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Amazon: What are you hiding?

blogs.computerworld.com — Amazon shipped its Kindle e-Book reader way back in November of last year -- since then, the company has tried to paint a picture of runaway success by suggesting that the incredible popularity of the device prevents the company from keeping up with orders. Is the Amazon the Kindle really a secret failure?

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  • ubuntu710, on 03/09/2008, -14/+38i thought it was a failure, anyone else get disappointed? i wouldnt buy one.
    • theragu40, on 03/09/2008, -2/+26I can't comment on whether or not it's a failure (and obviously no one really can except Amazon itself), but I will say that when I saw it at it's unveiling, the first thing I thought was "why"? The idea of an e-book reader has been around for a long time, and it has never *really* taken off. I'm continually puzzled by why Amazon thought the Kindle would be any different. Sure, there will be a niche market for a product like this. For some people, perhaps it fills a gap that another device could not. But as far as broad appeal - I can't see a 400 dollar book reading device every becoming popular or even remotely mainstream.
      • rpgmaker, on 03/09/2008, -0/+13Exactly, there's a niche market, I'm a prospective buyer but the $400 price tag is a deal breaker.
        • L0t3k, on 03/09/2008, -0/+5Agree entirely. I think the concept of an ebook reader is fantastic, but it has to have all the important things we've learned are necessary in one... appropriate contrast, clarity, size, navigation, feel, etc. Most important, we need it at a much lower price point.
      • AmusedToDeath, on 03/09/2008, -1/+4These days, BOOKS are a niche market, not to mention a $400 ebook reader.
        • CoolWind, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1If you had a big medical text like "Current Medical Diagnosis and Treatment" (for example) on a Kindle it would be much more useful than the cumbersome paper version. People in any profession could benefit from the convenience of having reference materials available on a Kindle. I don't think it's a niche market at all. If Amazon is telling the truth about supply versus demand, the price is artificially high simply because they don't need to lower it.
      • jmpeagle, on 03/09/2008, -0/+3if you are an avid reader and buy 2 new books a week (assumming you don't like going to libraries and waiting for new books to move down the waiting list), it is costing you $50+ dollars for your hobby. I can see how it might be a financially sound decision.

        However I like having a personal library where I can see all the books I have read and not fear some electrical shortage causing the memory to be wiped clean (of course I guess a fire would do the exact same thing). Plus, libraries are aesthetically pleasing rooms.
        • beatleman, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2By total coincidence (and because there's a link to the Kindle info page right there on Amazon.com), just yesterday I read over some of the stats and apparently it saves whatever you ordered on the Amazon servers in case you get your Kindle lost, stolen, burned (?), etc. I still don't see it as being worth $400 by any means...
        • HonoredMule, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1or, you could purchase and use an /open/ device without DRM, and be in complete control of your data's reliability and security. I'm thankful for the attention that the Kindle has generated though, because it led me to the PRS-500, a more open and functional device than I believed any current business had the incentive to produce.
        • kryptobs2000, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1you still have to buy ebooks, and the selection of ebooks is by no means comparable to printed books. This thing would take a while to pay off even if you read 2 pricey books per week.
    • jdh24, on 03/09/2008, -3/+8the Kindle has been on the top of Amazon's electronic bestseller list for months and yet I've never seen one in real life. I have seen all the various iPods and cameras that are near the top of the list though.
      • theragu40, on 03/09/2008, -1/+27Well to be fair - Amazon.com is the only place to buy the Kindle. I strongly doubt that every ipod and camera you see on the street was purchased at Amazon.com. I mean...Kmart sells ipods and cameras.
        • FatLoser, on 03/09/2008, -22/+2"Kmart sells ipods"

          Fitting imo. I wonder how long before the fanboy backlash against "unworthy" iPod owners results in an exodus to walkmans or some such emo *****.
        • Nidy1, on 03/09/2008, -7/+2Well that was unnecessary.
      • fuzzypuppy, on 03/09/2008, -0/+11You've hit it. The bestseller list is an amazon web page where you can put number you want on it.

        Even if Nintendo didn't release exact numbers until a few months ago (according to TFA), with the wii, you could see the people swarming the poor clerks when they opened the pallet. You could talk to the stores and find out how many they sold and get a decent idea of the volume in your area.

        Amazon just has a number on a web page and no way to verify things firsthand .
        • Daniel591992, on 03/09/2008, -1/+4Not sure what you mean, but the bestselling page has the bestselling things ON Amazon.

          As for the kindle: If they could make it look nice and drop the price to 200, it would become popular IMO.
          • CoolWind, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1They are selling them before they can make them. Isn't that popular enough?
          • kryptobs2000, on 03/10/2008, -0/+3Not if they aren't making them.
    • headzoo, on 03/09/2008, -2/+4When I heard of the Kindle for the first time, I was totally underwhelmed by the gadget. And I'm a geek.. I love gadgets of all shapes and sizes.
      • cdahlkvist, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1Dugg for the use of "underwhelmed". Whilst I disagree on your point regarding the Kindle I don't hear this word enough. I should hear it more at church.
      • CoolWind, on 03/10/2008, -2/+1Dugg down for being arrogant and unimaginative.
    • sarixe, on 03/09/2008, -1/+2what IS (or should i say WILL be) a failure is your username. come april, you're obsolete, bitch.
    • mrjit, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2I'd love to own one, or one of its many competitors, but not for $300-400.
  • EatingPie, on 03/09/2008, -34/+19Demand outstrips supply. It's impossible to get one without being put on a waiting list. The company claims every single one made is basically sold instantly.

    So are we talking about the Kindle or the Wii?

    The article offers no real info, only speculation, and basically calls Jeff Bezos (Amazon CEO) a liar. All for basically having a product that follows the same hard-to-get trend as the Wii.

    Even though the damn thing was hit with an ugly stick, I have no trouble believing it's popular, especially as a Sony Reader owner, and knowing how awesome e-ink is. The Kindle's even more enticing with Amazon -- and all their book-selling scruples (read publishers will make books for the Kindle because it's AMAZON) -- behind it.

    -Pie
    • OaklandNative, on 03/09/2008, -7/+45Dude, please stop signing all your comments. It's really annoying. We know who you are.

      -oaklandnative
    • diggingdownpie, on 03/09/2008, -17/+3I digg down all of Pie's comments because I'm sick of him signing every single one.

      -Pie
      • cdahlkvist, on 03/09/2008, -6/+4What's wrong with signing your posts? It's not like it takes away from the content. Nor does it require any additional reading.

        - Fat guy in mom's basement
        • cdahlkvist, on 03/09/2008, -1/+1I reply to myself. They all mised the humor. You hurt their feelings because it's true.
        • WhatsUpWithJack, on 03/09/2008, -1/+1*I move away from the common sense to sign my own comments
          • cdahlkvist, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1you only substantiate the point. Thank you.
    • RemyLogan, on 03/09/2008, -0/+13The difference between the Wii and Kindle is that Nintendo has released sales numbers and those numbers are verifiable by 3rd parties who are in the business of reporting how much stuff has been sold. Amazon hasn't said squat about actual Kindle numbers. I'd love to have an ebook reader, but I don't want to get stuck with something that proves to be unpopular and discontinued. Lately, tech companies have a very poor history of pulling the plug on DRM content and leaving users with nothing.
    • ferrariman60, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2Essentially, you are quite right. He didn't say anything with substance, he just hinted at things, like when he said "Amazon is still stubbornly hiding the most basic facts about the Kindle.." but only talks about sales numbers. I agree, it does have the edge over sony's model, primarily for being able to purchase books anywhere. I know that it's the point of his rant, but I'd like to see something other than "but they haven't released any sales numbers!" He basically repeated this and accused amazon of lying for the entire thing.
    • Braxo, on 03/09/2008, -2/+2I've never seen a kindle in the wild nor have I heard of anybody I know buying one. Makes me wonder how popular it really is.
  • valleyvideo, on 03/09/2008, -9/+123Has anyone ever even seen one in the wild? I sure haven't.
    • mbmatt, on 03/09/2008, -1/+25Just saw one on a commuter train this past week... Of course, since the woman using it was an Amazon employee who works on the Kindle, I guess that doesn't really count.
    • vhold, on 03/09/2008, -1/+17This has been my thought for quite awhile as well. I live and work in the Bay Area, practically the most gadget concentrated place in America and I have yet to see one or know of a single person that really wants one.

      I like the idea of ubiquitous delivery, but $400 for pure DRM lockdown is ridiculous. I wouldn't be in the least bit surprised if it is an artificially inflated price so that as they start dropping it, it creates the impression of a good deal, despite the real value never actually being above $100.
      • FatLoser, on 03/09/2008, -15/+3I rarely see desktop computers in public places either!!! OMG, clearly they do not exist. Only laptops are popular.

        Maybe you should look in your neighbors' bathrooms, studies, etc. This isn't a device meant for work, it's one for leisurely reading.
        • Acewrap, on 03/09/2008, -1/+12Your comparison makes no sense. Kindles were made to be carried.
          • FatLoser, on 03/09/2008, -13/+2Do you rummage through strangers' briefcases and backpacks? IPods are visible because people use them when they walk around or are doing something else in public. The Kindle is something you can't use when you're walking, nor when you're doing anything else.

            That said, I've seen at least a half dozen of them in the cafeteria I frequent. Maybe South Dakota is more "with it" than San Fran these days? Hmmmmm?

            Finally, the Kindle has been out for what... 3 full months? The IPod has been out for how many years? Laptops have been around for how many years? The fact that you don't see as many Kindles as you do either of those devices is a ridiculous, absurd, and quite douchebaggy comparison.
    • Dakk, on 03/09/2008, -0/+20My boss got one for himself at Christmas. He let me use it. I was VERY impressed with the legibility of the eInk display. It almost looks like one of those fake screens you see on dummy electronics in a store. It's really hard to believe the Kindle's display is not a sticker until you flip the page. Only thing I didn't care for was the Internet browsing capability. Really slow and most sites were horribly horribly rendered.
    • Ryan2845, on 03/09/2008, -3/+5Kindle has been in the top 5 on amazons daily electronics Bestsellers list since it came out, even thought it has been marked as "sold out" the whole time. Along with iPods and GPS units. I see iPods and GPS units everywhere...yet not a single Kindle yet. I had been thinking to myself a few weeks ago that something was fishy...
      • CoolWind, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1Is it hard to believe that they didn't intend to manufacture millions of Kindles right away? Why should they take a risk of creating a manufacturing facility that can make more units than they need? By taking it slowly, they not only maximize the profit per unit, but they have essentially no risk of losing money. Frankly, I can't see why anybody who can afford the content wouldn't want to own one. The $400 price is really the only barrier.
        • Ryan2845, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1I'm not questioning their manufacturing, i'm just questioning how it is the number 1 best seller EVERY DAY, when they haven't had it in stock in months. I have a hard time believing it is outselling the ipod, without any units to sell. It seems like they are bumping it to the top of the list on purpose, which is shady. Watch it for yourself http://www.amazon.com/gp/bestsellers/electronics/
    • Myonosken, on 03/09/2008, -1/+3I've never even heard of it mentioned. Is it a US only thing?
      • DephexTwin, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1Yes. It does not currently ship outside of the US.
    • DJPandemonium, on 03/09/2008, -0/+4I saw one a couple nights ago.
      Though, once again it was an Amazon employee who works on the Kindle.
      Seems like it's a runaway success with their own employees.

      I got to play with it for a bit. The web access is PAINFULLY slow. We didn't have the greatest reception where we were, but it wasn't that bad, and it was taking several minutes to load a wikipedia page.
    • ericdano, on 03/09/2008, -1/+4Seen about as many of these as I've seen Zune players.....
      And I haven't ever seen a Zune in the wild..........
      • FatLoser, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1Zunes get bitches. You must be a nerd who never gets any, or hangs out with guys who.
    • Ratekin, on 03/09/2008, -1/+2I saw one this morning in Chicago,but i never seen anyone with a zune. early adopters are rare creatures, and they are spooked easily.
    • Sonan, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1My wife has one and she absolutely loves it. And she bought it right before Christmas last year and it was delivered Christmas eve. She accidentally spilled some chicken broth on it and it stopped working, but they sent another one out to her free of charge and even paid shipping of the broken one back. As I type this, she's sitting next to me reading a book on it.
  • W00DR0W, on 03/09/2008, -11/+109I think the problem is that for $399.99 I could get a Stereo System, TV, 360, PS3, Computer, 30 new books, or 80 used books.

    And if I really needed to read my books on a digital format, I'd spend that $400 on a PDA that'll do 100 more things than a Kindle could.
    • MuletTheGreat, on 03/09/2008, -29/+3All that for just $399.99?!?! Where is this mystical store of yours?!?
      • h4mx0r, on 03/09/2008, -2/+5somewhere in China, where all the cheap knock offs are produced.
      • doctornkul, on 03/09/2008, -0/+24He said "or". That means that he could get any one of those items.
      • vibrokatana, on 03/09/2008, -1/+14He used "or". Isn't grammar wonderful?
      • s0u1man, on 03/09/2008, -2/+16"OR". Not "and". You should read before you reply.
      • killgore7, on 03/09/2008, -5/+3He said 'or.'
      • djepik, on 03/09/2008, -0/+9I'm not sure if he said 'or' or if he said 'and' could somebody please clarify this?
    • DolphinGL, on 03/09/2008, -4/+50So many people, like you, just don't get this. The whole appeal of these ebook readers is the e-ink displays. Reading a book on a pda sucks and it's hard on the eyes. The e-ink displays use a real, physical image instead of an LCD. It's not backlit, it takes zero power to run until you turn a page, and the displays are larger. If you've ever seen one, it's quite close to reading text on paper. Whether it's this or the sony reader, I fully intended to own one of these devices soon.
      • TotalHalibut, on 03/09/2008, -3/+10While I won't dispute the quality of the display, I do dispute the need to carry so many damn books with me at any given time when I could just carry around a paperback that is an actual, physical item, and does not restrict me on what I can actually do with it.
        • Macskeeball, on 03/09/2008, -0/+7I don't own a Kindle and have no plans to get one, but think about textbooks in backpacks. Also, think about the ability to search.
          • TotalHalibut, on 03/09/2008, -8/+2Backpacks? Goddamn kids, I used to carry my Law books around under my arm.
        • FatLoser, on 03/09/2008, -8/+5A) You're angry that its hard drive is too large? Huh? If it was smaller you would complain, "Why should I pay $400 for something that can only hold 5 books!@?!"

          B) People bitch and whine about the limitations, but when is the last time you ever did anything but read a book? How is this restrictive? You buy a book, read it, and then you're finished with it. Were you masturbating on the pages so as to glue them together? Is that the feature you're missing?
      • theragu40, on 03/09/2008, -2/+3If Amazon has failed at getting "so many people" like W00DR0W to get it, then the product is inherently a failure. If the Kindle is so much better than other e-book readers or PDAs, and indeed better than having real books, then it's Amazon's job to convince the consumer of that fact, not the consumer's job to take a leap of faith.
        • FatLoser, on 03/09/2008, -7/+2Amazon sells ***** on their website. Why are you pissed at them? Even if this is a flop, what business is it of yours? Shop elsewhere if your panties are in such a bunch over a speculative article written about a store. AMZN is a public company anyway, so it's not like they can hide their numbers for more than a few months.
        • theragu40, on 03/09/2008, -1/+2Ummm...the only one who's angry is apparently you. I'm not mad, I was just giving my take on what DolphinGL said up there. Note that I didn't have to take a combative tone and tell him his panties were in a bundle in order to give my viewpoint. I really couldn't care less how well Kindle does, or how well Amazon does in general. I just found this article to somewhat parallel some of my own thoughts on the issue and decided to comment on some other people's viewpoints in the comments section. Thanks for telling me how mad I am though...I guess I didn't really realize it.
          • FatLoser, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1You need to get your emotions in check, you sonofabitch. I was simply pointing out some facts about Amazon and you come off the handle like this. SETTLE DOWN!!!
        • ninjacob, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1Maybe they need those wicked cool flashy ipod ads that attracted all the teenage girls to buy apple ***** a few years ago.
      • DiggsOnlyJew, on 03/09/2008, -12/+2"So many people, like you, just don't get this"

        There's nothing to get, just because you like a product doesn't mean everyone else doesn't get it. The Kindle is a failure because reading is a failure.
        • theragu40, on 03/09/2008, -0/+5"Reading is a failure"?
          Fail.
        • TotalHalibut, on 03/09/2008, -0/+5Welcome to the Digg generation... of idiots.
      • W00DR0W, on 03/09/2008, -3/+6Fair enough, it's still over-priced and impractical considering I don't read multiple books at the same time.
        • CoolWind, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1It may be over-priced for you, but it's practical for anyone who can afford the cost of admission and the cost of the content.
        • W00DR0W, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1Thank you for that blazingly obvious observation. I'm quite aware that over-priced has a different meaning to me and most people than it does to Kobe Bryant or Jennifer Lopez, that much is clear to me.
    • DifferentAngle, on 03/09/2008, -0/+7I thought the novelty is the screen - isnt it supposed to look like paper (that is, no backlight)?
    • Dakk, on 03/09/2008, -7/+8You could get a:
      crappy Stereo System
      crappy TV
      third 360
      second PS3
      crappy Computer
      30 new books you don’t have room for
      80 used books you really don’t have room for

      And that $400 PDA?
      Top of the list of the “100 more things than a Kindle”:
      1. Go blind trying to read a book on a PDA’s display
      ...

      It's a niche product at the moment ... if you cannot afford one or justify the purchase then all you have to do is wait. It will drop in price, get retooled to be what you want, or drop from the market.
      • Daggity, on 03/09/2008, -3/+5Dude, you know his storage arrangements /and/ his quota of 360s and PS3s? This Kindle must be /amazing!/
        • Dakk, on 03/09/2008, -1/+3My head turns sideways as I am again amazed at someone reading my joke(s), typing repeating as if I made a mistake, and using it as a retort. You fail.
          • CoolWind, on 03/10/2008, -1/+2No. You fail for being so sensitive.
      • ch33sehead, on 03/09/2008, -0/+5Hey come on you could get a pretty decent stereo for $400. Other than that though, yes I agree.
        • Dakk, on 03/09/2008, -1/+1Okay, I'll concede that one can indeed purchase a pretty decent stereo for $400.
        • DemDude, on 03/09/2008, -2/+1What? A pretty decent stereo for 400$? Maybe a used one...
          Last time I bought a stereo, I spent more than 500€ on the Amp alone, plus 200€ for the CD-Player plus 300€ for the speakers. And it's a nice stereo, but far from decent. By the way, 1000€ is more than 1500$.
          • CoolWind, on 03/10/2008, -0/+4If your $1500 stereo is far from decent, then you are an idiot for spending that much on it.
          • DemDude, on 03/11/2008, -0/+1haha, not if one for less is even further from decent ;-)

            I guess it all depends on what you call decent...
    • SilverSeraph, on 03/09/2008, -3/+3I'd rather get an iPhone with PDF Viewer installed.
      • Daniel591992, on 03/09/2008, -0/+3And a short battery life... You'll also need to invest in some glasses (don't wanna go blind)! Plus, where are you gonna get good quality .pdf files of books?
        • CoolWind, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1and newspapers and magazines. And if you realize you need a particular book right now, you are out of luck if you don't have a Kindle. A PDA is more of a niche product than the Kindle. The number of things that you really need a PDA for are very limited.
  • jasonsalas, on 03/09/2008, -1/+23i can't say whether the Kindle's a hit or a miss, but good corporate mistake management is not to admit to the masses that you've made a mistake.
  • Remmy, on 03/09/2008, -16/+12The Kindle is kindling. With a design straight out of the 80's, it's perpetual vapor ware. The idea is an excellent one, but their execution was horrible. Amazon can claim what they want, but with that price tag, and a design that looks like my old Tandy, thanks, but no thanks.
  • akatsuki, on 03/09/2008, -7/+20Ugly, closed format, expensive, over-engineered, soon to be outdated with a better display... What is there to really like? One friend of mine bought one and he admits that it is purely cause he is impatient to purchase books and always forgets to before boarding a plane.

    eInk is just not there yet. And there is no way I want a dedicated device just for reading books anyway, I have enough crap to carry around as is.
    • rolf, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1"I have enough crap to carry around as is...."

      That is actually the idea. I don't know about you, but I hated carrying a backpack full of books for school or having my library take over shelves and shelves in my home (especially when I move) -- when one device can do store it all. And no, reading from PDA or LCD screens sucks for extended periods.
  • drmobutu, on 03/09/2008, -14/+2The next version of the ipod touch will make everybody forget the kindle ever existed...
    • samirss, on 03/09/2008, -0/+11And why is that? Is the next version of ipod touch, dumping its current display and moving to e-ink?
    • Skod, on 03/09/2008, -4/+3***** APPLE.
  • TotalHalibut, on 03/09/2008, -7/+82While an interesting conspiracy theory, this blog's complete lack of evidence makes it about as worthless as the vague statements of 'runaway success' that it seeks to debunk.
    • imikedaman, on 03/09/2008, -1/+9Ha, you think valid evidence is a requirement for shaping the opinions of the masses on digg? You're silly.
      • TotalHalibut, on 03/09/2008, -1/+2Hey now, any opportunity to expose the lurid ***** that is the vast majority of 'New Media' is enough in my book. There's a reason blogging, vblogging, podcasting etc is not taken seriously, and that sensationalist, baseless opinion column is a prime example. As a podcaster and occasional blogger I'd very much like the fools that write this kind of stuff to fall down a well, so the rest of us get taken seriously for a change.
      • FatLoser, on 03/09/2008, -1/+1Ha, you think any evidence is a requirement for shaping the facts of the masses on digg? You're silly.
    • schemp98, on 03/09/2008, -1/+9I thought the whole point of the article was that Amazon did not give any evidence to it's Kindle sales numbers...
      • TotalHalibut, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2And do two wrongs make a right? Remember, the burden of proof is on the accuser.
  • lukeduff, on 03/09/2008, -2/+10I hope it's doing well. I have one and I really like it.

    I'm sure the later hardware generations will address shortcomings, but for a device that's completely focused on reading books, it's pretty good.
    • PSUstoekl, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1How is the whole "whispernet" experience? Do people ever give you strange looks? Did you experience the alleged wait times?
      • lukeduff, on 03/09/2008, -0/+0Books are delivered almost instantaneously. Never had a long wait time.

        Browsing the store has always been at a reasonable speed.
  • flip2trip, on 03/09/2008, -4/+7Who wants to carry around a $400 book to read? Heck, I would be worried about losing it, someone stealing etc....at least with a book I'm out less than $20. Besides you still have to buy the books you store on the Kindle, and what if you want to share?
    • mradules, on 03/09/2008, -1/+7Exactly. The whole idea behind the Kindle baffles me. You can understand someone wanting to bring all their music with them, as a given album takes less than an hour to listen to, but does anyone really need more than one or two books on them at once?
  • EvilDr.X, on 03/09/2008, -1/+19Bah. The headline made me expect a CoS story. Something along the lines of "What are your crimes, Amazon? What are you hiding? Is it murder? Are you a pedophile, Amazon?"
  • TinternAbbot, on 03/09/2008, -3/+4Buried for poor writing.
  • johnhummel, on 03/09/2008, -3/+18If the thing was $99, maybe even $150, I'd consider it. Maybe if it was like an iPod - eReader and music player in one, then I could almost consider it. But $399 as it is?

    Nah. I'll pass.
    • FatLoser, on 03/09/2008, -7/+1want a medal?
    • Dakk, on 03/09/2008, -0/+6Actually, it can play MP3s and Audiobooks too.
      • johnhummel, on 03/09/2008, -3/+4I see that nowhere on its description - if that's accurate, they need to publish it better.
        • Dakk, on 03/09/2008, -0/+4It's accurate.
        • genericwhiteguy, on 03/09/2008, -0/+3Halfway down the page.

          Audio: 3.5mm stereo audio jack, rear-mounted mono speaker
          Content Formats Supported: Kindle (AZW), TXT, Audible (formats 2, 3 and 4), MP3, unprotected MOBI, PRC natively; HTML, DOC, JPEG, GIF, PNG, BMP through conversion
    • pakakapa, on 03/09/2008, -1/+1I don't think the title of "the most humongous mp3 player in the world" is something they're after.
  • 5Twelve, on 03/09/2008, -1/+8For a guy that seems to think the Kindle is a BS marketing ploy he's sure taken the time to write about it a lot. He has like 4 blog posts about the damn thing.

    Personally, I think it's way overpriced. Amazon should be selling these things to get the people in the door for the downloading service, instead of ripping people a new one for what looks like a beta product at best. If it was 99 bucks I could see myself buying one but for $400 I'll be buying an Eeepc and get a lot more done with it.
  • LMControl, on 03/09/2008, -1/+4I know no one who owns or wants one. I know a dozen people who would kill to get out of their cell contact just to get the iPhone. Go figure...
    • DarkDx, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1I will NEVER get into a cell phone contract, NEVER.
      Unlocked iPhone ftw.
  • mikegre, on 03/09/2008, -3/+18I have one and I love it. Period.
    On another point, has anyone noticed how many lunatics there are out there? Conspiracy nuts, paranoid freakazoids and envious know-nothings. I think the net has facilitated the ability for all these misfits to aggregate and develop a sense of community where they can all feel normal. Interesting cultural phenomenon.
    • TotalHalibut, on 03/09/2008, -1/+5You have just noticed this?
    • georgetds, on 03/09/2008, -1/+4A conspiracy nut mumbling to himself is just a nut. A conspiracy nut raving in a blog with a following cheering each word he types is a hero.
    • Nick519, on 03/09/2008, -0/+3i've been following ebook reader news in general for about 2 years across several dedicated sites, and i've seen far more positive comments about the kindle from people that actually have and are using them than i've seen negative comments. all the negative comments i've seen are from people who (like most of the comments here) have never seen or used one, and either have NO clue about the purpose and cost of ebook reader and have no idea about the realities of marketing and distribution.
    • mikegre, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1Let me add this. You can go to the Gutenberg Project (http://www.gutenberg.org/wiki/Main_Page) and convert any of those books for use in your Kindle for free. Gutenberg catalogs books out of copyright...think all of Shakespeare, Jane Austin, Tolstoy, etc etc. Check it out. I've actually downloaded more books from Gutenberg than I have bought from Amazon.
  • digitallysick, on 03/09/2008, -1/+3Its nice, but far to expensive, think about how many real books you could buy with that money.
    • AmusedToDeath, on 03/09/2008, -0/+5Or you could just get a library card and have thousands of books at your disposal for - wait for it ... FREE!
      • jhuebel, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1Well, I dugg both of you up. You're both right. The difference is that if an ebook is available, you don't have to wait for someone to return it before you get your copy. So there's a convenience there.
  • rento, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2The device is not bad and I think it markets for its functions and not for its looks. I would have bought the device if it was available in the UK. I had a little play with it while in US for work and the reader it's great. I have to say there are some design flaws here and there but overally is the best ebook reader on the market. And don't forget it is also a very basic but handy internet tablet.
  • xOKxWhy, on 03/09/2008, -1/+8What are your crimes, Amazon? I bet you made the Kindle!
  • dood, on 03/09/2008, -0/+3The big selling point for these is the idea that it could store the dozens of heavy textbooks a student needs to get through college in a much smaller package. But has this materialized? It seems like it'd require a partnership with a school, so they could get every textbook "digitized" (kindlized?).
    • roflbrothel, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2I don't think it has, I'd love to have all my reference and school books stored on my laptop though.
    • georgetds, on 03/09/2008, -0/+4Kindling? But book burning is usually a bad idea.
    • signal15, on 03/09/2008, -0/+6Yeah, that would be great.... Until you realize that because of the DRM, you can't turn around and sell that $200 chemistry book when you're done with it. The kindle would be a great way for college bookstores to screw the students even more.
      • MScrip, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2They should sell the Kindle textbooks cheaper. It's just bits anyway. The college could get a license to sell textbook via Kindle. There would be unlimited copies, no torn pages, no stockrooms filling up.

        I'd rather pay $50 to use a Kindle version of a Chemistry book, than spend $200 on the heavy book, and still not be able to sell it later after they change editions. If every freshman paid $400 for a Kindle, that's 8 semesters of textbook they will have access to.
        • bingobongony, on 03/10/2008, -0/+2Eight semesters? what decade are you living in? The average freshman these days takes between 9 and 10 to graduate now.
          • MScrip, on 03/12/2008, -0/+1I should know that... I was in college from 1995-2002 :)
      • hakamanakus, on 03/10/2008, -0/+0They do sell cheaper, just search Amazon.com, hell you can get Pride and Prejudice by Jane Austen for 25 cents and have it downloaded in seconds. If you read a lot you would end up making savings that would pay for the Kindle, plus save shelf space. Wouldn't have to pay gas for trips to book store, or to have the book shipped and wait days/weeks. This also implies that a college student wouldn't be paying $200 for that chem book dawg! Of course, I expect the book stores that sell $200 dollar books and buy them back at $20 to sell again won't like this idea, they'll probably be giving incentives to textbook publishers to not make their material available on Kindle. Guess we'll have to see.
  • Nubli, on 03/09/2008, -2/+2Kindle is a good concept for the technically average user. My mother and grandfather both have one and use it all the time, yet they still go back and read paperback/hardback books because there is a large gap in what is available on the Kindle. Also prolonged use causes words to burn into the screen (yay LCD's) because they all show up in the same exact spot for any page in the story.

    Good start, but could be so much better.
  • hiro, on 03/09/2008, -3/+7A secret failure? What's secret about its failure, I thought it was common knowledge?
  • jdeuel, on 03/09/2008, -0/+5"How to drive up page hits" or "Accuse Accuse Accuse"
  • dhbanes, on 03/09/2008, -8/+1THE AMAZON THE KINDLE THE SECRET FAILURE
  • roflbrothel, on 03/09/2008, -2/+6I thought the Kindle was a stupid idea to begin with. I already have an e-book reader: it's called a laptop.
    • bingobongony, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1You pop open your laptop on the subway, do you?
      • jhuebel, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1When I lived in NYC, I used my laptop on the subway all the time. How is that strange?
  • RationalXubrnce, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1Ebook reading needs to concentrate on working with devices people already carry. Kindle does seem like a pretty nice device all things considered though
  • DeucesWild, on 03/09/2008, -2/+4I would buy one if it were $99, had a color screen so I could read comic books of course and didn't charge extra for blogs which are already free.
    • bingobongony, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1OK...but they are not going to set a price point, and specs just for one person.
      • jhuebel, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1While I agree with you that they wouldn't do that for one person, I think that a $99 price point would open up the Kindle to a lot more people than just DuecesWild. I'd buy on at that price, personally. I don't even really care about color.
  • baconz, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1I'm surprised nobody has commented on the name. Is certainly doesn't evoke images of reading, or books, or spending lots and lots of money to read books that you could by for $10. Just what does the name mean?
    • cadmiumpaint, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1yeah its funny since kindle means to set on fire....i guess amazon wants to burn all books......
  • Scabbait, on 03/09/2008, -1/+3What is interesting is that all of the people who actually have one seem to REALLY like it. YOU may not want to pay 400 bucks for one but that doesnt make it a failure. Sure it could use some changes but very few first edition tech products are perfect from the start. Give the ugly thing a break...
  • caseclosed326, on 03/09/2008, -1/+3I have one and I really like it and I am not too concerned with it being a failure. As long as I can still USB some books onto the kindle I will be fine.
  • footodors, on 03/09/2008, -0/+4there's 1956 reviews of it on Amazon. wii has 974. Couldn't find a product with more reviews, so they must be selling a few.
    • Scabbait, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1Unfortunately a lot of those are negative reviews from people who dont even own one... Its not the product THEY want it to be so they give it a negative review. As for the people who own one and gave it a review they are almost all positive.
      • caseclosed326, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2I found this to be hilarious. Before they even started shipping them there were a ton of negative reviews for the Kindle. I think some people in the tech community have weird standards and they throw a fit anytime a new product is not tailored to what they want.
  • jminni, on 03/09/2008, -2/+1Can't you access email remotely with this device? Scott says so in his blog.
    www.hanselman.com/blog/AmazonKindle.aspx
    That seems like a good reason to get one.
    • albundy, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2It's a piece of cake to use gmail with this thing. Someone was even kind enough to publish a kindle book that shows how to do it for the less techy folks. I suspect you can also use google's reader service to read blogs, but I haven't tried it.
  • hardwickj, on 03/09/2008, -0/+3I met a trucker using one of all people. He actually said he knew several others as well. It makes sense since for the $400 price tag, they can automatically pull down their favorite publications - for free - over Sprints mobile data services. I didn't know it previously but apparently they bundled that into the price. Not really a bad deal when you consider that.
    • thereyago, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1Hey I'm a trucker and why the "of all people"? Anyway. I use my laptop with sprint and it is great but the problem with the kindle is you have to pay for books. The library is free and you can get books for weeks and recheck them online. The Kindle is a way to pay more money out when all I want to do is get more free knowledge. anyway truckers have to be up on communication technology so it makes sense for a trucker to be ahead of the curve.
  • WSPanic201, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2The only thing I see this thing useful for is college textbooks. If I bought that thing and was able to purchase my books cheaply and store them on it, it would no doubt pay itself within at most 2 years. Otherwise I don't think people want to stray from the 'comfort' of a good ole book.
    • cadmiumpaint, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1alot of teachers just scan stuff and email it out as PDF's. pretty easy if you have some rare out of print texts that you want your students to read from.
    • madeingermany, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1I know this is not the right crowd for this kind of information, but my wife told me that Whoopi Goldberg and Martha Stewart on The View loved it and suggested using the Kindle instead of Text-Books at school.

      But I would be surprised if the Textbook lobby would swallow that pill and let go of the very lucrative revisions they make each year.
  • devolved, on 03/09/2008, -0/+6I've got one (yay wife's foresight at Christmas!) and love it. I'm an avid book collector and this will certainly let me maintain 'reading copies' electronically, cutting down on shelf usage. Plus, every time I travel I usually pack 5-10 books to read, and this is lots better. It does real good at book-like things and not so well at computer-like things, but at least you can check email and stuff for free, albeit slowly. Also, the UI for organizing content looks like a programmer wrote it rather than a human factors person.

    Amazon actually did a piss-poor job advertising this thing's capabilities, and I don't know why. For example, you can put pretty much any text-y format thing on it (for free over USB, for 0.10 by wireless) like .pdf, .doc, and even .html. You can read blogs and web pages and stuff on it for free (but the pay versions are much more device-friendly). It's a Java based device so it's only a matter of time before the API gets opened up (with or without Amazon's consent). It plays audiobooks and mp3s. And shows photos (in b&w). And plays Minesweeper.
    • spacefaced, on 03/09/2008, -0/+1Jesus, that does sound pretty sweet.
  • albundy, on 03/09/2008, -0/+4I've got a Kindle. I received it as a gift. I have to say I am really happy with it. I do a lot of wildlife photography. It involves being still for long periods of time. I always make sure I have packed my Kindle. As far as DRM, I have downloaded a bunch of stuff and copied it to my Kindle. I also use their pay service. My only complaint is that all of the titles I want aren't available. Of course a lot of them I can find on google. It works with pdf's, contrary to what most people who don't have one say. As an example, I routinely copy books I purchased off of Oreilly's Safari service. Wonderful.
  • sega01, on 03/09/2008, -7/+1DRM=failure
    Kindle=DRM
    Kindle=failure
    • Dakk, on 03/09/2008, -1/+5You do not have to use any DRM'd files on this if you do not want to. It will read open format documents. So you are wrong if you equate the Kindle to DRM. You fail. sega01=failure

      Oh crap... sega01=DRM!!!!
      • sega01, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1It's main feature is the DRMed books and such. For the price and usability, I see no reason why you would get it for any other use. And by buying the Kindle in the first place, you support DRM. A tablet PC or just a laptop would work fine for Kindle's alternative functionality.
    • Nick519, on 03/09/2008, -1/+3this kind of simplistic thought process is also behind creationism.
  • aihuman, on 03/09/2008, -5/+1Is the Amazon the Kindle really a secret failure?Yes.No one reads books.
    • cadmiumpaint, on 03/09/2008, -2/+1people still read books. No one reads fake digital books.
  • AllLitUp, on 03/09/2008, -0/+3I don't know, there are nearly 2000 product reviews on the site alone...

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000FI73MA/ref=am ...
  • Popperian, on 03/09/2008, -0/+4I bought one and I like it a lot. The only real gripe I have is that it costs too much.

    But it really does make a good book replacement. I enjoy reading on it / etc. and the "always available" high-speed Internet access to the bookstore with no monthly fees is really pretty killer, and the bestsellers are cheaper on it as well.

    I really like the device, the "Ink" technology is quite cool, it makes it very easy to read books, and like I said, my only gripe is the price of it.
  • spiffywilco, on 03/09/2008, -1/+4I'm just glad I have my trusty newton 2100 to read my ebooks.
  • bigsteve, on 03/09/2008, -2/+1I have a $400 eBook reader. It's also a phone, web browser, email client, calculator, music and movie player, camera, Google maps viewer, and a bunch of other things too. I can stare at the screen all day and my eyes are fine. Apple makes it.

    Seriously though, the price tag seems to be for the eInk display, which is amazing; it only needs power during refresh. But I'll pass on the DRM. I personally don't read more than one book at a time, and I don't think many others do either.
    • bingobongony, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1The part where you said "apple makes it" made everyone realize that the rest of your comment was nothing but a plea to Steve Jobs to drop his pants for you.
      • bigsteve, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1So? He's kinda cute.

        ...point being, lots of smartphones display eBooks.
  • unit451, on 03/09/2008, -5/+0I don't believe the hype. This is no wii console. I bought this bad boy at 50% off when it was posted at CrazyTownDeals.
    I regret ever buying it.
  • cadmiumpaint, on 03/09/2008, -2/+1all i can say is that i know at least a dozen people who are tech gadget nerds who ran out and got the iPhone within the first 2 weeks....they don't have kindles. I've never actually seen one in the wild, and i go buy coffee shops semi often.

    I've also heard no buzz about it anywhere sooooo.........
    • mrjit, on 03/09/2008, -1/+1I love that on Digg buying iphones and EEE's is the epitome of "gadget geek."
    • bingobongony, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1And you are indicative of hte general population...OK.

      Apple's stock has fallen 40% in less than 3 months...mostly due to the failure of the iPhone.
      • cadmiumpaint, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1hard to call a product that gets on the cover of Time magazine and has a few million sales under its belt a 'failure' I see a few dozen of them a day. They are pretty widespread at least in my city. I was just saying of all the tech savy people that i know who rush out and buy new gadgets none of them have even talked about the kindle.

        you must be a windoze fan boy who hates all things apple...stats to back up your claims please?
    • Sonan, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1The Kindle isn't a "tech gadget nerds" kind of device. My wife has a Kindle and couldn't care less about the iPhone. And she doesn't hang out in coffee shops. She mainly uses it at home and in the car. It goes almost everywhere with her, but those are the main times she actually uses it.
      • cadmiumpaint, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1you'd think that the market for it would be the same people who use laptops, cell phones, mobile internet etc,
  • BlogCrawler, on 03/09/2008, -0/+3If you look at the comments here and comments on Amazon, it looks like people who actually used Kindle, loved it. So may be we should use one before we ejaculate our opinion about the device.
    • madeingermany, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1Thank you for talking sense.
      There is a ton of companies that chose not to divulge individual products' sales numbers. And just to quench some people's conspiracy theories is not a good enough reason to do so.
  • cadmiumpaint, on 03/09/2008, -4/+1If the thing could browse the internet, was in color, and could say DL newspapers, and magazines in digital form..maybe play music too.....basically be a giant version of an iPod touch, then i might get into it.
    • mrjit, on 03/09/2008, -1/+4Do you even know anything about it? It downloads nationwide newspapers, AND it has an mp3 player.
      • cadmiumpaint, on 03/10/2008, -1/+1yeah but its black and white. newspapers and magazines come in full color ...thats what i meant. i didnt know it had an mp3 player. i think its still too expensive and limiting for what it is.
    • Sonan, on 03/10/2008, -1/+0And it has limited internet browsing features. They call it experimental, and it's not the best in the world, but it'll due for looking up showtimes, etc. And color would be a waste on such a device. I'd bet 90% of Kindle owners would say they don't care about color.
      • cadmiumpaint, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1i'd never buy a digital device to read things, browse internet etc that wasn't in full color. Seems too 1999. We've come to expect digital things to be in color, even menus on cameras, tv's, phones etc.
        • spacechip, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1I don't know about you but I expect the text I read in books to be black. I understand what you're saying, e.g. I would really like a color iPod even though I don't even look at it while I'm listening to music, but the whole point of eInk is that it's incredibly efficient at doing one thing and one thing only: displaying text. If you want color, you want an LCD display, not an eInk one. When someone says they'd buy a Kindle if only it were in color it's kind of like saying they'd buy an iPod Shuffle if only it were the iPhone.
          • cadmiumpaint, on 03/10/2008, -0/+1yeah but if part of its appeal is to show you newspaper and magazine content, its already crippled. Yes i like reading text in black...but like on the internet, i like the text in black with color stuff around it. Nothing on digg *needs* to be in color. It just is because its more dynamic.

            I remember when color in newspaper was a big deal. Everyone started doing it at least on the cover like 10 years ago. its hard to go backwards.
  • DuffyDirect, on 03/09/2008, -1/+1"Is the Amazon the Kindle really a secret failure?"

    say wha?
  • aarongzmn, on 03/09/2008, -0/+2I think its a great product but the price is way to high.
  • TheRebel88, on 03/09/2008, -0/+0Reading books? I'm not familiar with this practice...sounds strange.

    back to TV
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