What is Digg?99 Comments
- locojones, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8Bariswheel -
I'm sorry, but it's people with lackadaisical attitudes like you (and by that I mean, "I'm not doing anything wrong with my constitutional rights, so I'm not bothered by restrictions on them") that are providing the pretext for those in power to continually erode our civil liberties.
So according to your logic, because you're doing nothing wrong and have nothing to hide, you would be OK with the authorities coming to your home and searching your belongings, checking your phone logs, and chat & browsing history without a warrant or even reasonable suspicion, or even notifying you, all in the name of preventing terrorism because we're in a war?
What happens when stories like this come out, that our own nation is spying on its own citizens, the effect is that it chills people's ability to exercise some of their most fundamental rights - namely that of free speech and freedom to assemble. And it is truly a sad day for America and everything it stands for if people cannot feel truly free to express themselves in public or in private, regardless of their message, on our own soil without fear of being branded a terrorist or having their lives catalogued in some government database and watchlist.
This kind of behaviour should be inexcusable to any real American. - lostngone, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6This isn't news!
I really hope people aren't surprised to hear this.
Most people I talk to don't seem to even care. Well that is until they are put on the "no fly list" and can't go to grandmas and they stand in front of a camera on the nightly news and complain about how we as a country could let this happen. - zenchick, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3It's so unusual for the mainstream media to actually air a story like this. Makes me wonder what the heck is going on. I believe it when I see it on alternative news sites, but when I see it on NBC . . . ???
- lostngone, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2SyDIGG Quote:
If you are not a terrorist and do not mean harm to the country, you have nothing to worry about. They can't use information not related to terrorism to prosecute your ordinary domestic crimes. You do still have your due process in this area. The court does not allow evidence seized without a warrant. Sine 9/11, we had no terrorist attacks in this country.
So chill if you are not a terrorist.
HA HA that's a good one! That's assuming you get a timely trial or even one at all. The US Government is starting to lock its own people up without a trial. They can hold you for an indefinite amount of time without even charging you with a crime.
Quote:
"They can't use information not related to terrorism to prosecute your ordinary domestic crimes."
Really? That's odd because they are already using the Post 9/11 anti-terrorism laws to charge people that haven't committed, or are planning on any committing acts of terrorism. - phraud, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2To further locojones' comment:
We need to stop this kind of military behaviour immediately (I'm Canadian, not a US citizen, but I'll be in the same boat soon enough). The government takes baby steps with infiltrating our privacy. They let us get used to a new limit, or restriction (baby step), and then they move on to the next. While certain people may not care because they've "done nothing wrong," they fail to see that this is just another baby step. You see, even if you want to spout off that you don't care if people are watching you because you are a law abiding citizen, it doesn't mean that you'll always be one. I mean this in the sense that after awhile, once monitoring is in effect, laws may get more and more strict - more and more controlling. Guess what? The government now has everyone monitored so they can easily see when someone "steps out of line." Maybe then you won't be so passive. There will come a point when we've given the government so much power that we won't be able to step back and say "hold on, wait a minute, this is crazy - we want our lives back." What about our kids? If we let these laws into power now, the kids will be used to them (and thats what the government wants), so even if there are a few of us "crazy old fogies" spouting off words like freedom, the government is spouting off new definitions of freedom to our children. If they can get a few baby steps completed with each generation, then when the new group of people are born, they are already used to the whole system. In the last hundred years, look how much power the government has compared to us. Look at the steady increase in monitoring and information gathering that has been going on. Think about what will happen in the next 100 years. Do you really want them to take this step? What about the next one? - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Thank you mr. bush.
thank you for destroying my privacy.
thank you for killing thousands.
thank you for lowering the value of our money.
thank you for increasing the deficit.
thank you for lying to the people.
thank you for destroying social security.
thank you for allowing the use of depleted uranium in combat. - OBKenobi, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1[quote]if you're not doing anything wrong, why should you be afraid of getting spied on?[/quote]
Who decides whether you are doing anything wrong or not? That used to be for the courts to decide, now it seems the US government is able to lock up anyone it wants without charge, throughout the world.
At this rate, maybe in a few years just because you're not a card-carrying Republican Christian, you may be doing something wrong, and you may be harassed--or worse. - asplodzor, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Well said, lostngone. It's amazing how apathetic we as a people are about issues of this much gravity.
- positron, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"Any government big enough to give you everything you want is big enough to take away everything you have." -Davey Crocket
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both." -Benjamin Franklin
"Stop throwing The Constitution in my face. It's just a goddamned piece of paper." -George W. Bush - 5blocksfree, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1To answer the question...yes. The reason? Because they're paranoid? No. Because they can. It is my guess that 99% of the spying they do has nothing to do with the types of threats that were supposedly in mind when the the rather unpatriotic PATRIOT act was signed into law. It's quite expected that the scope of "intelligence gathering" has started creeping outward- maybe we'll reach or surpass a point in recent history where the government had amassed secret files on more than a million Americans (all of them imminent threats, of course).
According to the EFF, one of the biggest problems with the pre-911 intelligence wasn't that they didn't have the appropriate information, it's that they didn't use it. They didn't "connect the dots". The irony here is that much MORE information is being collected, with no guarantee that the same thing won't happen again. Meanwhile, reasonable, harmless people are being subject to unreasonable surveillance. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I couldn't care less about national security. Give me my rights. Better to die living than to die without having even experienced life and freedom.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1sowusupb, people who care about their fundamental rights as Americans. The moment the government starts monitoring this stuff without probable cause, we are no longer assumed to be innocent. Thats the problem.
If you aren't bothered by this, then you don't deserve to a)Be an American, b)Live in America, or c)Benefit from America.
So if you don't care about the rights that make us American, leave, because you don't belong. - theImposs1ble, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1isnt it great that we get to pay taxes, so that we can give jobs to people... who in turn spy on us.
i love knowing that 33% of my paycheck goes to war mongers. its so nice being 25 and broke because we like to drop bombs on anyone that happens to be brown. - kosibar, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Don't click the link! They'll put you on the list!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"if you have done nothing wrong what have you got to hide?"
is very old and one of the most dangerous statements in the history of the world.
it has been used by every oppresssive governement since the beginning of time
there is a good reason we dont investigate everyone
some of you people need to open a history book if you dont have a problem with this - AlfaWolph, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Yes.
- hyberion, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0 First they came for the Muslims, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Muslim.
Then they came to detain immigrants indefinitely solely upon the certification of the Attorney General, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't an immigrant.
Then they came to eavesdrop on suspects consulting with their attorneys, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a suspect.
Then they came to prosecute non-citizens before secret military commissions, and I didn't speak up because I wasn't a non-citizen.
Then they came to enter homes and offices for unannounced "sneak and peek" searches, and I didn't speak up because I had nothing to hide.
Then they came to reinstate Cointelpro and resume the infiltration and surveillance of domestic religious and political groups, and I didn't speak up because I had stopped participating in any groups.
Then they came for anyone who objected to government policy because it aided the terrorists and gave ammunition to America's enemies, and I didn't speak up because...... I didn't speak up.
Then they came for me....... and by that time no one was left to speak up.
--Taken from the site http://www.janrainwater.com/htdocs/Rohde.htm-- - steal_apps01, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0NBC Would never do bad press on the pentagone. There parent company (the one that owns them) GE (General Electric) Has a huge contract to make bomb materials for the gouvernement through the pentagone.
- 5blocksfree, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0>> NBC Would never do bad press on the pentagone. There parent company (the one that owns them) GE (General Electric) Has a huge contract to make bomb materials for the gouvernement through the pentagone.
That's why big media is every bit as problematic as big government- there are too many conflicts of interest. As such, the media will always err on the side of protecting profits at the expense of journalistic integrity. This is might suggest a rathar large, systemic problem, because the media have often been considered the government watchdogs. Rest assured, they won't be biting the hand that feeds them. - Chewie67, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I certainly hope the Pentagon is spying on Americans.
Anyone remember Oklahoma City? That bombing wasn't done by Islamic Extremists. It was good old, home grown American nut jobs.
Of course they should be spying on Americans. That's part of keeping everyone safe. We can't just blindly assume that all threats come from overseas... - rebrad, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0With all the "Hate America First" groups around, I hope someone is watching them.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0i said nothing when they came for the war protesters
as i wasnt a war protester
i said nothing when they came for the homosexuals
as i wasnt gay
I said nothing when they came for the democrats
***** i dont like any of the parties
now they are coming for me
and there is noone left to complain. - drjones, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0If you really believe quakers are enemies of the state for opposing the military in any way then a majority of americans are traitors for saying iraq is a f'n mess in polls. When should we start lining them up to be shot?
In a democracy the military SERVES the people not the other way around. I work in defence avionics industry but I would gladly be out of work if it meant less wasteful useless military spending. I see it every day, everything costs twice as much as it should and the quality is not half what it should be. the US lives on military welfare, your tax money into my pocket for a feeling of security that lithuania won't invade New Jersy. And if I complain about it? Well then monitor me I am an enemy of the state!
-drjones - lostngone, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"Quote"
"Are these groups REALLY "peaceful and innocent?" What do we know about them?"
I don't know why don't you just ask for the report, or better yet ask for the report they have on you! How do we know your ""peaceful and innocent?"". Who cares even if you are, your still screwed because of what your file says. - mindsinker, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I'm kinda freaked out to use my laptop for anything shady because since I started using PeerGuardian2 I noticed I block connections to US Army Research Lab, NASA, and DISA. I think there was another but I don't remember. Oh well...
- GhostFreeman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0The question I want to know is how do I find out i'm on this list.
- diecastbeatdown, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0it's possibly that nbc published this to show that a small percentage of people are being monitored, "bad people" or however the government is going to label them.
this is also feeding into the masses with just enough oomph for them to say something like "hey, whats this all about? they are watching us? oh, only those people, ok." getting used to this type of thing is a problem. patriot act? come on, what the hell is going on here. its all been said, but nobody is listening, they may think the war in iraq is no longer a good thing - but they don't even realize what happened. we established our government in another country. hello, wake up! we have government embassies in almost every country in the world. its not just a building folks, its a piece of america in almost every country of the world. with soldiers, intelligence reports, and much more we don't know about. so which country is next, and when?
well, the way things are going we might just find out. unless people speak up in protest over this and stop the madness.
choosing a president has always been about who can take america into other countries, who can take it the next step to where we ultimately want to be.
do we want to follow in the footsteps of many nations before us who chose world domination? some think its too late for that, but there is always the possibility of a different future - it has not come yet, but the plans are well in motion.
move out of the country? what would that solve, nothing. then i would just be sitting on the bench watching my team lose. winning is stopping this madness, get in the game people.
(this comment monitored by the us patriot act, homeland security, dmca, pentagon, cia and other notable contributors to national threat reduction by means of fear and paranoia). - horar, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3Americans are so much easier to control because they think they are free.
- positron, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"The question I want to know is how do I find out i'm on this list."
What I want to know is, how do we get our spineless congressmen and representatives to tell them to ***** off!? - master_of_fm, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I know they are spying on me. My Dad has a number of security clearances for his job, and whenever they come up for renewal I find that I am being followed. Also I am sure that try to tap any form of communications that I have. They used to go to the neighbors house and ask them what type of person my Dad was and all sorts of McCarthy type questions. Funniest thing was in high school and my friends would say "hey did you know that someone is following you?" and I would simply say "yes"
- mancat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"I don't know why don't you just ask for the report, or better yet ask for the report they have on you! How do we know your ""peaceful and innocent?"". Who cares even if you are, your still screwed because of what your file says."
Only if I can see your report first. You sound kinda rowdy. In fact, you're acting very suspiciously. Excuse me while I let Homeland Security know about you... - BleckLord, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I wish I could double digg this story. Totally out of control.
DHS even set up shop in Las Vegas after 'intelligence' pointed to a possible terrorist threat to the city. Agents monitored every person flying into and out of Vegas; they were even able to bully the casinos into giving them lists of every guest.
More telling is that, like the article mentions, the information is no longer being destroyed once it’s deemed 'not useful'. The rule has always been domestic surveillance info of US citizens must be destroyed after the investigation, not so today. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0GhostFreeman: you probably weren't before but now that you asked that specific question in a public forum on the world wide web, you probably are. have you ever heard of "eschelon"?
- dazzed, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Haha, why is the title a question? If you don't know that you must live in the deep sahara...
- dbrodbeck, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0To anyone that is not an American the idea that the oft cheerleading US media is leftist is laughable. There frankly is no left in the US, not of any consequence anyway.
- Sirocco, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Yes, you are being watched. Yes, you have been watched since the day you were born. And yes, you will be watched until the day you die -- and possibly after as well.
This changes nothing. When a PETA splinter group blows up a lab, people are going to ask why the government didn't take measures to prevent the incident, and...? - adml_shake, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Damned if you do damned if you dont...
They don't keep an eye on things going on at home and some sleeper cell takes down another tower and we have everyone and their brother screaming "they should have been on top of this, what the hell are these agencies doing?!!" The do to much and people start going on and on about violation of rights and liberties....
it's really a no win situation. - davalf, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0heh...I think the real interesting feature about this is that they're spying on Americans and ONLY came up with about 1,500 "suspicious incidents" over a 10 month period. Seems to me like they're doing this a little half-heartedly.
- essrog, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0COINTELPRO - old news is new again
- JAFFA, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"Americans are so much easier to control because they think they are free."
Best quote on Digg this month! Which says more about the state of the nation rather than its citizens i feel. - imichaelj, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1srj76,
I wasn't posting that list to illustrate a "vast rightwing conspiracy." I was posting to illustrate the idiocy of making statements about the media and their political affiliations.
Fox News appeals to the right because of a perceived market need for a blatantly rightwing network. Murdoch is a businessman, not an ideologue. He saw an opening and snatched it up. Same with any pretty much any media outlet in the U.S.
It's all about money. And to figure that out, you need look no further than any media organization. The amount of commercials per minute of legitimate news coverage on the cable news networks, for instance, is obscene. Radio "headline news" is basically a recitation of headlines, not actual news. And the concept of putting two opposing views together and calling it coverage is a fraud perpetrated in the name of journalism.
I consume a variety of international news outlets (many with well-established political inclinations: Le Monde, The Telegraph, Politiken, and so on) and get better news coverage than what passes for the commercialized sham of "news" in the U.S.
Stating American news is rightwing or leftwing is pointless. Stating American news is "news" is just as pointless. Just my two cents. - SilverRocket, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0How else are they going to recruit you into the army without a little bit of personal details like 'We will kill your brother Gary and his wife Ellen if you dont join the army'
- tmcleroy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0***** yeah the Pentagon spies on us
- grayBot, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0for the comment about the New York Times being leftist....... hahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
I'm sorry my name is Karl Rove, I just bought 5 NYT journalists, again, and I can't stop laughing.
Seriously... there is this thing called PlameGate..it was great...I whispered to some journalists and convinced a few people that we should all put our money together and buy some really nice bombs and planes.
We only got together about 500 billion, but Im sure we can slush for more next time....
Love,
Karl - HeyArnold, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0File this under "Duh".
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0McCarthy Shifts focus; Will Now Fight 'Book-Reader menace'
Gotta love The Onion In History - deepsub, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0"The only organization less trustworthy than the DoD is the leftist media."
Everything is leftist if you're so FAR right you think Rush Limbaugh and Bill O'Reilly are anything more than Howard Stern 'shock jock' types pushing a political agenda. - phraud, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0They aren't afraid that the peaceful protesters are a threat in the conventional way. The protesters aren't going to physically harm the government. They aren't a "danger" to the military like an enemy in the field would be. The protesters are trying to raise public awareness of how stupid the wars are, this will hurt the military financially. They are scared of ANYONE getting the idea out that military is useless, or should atleast be cut way back.
- cma3, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Yes, the gov't does this. Yes, its been going on forever. No, it will never stop.
And now we've been added to the list for digging this story.
Enjoy the rest of your day. - Trublmakr, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Paid by the public to spy on the public. Perhaps Pentagon brass need to be reminded who pays their salaries.
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