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183 Comments
- chocobomog, on 10/11/2007, -4/+86The internet is "dumbing you down" only if you trust everything you read as the unquestionable truth. If you read something interesting or too good to be true, then do some more research on it to find out the "truth". Digg is a great example of this. There are some very informative articles posted on Digg but there are also articles posted which are nothing but lies. If someone took everything they read on Digg as absolute truth, they would be misinformed and out-of-touch with reality. But if they took the initiative research what they read to learn more about it, they would be very well-informed.
A professor told my class "the internet is a sea of information that is only one foot deep". You can learn about a little of everything on the internet, but if you want to become an expert in anything, open a book and start studying. - webcure, on 10/11/2007, -6/+72My Internet experience is making me smarter.
Really!
Go ahead, ask me something... - sockpuppets, on 10/11/2007, -2/+59Since I've been on the internet I met a time traveler, sold a laptop to a great guy in Nigeria, saw a shark attack a helicopter, and have been chatting with a super hot blond on craigslist who is into really kinky stuff.
This guy is out of his mind. - ROFLance, on 10/11/2007, -8/+61Only dumb people get dumbed down by the internet.
- ahawks, on 10/11/2007, -3/+46This article is right next to "Poop to power your house" on the front page.
http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/9945/screenshotigooglemozillyb1.png
I think the answer is obvious. - strikezero, on 10/11/2007, -5/+34I agree, he's a nut
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -2/+22No, it's the other way around. The Internet was created by and for academics and scientists. Now it's overrun by dumb-***** who can't even use capital letters correctly. Just like thugs with cell phones, it's a great example of "standing on the shoulders of giants."
- fkr3, on 10/11/2007, -20/+38I think the internet isn't dumbing people down, it's straight out retarding them.
Look at
- the ill informed, outdated rhetoric and opinion cited as fact everywhere you go... Wikipedia has/had that issue with "anonymous geniuses" being certain they knew more than professors and other professionals
- spelling, and the almost conscientious effort to ***** every word down into 3 or fewer letters.
- some of the stupid ideas, like blogging has replaced journalism (true in what... 0.000001%?), digg et al replacing news (they link to existing news, they rarely create it) etcetera - replacing has been redefined to mean supplementing / complimenting
- the demand that everything be free, without reason or logic beyond "I don't want to pay for it"
- the misbelief that people are immune and unaccountable for what they say and do online - like that chump yesterday blogging about how he's scored a felony offence for hyping up the digglettes and getting them to harass some girl
I'm sure there's plenty more examples. It's not a broad-scale retarding, but I'm quickly getting the impression everyone who's a teenager has succumbed to it, and those people are going to be adults one of these days.... - merreborn, on 10/11/2007, -3/+19"The internet is "dumbing you down" only if you trust everything you read as the unquestionable truth."
That's not the kind of dumbing-down Keen is referring to. He's talking about the abundance of crap on youtube -- stuff like "monkey sniffs butt and falls off tree", etc. People are replacing their regular media consumption (television, etc.), with crap like that. Instead of paying for a magazine subscription, for a edited, reviewed set of articles, people would rather read a free blog, even though the editorial and fact checking processes are far inferior.
Thanks to the current incarnation of Web 2.0, people would rather get free content from amateur sources, rather than pay for quality. If professional media collapses, society as a whole will suffer. And Keen's afraid it will.
Personally, I think people will realize the value of quality, and will be willing to pay for it again, in the future. This isn't the first time there's been a leap in the ease of amateur publication -- I'm sure there was someone lamenting the death of media at the dawn of the printing press, the novel, and the mimeograph. And while each of these things did change the way we communicate with each other -- drastically -- they simply resulted in the reorganization of media, not its extinction.
One of these days, people are going to start putting stuff on the net worth paying for. And we'll pay for it. We know the free stuff is crap, and we really do want better. - unrealfan, on 10/11/2007, -0/+16I think it is, much in the same way that TV dumbs down its audience. but then again there's the discovery channel, pbs, etc. that help tip the balance. the web works the same way.
- tizz66, on 10/11/2007, -0/+15So are you saying us clever people should go and set up another new thing we can use and leave the idiots on the internet? I like your thinking... when do we start?
- Lane, on 10/11/2007, -3/+18Wiki isn't a source of stupidity, it only shifts the measurement of intelligence away from pointless memorization. I think the author is out of touch with reality. The internet is not dumbing people down its merely bringing out how ignorant the masses are. why do you think newspapers are written on an 8th grade level?
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -7/+22Sites like Digg are giving you all ADD.
- dbr_onix, on 10/11/2007, -2/+16"Is The Internet Dumbing Us Down?"
Nope, it's just making the dumb people louder and more noticable - adr4, on 10/11/2007, -6/+19Is it any surprise this kind of ***** is popular? People from the older generations read it and think "those damn kids," just like every other older generation has looked at the generation beneath them. The TRUTH is that the internet has completely changed the way people share information, and elitist ***** afraid of losing their stranglehold on being "experts," on various subjects will continue writing books like this until the old model is gone. The old model being a few knowing a lot with the rest of us taking their word for it, and the new one being everyone has access to pretty much everything. That's why the current form of government is breaking down before our eyes too.
- marmite, on 10/11/2007, -2/+15I'd rather be a web zombie than a TV zombie. That is what I think.
- fuzzmeister, on 10/11/2007, -1/+13Just because stupid people use the internet doesn't mean that smart people don't.
- Gorrondonuts, on 10/11/2007, -1/+13That damn rock and roll music is gonna ruin these kids!
- zenerdiode, on 10/11/2007, -1/+13First off NY Times and Washington Post are the most HATED papers by the neo-cons cause they have such an Anti-War slant. Just ask Bill O'reilly.
Secondly, editorial is not news--just like Bill O'Reilly isn't news. If you're dumb enough to believe things reported in editorials are facts, then you're a perfect description of a Web 2.0 user.
Lastly, as the article points out, these papers have contributed to some of the finest investigative journalism recently (VA Scandal, Rove e-mails, Valerie Plame scandal). Bloggers generally wouldn't have the financial capability nor the personnel contacts to fully get down to the bottom of these scandals.
If you so easily dismiss "Big Media" in favor of the Drudge Report, you're exactly the type of dumbed down Web 2.0 user the article talks about. Howabout your read both sources of info with a healthy does or skepticism and use BOTH Big Media and Web Media to make an informed decision. - slipgrid, on 10/11/2007, -3/+14No, it's not. FUD. The Internet is showing us things about the world we never knew.
- Chiliap2, on 10/11/2007, -6/+17I love it. He presents valid viewpoints, like the fact that bloggers can't do extreme in-depth investigative reporting, and that record companies provide much needed capital for new artists, and you call him an elitist conservative moron. You flame anyone who doesn't agree with you.
- endustry, on 10/11/2007, -2/+12What is he talking about? Posting about the 1/1,000,000,000,000,000,000 chance I have of having sex with Jessica Alba gives me the hope I need to make it through the rest of my day.
- kahrn, on 10/11/2007, -2/+11Sure, todays internet might be killing *the* culture we have now. But cultures change over time, and this is just the beginning of a new culture. I don't think that is a bad thing.
The internet means that we are free of geological boundaries that we had in the past. If that causes a shift in culture, then good. - qubeular, on 10/11/2007, -0/+9we were dumb before the Internet.
the Internet just enables us to be dumb in much more creative ways. - ROFLance, on 10/11/2007, -3/+12Please do not feed the troll.
- wannabenomad, on 10/11/2007, -0/+8Actually, I think that the Discovery channel(s) over the last 5-10 years is the worst dumbing down I've ever seen. I see your point though, and agree. There will always be intelligent and unintelligent options in any form of media.
- fkr3, on 10/11/2007, -3/+11Skimming a few wikipedia articles and googling answers to questions doesn't make you an expert. People aren't afraid of there being more experts, they're afraid of experts being redefined to mean any kid with access to Google, as opposed to an adult with a degree / masters / phd etcetera.
- dezmd, on 10/11/2007, -7/+15CEILING CAT IS WATECHING YUO MASTURBAT3.
- DFENS, on 10/11/2007, -0/+8It's a tool. Like a screwdriver. You can use it to build a home, or you can shove it 4 inches into your nostril. A person doing either is not a reflection of the tool, but the person.
- jklyon, on 10/11/2007, -10/+18Is The Internet Dumbing Us Down?
No. Now leave. - mwosh, on 10/11/2007, -3/+11Yep, just like how alcohol, video games, sars, homosexuals, mcdonalds, fud, and being unpatriotic (etc) are destroying our country.
Add it to the list. - merreborn, on 10/11/2007, -2/+9"The TRUTH is that the internet has completely changed the way people share information, and elitist ***** afraid of losing their stranglehold on being "experts," on various subjects will continue writing books like this until the old model is gone"
Keen's point is that experts *are* valuable.
Expert journalists provide in-depth, fact checked reporting, while bloggers frequently offer little more than opinion and unsubstantiated rumors.
Expert film makers offer intellectually stimulating film and television, while youtube provides "Guy falls off cliff" and "Dog humps cat".
And so on and so forth.
There's still room for professionals and experts. Amateurs, with few exceptions, do not, and cannot create for free, the kinds of works that trained experts can with a real budget. - meshman, on 10/11/2007, -1/+8"and Web 2.0..."
"beloved Web 2.0..."
Yeah, REALLY dumbed down. - NSMike, on 10/11/2007, -11/+18The title of the book alone is enough to call this guy out as a total asshat *****.
"The Cult of the Amateur"? Give me a break. Most people are not experts. Sounds like this guy is just a corporate shill trying to sell encyclopedias again.
The so-called "wisdom of crowds" has been around a lot longer than he realized, and surprisingly it has provided much more GOOD results in the world than a single authority.
For example, dissenting colonists = United States of America (I know, we're not exactly liked in the world right now, but we've done pretty well for ourselves)
On the other hand, Adolf Hitler = fascism and genocide.
@fkr3 - Those problems were around well before the internet. The internet just made them a lot more easily accessible. - DFENS, on 10/11/2007, -1/+8Yeah. Stupid premise. 'Ideas are too free and rampant on the net! There are TOO MANY ideas, people! We need our ideas in very small quantities, delivered to us by the government and the network news media."
And the argument about 'stupidity of the group' is just as retarded. We no longer value experts, we value the info we can find. That's his belief. Me? I tend to research and check sources AGAINST other sources. And guess what - in my experience, Wikipedia (with all it's *****) is generally about as accurate as professors of the subject I'm researching.
Here is the truth his book doesn't consider:
Idiots are everywhere. The idiots outside the net are the same idiots who are inside the net. The percentage of idiots on and off the net are the same. Idiots per capita is the same everywhere. In real life, I have access to fewer idiots - but online I have millions of idiots to talk to. Because I have more idiots to talk to, I also have more REAL experts to talk to. More idiots = more experts = more information = better chance I get the facts right.
You're right now reading one idiots idea about why this other idiots article about yet ANOTHER idiots book is a bunch of crap. You get to weight all 3 against eachother, and figure it out for yourself.
If this was reviewed on television, you'd have a 4 minute soundbyte and be stuck with many less idiots opinions to help you figure out YOUR idiot opinion.
Conclusion? The guy who wrote this book is just another idiot. - Zuggy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+6The democratization of the internet makes smart people smarter and dumb people dumber. This works because smart people will generate and promote smart content while dumb people will generate and promote dumb content.
Example, a theoretical physicist writes an article on string theory and it ends up on digg, people who are interested in the subject in any form read it and become smarter.
The flip side is somebody posts a video on digg on how to cure the hiccups with black pepper and the dumb people see it and become dumber. - avester, on 10/11/2007, -3/+9if anything the internet keeps people smarter. the internet gives people a tool to find out for themselves what is going on and to find other opinions. the old media is useful but it still only gives you a small narrow view to see the world through but the internet allows people to see the world through their own view or through multiple different view points instead of just what NBC or CBS or whoever wants you to see it through. the internet further enables people to think for themselves and find out for themselves.
- akatherder, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7The article doesn't make a compelling argument at all. The main point is that he disagrees with a lot of people, so they must be brainwashed by the democratization of the Internet.
If you believe and agree with everything you read, then the Internet can dumb you down. If you get different point of views and hear information that you never would have heard before, you are going to learn something worthwhile. - inactive, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5Even if the 'net isn't making us dumber, it certainly is making some of us think we're smarter.
- redfan, on 10/11/2007, -1/+6I'm sure the elites said the same thing when Gutenberg invented his printing press and regular people started to learn to read and write.
- Rhino2, on 10/11/2007, -4/+9Which you could post pictures as replies.
I'd post the guy with the sign:
"get a brian morons!" - inactive, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5I'm not concerned. There is already enough good accumulated research and literature to keep most people busy for a lifetime. Persons doing cutting edge research aren't going to be dumbed down by anything. The masses who don't read books or research have always been dumbed down. Nothing new here--move along.
- pampusik, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5What's this "ruining our culture" nonsense? Why do people assume that cultures are static and need to be preserved, when, in fact, cultures change and reinvent themselves?
Viva 21st Century culture! - Genady, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5An old shop teacher told me a long time ago, "It's not what you know, it's knowing where to find what you need to know." Smartest damned teacher I ever had, and prescient as all hell. This guy should have been in my old shop teacher's class.
- CoreBurn, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4Here, go learn something for free.
http://www.ocwconsortium.org/ or http://ocw.mit.edu/index.html - zenerdiode, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4"I think people who use the word neocon have been dumbed down by the internet (Digg specifically)."
I think people should research the word "neocon" (a word that has been around since the 70s and popularized during the Reagan administration) before making dumb statements such as the above. One place to look is Wikipedia. Now in the context of this article, is that ironic or fitting? hmmmm.... - nubnub, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5***** as long as you stay away from MySpace the internet makes you smarter.
- fermi, on 10/11/2007, -4/+7I believe we need to redefine "expert" for our times. A century ago, being an expert in, say, flora of the Middle East took an incredible amount of travel and time. While the student of that era may have spoken with the originators of thought in a field, that kind of research was limited to a small percentage of the population. Most of society lived day-to-day and was only presented information on a local level.
Today, it is possible to become an expert on, say, the Second World War without visiting a single battlefield. Does direct contact with the past make the knowledge more meaningful? Yes, but it is no longer necessary.
The world has changed. We all have it in us to be experts if we are intelligent enough to separate the wheat from the chaff in the world of knowledge. Some people feel threatened by this. - dbr_onix, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Maybe you would be just as dumb without the internet? In fact, if you use the internet right it could have helped.. "Results 1 - 100 of about 333,000,000 for science study help" \o/
- Samiyam, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3I guess that means the One Laptop Per Child movement is a nefarious plan designed to keep developing countries shrouded in ignorance.
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