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155 Comments
- chrissku, on 04/22/2009, -18/+65I love how the Republicans jumped down Michelle Obama's throat during the election for her comments about being proud of her country for the first time in her adult life.......but it's perfectly acceptable for the Republican Governor of Texas to suggest twice in a 2 week time span that Texas might be able to secede from the United States
- quomen, on 04/22/2009, -11/+37I don't support the secession. However, I do support the idea that secession is the choice for the state to make.
- paidhima, on 04/22/2009, -1/+25Secession: Withdrawal from an organization.
Succession: Following an order or sequence.
Can we please - please - at least get that part right before attempting to argue the point? - spyder666111, on 04/22/2009, -4/+22for the Canadians
http://watch.thecomedynetwork.ca/the-colbert-repor ... - Quicksilver4648, on 04/22/2009, -7/+25Even though the civil war ended well over 100 years ago there are some that feel it goes on everyday. I would actually find it funny if Texas did secede, simply because it would mean republicans would have no chance winning another election after losing those 34 electoral votes.
- FearlessFreep, on 04/22/2009, -1/+17I suppose it depends on if you are patriotic to a patch of dirt or a set of ideals
- DankBuddz, on 04/22/2009, -1/+16"Polls that would have made sense in 1836."
LOL, no kidding. - DarkBlueAnt, on 04/22/2009, -11/+25At least if Texas secedes they won't have an immigrant problem. No Mexican would want to live in their crappy country.
- inactive, on 04/22/2009, -7/+20This comment is like a stupid overload. Your first point is NASA, a US GOVERNMENT institution, you think they would stay in your little republic? The other gem is that you managed to work climate change denial in there, nice one. Obama never predicted global warming, because he's not a scientist. A lot of tech companies you name are actually multi-national.
Besides that, the government will take all that stuff back, or blow it up.
Oh yeah, and you're a member of a treasonous fringe group, have fun with that. I'm not even sure why I wasted my time dignifying this with a response. - DankBuddz, on 04/22/2009, -3/+15That comment looks like a middle school research project on the state of Texas. Full of holes and inaccurate assumptions.
- thephosphorbox, on 04/22/2009, -4/+15Sting.. would be another one of my role models. The music he's made over the years, I don't really listen to it, but the fact that he's making it, I respect that.
- RiMac, on 04/22/2009, -12/+23Pretty sure the Civil War nullified the states' rights to secede. Also, secession is, by definition, unpatriotic.
- mfc5200, on 04/22/2009, -2/+12to THETEH:
Read a history book:
"Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."
Does that sound familiar to you? It should, it is OUR Declaration of Independence. Hence, the act of seceding is in fact very American and very patriotic. Like FearlessFreep said, are you loyal to a set of ideals or to a patch of dirt. - SpeedSteamBoat, on 04/22/2009, -6/+16What? They challenge media spin (the current "status quo") more than anyone else on television. Get bent.
- strad2, on 04/22/2009, -6/+16This is all hot air - there is no support for secession in Texas, and there is no good argument for secession. Unlike with the British, we can actually vote for representation now... so let's just look at how Texas votes. Texas has just come off of 8 years of having its preferred president elected. And so much for this imagined libertarian streak - the libertarian candidate received less than 1% of the vote in 2008.
The truth is that Texas (which has been extremely influential politically for at least the last decade) is at least as responsible, if not more so, than the rest of the country for our current situation. - geodebug, on 04/22/2009, -0/+9if at first you don't secede, try, try, try again.
- strad2, on 04/22/2009, -4/+13Love the NASA bit... so you really believe that its those buildings (and the location near Houston) that makes "NASA"?
You do realize you wouldn't be a contributor to NASA anymore, right? And that you would have to start a new Texas Space Agency... right? And you would have to build a new military?
Nevermind... - DarkBlueAnt, on 04/22/2009, -4/+13You think you get it, but you don't.
He never actually gives news and his viewers know that. That is why he has a studio audience that laughs. - SpeedSteamBoat, on 04/22/2009, -1/+10The people are the government.
- homah, on 04/22/2009, -4/+13It is unpatriotic (that is to say, opposed to the principles upon which this country was founded) to say that secession is unpatriotic. Many say if you are for secession you are un-American. But what happens when America is no longer the America it once was? Perhaps secession is what is truly "American" and sitting idly as your rights are stripped away is not.
By the way, July 4th is secession day, as in the day we seceded from England. Was that wrong? Should we have stayed under their regime? - Kryptus, on 04/22/2009, -2/+10dug for the old Raid commercial
- FortyCaliber, on 04/22/2009, -1/+91. Those energy companies that own those refineries (Chevron, Exxon-Mobil, etc.) are based in other states.
2. The "Texas" Nat. Guard and Air Nat Guard are Army paid-for institutions. They are commanded by the Governor of the state. In the event of secession, there is no more Governor and the Army takes back the Nat. Guard Installations, equipment, weapons, ammo, etc.
3. All of your agriculture dies because of a lack of irrigation from the now U.S. -owned rivers. Rio Grande irrigation is not an option as you would have to move the water up hill tot he northern part of the state. No crops, no food, no feed for animals, no livestock.
4. You universities are staffed by scholars and teachers, most of which are historically Democrat-aligned... but on a similar note, just because the state reps. decide to secede doesn't mean that the populous is behind it. Your'e likely to have a mass exodus of most democrate-aligned citizens.
5. As far as your seafood and gulf-based NAt. Gas rigs... the U.S. Navy and C.G will blockade every port and occupy every rig. The war would be quick and bloodless as the superior U.S. military would wear you down and suck you dry until you ran out of resources. Austin would fall within the month.
While I commend your love for your state, your arguments are ill-thought and short-sighted. - staticneuron, on 04/22/2009, -1/+9"But each State having expressly parted with so many powers as to constitute jointly with the other States a single nation, cannot from that period possess any right to secede, because such secession does not break a league, but destroys the unity of a nation, and any injury to that unity is not only a breach which would result from the contravention of a compact, but it is an offense against the whole Union. To say that any State may at pleasure secede from the Union, is to say that the United States are not a nation because it would be a solecism to contend that any part of a nation might dissolve its connection with the other parts, to their injury or ruin, without committing any offense. Secession, like any other revolutionary act, may be morally justified by the extremity of oppression; but to call it a constitutional right, is confounding the meaning of terms, and can only be done through gross error, or to deceive those who are willing to assert a right, but would pause before they made a revolution, or incur the penalties consequent upon a failure." - President Andrew Jackson
- DarkBlueAnt, on 04/22/2009, -2/+10You still don't get it, dude. He's not covering any news. He's covering other newspeople giving the news.
- SpinningHead, on 04/22/2009, -1/+9So, you "real Americans" are supportive of torture, treason against your government, and purges of people you don't agree with. Clearly the lack in support for education in this country has created a "head in ass" epidemic.
- jcavaliere, on 04/22/2009, -1/+9The important part of your statement is that 25% of the population supports secession.
What would be required for them to change their mind? What actions would make another 25% support the idea? I live in Austin, which is a fairly liberally minded city, and I hear a lot of people talk about this idea behind closed doors, even if they don't talk about it openly. Of the 300ish people I know here, there’s a few that are completely fed up and say something needs to bee done, but majority of the rest are on the fence, needing a push in one way or another to swing their opinion.
And for the record, I have a wide diversity of friends, of race, religion (or lack thereof) and sexual orientation. - rabidjester, on 04/22/2009, -2/+10Why do you Whig bastards hate America?
- RyanBlueThunder, on 04/22/2009, -6/+14As a Texan, I am quite patriotic of both my state and nation. While I think our state would prosper as an independent nation (as we have developed a strong business environment and healthy economy---yet continually pay more to the federal government than we receive), I don't agree with people here that argue in favor of secession. I don't favor secession, because I believe it gives up on a great Union, and I still believe that the Tenth Amendment to the United States of America should have legal meaning and effect. "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people."
We are a nation of states that are bound together by a federal, limited Constitution. A Constitution that my state, the former independent Republic of Texas, volunteered to join.
What I find interesting is that Vermont (another fiercely independent state) has also made overtures that it would secede. - jts10, on 04/22/2009, -0/+7source?
because this link says different
http://www.taxfoundation.org/research/show/266.htm ...
Texas gets 94 cents back for every dollar paid. - mischiff, on 04/22/2009, -5/+12We're not talking about rebellion. We're talking about seceding. Federal property stays federal, including things like, oh, gold, and everybody shakes hands. If you want rebellion, I'd imagine you'd get to keep even less than that. At the risk of pointing out the obvious.
- OniSyphon, on 04/22/2009, -0/+7You realize that in times of war that the National Guard unit fall under the command of the Commander-in-Chief? You also realize who that is right? I'll wait. Yes, the President.
Sorry to nip that in the bud but they would be taking the same orders just like Active Duty and Reserve. - staticneuron, on 04/22/2009, -2/+9Texas v. White, 74 U.S. 700 (1869)
"In accepting jurisdiction, the court ruled that Texas had remained a state ever since it first joined the Union, despite its joining the Confederate States of America and its being under military rule at the time of the decision in the case. In deciding the merits of the bond issue, the court further held that "the Constitution did not permit states to secede from the United States", and that the ordinances of secession, and all the acts of the legislatures within seceding states intended to give effect to such ordinances, were "absolutely null".
Even though people are digging RiMac Down, he is right. Secession is nullified because the courts view that the constitution does NOT allow the states to secede. And logically speaking the act off secession or leaving a country behind is unpatriotic, despite the (valid or unvalid) reasons. - THETEH, on 04/22/2009, -9/+16secession isn't unpatriotic? Threatening to leave the United States and start your own country isn't unpatriotic?
- SpinningHead, on 04/22/2009, -3/+9People are doing some serious rationalizing on this thread. Point is conservatives were waving the US flag telling other people that they were the "real America". Now some of those same people want to secede. That's treasonous. You can talk about being "true to your ideals" all you want. That has nothing to do with patriotism. When we broke off from England it may have been true to our ideals but we lost all rights to call ourselves patriotic Brits.
Its not complicated, people. - staticneuron, on 04/22/2009, -1/+7Patriotism defined as love of and/or devotion to one's country.
Leaving that said country instead of fighting for change in that country, is unpatriotic. Period. - RyanBlueThunder, on 04/22/2009, -0/+6@lordmike: you are absolutely incorrect.
According to the Tax Foundation, for every $1 paid to the federal government, Texans received $0.94 in federal spending. Texas is a donor state. - NoLibertarians, on 04/22/2009, -12/+18The notion that any state will secede is total insanity. People claiming it is a good idea to consider are bat ***** insane
- MaxxusFlamus, on 04/22/2009, -3/+8You're just retarded.
NASA Houston does not control all of space. NASA Ames, JPL, and Goddard (CA and MD) also have equal command and control capability.
More importantly- Vandenburg AFB, and Cape Canaveral are more important because of their launch location.
11. In case of a foreign invasion, we have the Texas National Guard and the Texas Air National Guard. We don't have an Army, but since everybody down here has at least six rifles and a pile of ammo, we can raise an Army in 24 hours if we need one. If the situation really gets bad, we can always call the Department of Public Safety and ask them to send over Chuck Norris and a couple of Texas Rangers.
Have you SEEN what weapons the US carries in it's arsenal?
Dear god if you live in Texas, then it'd be worth it for all of Texas to secede just to have you removed from the US. - EricSchC1, on 04/22/2009, -0/+5"...And that's why Texas is the bestest state ever! The End."
- aletoledo, on 04/22/2009, -2/+7If it was decided that states can't secede over differences of politics, then there is no secession, because everything is politics. Joining the united states is a one way path. Thats fine if it's how you view a willing partnership, but I personally don't think of that as willing, nor as a partnership.
In the end it's a moot question of it being a voluntary agreement. Everyone knows that the power brokers won't allow anyone to leave and so if Texas attempts to step out of line, then they'll be invaded (e.g. Iraq, Panama, Afghanistan, Hawaii, etc...) and forced to comply.
I should also mention that you have a weird definition of "love it or leave it". I think most people would assume that means secession, but you seem to think it means to move to another country. I have to say that I'm glad you weren't alive during the revolutionary war, because that kind of attitude wouldn't have served for much of anything. - inactive, on 04/21/2009, -9/+14 The organic gardening piece was also good.
- SpinningHead, on 04/22/2009, -2/+7Besides most of the obvious things that everyone with at least a 5th grade education pointed out, much of that oil is from leased public (US govt) lands.
- deathandtaverns, on 04/22/2009, -0/+5I'm pretty sure that he was talking about the presidential elections where the winner of the state gets all the electoral votes. Thusly we most likely would not have another republican president until the center line was moved left.
But yes the Democrats would only be up 8 more congressmen and 2 senators. - WasabiBomb, on 04/22/2009, -2/+7Michelle Obama's quote was basically taken out of context and then run up the flagpole to make it worse than it appeared.
Rick Perry, on the other hand, is being quite clear. What he's talking about would be deemed "sedition" if a Democrat had said it.
One is MUCH worse than the other. I have a feeling you'll pick the wrong one, though. - JSavage37, on 04/22/2009, -2/+7I bet you're one of those people that think the Civil War was over slavery.
- SpinningHead, on 04/22/2009, -1/+6@homah
Seriously? The question is was July 4, 1776 patriotic to England. Answer:No - SpinningHead, on 04/22/2009, -1/+6Because Jefferson has the best opium in the colonies!
- MakanGuru, on 04/22/2009, -5/+10somehow i just dont see NASA and a lot of those companies staying in Texas if it does leave
- emkaysmith, on 04/22/2009, -1/+6"We established the idea that a state cannot secede over differences of politics during the Civil War."
No, the *North* established the policy that no state could secede from the Union if they could bludgeon that state into submission. To claim that the policy of the winning side has some special value just because they won is disingenuous.
However, the right of a state to secede also implies the right of the rest of the country to eject a state for being too much of a dick. Texas is fast approaching that point -- and I say that as a six-generation Texan living in exile. Texans like to brag that if Texas were an independent nation, it would be the 6th-wealthiest in the world (or 3rd-wealthiest, or whatever this year's implausible figure is), but I don't think most tax-hating Texans would be very happy to discover just how much a really modern and effective *separate* military establishment would cost them.
However No. 2, this also avoids the point of determining just *who* in the state decides Texas is going to secede. If the State of Texas is going to insist on its right to thumb its nose at the majority in this country, then don't the pro-U.S. citizens of Texas have that same right? Texas held a Secession referendum in 1861 (it passed by something like 75%, I forget the exact figure) -- the only Southern state to do so. In all the rest of the South, the State Senate made the decision. In certain parts of Texas, such as the Hill Country, the referendum lost badly. And the (mostly German) residents in those areas were called traitors for, in effect, seceding from the secession.
So how is it going to be decided this time? State-wide vote, majority rules? And the minority has to go along with the majority -- but only *within* the state, obviously, since the Governor of Texas doesn't want to go along with the majority himself? Or county-by-county? And the counties that vote against secession get to stay in the U.S.? Those probably would include Travis County, home of the state government and the liberal hub of Texas. Maybe block by block, or house by house?
This should be interesting.
Oh, and "Love it or Leave It" was *not* invented by George Bush, Dick Cheney, and the neocons. If you think it was, you're not old enough to remember Vietnam. It was an invitation by the warhawks for anyone who didn't agree with them to leave the country. - FortyCaliber, on 04/22/2009, -0/+5PyrosMagus,
I don't want to be a grammar Nazi; In this case, your glaring error should be corrected, for your sake:
succession is the act of succeeding... meaning gaining progress over and beyond another entity.
secession is the act of removing oneself from another entity
Forty... -
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