another. Worse still, those that defend it.
          • RonnyN, on 01/25/2008, -0/+1@Waiting...
            I worked in the military intelligence "field".
            I remember seeing the pictures, and know that they are fake, but unfortunately have no way to prove it today.

            I'm quite an honest guy, but you obviously can't just trust what I say. It'll stay a mystery...
      • Zecchetti, on 01/24/2008, -14/+11@ RonnyN:

        Are these the Israeli kids that are taught to love and respect their neighbours?
        http://sabbah.biz/mt/archives/2006/07/17/photo-of- ...

        Lie much?
        • RonnyN, on 01/24/2008, -6/+14Do you have any other PALESTINIAN sites you care to share?
          Don't be unfair.
          I happen to know that the school system in Israel doesn't teach hatred of Muslims or Palestinians.

          The pictures are doctored, and I've seen them before. The picture of the dead children are from the Iraqi attack on the Curds in the 80s.
        • urik88, on 01/24/2008, -1/+10That's funny. I spent all my highschool years in Israel, and never learned to hate the Palestinians or did ANYTHING like that. In fact, in history class each time some ignorant kid said "***** arabs" or something like that, the teachers would correct him.
          I don't know from where you got those pics but I can assure that the educational system in ISR doesn't teach to hate Arabs.
    • Carburetor, on 01/24/2008, -2/+13That's amazing, the tactics some of you are using.
      I'm an Israeli, after 12 years of learning in Israeli school.
      All the books, including the history books, are wrote by left wingers, like our media.
      Don't forget there are more than 1 million Israeli Arabs, they wouldn't tolerate lies in their books.
      On the other hand, the palestines, are teaching their kids modified history, and using their propaganda, trying to convince people who know nothing about the conflict, to take their side because they're "poor and hungry".

      So what people like you are doing ? taking what the Palstines are doing, and saying the we're doing that kind of stuff.

      Just have a look on youtube, and see how our media is acting,
      They're totally left wingers, and on the last war, some of us actually saw the as unfriendly.

      Please don't spread these kind of stuff, you're lying to yourself and to others.
      I know that's digg and all, but you really pissed me off.
  • phnx0221, on 01/24/2008, -30/+33"The population finds itself hostage to this conflict and is suffering the most serious consequences," with hospitals under particular strain given the lack of supplies and electricity, Krimitsas said. "Many medicines are lacking and need to be restocked, otherwise hospitals will have to close."

    There is absolutely nothing that can justify the treatment of these people in such a way. Regardless of the actions of any government, it is entirely unreasonable, unjustified, and illegal, to punish innocent civilians in such a way that they can not have their basic needs met (groceries, electricity, sanitized water, and medical treatment). I would not with the same upon the Israeli people, regardless of how much I loathe the atrocities of terrorism their government has committed against the Palestinian people. International protests absolutely must continue, so that hopefully, the violence can end from both sides of the conflict, and the civilians can once again coexist in peace.
    • IADTatami, on 01/24/2008, -5/+1Collective punishment isn't only fundamentally unjust, it can also be counter productive. Take the Treaty of Versailles, for instance.

      The conditions created by this blockade will probably do nothing but further radicalize the Palestinian population. People generally respond to hardship by becoming extra tribal, extra violent and extra xenophobic.
    • kildorn, on 01/24/2008, -1/+4The reason that palestinians are unable to have their basic needs met is because they continue to tolerate groups like hammas. International protests will do nothing. The people living in palestine need to realize you cannot have it both ways, electing hammas to power and still expect Israel to continue to cooperate. This is in THEIR hands, not anyone else's.

      My first suggestion would be to start using aid money wisely, not using it to wage war.
    • sifuchar, on 01/24/2008, -2/+1Your argument is invalid because:
      1) Hamas was democratically elected and still enjoys popular support.
      2) Israel is simply closing it's border, not nuking Palestine or poisoning their water. If the Palestinians hate Israel so much that they JUST CAN'T STOP firing rockets into civilian areas, let them trade with Egypt instead. Why should Israel be forced to support or trade with those that seek to destroy it?
  • Kizilbash, on 01/24/2008, -11/+35Looks like the Palestinians helped themselves for now. It's the biggest jail break in history. The Egyptians have said they will not stop them until the humanitarian crisis is over. That will probably not be this century though...
    • malaak, on 01/24/2008, -6/+20There's something so sweet and right about that border wall coming down! I hope it stays down!
      • Iconoclast25, on 01/24/2008, -8/+10"I hope it stays down!"

        And I hope that for every rocket that hits Israel, ten precision munitions hit military / infrastructure targets in Gaza. If it becomes uninhabitable, it would be an appropriate end to this - let their 'arab brothers' feed them instead of just sending them explosives.
  • midoritsuru, on 01/24/2008, -13/+23Sadly, both sides are too stubborn and bitter to come to any resolution. This is a family feud in which the rest of the world will probably never be able to successfully intervene; they will fight down to the last man. Unfortunately for Palestinians, nearly all Israelis have military training.
    • ElAssoWipo, on 01/24/2008, -17/+24I don't agree with that.

      Yesterday we had the news that the Arab coalition offered a full pledge of peace in exchange for the retreat of Israel from occupied territory. Israel is never willing to compromise. Just occupying those territories constitutes a crime against humanity. They choose to pursue crimes against humanity. I mean if giving up a small peace of land could ensure that your citizens can live wihtout fear and in harmony with their neighbours, isn't it worth it? The arab coallition offers to police Palestine FOR Israel even. Israel wants nothing of it.

      Arabs in general want peace in Israel. Simply because they feel bad for Palestinians and want to end their miserable condition.

      The problem is always Israel. Israel doesn't recognize that there is a difference between Palestine and terrorist organizations and they act accordingly. Every peace accord ever made between the two was broken by Israel in retaliation to the actions of a handfull of individuals. Palestine doesn't bomb Israel. Victims of Israel bomb Israel. Peace accord or not, if you kill my brother, I will come after you.

      The problem is that personnal vendettas impedes the peace process.

      Palestine agrees to the accord, some dumbass that doesn't represent Palestine blows himself up, and it's back to square one.

      Also, if Israel could just respect the geneva convention, most of the violence would end. They have been denying these people their basic human rights as defined by various international treaties and UN resolutions since the 60's.

      Add that to the so-called pre-emptive strikes.

      Add that to the neverending influx of "settlers" who NEVER saw Israel in their lives anyway and justify themselves with racism and religious doctrine.

      There are three ways this can end: either America stops supporting Israel forcing it into reconciliation or, America decides to be ethical and or moral and imposes real sanctions against Israel, or as you said, if Israel completes its genocide of Palestinians.
      • PatNolan, on 01/24/2008, -24/+4The problem is Arabs and Islam. If you want peace you should exterminate them just like you do roaches.
        • malaak, on 01/24/2008, -2/+12holy *****, i had to read that twice to be sure you typed what i thought you did....
          i shouldn't be amazed - but i am
          shame on you
        • Zecchetti, on 01/24/2008, -5/+7I'm surprised racist people like you survive on digg. Look at who truly harbours the hatred...
        • ElAssoWipo, on 01/24/2008, -8/+5Ladies and gentlemen, the true voice of Israel.

          http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=define%3A+rac ...
        • hadees, on 01/25/2008, -0/+1ElAssoWipe, You have got to be ***** kidding me. I am Pro-Israel and I buried him and reported his comment as offensive. I would like to know which of antisemitic comments you did the same for.
      • Iconoclast25, on 01/24/2008, -10/+9Nice spin, ass wipe. Yeah, Israel should trust an organization in which several of the members have vowed to destroy their nation. /* sarcasm

        I don't blame Israel a bit for holding onto the areas in the north they won with such cost - e.g., the Golan Heights. Let the palestinians have Gaza and the West Bank if they stop attacking Israel. If they will not stop then, yes, enough already, hit 'em with everything ya got until they desist or are dead - no more compromises. Put Jerusalem under an international body of some kind without a dog in the fight - maybe jointly between India (Hindu), Burma (Buddhist) and Japan (Shinto).
        • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -4/+10Do you see the Palestinians as humans? With basic human rights?
          • Iconoclast25, on 01/24/2008, -10/+4(1) Human - technically.
            (2) Rights - forfeited by the second Intifada and the dance of joy broadcast on 9-11.
          • notque, on 01/24/2008, -4/+7@Iconoclast25

            Wow...
          • gerbil20, on 01/24/2008, -2/+7Their arab brethren certainly do not. They created them as a weapon to use against Israel.
            Kind of a stockpile of two-legged guided bombs. And they make it plainly obvious to anyone capable of understanding more than "hummous" and "tahine" in Arabic.

          • Iconoclast25, on 01/25/2008, -2/+1@ notque -
            ---------------------------
            Well, looky here - a fan of demented denny the space hobbit who quotes the rabid America-hating fraud Chomsky. It is easy enough to see why you are so in love with the ones who celebrated in the streets as the Twin Towers collapsed. "Wow" indeed - please FOAD.
          • ElAssoWipo, on 01/25/2008, -2/+2The true nature of Israel surfaces again.

            Talk to an israeli and contradict him until he gets angry, then you'll hear his real motivations. Every single time: racism. Not one of them as failed me in 30 years.
          • Iconoclast25, on 01/25/2008, -2/+1@ the ass wipe -
            ----------------------------
            Both gerbil and I are Americans - what Israeli are you addressing ? Typical leftard maggot, spinning everything, frantically throwing up random strawmen . . . but even with both hands and color-coded instructions too stupid to wipe his own ass. "It is easy enough to see why you are so in love with the ones who celebrated in the streets as the Twin Towers collapsed . . . - please FOAD." Do not stop at the DNC, do not collect your welffare check, just FOAD.
          • ElAssoWipo, on 01/25/2008, -2/+2I'm sorry, I don't speak redneck. Can anyone translate?
          • Iconoclast25, on 01/25/2008, -1/+1@ ass wipe -
            ----------------------
            Where you are a native speaker of yellow douchebag, that may be very hard, but start with phonics, progress to English and then try "Google" for the acronyms. HANDDA
          • ElAssoWipo, on 01/25/2008, -1/+1Couldn't make that out, sorry. Try english.
    • commernie, on 01/24/2008, -9/+4Family feud? WTF are you talking about? This is the main problem. People think this is "just another war". A conflict between two groups who want the same thing. It's not! The Israelis settled in Palestine and then proceeded to kick out the Palestinians (with the help of the UK and the US, of course) who had been living there for centuries.

      It's not much different then when the British arrived in America and wiped out the Native Americans. Was that a war between two nations? Were the Natives too stubborn? Would anyone call them terrorists when they fought back?
      • kahrytan, on 01/24/2008, -0/+5Dude, Family Fued. Abraham and Sarah ... They had two sons. Isaac and Ismael. Isreal is Isaac decedents and Ismael the Palestinians.

        Also, Israel's land belongs to them. Not the Palestinians. Jewish people have been conquered and forced out of their land for 1000s of years, It's time for them to take back what others stole from them. Palestinians settled on land that wasn't theirs in the first place.
        • kelly, on 01/24/2008, -1/+1I was going to say that same thing... though probably less eloquently. Thanks for your response to him.
    • azdek, on 01/24/2008, -1/+0The conflict stems from sibling rivalry. See Genesis 21:8-21.

      The Israelis Lived in Palestine for about 1500 years prior to the Palestinians. If you are going by who lived there first, or for a longer time, the Israelis have more right to the land than the Palestinians.
  • yellowcakewalk, on 01/24/2008, -35/+26Protests against the seige of Gaza in the US:
    http://www.answercoalition.org
    Protest at the Israeli Embassy in DC Friday
    • redmonkey, on 01/24/2008, -10/+19Are protesters going to protests to shooting rockets to civilian population also?
      • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -13/+6 a group of people from one country shooting home-made glorified bottle rockets into a country - and invading the country are two vastly different things. One is a criminal case - the other an act of war.

        • sharkd, on 01/24/2008, -4/+9You've obviously never seen a Qassam rocket, if you're going to characterize it as a "bottle rocket."

          I doubt you'd consider a 6 foot long ballistic rocket, carrying 20-40+ pounds of high explosive a "bottle rocket," particularly if it landed in what was formerly your home.
    • IKORKYI, on 01/24/2008, -1/+3yeah, i protest all acts of inhmanity not just the ones which support terrorists
  • typicalusername, on 01/24/2008, -25/+16Wait, how is this going to be accurate reporting from a Lebonese report? I'm all for saying the situation is *****. But we both KNOW that the Israeli and Arab reporting agencies always pump out *****. Why is this making Digg at all?
    • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -8/+16Because the article is reporting the international response by using direct quotes from international bodies which can be verified elsewhere.
  • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -20/+31FTA:

    "There is a major risk of a total collapse of all the infrastructure. The blockade measures have an enormous human cost and we have asked Israel to immediately lift all retaliatory measures. The population finds itself hostage to this conflict and is suffering the most serious consequences. Many medicines are lacking and need to be restocked, otherwise hospitals will have to close."
    - Dorothea Krimitsas, spokeswoman for the International Committee for the Red Cross (ICRC)

    “We are very concerned about the situation of children in Gaza ... children are always the victims in times of conflict,“The Palestinians have the right of access to food, fuel and medicine. The inhumane action by the Israelis would make the living conditions of the Palestinian people even more unbearable, [the blockade] has exacerbated the already worsening humanitarian crisis in the area and this will cause a humanitarian catastrophe."
    -UN children's agency, UNICEF. Executive Director Anne Veneman

    “The Palestinian territories are like an open-air prison, they are under siege from Israel. According to the latest news I received, the people of Gaza are now facing a humanitarian tragedy. It is not possible to accept a practice that amounts to punishing nearly 2 million innocent people on account of rocket attacks”
    - Turkish prime minister, Recep Tayyip Erdogan
    • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -9/+17Just to be thorough I accidentally meshed two quotes together...this is how they should read:

      “We are very concerned about the situation of children in Gaza ... children are always the victims in times of conflict"
      -UN children's agency, UNICEF. Executive Director Anne Veneman

      AND

      Prime Minister Abdullah Ahmad Badawi, who chairs the 57-member Organization of Islamic Conference: “The Palestinians have the right of access to food, fuel and medicine. The inhumane action by the Israelis would make the living conditions of the Palestinian people even more unbearable, [the blockade] has exacerbated the already worsening humanitarian crisis in the area and this will cause a humanitarian catastrophe."
    • Iconoclast25, on 01/24/2008, -9/+8The palestinians chose to be led by hamas, they allow the terrorists to hide in their midst and now they complain they are caught in the crossfire. Tuff ***** - no sympathy. Come back when you've cleaned your own house, achmed.
      • pintomp3, on 01/24/2008, -6/+7americans elected bush, do we all deserve to get bombed because of this administration? see the problem with collective punishment now?
        • geekee, on 01/24/2008, -4/+4Removing a dictator and replacing it with a democracy is not immoral, even if it was stupid and poorly executed.
        • Acolyte357, on 01/24/2008, -2/+2Currently no, But if we kept doing the same thing for 40 ***** years, I would say it's a good idea.
        • Iconoclast25, on 01/25/2008, -1/+1If we make the mistake of electing any of the dimocrap candidates currently running, we won't have to worry about the ethics of it, the terrorists will have free reign.
  • eclipse007, on 01/24/2008, -46/+32Gaza is the Auschwitz of our time, thanks to some radical Zionists, the nation of Israel became what they feared most.
    • davidkeithjones, on 01/24/2008, -19/+20Oh come now, thats not the case. Whats going on is tragic; however, it does not parallel the holocaust, its a separate beast.
    • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -15/+27Personally I'd argue it is more like Warsaw or some other Nazi Ghetto for Jews and Gypsies, but I agree with the sentiment.
    • SQLDigger, on 01/24/2008, -13/+27Except that the European Jews didn't launch rockets from the ghetto or turn their children into suicide bombers to attack the Nazis. The Nazis just rounded them up one day with no provocation. This is not a holocaust, it's a war (forget who started it, because both sides did) and the Palestinians have never admitted defeat (despite the consistent record of 0% in major conflicts w/Israel by them or their allies). Negotiation is going to be the only way to end this war and establish peace, and I don't think a cessation of hostilities and an acknowledgment of Israel's right to exist is too much to ask for.
      • lnf69, on 01/24/2008, -11/+8Actually, it was the ancestors of the Jews, the Israelites, who were the first at terrorist, suicide attacks. Please see the story of the original Zealots and Masada.
  • fadeout, on 01/24/2008, -40/+65They can get their fuel back when they stop using it to launch rockets at Israeli civilians.
    • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -28/+27Thus, you are attempting to justify a collective punishment of 1.5 million, throwing them into a humanitarian disaster, because of the actions of a few; a few empowered by an aggressive Israeli foreign policy.
      • Battleloser, on 01/24/2008, -15/+21THEY VOTED FATAH INTO POWER.
        • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -13/+8And? Didn't the Jewish people vote in the people that are ignore international treaties?

          How about not picking any side and just say both sides are idiots and costing their citizens in terms of money, life and liberty. But like here, their politicians just see them as the same sheep that our politicians see us as.

          There is an "us" Vs "them" - it is just we keep thinking it is between different cultures when in fact it is those that live by the motto "By any means necessary" against those that don't
        • StGhurka, on 01/24/2008, -2/+19Hamas - they voted Hamas into power, and voted Fatah out.

          But the point is the same. They voted for the most militant of the two and have no right to act surprised when the government they elected supports terrorist activities.

          They sewed the wind, they're reaping the whirlwind.
        • breckinshire, on 01/24/2008, -6/+4So, because Bush was voted into power, every American deserves what they got?
        • Barbosa, on 01/24/2008, -1/+3How could you get that so LOUD *AND* WRONG? I don't even know where to begin, you need to educate yourself.
      • PatNolan, on 01/24/2008, -14/+5There are no innocents. If they oppose their government they have an obligation to change it.
        • pintomp3, on 01/24/2008, -7/+10that's the same justification for killing american and israeli civilians. many people are opposed to the policies of the US and israeli governments, but according to your logic the punishment should be vetted onto the civilian population.
          • PatNolan, on 01/25/2008, -1/+1Actually I require you to think beyond slogan for a moment. You don't make war on governments; you make war on nations. If the US government is doing something reprehensible, it is incumbent on the citizens to stop it. If we fail to oppose those wrongs that we are complicit in committing those wrongs. And so it is with Palestine. The Palestinians are equally responsible for the crimes committed in their names. And yes, I believe that war must be waged against a nation as a whole: military and civilian. The only way to win a war is to break the opponents will and ability to fight.
      • RonnyN, on 01/24/2008, -9/+9Based on that logic, no people of no state should ever suffer for their government's policies.
        If Russia nukes us, we shouldn't retaliate. It was Putin who ordered a General, who ordered a Colonel, who ordered a Private, who pushed the button. Let's just punish these four.

        WTF is wrong with you?!
        • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -7/+7No at all - all of your examples are governments acting. What is happening is a select few are engaging in this - NOT the country.

          The other side is that Israel, the country, IS engaging on it.

          It would be the same that a few America went into Russia shot up the place and Russia Nuked the US for it. Stupid, silly and unjustifiable - yet here we are, listening to the justifications complete with calls of being anti-Semites

          But the guilt is wearing off, the injustice too hard to ignore and the name calling just is simply having less effect on more people. Jewish people are not the problem - the Israeli government is.

          • StGhurka, on 01/24/2008, -0/+10It is naive to assume that hamas is not complicit in the rocket attacks. At the very least they encourage it by doing nothing about it.

            Hamas is the biggest, baddest gang in Gaza, they know all the bad actors and if they wanted it to stop, it would stop.
          • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -3/+2 StGhurka

            Maybe - but do you have any evidence of it or is it your gut feeling? I happen to think they know about it, and I even think they will not do anything to stop it because it has only ever been the militant people that have defended the average people against, what they see as, Israeli aggression. However, that is purely a gut feeling. I have yet to see any evidence to support that claim.

            Just as we saw and were told by the Lebanese people for their support.

            At the end of the day what do you do? You are walking down the street and you see some poor, desolate person being pummeled by a huge, well fed, well armoured person. Even if the smaller, poor guy started it - you have an obligation to humanity to stop it. That is our obligation.

            After we stop the violence - By merely insisting that Israeli live up to its international obligations - then there is some chance of peace. And even then it will only last for as long as we can keep the poor sod from trying to attack the bigger guy again - and being treated fairly, under international laws would be a huge, HUGE step in that direction.
          • RonnyN, on 01/24/2008, -1/+6@Waiting2...
            We're not talking about a few people. We're talking about a policy set by and organization (Hamas) that is now in power.
            A lot of the suicide bombers were actually Hamas members (they still are).
        • ElAssoWipo, on 01/24/2008, -8/+7No my friend, a proper analogy would be, because a black man comitted a crime, all black people pay the price.

          Palestine doesn't attack Israel. Palestinian individuals attack Israel. When's the last time Israel arrested someone who blew himself up? But each time someone blows themselves up, they kill people. They punish them over and over while already being punished since 1967. Some of these people were born into punishment. And then even more people want to become suicide bombers.
          • RonnyN, on 01/24/2008, -2/+1How would you resolve the situation?
          • Barbosa, on 01/24/2008, -1/+21-force Israel to accept international law regarding the taking of land by force would be a start... 2- get the west (us) to be even handed in their treatment of the two sides (for the first time ever)... 3-get the us to stop supplying Israel with cluster bombs and other high-tech weapons... 4-hold both sides to the same standard when negotiating a final settlement and most importantly take into account the fact that the west is generally biased against Arabs in general and Palestinians in particular.
        • Iconoclast25, on 01/24/2008, -6/+2@ ass wipe -

          I agree, Israel should not attack palestinians when one of the vermin kills itself and however many Israelis with a C4 vest. Instead, they should identify the terrorist and kill all its immediate family. This way, the vermin will understand the cost of their stupidity.

      • smacksaw, on 01/24/2008, -4/+10I lived with a Palestinian family for years, and I tend to agree with their sentiment that their own people suffer because they are doing wrong. The rocket attacks could end tomorrow. If I saw my child starving, or unable to get help at a hospital, what would I do? I think I'd quit supporting actions that make the bully beat my ass. In fact I think I'd turn my anger towards people provoking said bully.

        A lot of the people who are suffering support the actions that lead to that suffering. That's the problem. Decent people should rise up and revolt against the people attacking Israel. But the same goes for Israel. Decent Jews should rise up and oust the people who support genocide against Palestinians because of a couple of rockets launched at homes that the Israeli gov't WRONGLY put there in the 1st place.

        The truth is that many of these people who are suffering support policies that provoke their suffering, just like Israel supports policies like giant walls that cause their suffering. There's a lot of stupidity going on and it's like half of populations of MILLIONS.
        • ElAssoWipo, on 01/24/2008, -8/+3"If I saw my child starving, or unable to get help at a hospital, what would I do?"

          What if the IDF shot your child, your brother and mother? What causes their suffering?

          http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4580139.stm
          • smacksaw, on 01/24/2008, -4/+3I wouldn't undermine myself by launching rockets at them.

            What if a black man mugged you? Would you go bomb a black church?

            Why is indiscriminate violence a suitable response for indiscriminate violence? Your logic makes no sense, which happens to be the logic of the reason. And that's why all of this killing and suffering happens: people are not thinking reasonably.

            IDF are not living in settlements next to the border.
          • ElAssoWipo, on 01/24/2008, -8/+3Logic? You're talking about human beings, not numbers. If you want to use logic, how about we look at the justification for the creation of Israel, the crimes of war, the crimes against humanity to get an index of savagery compared to an index of logical justification?

            When you're talking about human conflicts, logic is very dangerous and very inhumane thing. Logic would dictate that the best way to end this conflict would be for Israel to invade Palestine and kill all its citizens. The conflict would be over in a year.

            There is no logic behind these actions. There is only racism, religion, hatred and a history of oppression. If logic could be applied in this case, they would simply stop fighting, both sides would just stop.

            Human emotions aren't logical. You think there's anything logical in the principle of a martyr? In saying that jews that never saw Israel are more justified to live there than arabs who were born there? That buying pieces of land justifies the creation of segregationist government?

            This is about religion, hate and racism. There's no logic in this.
          • StarlessKnight, on 01/24/2008, -3/+2@ElAssoWipo: "Logic." You keep using that word...

            Logic is reason. It is a way of thinking and understanding a situation. If you scoff at logic, all you're left with is emotion. No rhyme, no reason, no pause to think about how best to resolve the situation. What you're advocating, by denying Logic's role in these affairs, is exactly the sort of reaction that you're advocating is inhumane, unjust, and senseless. Logic is exactly what is needed; Logic with heart (as untempered logic can become heartless and cruel--the "wipe out Palestine" reaction you fear, for instance).
    • SQLDigger, on 01/24/2008, -18/+27No, he's just saying that the Palestinian gov't need to stop attacking their neighbor and act like a real government if they want hostile actions by a neighboring state to stop. Israel is not responsible for the Palestinian people, the Palestinian leaders are. And their leaders have been doing a really lousy job of making peace with their neighbor. I would go so far to say that they haven't even tried.
      • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -17/+141.5 million Palestinians without medical supplies, a shortage of food and no electricity - even though the oil for it is already paid for by the EU and shipped from Egypt but because it 'must' go through Israel the 1.5 million go without because of a handful of people they have no control over.

        It is barbarism. One inhumane act does not justify another.
        • Skitzzo, on 01/24/2008, -15/+20You're right, Israel should just allow the Palestinians to do whatever the hell they want. I mean it's not like they are launching rockets or anything... Oh wait.
        • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -15/+10Skitzzo - Bottle rockets from a few, deserve punishment of the many? I agree that Israel can't just sit back - but it would take less resources just to defend against such feeble rockets, compared to Israeli's Military might - AND talk.

          What they have done is nothing short of a crime against humanity. I wish there was an easy solution, but there isn't. Someone has to give a bit and is it really that unreasonable to expect it to be the one that can defend itself?

          Wouldn't that be the mature thing to do?
        • Liam76, on 01/24/2008, -7/+15Do a little more research. Israel has offered medical supplies and emergency fuel for the hospitals throughout the blackade (hardly a seige). I posted more links below, but here http://www.maannews.net/en/index.php?opr=ShowDetai ... .

        • PatNolan, on 01/24/2008, -9/+7The correct solution is for Israel to respond to Palestinian aggression with a true war and level everything in their path. Break the Palestinians' will, break their back and they will stop. You cannot truly have peace until there is a victor in war. You can't have a victor until you have broken the enemy's will and ability to fight.
        • StarlessKnight, on 01/24/2008, -0/+1Why are people digging PatNolan down? I don't agree, but consider what PatNolan's said. It's the same "new" strategy for warfare that America advocated at the start of the Iraq war. Decimate the infrastructure of the civilian population and your enemy's army will have few able or willing to enlist, refilling the ranks, while they're too busy just trying to keep their families, or themselves, alive.
        • Barbosa, on 01/24/2008, -0/+1there's really no point in discussing this here, we are talking past each other. i am mad at myself for allowing myself to be drawn into, once again, "debating" people who are blind and hateful supporters of Israel. I've done this too many times and continue to see the same people, saying the same *****. Hopefully i will find enough self control to avoid this in the future. talking about anything about race and religious conflict (especially Israel/Palestine) here on digg is like talking to yourself.
    • VeryBoredNow, on 01/24/2008, -3/+5Wouldn't you think it would be kind of hard to form a real police / military force to keep the peace and the radicals from attacking without any money, food or supplies? I am sure if the Palestinian people would have access to money, food and basic supplies there would be a lot more less upset people and maybe enough support to build up a real police force to keep the peace?
    • digggggggggg, on 01/24/2008, -5/+9Oh, that's totally logical. Punish millions of people for the acts of a handful. Talk about burning down the barn to get rid of the rats.
  • mordochai, on 01/24/2008, -13/+33Hamas must end terrorism before full-scale Gaza operation.
    • Albionshores, on 01/25/2008, -2/+1GOOGLE IS YOUR FRIEND!

      http://tinyurl.com/yq72lq

      Hamas has offered a ceasefire in December 2007. Israel turned it down December 23rd 2007. The Guardian reported it on the 24th.


      :O
    • foopirata, on 01/25/2008, -0/+2Hamas offers "peace" with one side of the mouth and reneges it with the other. Google is your friend, check the meaning of "hudna".



      HAMAS CHARTER:

      Article Thirteen: Peaceful Solutions, [Peace] Initiatives and International Conferences

      [Peace] initiatives, the so-called peaceful solutions, and the international conferences to resolve the Palestinian problem, are all contrary to the beliefs of the Islamic Resistance Movement.
  • Skitzzo, on 01/24/2008, -32/+49Digg: where it's ok to be racist as long as it's against the Jews.
    • Battleloser, on 01/24/2008, -13/+22You new here? Digg is racist against everyone.
      • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -4/+6Thats different. Don't you know it is only the Jews that count... They are the chosen people after all....
    • phnx0221, on 01/24/2008, -16/+23When you brush aside valid arguments against war crimes and terrorism by saying it's racist, it does a complete disservice to the arguments at hand. I have nothing against Jewish people, yet I have everything against what the state of Israel has done against the Palestinian people. By calling this racist, or anti-semitic, you not only brush aside the arguments given, while not providing a counter of your own, but you also exacerbate a misunderstanding of what those words actually mean.
      • malaak, on 01/24/2008, -8/+16Spot on!
      • Tangaroa, on 01/24/2008, -13/+4> When you brush aside valid arguments against war crimes and terrorism by saying it's racist,

        Balls. When you call the peaceful alternatives to war "war crimes and terrorism" just because the people carrying out the policies are Jews, you are a racist. Border closures and sanctions are the peaceful alternatives to war in the face of the daily acts of war committed against Israel.
        • glasnostic, on 01/24/2008, -1/+3collective punishment = war crime
          settlement building = war crime

          look it up...
    • vermax, on 01/24/2008, -11/+19no, you're the racist by equating Israel with Jews, and you suck as much as those who equate the genetic history with an obligation to adhere to the religion. i have nothing against Jews (though i do despise anyone dull enough to adhere to a religion, regardless of race), but the way Israel is behaving i don't give a ***** for it at all. You jerks who keep doing that are why there ARE many people who do truly hate Jews. keep it up, you might have plenty more to whine and gnash about soon.
    • VeryBoredNow, on 01/24/2008, -8/+3It's OK as long as it's against the agressors
    • brainster31, on 01/24/2008, -6/+3We hate everyone evenly...except Bush
    • erkokite, on 01/24/2008, -7/+5Yeah, we don't approve of Israel's treatment of Palestine, so that of course makes us racist. Right.
      *****.
    • Nico_, on 01/24/2008, -6/+1Its not racist, its disagreeing with something a nation does. There are not only Jews in Israel.

      Why they ever made that country is beyond me. Why would anyone think its a good idea to move a bunch a people and put them in camps so that other people can live on some land their imaginary god said they own. Ignorant religion is ***** up the world.

      People please, some old man never ever built a boat and filled it with two of every single animal in the world, it just didn't happen! And no man ever rode on a horse with wings up to the heavens and received a book! FFS what ever happened to critical thinking. All the religious books are filled with outlandish claims with nothing backing them up. All they ask is that you believe in them so you can go to heaven and be happy forever while others go to hell for nothing more serious than being misinformed.

      I mean wake up, i am not gonna tell you how the world works. I don't know. But we can be sure that all attempts so far to explain anything has been totally off mark.
    • xsquirrel378x, on 01/24/2008, -6/+1Throw the jew down the well,
      So my country can be free,
      And then we'll have a big party
    • glasnostic, on 01/24/2008, -4/+2ok so please answer my question.

      what is racist about wanting an end to the desperate plight of the Palestinians?

      • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -1/+4Nothing. So please answer my question: what's wrong in asking the Palestinians to help end their plight?
  • reazal, on 01/24/2008, -14/+21"If you torture one person you create ten, a hundred, a thousand new enemies." Just some random quote from the film Rendition.
    • ssn697, on 01/24/2008, -9/+4*****, "please let us hit you over the head with the same point, over and over, because you are too stupid to research on your own" movie.

      Anything relevant to opine?
  • onetimer, on 01/24/2008, -33/+63Wow, when did digg become so vehemently anti-israel? Israel may not have a clean record, but they are certainly not the ones solely responsible for the conflict with the Palestinians. It seems like it's now in vogue to hate anything and everything with a "zionist" connection now. And alot of it seems to be fueled by ignorance from some biased web source, instead of having at least a semi-factual basis.

    If the Palestinians could act civil when the blockade was lifted, then I would agree that israel is being cruel. But they only stopped the blockade for ONE DAY and were fired at by a dozen rockets? Can anyone blame them for wanting to protect themselves? (Don't start with that "stolen land" *****. The land originally belonged to the israelites and was given back to them by the UN)

    I'm all for peace between the two countries (they are both fueling the war), but when one side absolutely refuses to even acknowledge the other sides existence and can't even behave for the sake of their people, they are just as part of the problem as israel.
    • strafefire, on 01/24/2008, -16/+22Ummm...the land may have been owned by the Isrealites thousands of years ago, but it has been Arab land every since, up to the 1940s:
      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel

      Your statement is like saying that the Native Americans should have the UN force land from the United States to make room for them because they were there hundreds of years ago.

      If that ***** happened in the US, there would be war too so...
      • p0s3r, on 01/24/2008, -16/+17Please point out the country of Palestine on a 1940s map.
        • abid786, on 01/24/2008, -14/+12http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Palestine_south ...

          This is one from 1924.
        • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -8/+12@abid: he asked for the COUNTRY, not the region. Who was the president,prime-minister,big-kahuna of "Palestine" in 1924?
          • glasnostic, on 01/24/2008, -3/+5oh.. i get it, so you think that a nation within a region has no right to their land?

            do you think the US would be justified in kicking every native american off their reservations since those reservations are not countries? heck.. couldn't china do it, and force us to take the refugees?

          • foopirata, on 01/25/2008, -2/+2"oh.. i get it, so you think that a nation within a region has no right to their land? " - where in the pimping pants of Josaphat have I said anything remotely connected to what you are saying?
            I simply pointed that there isn't, wasn't, weren't any _country_ called Palestine, ever, there was simply a region called Palestine. If you can't see that...you got worse problems than your opinion on geopolitics.

            A "nation" inside a "region" is actually called a "country".
        • malaak, on 01/24/2008, -2/+7http://www.maps.com/map.aspx?nav=MS&cid=1560&pid=1 ...
          from the 1940's....
      • PatNolan, on 01/24/2008, -14/+15Actually no. They lost the land when they attacked Israel and Israel fought them off, keeping a nice chunk of territory as breather room. The rest of Palestine was swallowed up by the Arab states in the region.
        • notque, on 01/24/2008, -5/+5Benny Morris -
          "Palestinians were ethnically cleansed in 1948.”
        • glasnostic, on 01/24/2008, -2/+4the west bank and Gaza are indisputably occupied territories. moving your civilian population onto occupied land is a violation of the Geneva conventions. a WAR CRIME.

          if you look at a map of the settlements that were build after Oslo you will see exactly why the Palestinians had to do something to stop the ethnic cleansing.

          i say this knowing that you will never take an objective look at the map. continue making excuses for war criminals if it makes you feel better about your hatred toward brown skinned non-Christians..
        • glasnostic, on 01/24/2008, -2/+4by the way.. they lost the land the first time when their landlords sold it out from under them, and the Early Israelis used TERRORISM to attack the Brits who were in control and take complete control while kicking the Palestinians out.
      • malaak, on 01/24/2008, -6/+9Thank you for bringing up that very relevant point!
      • stanleyford, on 01/24/2008, -4/+3"Your statement is like saying that the Native Americans should have the UN force land from the United States to make room for them because they were there hundreds of years ago." -- It works both ways. It may be unjust that Palestinians lost their land six decades ago. Would it be more just if Israelis who were born and grew up on that land, who call that land home, now lost it to Palestinians who are the children and grandchildren of those who used to live there? What if, instead of equating the Israelis to the Native Americans and the Palestinians to the US, one equated the Palestinians to the Native Americans and the Israelis to the US? Should the Palestinians get back the land they used to live in generations ago, taking it from those who have since made their homes there?

        Grave injustices have been done to both sides. That much seems obvious. But you cannot rectify one injustice by perpetrating another. If you believe that it was unjust for the Palestinians to lose their homes in 1948, surely you must concede that it would be similarly unjust for the Israelis to lose theirs now. The tragedy of the situation is not only that injustices have been committed, but that there may be no satisfactory way to right those wrongs without committing others.
        • glasnostic, on 01/24/2008, -2/+4personally i do not think it would be just for Israel to be destroyed in order to give the land back to the Palestinians. BUT the 67 border must become a real border and every settlement must be handed over to the Palestinians.

          make no mistake, the current intifada is a result of stepped up settlement building (a war crime) that proceeded the Oslo peace accords which brought about a cease fire from the Palestinians.

          Israel did not uphold their part of the bargain, and on the contrary they used that time of peace to grab land that they now say they must defend.

          terrorism is nasty but i would gladly kill civilians to save my society, and everybody who supports our government's deployment of nuclear weapons also supports killing civilians on a level that Palestinians could never achieve.
      • geekee, on 01/24/2008, -3/+4Did you read your own link? The British owned it most of the 20th century.
    • pintomp3, on 01/24/2008, -12/+13"but they are certainly not the ones solely responsible for the conflict with the Palestinians." they are the ones living in the former homes of palestinians. they are the ones who control air, water, and border. they are the ones building illegal settlements. they are the ones receiving billions of US dollars and weapons. how do you expect fair and honest negotiations between an occupier and the occupied?
    • bxblox, on 01/24/2008, -5/+3"originally belonged to the israelites and was given back to them by the UN"
      yea, right.....
      • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -1/+6You don't seem to believe much in archeology, uh? It's not all Indiana Jones stuff.
    • azdek, on 01/24/2008, -1/+4Strafefire: It states in YOUR cited reference that:

      "Between the time of the Jewish kingdoms and the 7th-century Muslim conquests, the Land of Israel fell under Assyrian, Babylonian, Persian, Greek, Roman, Sassanian, and Byzantine rule.[25] Jewish presence in the region dwindled after the failure of the Bar Kokhba revolt against the Roman Empire in 132 CE and the resultant large-scale expulsion of Jews. Nevertheless, a continuous Jewish presence in Palestine was maintained, although the main Jewish population shifted from the Judea region to the Galilee;[26] the Mishna and part of the Talmud, among Judaism's most important religious texts, were composed in Israel during this period.[27] The Land of Israel was captured from the Byzantine Empire around 636 CE during the initial Muslim conquests. Control of the region transferred between the Umayyads,[28] Abbasids,[29] and Crusaders over the next six centuries, before falling in the hands of the Mamluk Sultanate, in 1260. In 1516, the Land of Israel became a part of the Ottoman Empire, which ruled the region until the 20th century.[30]"

      So your statement that the Arabs have owned Palestine ever since the Jewish people lost it is proven false by your own citation. It was also owned by the Romans and Byzantines for a large part of that time.
  • Liam76, on 01/24/2008, -16/+37They blew down the border wall between Gaza and Egypt to get emergency "supplies" and came back with TV's, junk food, and cell phones? Sure sounds like a humanitarian crisis.

    Gaza Blackout was largely staged, Israel never cut off all power, they offered fuel and medicine to Gaza but were turned down.
    http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1200572 ... http://www.maannews.net/en/index.php?opr=ShowDetai ... http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/About+the+Ministry/MFA+S ...

    SOme of the sources were the Israeli govt, so yes they are questionable, but then again who controls power in Gaza?
    • valkyries, on 01/24/2008, -2/+630% comes from inside Gaza the other 70% i believe comes from Israel. (power)

    • malaak, on 01/24/2008, -5/+9"SOme of the sources were the Israeli govt, so yes they are questionable"

      That pretty much says it all!
    • Iconoclast25, on 01/24/2008, -4/+6"and came back with TV's, junk food, and cell phones" - same kind of 'shoppers' as seen in NOLA after Katrina.
      • Barbosa, on 01/24/2008, -2/+1wow just wow. your generalizations are stunning.
        • Iconoclast25, on 01/25/2008, -0/+1You may not like this one, but it is accurate nevertheless. In the aftermath of Katrina, there were those who broke into stores for diapers, water, food, etc. And then there were the ones who 'shopped' for flatscreen TVs, jewelry, booze, cigarettes, etc. The comparison breaks down, of course, when one notes the palestinians, at least, PAID for their goods rather than merely looting them. Thanks for playing. HANDDA
    • neoknight, on 01/24/2008, -3/+1They also came back with meat, rice and sugar...if all they could find was junk food than so be it. It's not like they had the weekend organic farmers market going on when the wall came down.

      As for the TV's, and cell phones if you take those things for granted, why can't they. Cell phones and TV's are part of normal everyday life, just as you take digg to be.
  • Picaroon, on 01/24/2008, -30/+48Digg is ridiculously and rabidly biased against Israel. What a bunch of garbage.
    • onetimer, on 01/24/2008, -16/+17I've noticed it to. In the last few months, as a surge of truthers and ron paul supporters (i'll be dugg down for saying this) have joined the site, hate against israel has not only come to be accepted, but deemed as legitimate. The problem is the people who are bias go around spreading exaggerations and misinformation (which it turns out are attributed to some anti-israel and/or anti-jewish website with little to no substantiation).

      It's like these people are describing a war which two sides are fighting, but only choose to talk about the acts of one side and pretend the other side is completely innocent.
      • unpolloloco, on 01/24/2008, -4/+9correlation does not equal causation in terms of groups of people joining
        anyway, i agree both sides are equally to blame
      • card51short, on 01/24/2008, -9/+5"It's like these people are describing a war which two sides are fighting, but only choose to talk about the acts of one side and pretend the other side is completely innocent."

        Nothing like you guys attacking the Muslims, right?
        Poor Israel :( Can it withstand any more people talking down on it in cyberspace?
      • mst3kcrow, on 01/24/2008, -1/+3I agree with unpolloloco. Personally I don't have a problem with Israel itself or the citizens of Israel; same goes with Palestinians. What I do have a problem with is AIPAC, a few specific IDF actions, people firing rockets towards Israel, distortion of the truth from both sides, collective punishment, and generalizing people based on the actions of a few. What really sucks is that both sides haven't been able to swallow their pride, work together, and kick out the people who stir up *****.
    • VeryBoredNow, on 01/24/2008, -12/+8But I am sure both of you can agree that Palestine was converted into a big CONCENTRATION CAMP.
      • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -4/+8Really?
        British Palestine was turned into Israel and Jordan. A part of it went to Egypt.
        Apart from a huge massacre in Jordan in 1970 (research Black September) when the PLO tried to overthrow the Hashemite Kingdom, I am not aware of any organized mass killing in the "Palestine" region. Nor ovens. Or death marches. In fact, I am quite aware of the Palestinian population steadily growing. So...where is this concentration camp you talk about?
        • Iconoclast25, on 01/24/2008, -5/+5foopirata, please, for your own safety, please do not feed the libtards facts, logic, reason, truth or history. They cannot process such, causing them to choke on their own venom, at which point their buddies of the tort bar will sue you not only for their physical stress but also on behalf of the surviving sheep and goats, for loss of intimate relations.
    • glasnostic, on 01/24/2008, -3/+2you support Israel?

      well then you support a state guilty of ethnic cleansing and war crimes.

      it is a war crime to move your civilians population onto occupied territories, yet nobody disputes that this is happening.

      why do you think the second intifada started. the pals. stopped their attacks, and to thank them, the Israelis took more land.

      so yeah, i guess you could call me anti-Israel.. just don't ***** dare call me an anti-Semite since both Palestinians and Israelis are SEMITES
  • chronically420, on 01/24/2008, -21/+9if im remembering correctly, bush just went to israel...why must he leave a trail of destruction wherever he goes? seriously, can he do one single thing right without ***** something/one else up?
    • ssn697, on 01/24/2008, -2/+9I bet people say the same thing about you. Maybe not all of them to your face, but that is to your detriment.
    • SteelChicken, on 01/24/2008, -2/+1looks at user name.
      looks at post.
      sees correlation.
    • pitlord, on 01/24/2008, -0/+2This is a ***** article that totally ignores the fact that Israel never cut off electricity to "Gaza" and the border between Gaza and Egypt was blown up yesterday allowing tens of thousands of people to buy supplies (and probably weapons with which to murder more civilians). The article is not about Bush at all.
      X^(
  • nepawoods, on 01/24/2008, -17/+40"The Palestinians have the right of access to food, fuel and medicine."

    The people killed by Hamas have the right to live. So what?
    • phnx0221, on 01/24/2008, -10/+12Yes, the people killed by Hamas have a right to live, as do the people who are dying because they do not have access to adequate food, shelter, medical care, or fuel to get to these places.
      • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -4/+13I guess they should take it with their democratically elected government, Hamas, no ?
        The first responsibility of a government is the well-being of their people, NOT the destruction of other people like Hamas focuses on.
        • speerross, on 01/24/2008, -2/+4Well what do you propose to do about that? The Palestinians elected Hamas in fair and free elections, no Hamas should not go around attacking people (nor should plenty of other governments that come to mind) but what are we going to do? Topple their government becuase the people voted the 'wrong way'?
          • foopirata, on 01/25/2008, -1/+2"We" shouldn't do anything. The Palestinian people should notice they have a non-functional government in their hands and elect moderates that are willing to come to the table, talk peace and make peace.
            The responsibility is square in the shoulders of the Palestinian people.
        • epohs, on 01/24/2008, -1/+7If they continue to attack, refuse to recognize the existence of, or peacefully negotiate with their fully legitimate (by the UN's own standards) neighbor, then yes their government runs the risk of being toppled.
    • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -5/+7Agreed completely. Those people killed by HAMA though were killed by a terrorist entity - not a State, not a government and not someone that is supposed to be living up to international treaties. No one can say Israel doesn't have the right to defend itself - it clearly does - but because the mob sends someone from the home country to do a hit in Jersey - doesn't give the States the right to bomb Italy.

      It is a horrible situation all ways around. Why is it that the average Palestinian doesn't go after Hamas themself's? What is HAMAS(Military wing) giving them that the HAMAS(Political wing) aren't giving them?
      • lnf69, on 01/24/2008, -2/+9Didn't hamas win the majority in the last Palestinian elections?
        • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -5/+6Aren't there really two factions of HAMAS? A political one an a Militant one? Didn't I already state that in my post?

          So back to the question - Why isn't the average Palestinian not taking up arms against the Militant wing of HAMAS? What are they getting from them that the elected government can't do?

          On the other hand though - Israel has no such divide. They are being order by the government - which is in violation of the UN.


        • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -4/+5"Aren't there really two factions of HAMAS? A political one an a Militant one?" - the militant one is under control of the political one. If it isn't, then wtf does the political one want a state for? If they can't control a party, how can they control a state?

          "On the other hand though - Israel has no such divide." - just goes to show how little you know. Israel has a very lively political debate - and the pull is to many sides. The government has one agenda, which is definitely not the one of a VERY vocal opposition.
          • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -4/+4Foopirata - Think about it for one second and you will see you are talking out both sides of your face. If you expect the HAMAS political faction to control the military one - and are willing to make the entire population pay for the actions of a few - then you must - MUST - state the same for the other side. That Israeli people are to be blamed for the actions of their government, and their military. But you don't - you defend, and defend and still defend as the bodies and UN resolutions pile on and when people point it out you call them anti-Semite. It is sad and disgusting and sooner or later people will just figure the smoke and mirrors out. Then - you and your lemmings will have to deal with the effects of all the causes you have laid.

            Reap and sow. The media can not keep people in the west in the dark forever.

            The non-divide between Israel and the people is that the government elected by Israelis are the ones doing the damage. On the Palestine side it is the militants, the mob for lack of a better analogy, and you simply would see the preposterous reaction if a country acted against another country for the actions of a few within said country that have no official ties with the government. Just as going after AQ within Pakistan would be considered an act of war against Pakistan. Just as Afghanistan has turned into a cluster - because the solution you are trying to defend only creates what you are fighting against.

            But hey - keep it up, clearly you understand it much better which is why the problems have been solved in the last 5000 years, maybe THIS TIME it will work??

          • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -3/+4"If you expect the HAMAS political faction to control the military one" - I _expect_ ? I'd expect them to expect it. Otherwise, it's not the same movement, and then Hamas as the dully democratic elected government must do something about it.
            "That Israeli people are to be blamed for the actions of their government, and their military." - that makes absolutely no sense. The Israeli people elected their leaders. These leaders serve the people - and more than once the Israeli people went to the streets demanding a change in policy and sometimes even demanding (and succeeding) a change in government.
            Your apology for Hamas is as disgusting as what you claim my position to be. The difference is - while I agree that Israel is hardly the saint - you cannot see beyond the shallowness of your argument. Hamas wants to be a government? Then it has to act as one. It wants to be a resistance movement? Then it has to be ready for the backlash. You can't have the cake and eat it too.

            As to the cheap appeal to emotion, bodies and UN resolutions piling - I couldn't care less for UN resolutions until they agree to address both sides of the problem, and the bodies are to be "credited" to Hamas, political (check their charter) and/or militant (check their actions). Once they change their song and dance and come to the table and talk, then I'll agree Israel has blame on it.

            "Reap and sow. The media can not keep people in the west in the dark forever." - indeed. Just today I saw four or five different places explaining the crisis that never was, the border crossing that never was, the fuel crisis that never was. People are getting on to the theather of Hamas, and they're getting fed up with it.

            "The non-divide between Israel and the people is that the government elected by Israelis are the ones doing the damage." - you do know that Olmert has one of the lowest ratings ever in an Israeli Prime Minister, and that most of the country is hoping, nay, praying, for his government to fall? It is all a question of time now. That's a divide.

            "for the actions of a few within said country that have no official ties with the government." - so...I guess that Hamas admitting that it was them who sent the rockets, or that their operatives where the ones intercepted by the IDF, or that they hold Shalit...that's....just...a few...with...no official ties...to the government? You seem to live in an interesting land. Does candy grow in trees there?

            "But hey - keep it up, clearly you understand it much better" - at least I look at the problems, instead of fantasizing explanations for them away like some.

            "which is why the problems have been solved in the last 5000 years" - ah, now it is 5000 ? I was sure it was 60, since the "zionist entity" was established...uh, guess it's not the occupation after all, eh?
      • RonnyN, on 01/25/2008, -1/+2No government?
        Let's see:
        Palestinian president? Check!
        Palestinian PM? Check!
        Palestinian Cabinet? Check!
        Election system? Check! (ask yourself: election system for what exactly if not, that's right! government!)
        What is your definition of government??
        Why are you so blatantly ignoring the facts man??
    • OMGIAMTHEMAN, on 01/24/2008, -3/+2nobody is supporting hamas, but do you starve the entire population of gaza just to make sure that some hamas militants are also hungry?
    • digggggggggg, on 01/24/2008, -2/+4Right, eye for an eye. Pretty soon we'll all be blind.
  • Itisus, on 01/24/2008, -9/+2Dig this.
    http://digg.com/political_opinion/World_End_the_Bl ...
  • valkyries, on 01/24/2008, -6/+16ill say this over and over.
    willingness to do business with Israel on the very same day it commits another atrocity against the Palestinians in Gaza.
    after Israel opened the border for small amounts of medicine/fuel, Israel got 11 rockets in return just this last monday....
    • VeryBoredNow, on 01/24/2008, -5/+3so the 11 rockets were fired for no reason at all?
      • pitlord, on 01/24/2008, -1/+4The reason they fired 11 rockets was to thank Israel. They originally planned to launch 22, but since Israel opened the border they gave them a gift of 11 fewer rockets.
        -_-
  • N987SA, on 01/24/2008, -9/+17And who fired those rockets?
    • Waiting2awake, on 01/24/2008, -5/+6Good question. Who did it? Who ordered it? Lets go after them.

      Do the same on the other side.

      All in the name of fairness. Who, oh who, could be against that?
    • VeryBoredNow, on 01/24/2008, -6/+9Are you talking about the homemade ones fired by Hamas or the hellfire missles fired from Apaches by Israel?
      • urik88, on 01/24/2008, -2/+4Is it Israel's fault that they have a better army?
        The bastards! They should give the palestinians some advantage by letting them fire some rockets before responding! How do they dare to have better weapons!?
    • Albionshores, on 01/25/2008, -3/+2GOOGLE IS YOUR FRIEND!

      http://tinyurl.com/yq72lq

      Hamas has offered a ceasefire in December 2007. Israel turned it down December 23rd 2007. The Guardian reported it on the 24th.


      :O
    • foopirata, on 01/25/2008, -0/+4Hamas offers "peace" with one side of the mouth and reneges it with the other. Google is your friend, check the meaning of "hudna".



      HAMAS CHARTER:

      Article Thirteen: Peaceful Solutions, [Peace] Initiatives and International Conferences

      [Peace] initiatives, the so-called peaceful solutions, and the international conferences to resolve the Palestinian problem, are all contrary to the beliefs of the Islamic Resistance Movement.
  • segiterrus, on 01/24/2008, -19/+19ughh..Palestinians..sad story, how there entire country got jacked and given to zionists...
    • unpolloloco, on 01/24/2008, -7/+4and how they jacked it from the Jews before that, and how the Jewish people jacked it from them before that, and it goes on millennia back
      • pitlord, on 01/24/2008, -2/+5There were no "palestinian" people before Britain named the region "Palestine" after they took control of it when WWII ended. There never have been any "palestinian" people to take land from.
        -_-
        That land was given to the Hebrews over 4000 years ago by G-d. When G-d returns he will settle all of this once and for all. I feel sorry for the people who have been cursing the Jews. I'd rather die being smothered by Hugo Chavez's ass than be denied the light of H-shem barechu.
        • uberchaoslord, on 01/24/2008, -2/+3It disturbs me that you've envisioned dying by being smothered by Hugo Chavez's ass...
        • Barbosa, on 01/24/2008, -1/+3Thanks for not taking that comment seriously. talking seriously to someone who believes that is pointless.
  • pintomp3, on 01/24/2008, -19/+22collective punishment is wrong and israel should be condemned for doing it.
    • unpolloloco, on 01/24/2008, -9/+8and palestinians should be condemned for their collective punishment of israel in the form of terrorism
      it goes both ways - both sides are to blame
      • Albionshores, on 01/24/2008, -7/+12But Palestinians aren't guilty of it, 1.5 million in Gaza and how amny rockets, how many Israelis killed? The actions of the militants are not the actions of the people. HOWEVER what the Israeli administration has been doing IS collective punishment because the policy being used targets 1.5 million - not the people firing the rockets.

        You are right that both sides have blame - but Gaza is not collectively punishing Israel.
        • foopirata, on 01/24/2008, -6/+8You are such an advocate of "power to the people", "revolutions", "the people united will never be defeated"...and when it is time for the "people" to do anything about their own situation, you throw it squarely on the shoulders of .... someone else.
          If the terrorists are so few, and there are 1.5 million Gazans that only want peace, tell me, oh Oracle of Albionshores, what is easier? For the Gazans to do something about the few terrorists in their midst or for Israel to do nothing?
          Ah. Of course. The Gazans can't do it...because of the "occupation"...right.
        • unpolloloco, on 01/24/2008, -6/+6ummm terrorism isnt collective punishment???
      • OMGIAMTHEMAN, on 01/24/2008, -4/+1"palestinian" collective punishment or Hamas' collective punishment?
    • pitlord, on 01/24/2008, -3/+3Border control is "punishment" now? I suppose you'd like to see U.S. open it's borders to everyone too. At least the Mexicans aren't firing rockets at us.
      >
  • Zecchetti, on 01/24/2008, -11/+10Why hasn't this been made popular yet? 146 diggs at only 19 hours 48mins!
    • redmonkey, on 01/24/2008, -6/+7Because people does not like terrorists supporters
    • Barbosa, on 01/24/2008, -3/+3Possibly because, like me, the folks at digg have realized that discussions like this one have become pointless and unhealthy.
      • Albionshores, on 01/25/2008, -3/+2Discussions like these if done properly can empower moderatism in others, at least they can trigger further analysis and put it more in the public eye. The last thing the region needs are more victims of ethnic cleansing which nobody gives a damn about. A bit like what happened to Iraqis now purged to Syria.
        • Barbosa, on 01/25/2008, -1/+3Just a bit frustrating that here on digg "discussions" of Arab Israeli relations often lead me to feel like I am talking to a brick wall, but point taken.
    • Albionshores, on 01/25/2008, -3/+1F.L.W.
  • str3ama, on 01/24/2008, -10/+16The biggest problem not being discussed about Israel, is that there is steep divide between the people and the Government (ring any bells about the current US atmosphere?) - the main problem is that a lot of the citizens (not all, but a lot) are willingly to live peacefully with the Palestinians but the Government needs Palestine to 'scapegoat all social or political problems on. It's too convenient that the military industrial complex in Israel is responsible for the majority of Israel's GNP.

    When weapons technology research and manufacture becomes that important to your economy, the rockets must and will fly - especially since it's so profitable. If the Israeli gov't