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385 Comments
- billricardi, on 04/06/2009, -115/+385Wow, buried. This is a tourist's ignorant snapshot if a city that is really in it's modern infancy. He doesn't mention any of the upcoming improvements other than the new mass transit system. He seems to think that the city needs oil to continue to grow ("The truth may be that this city will be obsolete in less time than it takes most communities to figure out who and what they are."). This is BS. The city is becoming a massive technology center as well as being a haven for the ultra rich, who's taxes alone will keep the city from dying.
He mentions a 200 car pileup where 3 people were killed... let's compare the worst crash there to the worst in... oh... Tennessee! As a measure of scope: 11 December 1990: Interstate 75 in Calhoun, Tennessee, United States, between Chattanooga and Knoxville near the Hiwassee River, due to very heavy fog; fiery crash involved 99 vehicles; 12 deaths and 42 injuries. In that giant mecca of... Calhoun.
He says, and I quote, "Mostly, however, tradition seems more an intrusion. The most obvious instance, perhaps, is the Muslim call to prayers, which cuts through the din five times daily, literally a voice from the past." What the hell is THAT? He goes from talking about informal meeting places to THIS?
I've been there, it isn't a quarter as bad as he's implying. This guy, whether true or not, just comes off as a clueless tourist bigot. - Alias1431, on 04/06/2009, -11/+274I know how to build a city! I also know how to destroy one. Sim City ftw.
- SkittlesUSA, on 04/06/2009, -16/+251Dubai will never be a world-class city unless it changes its ultraconservative laws. Nobody will tour Dubai if touching somebody of the opposite sex in public is illegal.
- maledin, on 04/06/2009, -7/+187I think you're missing the point of the article.
I know someone who's been to Dubai multiple times. He says that basically all of the new building going on there is what we see as auto-dependent suburban ***** over here.You have to drive to get anywhere there. Forget about even trying to walk on Sheikh Zayed Road, the city's main throughfare. The main street over there is basically a highway.
He finds it amazing that they had the opportunity to build smartly--or at least make it somewhat viable not to have to rely on a car-- for when oil is no longer cheap. Even with their boundless wealth, they didn't and instead chose to go with the oil-dependent, unsustainable stuff. They basically took all of American's worst building practices (car dependent, unfriendly for pedestrians) and hyperbolized them.
No matter how you spin it, that's how not to build a city. - L0NER, on 04/06/2009, -7/+125I swear those people would put spinners and 14 inch woofers on their buildings they could
- Haoie, on 04/06/2009, -4/+117Too much building on speculation only.
- alsouno, on 04/06/2009, -5/+108wow didn`t realize there were so many mississaugans on digg...
- morningmatters, on 04/06/2009, -2/+83"The city is becoming a massive technology center as well as being a haven for the ultra rich, who's taxes alone will keep the city from dying."
It's well known that Dubai is mostly tax-free. - AttackOfTheClaw, on 04/06/2009, -1/+74The only way to build a city, is on rock 'n' roll.
- swazo, on 04/06/2009, -8/+70Dugg for Mississauga.
- Aroundtown27, on 04/06/2009, -8/+67His point about how they're building the city based around cars is a good one though. North American cities are mostly build around the car and they generally are a disaster.
- SigmaEcho, on 04/06/2009, -4/+53With all due respect, you don't know what the hell you're talking about. While the author does lash out irrationally at certain points, his underlying point is sound: Dubai is an unsustainable city destined to fail, pure and simple. For those of you who missed this big story from a couple months ago, Dubai has already begun to die:
http://www.boingboing.net/2009/02/09/dubai-airport ...
There are currently 3000 abandoned cars at the Dubai airport, and the number is growing, as the 90% immigrant population, almost entirely construction workers, leave Dubai because they aren't getting paid. The Arab oil barons are suffering from the global recession, and have either cut back, suspended projects or stopped hiring. And this is just a simple recession - Peak oil, which everyone knows is just around the corner, hasn't even happened yet.
Once the oil starts to run out, all Dubai has to rely on is tourism. There is literally NO base economy in UAE other than oil. Your claim that the city is "becoming a massive technology center" is just wishful thinking BS. Assuming tourism ever really does take off, people will stop coming after the first dozen or so international incidents of vacationing couples being arrested for touching each other in public. People go to Vegas, a desert city in the middle of nowhere, because alcohol, gambling and even prostitution are legal in Nevada. In Dubai, not only is there no alcohol, but I have a hard time wondering why anyone would want to visit such an oppressive country: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_rights_in_the_U ... What DO they have? They have indoor skiing that takes FSM knows how much energy to run, or the golf courses that the author mentioned that take millions of gallons of water a day to keep the grass alive. Does this sound sustainable to you?
It's sad that it took the recession before people started to openly point out the blatantly obvious reality that Dubai will soon be the tallest ghost town in the world. Feel free to also call me a "bigot" for also denouncing their anti-freedom religious *****. - M4v3rIC, on 04/06/2009, -8/+56dugg only for a reference to mississauga
- borez, on 04/06/2009, -11/+57As somebody who's spent a couple of weeks in Dubai, I came back with one overpowering observation that sums the place up perfectly for me:
Dubai is unsustainable. Period.
Oh... and if anybody just happens to be ***** listening from the Dubai tourist board, you may want to have a long hard think about the way you treat incoming Western visitors at your airports in the future because personally, I've never in my life felt so much anger at one culture and its methods before I've even set foot on it's soil. Basically ( and excuse my French ) you viewed me as a *****, and you treat me like a ***** from the minute I landed, and for that reason I won't be going back. Thanks. - AmishRefugee, on 04/06/2009, -16/+58"even in a city built by oil-fuelled hubris."
*****. It's not hubris that made Dubai what it is. They realized their oil wealth will slowly drop in the coming decades to nothing and needed to make their own economy out of nothing but money and sand. Whether or not it's going to work is one thing, but the city wasn't made because of greed or the desire to be as ostentatious as possible - billricardi, on 04/06/2009, -1/+42Dubai is a city. The UAE is the country.
- alappat1, on 04/06/2009, -0/+38SkittlesUSA, the biggest problem anyone would have in dubai, is not the conservative laws (many ways to get around that), but the lack of personal rights and civil liberties. There is no constitutional guarantee of fair trial, and islamic law. Don't get me wrong, they have a well funded police force, but there is severe bias in judgements of cases, and no 4th estate (state controlled media) to help keep people clean
The corporations run all there. However it is not really corporotocracy (sp?) because the government owns most of the real estate companies..and others). In addition, there is no protection for workers, and there is a large underclass of people who suffer low wage, and daily threats of being fired and deported back to their respective 3rd world country if they don't work 12 hrs a day. There are hundreds of thousands of men living in squalor.
corruption in such environments are usually ripe, and the culture definitely one of winner take all, no holds barred, ethics be damned. If you don't have money and your not Emirati or white (with some connections) your a second class citizen. And god help you if you brown or Asian - these two ethnic groups are very discriminated against; i know from experience.
there is no social security, equal pay for women, and until recently no real property rights (they changed it to increase demand for real estate market - not out of any ethical consideration i assure you).
that said, if your a shark, and don't mind living with sharks to make a killing, dubai is for you - jabbajabba, on 04/06/2009, -0/+38I don't know how you think Dubai is becoming a becoming a massive technology center - I lived there for a year working in telecoms and there is only one ISP called 'Etisalat' which is a monopoly owned by the all the Emirati royal familys. The ADSL service Etisalat provides is all piped through a proxy so they can block 'un-islamic sites' including most of the major social networing sites and any blogger whom may say something controversial about the country. Etisalat also blocked skype as they own the only fixed line and at the time telecoms company so it obviously meant less money for their monopoly.
Since then (2006) another mobile telecoms company has launched called 'Du' - No more monopoly? well yes it is as Du's main share holders are the same as those who own Etisalat.
As for the city itself i was glad to leave. I met some really nice people while there..but its not the kind of living conditions for me. If you like being in air-con all day and driving everywhere you will like it. - salmonz, on 04/06/2009, -5/+42w00t, mississauga
- maledin, on 04/06/2009, -6/+42I think you're all missing the point of the article.
I know someone who's been to Dubai multiple times. He says that basically all of the new building going on there is what we see as auto-dependent suburban ***** over here.You have to drive to get anywhere there. Forget about even trying to walk on Sheikh Zayed Road, the city's main throughfare. The main street over there is basically a highway.
He finds it amazing that they had the opportunity to build smartly--or at least make it somewhat viable not to have to rely on a car-- for when oil is no longer cheap. Even with their boundless wealth over there, for some reason they didn't and instead they chose to go with the oil-dependent, unsustainable stuff.
That's how not to build a city. - Nateon, on 04/06/2009, -1/+36The thing that bugs me about Dubai is that from what I've seen it's all flash and no substance. I mean, it's cool they have the tallest buildings and most luxurious hotel but in the end does this kind of thing really matter? A digger earlier said that most cities are built because the people have already come there and Dubai is being built to get people to go there. That's kind of what I'm seeing.
I'd rather live in a place that has a personality with roots in the history, culture of its inhabitants and built harmoniously with its surroundings. Not some artificial place that uses 4 million gallons of water a day to sustain a golf course. It's just my opinion based on what I look for in a place. I need to be somewhere in tune with nature, not fighting against it. - BoneheadFarker, on 04/06/2009, -1/+36Yeah, but it doesn't normally result in jail time and/or lashings...
- PandaBearShenyu, on 04/06/2009, -0/+33The article seems a bit daft and subjective, more of a livejournal than an actual inquisitive article. It was just a rant by someone who doesn't like Dubai from the bottom of his heart.
I do have to wonder sometimes about Dubai though and ask, what's the point? It's so hot there that as soon as I step outside I feel muggy and disgusting, I feel like many people not from that atmosphere will not be able to even get used to the temperature and the insane humidity.
It seems like Dubai is a city built waiting for the people to come, whereas normal cities are built because the people already came... - Maksx, on 04/06/2009, -4/+35Nice mention about Mississauga, a city which often goes ignored I'd say. Most American's haven't heard of it yet it itself is the 6th largest city in Canada, and certainly one of the larger in North America
- kingamoon, on 04/06/2009, -19/+50I've been to Dubai. It's not bad at all. I'm not sure what the author's problem is with Dubai (except his apparent problem with the religion).
- borez, on 04/06/2009, -1/+32Although some of that guys observations are completely wrong, I've been there too and a lot of it is the truth.
- bartofdahammer, on 04/06/2009, -1/+31haha well Mississauga is the epitome of a suburb.
- avataros, on 04/06/2009, -6/+36Dugg article for daring to cross a world-class city in Vegas with a suburb-ish town close to Toronto for the sake of creating a local journalistic flavor.
- borez, on 04/06/2009, -8/+37You can digg me down all you ***** want, I care not... but when I'm tired and jet lagged from travelling around the world for three weeks, the last thing I need is some Muslim bird with a smirk on her face testing every ***** grain of sand in the bottom of my rucksack to see if it's cocaine for two ***** hours whilst her mate watched me with one hand on his gun longing for me to be a drug smuggler so he could basically rape me.
Sorry and that, maybe next time eh?
/and you still think I liked it there. - sladek, on 04/05/2009, -6/+30The article wasn't kidding about the number of lanes on the motorway / highway
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&a ... - emjaymj, on 04/06/2009, -0/+24The 401 in Mississauga/Toronto is 18 lanes at some points...
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&a ...
And the traffic STILL crawls during rush hour... - imhigh, on 04/06/2009, -22/+44This article is seriously flawed. I was in Dubai literally 2 weeks ago on a vacation and traffic isnt nearly as bad as he describes. I will say they do drive a bit reckless but the city is fine for pedistrians. The archetecture of the buildings is out of the world. If anything its a city of the future. Also burried for his clearly biggot comment on the muslum prayers. Its a muslum country, its part of thier culture
- hackiavelli, on 04/06/2009, -3/+24@billricardi
"He mentions a 200 car pileup where 3 people were killed... let's compare the worst crash there to the worst in... oh... Tennessee! As a measure of scope: 11 December 1990: Interstate 75 in Calhoun, Tennessee, United States, between Chattanooga and Knoxville near the Hiwassee River, due to very heavy fog; fiery crash involved 99 vehicles; 12 deaths and 42 injuries. In that giant mecca of... Calhoun."
I could tell you're not American reading that (that's not intended to be a put down, by the way). The interstate system is designed to be a high-speed, cross-country expressway that avoids going through little towns like Calhoun. A quick check of Google Maps shows it indeed doesn't. Calhoun was probably just the town closest to that particular stretch of I-75.
That there could be major accidents when people are driving 70 MPH (~115 KPH) in bad weather that limits visibility isn't exactly surprising. It is surprising you could get a 200+ car pile up in a metro area (presuming there were no weather issues). - ScottMitchell, on 04/06/2009, -1/+21We Americans have heard of Vancouver. They had an NBA team for a short while, after all.
- Teburninator, on 04/06/2009, -2/+22Oh where for art thou Sim City 5? *Hopes for new tax on tax ability* OH the funding opportunities will be endless! Healthcare for all!
- alsouno, on 04/06/2009, -0/+20LOL i also dugg it for comparing dubai, in essence, to mississauga.
- Trichomonas, on 04/06/2009, -0/+20Mississauga has the world's 2nd best Mayor (Hazel McCallion) according to a recent poll. "She is one of Canada's best known and longest-serving mayors. At the age of 85, she was easily re-elected in November 2006 for her 11th consecutive term, holding a 91% majority of the votes, and has often been reelected without even needing to conduct an actual campaign."
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hazel_McCallion - Cheezian, on 04/06/2009, -1/+20Dubai is an emirate
- L0NER, on 04/06/2009, -2/+21FUNDS code ftw!
- jbmcb, on 04/06/2009, -0/+19The people putting up buildings in Dubai. Duh.
- WVUDoss, on 04/06/2009, -1/+18"And not to be outdone, there's the brand new The Tiger Woods Dubai, a golf course in the desert that requires four million gallons of water a day to stay green."
Wow - robbiedo, on 04/06/2009, -0/+17Yeah, but Japan has the world's most precious renewable resource: Japanese Teenage Schoolgirls.
- SpeedSteamBoat, on 04/06/2009, -1/+17@Spartyon: In five or ten years, $4 will seem very cheap.
- bigbird, on 04/06/2009, -1/+17what else is there to do in mississauga? Besides go to the movies, or boston pizza, or well the movies again?
I guess streetsville is pretty sweet though. - IOhBot, on 04/06/2009, -3/+18I've been to Dubai recently as well, and I agree... I was also struct with how "weird" the place felt.
Like sitting in some mall in the food hall, knowing there is a desert right outside the door... It may as well have been on the moon for feeling you were somewhere that just wasn't quite "natural". - Akraz, on 04/06/2009, -0/+15lol i saw it and im like.. Mississauga... WTF!!!!!!!!! :O i knew it had to be a Canadian article.. i dont think any americans ever even heard of mississauga in their life. its a shock to see it on digg's FP
- Bloodwine, on 04/06/2009, -2/+16I really don't see how a city built on decadence will survive a worldwide economic downturn, at least not unscathed.
- beatitlikeacop, on 04/06/2009, -4/+18You're an idiot.
- joe122370, on 04/06/2009, -0/+14so we'll not be using any of the other things made out of oil? like plastic? it'll cease to exist because of one plug in car?
- Gizza, on 04/06/2009, -3/+17The difference between the US and Dubai though is that they actually have money to spend.
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