What is Digg?81 Comments
- LiquidPenguin, on 10/12/2007, -1/+30A very interesting read, but there's a few points I'd like to bring up.
In point #7, it cites that electronic "books" are not vulnerable to natural disasters or pulverization. This is false and shows a basic misunderstanding just what it means when media becomes digitized.
Digital media is equally vulnerable to natural disasters as their "real world" sisters. The media has to physically exist somewhere, in most cases on a hard drive. This hard drive can easily be lost in any natural disaster and as history and experience shows us, can also be lost in man-made disasters. How much data did we lose when the WTC was destroyed? There are also other dangers present to digital media as well. Hardware can easily fail, destroying data in the process. Malicious worms, virii and Trojans can potentially make their way to the host and destroy thousands of GiBs in the time it takes before one realizes what's wrong. Even an inadvertent rm or an errant update might hose the information in less time that a storm would.
And like any good library, this problem is reduced (but never negated) by replicating the works as widely as possible over a large physical area.
Point #24 mentions that libraries aren't prone to the kind of manipulation as that found on-line. This is true, but it sugar coats the real problem that libraries can and are manipulated. There have been cases where things like political pressure and outright violence have caused the destruction or removal of precious works. In most cases, money is rarely, if ever the issue. It is a sense of one persons "morals" over another. The quality of a work has very little to do with whether people want to manipulate or remove these works. Some examples of banned books can be found at http://www.forbiddenlibrary.com/
Point #33 is slightly misleading, but I'm not grudging it. There are already people out there who are not considered librarians but whose job is to preserve old books for future generations. The ideology of one (Archivists) is not always on par with the other (Librarians) even though both jobs are often similar. Librarians are supposed to make books available to the public for reading with preservation right behind it. Archivists are supposed to preserve the books for generations with making them available to the same a secondary priority. A shift in this would merely mean fewer Librarians and more Archivists. - jivatmanx, on 10/12/2007, -2/+16Libraries are always going to be of a fundamental importance. How do we have a record of things that happened throughout history? The civilizations and political structures that created them are obviously no longer in existence, but they give us knowledge of what came before.
Clearly, electronic data is cheaper, more efficient, and easier to duplicate than paper, the ability to transfer it so easily is obviously of incredible significance.
But we cannot ignore the fact that civilizations rise and fall. Throughout history, ***** happens. Nuclear war, a meteor or volcano may cause us to permanently lose the technology to acess our data, similarly, magnetic storage degrades extremely quickly. Despite assumptions that flash will last 20 years, understand, that is NOT a long time.
What I think electonics can be used for, is to perhaps create a type of "microfilm" for our vast stores of electronic books. Basically, printing very small texts of the book on hemp paper (or any other non-acidic paper) so that we can try and assure it's lifespan.
I know it's hard to understand the importance of leaving our legacy, (considering that so many care so little about radically altering our climate)
We should preserve what we can. - ki1022, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11How are we supposed to have good porn movie plots without librarians?? :-(
- Holyfool19, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11What will we do without somewhat sexy women librarians?
- striker1211, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8As long as there are poor ghetto kids there will be need for libraries, where else would they view their myspace?
- NanoStuff, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8What's a libarian?
On second thought, never mind, I'll just check wikipedia. - ellegb, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Am I becoming obsolete as a librarian - No. As a research librarian I am very much in demand, why? because not all the answers are on Google that's why.
The surface web of which Google trawls through cannot access those web sites that require some form of intervention - namely asking a question or two before being given an answer. And the "deep web" (those sites hidden behind passwords, firewalls and questions) is only a fraction of the material/information that is contained in libraries across the world. What makes a (good) librarian so important is they know where to look....
most libraries around the world have as much electronic information (ebooks, ejournals etc) as they do "hard copy" and even more access to those databases where the really good information resides. - dgolding, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7The author of the article made a major mistake - he associated librarians with books. My sister is a reference librarian at a major research University. I suspect she spends a minority of her time dealing with hardcopy books. She spends a huge amount of time teaching people how to perform complex Google queries (there is a science to getting usable results instead of crap), consulting online databases (many of which are pay for play and require gatekeeping), and helping students and faculty use scientific journal resources. That doesn't even get into government documents or maps/GIS systems. This is a very different librarian and many of the "old school" will not be able to adapt. Helping people use LEXIS/NEXIS is a bit tougher than understanding the Dewey Decimal System...
Think of the next generation of librarians as database and data mining professionals. - RoboRay, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9"When i need an answer i just look it up on wikipedia, takes 1/10th of the time. "
With 1/10th the accuracy. - TheComplex, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Librarians are still the best search engines on the planet. They give you just a couple of really relevant hits, which is enough. Don't need 15 million hits in 0.002 seconds.
- Weasel_DB, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Anyone else remember the Twilight Zone episode with Burgess Meredith? He played a Librarian in a future society. The scene takes place in a court room. The Judge sentences the poor old Librarian to death because he has been found by the state to be OBSOLETE!
- soogy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Support our librarians!
http://www.librarybarnyc.com/images/screensaver2.jpg - danielman94, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Hrmm, maybe Google will have a librarian app, like in Snow Crash, by the time libraries are obsolete.
- MonkeyFarts, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6And zero credibility in an academic setting. I have never had an instructor that accepts Wikipedia as a source of information. In fact, my professors give instant 0's to any paper that lists a Wikipedia article in its sources.
- Librarian1968, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4The idea that in a library it is always "quite time" is long gone (or should be).
- patience, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5In my library, the librarians are having the loudest conversations and eating in the library.
The only people doing real work are the student employees. - ubuwalker31, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Librarians will be around in 500 years, just as Lawyers and Doctors will be around in 500 years. Advances in technology do not eliminate traditional professions entirely. They redefine the size, scope and practice of the profession. If cancer is cured tomorrow, there are still 10,000 other ailments which torment humanity that will need to be treated by a Doctor. If the Federal tax code is abolished tomorrow, teams of Accountants and Lawyers will be needed to figure out the implications of whatever replaces it. If all information is placed "on-line" and physical libraries disappear, Librarians will still be needed to teach people how to retrieve and use the information. And so on.
- CaptShmo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Shhhh! people are trying to read digg here!
- dtfinch, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Libraries have become a place to pick up books you found and reserved online.
- Weasel_DB, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3And here it is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b4eFblS2-io
- linkerjpatrick, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3The Library is very important to me. I can now take my laptop in, acces their wireless network and set up an office for free. I think they might get upset however when I start conducting staff meetings and office parties however.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Hopefully we'll always have a place for librarians
I have some nice memories of my local librarians.
It's not like they're the most important things in my life
but whenever I used to go there i'd feel welcome
and have a nice familiar surrounding.
Why do I not go to the library anymore?
Well I sorta do.. but i'm in college..
and libraries here are giant fortresses
not quite that cozy local library feel
-_- - dtfinch, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3If wearing Depends makes a woman sexy. I just haven't met any young librarians in recent years.
- Coffeedemon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3We'll have a paperless workplace the same day we have a paperless washroom.
- BTime, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3The internet is spiffy in its own way, but it can't fire the imagination like a truly sexy librarian.
- JimXugle, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3mhmm... In the Public School where I live (left it, thank god) the newest book in the library was printed in 1982.
No Harry Potter because of Magic.
No materials supporting any economic system other than Liberal capitalism because it might corrupt us youth.
No materials supporting any government form other than Indirect liberal democracy.
No materials on the inner workings of computers or computer networks because we might learn how to "hack"
No materials that suggest that non-Christian religions have their flaws, as it might turn us into bigots.
No materials that suggest that homosexuality is morally/socially unacceptable, however materials promoting homosexuality are OK.
No materials that describe or depict violent or disturbing images (i.e. a detailed description of a Nazi Concentration camp).
No materials that suggest that there are human rights abuses continuing today.
Yea, censorship sucks. - bariswheel, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Instead of bitching, your civic duty is to report them. Collect evidence and report. Film them and put it up on digg. There's no punishment like public naming and shaming.
Go user content! - RyanJohnston, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I don't want to pay taxes for a library I would never use. Libraries are a luxury.
- bariswheel, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5We need to have areas where we can get away from the capitalistic pop up commericals of every day life, and listen to peace and quiet.
The public library is one of the few places left in this world where you can read a book in peace. Borders, not unless you wish to sit on the floor with annoying background muzak or a very loud cash register (all of which strategically placed in specific areas on purpose by the way). Your house? Yeah if you don't mind being interrupted by cell phones, people coming over, nagging siblings/parents, and other distractions like your kitchen yelling at you to clean it.
The library is one of the few intellectual edifices that are left in this world. It is VITAL.
Sure electronic media is vital as well...but no reason why we can't have both. We just can't be using libraries for 'pwned teenage culture' emo's to check their myspace accounts, and check out blockbuster movies. That's an inappropriate way for libraries to spend taxpayer money. Instead there should be endless rows of documentary dvd's everywhere.
Some of the documentaries out there are so goddamn fascinating (mvgroup.org), it's a shame they're not popular enough for mass appeal. Instead 'snakes on a plane' gets exposure. Watch the movie Idiocracy (same director from office space). It's not the best movie, but it has a VERY important message to take home. Do not breed stupidity and cherish everything that prevents breeding of stupidity. - VinceNoir, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Sadly, it's very unpopular to be intelligent or have original thoughts in the current age. If you do, you become an outcast as people slowly realize you don't fit into the mainstream in every possible way. Didn't buy an iPod and opted for something that supports Ogg Vorbis? You're a freak. You don't like Desperate Houswives and instead prefer foreign film or even stage plays and performance art? What kind of a weirdo are you... This seems to be most concentrated in the United States more than anywhere else. I'm not saying it doesn't happen anywhere else, but it's certainly much more of a problem here.
Americans are constantly encouraged to take the "easy" way out and buy the things you need as opposed to actually working for something. It all spirals down from pressures that business put on individuals whether you're an employee or a consumer. If you're an employee, your employer tries to squeeze every bit of value they can out of you resulting in a deficit of personal time. So as an employee you don't have the time to pursue things that might require a deeper time commitment. Say... learning to bake a good chocolate cake from scratch possibly replacing some of the less healthy ingredients with better alternatives. The answer? Use the money you earned to buy a cake if you want one. It takes less time than making one and you still get the same results. But do you really? I don't think so.
As a consumer, you are constantly being told you need to buy product X or service Y so that your life will somehow become "easier". On top of that, many ads (in all media) portray people who don't buy the product as fools which should give you more impetus to buy in as no one wants to be a fool. But who is really the fool in this formula? The person who overextends their finances just to avoid being like the "fool" in the ad, or the person who makes some intellectual and/or time investment and does things the slightly harder way? Personally, I'd rather make a larger investment now if it will pay off later. In my case that is stuff like learning to rewire my house, using Linux on all my systems, creating my own recipes for things like soft drinks and dessert that don't use sugar.
And how did I get to be like this? Well, I grew up as a library user. I still am. That's where I learned how to do things the RIGHT way instead of just buying a solution for every problem. That's why I can live on a smaller income than most of the people in my generation (I'm 36). Personally, every bit of time sacrifice I've made instead of just buying an easy solution has paid off in the long run and I have libraries to thank for teaching me how to learn things on my own. Unfortunately, this approach is VERY unpopular in today's America. There was a time when behavior like mine was encouraged and lauded as a good thing. Today, I am an obstacle to profit for businesses and most of my generation has been convinced by those businesses to the easy way out every time. Mainly because it makes them a lot of money. - bariswheel, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2And who are you to base judgement on accredited degrees? Before you make outlandish claims, state your evidence, you might get a few of us to pay attention.
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. - Carl Sagan (RIP) - viscousplatypus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2As long as the people who are producing information and information access tools and the people that use that information and those tools are different, we will need people to help mediate, translate, and analyze. Some of those people are librarians.
- Coffeedemon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Actually the next step is already begun with many "library" schools rebranding themselves as schools of "information management". Responsibilities have expanded (in many cases the librarian was always responsible for these but now there is a greater recognition of them) to ensuring that the preservation schedules are in line with what you think you may want in 100 years, migration planning to avoid media obsolensence, standardizing the description of those millions of documents so that search tools can become more effective and retrieve relevant results, train the users on their responsibilities so they don't mis-organize, enacting policies that are in line with the 34 (or so) pieces of federal legislation and acts that govern (in Canada anyway) the management of information. The schools are expanding beyond just physical books to go into system design and analysis, digital libraries, research services, etc.
- Coffeedemon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"a degree as useless as a Masters in Library Science. That's as bad as a communications degree in terms of legitimacy"
Do tell oh great scholar...
Mine got me into information management for a government agency where I coordinate standards for systems, develop instructional material and influence the policies that will impact what kind of state our information will be in in 100 years when researchers of tomorrow come in to try to piece together our history. I like my starting 54K/year and being on track to make 80-90+ by the time I retire. Plus it boils down to helping people (users and the public) find information so I can make $s AND sleep at night. - twiztedambience, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Hey, I still call up the New York Public library whenever I need a really tough research question answered. It's amazing how they can find the answer, and you'll always get something in 5 minutes, guaranteed!! Call them up.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/19/nyregion/19answer.html?ex=1308369600&en=06a00b3321cfbe5a&ei=5088 - Sodathief, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2There will always be a need for those books that have like spells and curses in them. Like the ones in movies, found at the top of a dusty shelf in a old victorian library.
- Librarian1968, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Awesome! I got a Bachelor in Mass Comm ("the English major for people who don't like to read") and an MLIS. I feel so privileged. Now I know why Digg is so popular. I hope to be cool like you people.
- anachronaut, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2A well-stocked library rocks. Forget about research -- how about entertainment? For instance: maybe you're into graphic novels, but you've found that they're just too expensive for you to be able to buy all the ones you've been wanting to read? Well, check your local public library -- if they don't have what you're looking for, they can almost always get it from somewhere through inter-library loans. Acme Novelty Library, From Hell, Jim Woodring stuff... you name it, they've got it or can get it in a fairly short amount of time. They'll have mainstream stuff, too, if that's what floats your boat. And that's just the comics aspect of it, which is relatively minor -- they also have DVDs, including some fairly obscure titles. Oh yeah, they have tons of books, too.
I hadn't visited a public library in about 20 years, and was I ever surprised and delighted with what I found when my SO recently started working at one. I haven't even browsed Amazon recently, much less purchased anything from there (and I used to buy massive quantities of books, sometimes 20 or more at a time). I really can't say enough good things about [good] libraries. If you love to read (or watch movies, etc.), you really do owe it to yourself to check out your local public library. - bdbr, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Actually most people do. I don't know of anyone who would want to sit in front of a computer and read something as long as a Harry Potter book (or try to squint and read it on an iPod). Most people at work will print out a paper of any significant length (more than 5-10 pages) because paper is just better for reading. When I ever see an e-book reader that is small enough that it takes little room in a handbag and is as easy to read as paper, THEN I'll start considering it an option.
Frankly, a lot of people don't have $14 to shell out on a book just for the pleasure of reading it then stashing it away never to be used again. Most technical books are $50 or more. Of course these prices probably pale in comparison to the price of e-book readers. Sure, books are made of trees, but do you have any idea of the toxic chemicals that are used in the manufacturing of e-books (hint: why Greenpeace was protesting outside Macworld)?
I use our library all the time, though I don't use it as much for books these days. They have CDs & DVDs...and there are several internet computers that get a lot of use by people who can't afford that either. Most of the librarians there are basically doing administrative tasks, though the reference desk still gets some use. - Lurz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Did you know that librarians invented tagging? When librarians create indexes (the mother of search engines) they keep them pure and free from lies and malice.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I used to work in a library and it was clear that students wanted more access to online journals and less access to printed copies. It has gotten to the point where students will, often, confine their literature search to items that are available in full-text online. Those subscriptions are NOT cheap and do eat into the budget for everything else. The librarians did come in handy for helping students navigate the various online databases (which is quite confusing because there are a LOT and there is some overlap). It got to be pretty rare to see students at the circulation desk. It was even more rare to see students check out books.
I do think the days of libraries building huge collections are over. Those that already have huge collections will probably let them slowly whither away (with the exception of exceptionally well funded libraries). - quinnk, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Over the course of four years of university, the only thing human librarians did for me that a machine couldn't do was remove illegitimate fines from my account.
- kstyron, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'm with the person who said reading on a screen hurt their eyes after a short period of time. And I know there's more than a couple of people like that. When I read extensive works from electronic sources I print, always. I generally read print books and plan to in the future.
- OnAnyMouse, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Owning a printed document is the primary defense any person has against revisionist history. While I can only name a few websites whose content has changed or has disappeared simply because of controversy, I wouldn't be surprised to learn that there were several thousand, or will be several million over the next few decades.
The internet is an important communication tool, but has not proven itself a viable preservation tool. Communication is important, but more important are static snapshots that are physical, tactile objects. Imagine, for instance, this county in the complete absence of a tactile constitution. Print is vital: newspapers, rogue newspapers, banned books, are all necessary for the preservation of unofficial society. - orbit1979, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I don't know about any of you, but if I read the equivalent of 5 pages on my screen, it starts to hurt! I tried the whole online book experience and I definitely prefer reading the old-fashioned way. Not to mention I frequent several libraries and they are always busy (and no they are not just there for PC access).
One of my mother's employers back in the late 80's said that one day with the proliferation of computers we would be a "paperless" society. The irony is, the use of computers has exploded as he predicted, but we now use more paper than ever before. - Vazel, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Nothing will ever replace real paper and flipping the pages with your hands. And that includes comic books.
- Insolent, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1*Ali G*
Are Librarians Becoming Totally Obese?
What gives? Where's all the hot librarians at? - orbit1979, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I second that. Especially for academic research. Lets face it, I love the Internet, but a lot of information is a.) either inaccurate, with good intentions by the author, or b.) just plain garbage.
My university library gives me access to hundreds of journal databases and other university libraries. The public libraries (at least in my area), although they may not have access to professional journals, do have networks with other local libraries, giving patrons access to tens of thousands of titles. - bobothn, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Get a better monitor or increase the Vertical refresh. monitors use to hurt peoples eyes back when they were 640x480 with a 60 hz Vertical refresh but if you have a decent monitor and have the horizontal refresh turned up it wont.
- o2o2o2o2, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1117,341 libraries in the usa
100 million books in print since the 15th century (estimated)
If 1 librarian in every library could digitize 1 book a day X 365 days =
42,829,465 digitized books per year!
We could digitize every book in 3 or so years. -
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