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55 Comments
- samfisch, on 07/15/2009, -6/+59relying on a paypal account wasnt a smart move. This should be known by now.
- yeeaauuh, on 07/15/2009, -1/+46With all the complaints about PayPal, I can't understand why SOME payment processor hasn't stepped up to try to get some of their market share. Email for customer service....screw that.
- rolf, on 07/15/2009, -0/+44Paypal sucks. They aren't really a bank so they aren't held to bank laws. However that works is beyond me.
A bank can't freeze your account and take your money because they decide they don't like your business. They only can do that when the government tells them to. Paypal, otoh, does whatever it feels like. - ThantiK, on 07/15/2009, -1/+39Google checkout. And yes, they have non-profit.
- inactive, on 07/15/2009, -3/+39Dugg for PayPal hate
- Ryan0617, on 07/15/2009, -3/+33We need google checkout to step it up!
- Otto, on 07/15/2009, -0/+29FFS, you'd think people would have wised up by now.
PAYPAL IS NOT A BANK. They are a company and they can basically do whatever they like. Money in a Paypal account is not yours, it's Paypal's money until they give it to you. If they decided to say "hah hah! we ownz all the monies now!" and just keep everything, they can do so.
Do not trust money in a paypal account. Do not leave money in a paypal account. Paypal can, and will, lock your account for any reason whatsoever, including "we just wanted to take all your money, sucker".
The biggest mistake you can possibly make with them is leaving money in a Paypal account for any length of time whatsoever. - hevnsnt, on 07/15/2009, -3/+26@simplenomad: Keely Fox is the current PR person for paypal, kfox@accesspr.com, 415-844-6284
- xavier2010, on 07/15/2009, -0/+19figures that you call a live service and they tell you to use email... Like a bank teller saying you have to use the atm, I can't help.
- rolf, on 07/15/2009, -0/+17Paypal, like ebay, has first-mover status (which is why ebay bought them rather than starting their own service). First mover status is a powerful thing.
Paypal needs to be recognized as a bank that it is, and put under banking laws and requirements. - Quadling, on 07/15/2009, -0/+16We are working to resolve this. Johnny is attempting to set up another account for people to send money to, and we are working to set up contingency plans for Defcon. There will be a booth, no matter what. Disclaimer: I am a officer of Hackers For Charity. Double Disclaimer: I was not part of the banking bit. Triple Disclaimer: I will be the poor schlub trying to set up a Defcon booth with no money. <grin> This could be interesting.
We will diversify our funding sources/bank accounts. In the meantime, if anyone has pull with Paypal, or as seen above, has some good ideas about how to diversify our funding/bank accounts, please let us know. It is appreciated. I have already called Keely Fox and left a voice mail.
Happy to answer any questions.
joshuaviktorATGmail.youknowtherest
Joshua - HisTumness, on 07/15/2009, -0/+15Really. After this: http://www.somethingawful.com/d/news/paypal-fiasco ...
I don't understand why any nonprofit would use PayPal anymore. - vagarach, on 07/15/2009, -1/+15Absolute genius going to Africa and having no means of survival other than Paypal. Wow. This guy is a hacker, the very last person you'd think would trust Paypal with a large sum of money like that, but instead, he goes to Africa, has limited access to the internet, and then makes that his sole access point to money that he and other people are depending on.
Such a horrible situation, I hope that he can resolve it, may be some contacts in the US could get Paypal to reverse this dickheaded (but typical) behaviour of theirs. - StonerThomas, on 07/15/2009, -0/+13No, Google is notorious for having horrendous support on any service (even for people advertising on Google). Last I checked they didn't even have a phone number for Google Checkout.
We need a company that gives a *****, and isn't a bloated behemoth. - yttrstein, on 07/15/2009, -8/+20While Paypal is certainly evil, this guy is a complete idiot. He decides to rely on his paypal account to survive after not bothering to read any of the instructions or fine print about how to set up a non-profit with them. Smooth.
- xSPANNERx, on 07/15/2009, -3/+11Really man? I think you need to read about Johnny and what he is doing and what he gave up to do it... Then maybe the empathy that your parents taught you when you were a little child will kick in. Remember empathy? It was probably right around the time they taught you not to make fun of people less fortunate and also taught you the "Golden Rule" (also known as the ethic of reciprocity).
- nETBUs, on 07/15/2009, -1/+8Despite the fact that he used PayPal and is now getting screwed, ease up people. Johnny is doing a noble and charitable thing and trying to help people. How many of YOU have ever put yourselves out there to help someone else. Rather than sitting on your fat arse and slamming the guy, why not pitch in and help out. Our thoughts and prayers go out to you Johnny. Let the Digg downs begin!
- s0nicfreak, on 07/15/2009, -0/+6"The bottom line is PayPal has frozen my assets (which aren’t theirs.. how can they do this?) "
Read what you sign up for... basically paypal says that they can freeze your account any time they want to.
Yes there's google checkout, but a LOT of people online only want to use paypal. With ccnow (google it) you can except paypal payments after being banned from paypal... - sexybobo, on 07/15/2009, -0/+6Some one tried to set the account up as a non-profit company which they are not a non-profit yet. That is why everything got locked up is because they made a mistake.
Also PayPal really isn't the best thing to keep $10K in - HonoredMule, on 07/15/2009, -0/+5Buried for failing to purely and completely loathe and condemn PayPal.
As your own experience relates, they regularly hold "your" money at the end of a stick and then make you dance through hoops for a /chance/ at getting (most of) it back. How anyone can be willing to stand for that is beyond me. The risk of potentially *throwing your money away* completely invalidates any possible benefit from satisfying the odd customer, seller, or donation acceptor who thinks using PayPal is a good idea.
If you run a business and really want to look out for your clients, warn them about PayPal...they should know that using credit cards is actually far safer AND easier AND universally accepted, and might even appreciate being educated before *they* get taken to the cleaners or just royally screwed over by PayPal's unreliable service. Until PayPal dies the horrible death it deserves, we probably won't see a truly ubiquitous, safe, and reliable online currency system - Kewjoe, on 07/15/2009, -0/+5http://www.hackersforcharity.org/265/paypal-makes- ...
Sounds like it was resolved. - anawnymoose, on 07/15/2009, -0/+4Anyone remember when paypal hijacked tens of thousands of dollars earmarked for katrina victims because it counted as "suspicious activity", and even refused to forward it to the red cross?
- xero69, on 07/15/2009, -0/+3You'd think a good hacker would know better than to keep any money in a Paypal account any longer than necessary.
- tutelage, on 07/15/2009, -2/+5I like and dislike paypal. I have had a similar experience when they had a bug in their software which did not allow me to purchase items in EUR.
Their customer service got me to transfer funds from CAN to EUR then to USD to EUR and back to CAD. Sure it was only $20. I lost money on each transfer and Paypal did not repay me back even though it was their customer service that told me. They flagged my account and when I called back in 2 days there was no record of it ever happening. (see: http://michael-mcmullen.blogspot.com/)
Good luck to you and your company. - AFriendlyNerd, on 07/16/2009, -0/+3@yeeaauuh Almost simultaneously, every serious paypal competitor shuttered a couple of years ago, their market share was so low. Then eBay bought it, and did their best to make it the only game on eBay.
Nice job eBay and PayPal, customers are terrified of using you and merchants hate you. - dagr8tim, on 07/15/2009, -0/+3I spent nearly an hour on the phone with paypal last night because they sent me an email on an auction I had on ebay and due to a glitch in their system, they didn't send me the buyer's address.
- FXNGLAS, on 07/15/2009, -0/+3I understand the guy is in a bad spot, but using a paypal account was definitely a bad idea for what he is doing, and it's also kinda his fault for not following proper steps for the official non-profit status before even doing the deed. 501C3 is a big deal.
- budaloco, on 07/15/2009, -0/+3I guess they coud post some bank info se people can wire some money in the meantime. Good luck with this man!
- Quadling, on 07/15/2009, -0/+3Paypal restored the account. Life is good. Shirts are ordered for Defcon. YAY!!! Paypal was supposed to send me the official statement as to why it happened, but haven't got it yet. Thanks for digging this story, guys and gals. Appreciated. Stop by Defcon booth for a discount on T-shirts if you digged or commented on this story.
Quadling/Joshua - p0tent1al, on 07/16/2009, -0/+3You don't really need as much support on a system that runs great automated, unless the company is actively trying to screw you over (PayPal). Google Checkout already works great and has had minimal complaints, and many people have already started using it in favor of PayPal. Google needs to push harder for it to become easier and ubiquitous.
- lolmax, on 07/15/2009, -1/+4***** paypal! me and nearly everyone I know have had at least one major problem with these *****
- NegativeDigg, on 07/17/2009, -0/+2Everything has been resolved...Move along people...
Look here...
http://www.hackersforcharity.org/265/paypal-makes- ... - xSPANNERx, on 07/15/2009, -1/+3When you read the article Johnny specifically says: "I had a subscription system running under WP-MEMBER for about a year before that software flaked out on me. Multiple domains caused problems that were irreconcilable." *and* "So I shopped around and picked up Suma. In the process, we had to switch to a business account (although I don’t understand why…wp-member was happily doing recurring payments without a business account)."
The way I read this is, "I wanted to keep it non-business but the provider I had to switch to forced me to get a business account".
On top of this, perhaps PayPal should have assigned a human to look into this rather than some semi-automated process? - inactive, on 07/15/2009, -0/+2thanks for the info
- eavesdrop, on 07/16/2009, -0/+2I gave up on paypal 5 years ago, you should too. They're owned by ebay...... that's enough for me thanks.
- rxbudian, on 07/16/2009, -1/+3You should ask yourself this question: Do you really want to have PayPal lower their security standards just to make your life easier?
It's too much of a hassle for me to deal with paypal since I don't use that kind of service often, so I just let the Credit Card expire on my paypal account. - Black6x, on 08/01/2009, -0/+1Yeah, seriously. Writing your email like this will save your spam blocker some work. It's just a way of not putting your email out there for *****.
Why would you question people with a booth at DefCon? - kopiwrite, on 07/15/2009, -0/+1eBay did start their own service at one point, but it failed so hard they just ended up buying out PayPal.
- config32, on 08/03/2009, -0/+1Ouch!.. i agree..if paypal says we ownz all da money.. then we could not do anything about..
so better not leave your money to PP.. - skatoolaki, on 07/15/2009, -0/+1Amen. Thank you and my thoughts exactly.
- sexybobo, on 07/15/2009, -0/+1He could have converted his account over to a business account with out saying it was a non profit business.
- scootinger, on 07/20/2009, -0/+1Security standards my ass. PayPal is well-known for pulling ***** like this when there is absolutely no justification, and arbitrarily siding with the buying/paying party.
- Kyrgizion, on 07/26/2009, -0/+1I had some 60 bucks sitting idle in my account as a restitution from a botched eBay transaction. Getting it wired to me would (somehow) have cost more than the money was worth. It's been sitting there for over a year until I just bought a Steam game with it. Much safer investment.
- cawfee, on 07/19/2009, -0/+1It's because they can ignore you more efficiently via email than they can ignore you on the phone.
- Khast, on 07/16/2009, -0/+1Well, as far as eBay goes, they nailed down the payment system in the US, that Paypal is the only method of payment allowed. (They tried in other countries first...but failed miserably because it is an anti-trust issue.) eBay claims that Paypal is the most secure method of payment. Though I would bet that has something to do with the fact they own it, and make a profit each time someone uses it.
- Charlotte_Web, on 07/15/2009, -0/+1Yep... a business I was consult for tried using PayPal to process credit cards, and PayPal was frequently putting money on hold, because of the size of the purchases. Very bad situation for a business to be in.
- sonnyF, on 07/15/2009, -1/+1Amazon has Flexible Payments Service for developers to integrate into their websites.
- xSPANNERx, on 07/15/2009, -3/+2Just because they *can*, doesn't mean they *should*. This is the same fight that is being taken to the courts regarding ridiculous EULAs over the past year or two.
- chrisvanhorn, on 07/20/2009, -2/+1"joshuaviktorATGmail.youknowtherest"
seriously? -
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