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56 Comments
- clvngodess, on 04/11/2009, -0/+33I like this business. It is a transfer of good will. It is a good exchange. It helps the unemployed and it boosts the profile of the business. It's win win for everyone in the community.
- AgeofMastery, on 04/10/2009, -2/+23Because contrary to what your full of herself idol Rand said, helping other people is a good thing.
I'm sure a lot of people will remember this and when they get a job and need regular dry cleaning services they'll go back there. - AgeofMastery, on 04/11/2009, -1/+18Explaining the concept of simply helping people, doing a good deed or simple kindness to somebody like you is a lost cause.
But there is a reason why "selfish *****" isn't a compliment. - clvngodess, on 04/11/2009, -0/+16Some things in life, such as risk, compassion, or acts of kindness don't really need rationale. Sometimes you do things because you know in your heart that they are the right thing to do. Some people have faith, some have some other system of checks and balances with the universe (perhaps the law of equalibrium), what ever the case, they trust that their benevolence will be returned or will pay forward. If that's silly, or lacks rationale, so be it. It's something that many very very wealthy people practice. Consider it a tithe. Or karma. Or a simple exchange of energy.
When you break it down, what is a sale? A transaction? Really? What is it? Is it the exchange of product for money? If you say yes, you are not completely correct.
A sale when broken down to it's most basic form is simply a transfer of enthusiasm from one person to another.
How do you with your rationale, transfer your enthusiasm from your self to others? - inactive, on 04/11/2009, -1/+14This isn't goodwill, it's simply good business. An unemployed man has no need to get his clothes cleaned but an employed one may.
- zeebo, on 04/11/2009, -0/+12The rationale is pretty simple, and is fairly logical. Just as other apes strengthen social bonds and improve their status among their social group by cleaning the parasites off of one another, these dry cleaners are attempting to accomplish much the same effect by offering free cleaning services.
It attracts attention to themselves, and it builds a bond with the people who get their clothing cleaned. When they are one day in better shape they might remember that and are likely to continue to use their services. - freedomjoe, on 04/11/2009, -9/+21Yo, Phil..the right and righter (libertarians) don't like generosity of spirit. it scares them (hence above comments from the galt crowd). socialism for sure. best if no one helps anyone, because after all, if everyone helped everyone, where would we be? /s
- deathspeth, on 04/11/2009, -0/+12If you feel that way, vote with your money and go to a place that does not do it. I mean It is only the Dry Cleaners money, those damn socialists helping people get the resources to get a job and making someones life a little better.
- freedomjoe, on 04/11/2009, -1/+11Oh, I see. Your reasoned argument and persuasive civility bespeaks of your "objectivist" ideology. LOL. And saying I am "puppeting *****" is the cherry on your faux-objectivism. I guess you don't even understand why your claim is such a joke, but that's OK.
You keep patting yourself on the back over your objectivism, while we laugh our selves silly at you. - compgeek, on 04/11/2009, -0/+9That's a heck of a generous thing to do. I know if I were one of the people he helped and I nailed a job because of it I'd be finding a way to pay him back even if not in money but in some other way. Kudos to this guy for realizing he can help people to better themselves
- humptyz, on 04/11/2009, -0/+7Now this is the kind of story the mainstream media should be highlighting more of. Makes me happy to read.
And to the cynics out there. Altruism doesn't have to be entirely about unselfish goodwill, it can be good business too. Some people, like me, would be more inclined to do business with this guy because of what he's doing. - thebeginning, on 04/11/2009, -1/+7They've had the business for 50 years, and if they expect that many unemployed people to come by their store, it looks like they already have a good amount of exposure around the area.
$32k doesn't seem like chump change for a small dry cleaning business. - vagabond45, on 04/11/2009, -0/+5It's a nice way to do business, though. Very innovative. Everyone wins. The government is kept out of the transaction, the business gets a new loyal customer when the guy gets a job!
- inactive, on 04/11/2009, -0/+5The audacity of it!!!
- effinboy, on 04/11/2009, -1/+6I'm libertarian. And this, nor any generosity scares me, or us as a whole. It's FORCED generosity that scares us. I applaud this business and it's owners for this move.
- Scuzzle, on 04/11/2009, -4/+9What a terribly false and misleading claim. Objectivists and Libertarians believe in the freedom of exchange, and we endorse all benefits that come about.
What you need to do is take a look at the broad picture. There are three possibilities here:
1. They are doing this because it is good for the business.
2. They are doing this because society tells them they should when they don't really want.
3. They are doing this for intellectual gratification.
If #1, then the motivations are selfish, and the side effect is that outsiders (community, country, person, etc) benefit greatly.
#2 isn't likely. Imagine damning your own business, your livelihood, so that you can join the ranks of the unemployed, juts because society thinks it's right. I hope no one is this stupid.
If #3, then the motivation is selfish. Personal gratification from 'helping' someone. If you don't derive any pleasure from giving a bum a dollar, you're not going to do it. Just like you will order your hamburger with no mustard because you don't like mustard.
Your mind is narrow; your vision, cloudy. - deathspeth, on 04/11/2009, -0/+4Why should I have to help someone who wants a job and make their own money?
/s - smemily, on 04/11/2009, -0/+4Aren't you one of the same libertarians who doesn't favor any government-run-charities, because people can and will do it more efficiently themselves? And then when people DO, you bitch about that too, huh?
Looks like it's not about efficiency at all, it's about just plain being an *****. - Birukun, on 04/11/2009, -0/+4Except the Government is taxing the crap out of the business man. Donations help offset that due to our complex crazy tax code.
- charlie6969, on 04/11/2009, -0/+3Dugg for cool people.
When you give; you get a good feeling. Good deeds are paid for in their own way. - ohmytodd, on 04/11/2009, -1/+4why does this oddly touch my heart and soul. positivity, good will, and just CARING towards others always makes me believe there is still good out there.
best wishes world.. i know you can do it.
(i think it may be that i was raised by Saved By The Bell, Family Matters, and Full House that I've learned to do and hope for the right things in life.) - zenmechanic, on 04/11/2009, -1/+4I agree with Scuzzle, but would like to re-interpret your third motivation if you'll indulge.
"3. They are doing this for intellectual gratification."
I think a more appropriate description would be
3. They are doing this for ego gratification.
Not ego in the common understanding of "an inflated sense of self worth", but in the Freudian definition:
"...it seeks to please the id’s drive in realistic ways that will benefit in the long term rather than bringing grief."
All actions are ego driven. - wadd, on 04/11/2009, -1/+4Talk about narrow! Only 3 reasons why someone might do this??? Come now... Perhaps they believe it's the right thing to do. Perhaps someone helped the dry cleaner when he needed a helping hand and he views this as a small chance to give something back. Perhaps the dry cleaner is just a lousy business person.
The possible reasons are many and not mutually exclusive.
Who have you helped today? - Scuzzle, on 04/11/2009, -1/+4Not free. They are being paid back in publicity. The actual cost to dry clean a shirt is very small, which is an insignificant price to pay for the possibility of a repeat customer. Combine that with the media attention, and this dry cleaner's business is going to explode.
Nothing is free. - Chazbear, on 04/11/2009, -0/+3It's heartening to see someone taking time out to help others in such an unstable world, Dug for Kindheartedness!
- thebeginning, on 04/11/2009, -0/+3Good for him. This is what we need to boost the economy: people looking to work for each other in order to improve society, even if that means sacrifice.
- wadd, on 04/11/2009, -0/+3I understand the broader picture, you've made it very clear. But my question remains unanswered...
- aserer511, on 04/11/2009, -1/+4That's nice-real nice. Sadly, nicer than anything I would ever do.
- inactive, on 04/11/2009, -1/+390% advertisement of a business
10% goodwill towards man
I mean seriously you think car companies are offering to hold off on demanding payments if you lose your job because they love the customer? No. They are banking on you A. Going and buying a car in the first place B. Paying off the car at some point which is the best they can hope for these days.
Yeah and for all the hippies here some form of free market capitalism has existed for a long ass time. There have always been the rich and powerful and the weak and poor, even in Communist countries. It isn't some special failing of the system. It is the failing of the people who are part of it. Guns don't kill people, people kill people. Send the people who display excessive greed that harms others to jail. Stop blaming the system. - anarchist101, on 04/11/2009, -0/+2Looks like a good investment in community goodwill to me.
The whole world would be so much better if everyone just treated each other with respect and compassion.
For those who can't or won't do that, I am all for therapy and psychiatric services as they are clearly in need of it.
Amoral behavior (which is NOT what capitalism and free markets are really about) is abhorrent and definitely counterproductive to the interests of most individuals. This is why dehumanizing big businesses is nearly always injurious to society as a whole. Money becomes way more important than people to them, despite any claims to the contrary which they frequently make. - RedHeadedFreak, on 04/11/2009, -0/+2http://abcnews.go.com/2020/story?id=2682730 I think that's slightly relevant.
- cowboy86, on 04/11/2009, -0/+2You're an idiot.
- Scuzzle, on 04/11/2009, -1/+3"Paying it forward", as you suggest, is total personal gratification. The person who did you a favor isn't likely to know what favor you're doing for someone else. You are doing it because it makes you feel good to do it. That's how it goes with happiness. Not many people smile while paying their taxes, but they do it anyway. But most people smile when they eat, watch a movie, listen to music, and so on. When you help someone, you smile for the same reasons. It's very selfish, indeed. This fits into #3
If the dry cleaner is a lousy business person, then it suggests that he is doing this to improve his business and he just doesn't know any better. (Side note: this happens to be a genius business idea). This fits into #1.
Do you have anymore? I'm more than willing to help you to understand the broader picture. - drexl, on 04/11/2009, -0/+2Why the ***** didn't you post the link to NPR's story?
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?story ... - Scuzzle, on 04/11/2009, -0/+2wadd: Help is such a relative term. Should we play semantics? I've helped you to kill some of your time on a Saturday. I've dug this thread and helped its popularity. I've written several e-mails to my boss, concerning things that will help operations at my job. Later today, I'll likely let someone in traffic, help my girl carry groceries up the stairs, help cook dinner.
What do you mean by help? If by help you mean that I should sacrifice my time, and therefore my effort and money, for things I couldn't care less about, then I would say I haven't helped anyone in years.
Zenmechanic: I'm okay with your revision. - vidaliasweet, on 04/11/2009, -0/+2It's a little bit of both.
- tech42er, on 04/13/2009, -0/+1From a purely economic standpoint, if everyone does it, you can't afford not to do it. If all your competitors do this and you don't, you'll lose customer goodwill and customers. So yes, if all the dry cleaning stores were the members of a cartel, it might make sense for them to agree not to do this. But since it's a free market, one will start it, get a lot of goodwill, then others will follow and pretty soon everyone has to.
- tech42er, on 04/13/2009, -0/+1@Galt
What are you blubbering about? AgeoMastery already answered you. From a purely economic standpoint, this is a great way to get customer goodwill. It's like advertising, marketing, giveaways, sales, etc. - shypop1, on 04/11/2009, -0/+1It all depends on what the expense is to you.
The dry cleaners is offering people something that doesn't "expend" themselves or resources at an inordinate rate.
Now if you asked the dry cleaners to clean all your clothing I'm sure they will say "get the hell out here. now that will cost me a pretty penny"
But they are offering to clean a suit. It doesn't cost them much and they get free publicity which costs much much more.
So while I am not going to enshrine them and name a holiday after the Dry cleaning establishment. I will say that it's a pain free ploy that helps all involved.
So to answer your question it was not an "expense" but an investment.
SO tell Ayn and your face not to shed any tears for the sacrifice /or "expenditure" - tech42er, on 04/13/2009, -0/+1You don't HAVE to help anyone. This is all voluntary. That's what makes it so great. The government is NOT forcing them to do this; they are, of their own free will and in the confines of a free market, helping the less fortunate (which has the added benefit of helping their business). It's a powerful argument for human kindness, and the advantages of freedom.
- tech42er, on 04/13/2009, -0/+1Depends on your definition of altruism. If you wanted, you could claim every decision someone makes is in their rational self-interest. Even if it doesn't make sense to an outside observer, it's a rational decision given the person's value judgements. You've already made this argument: if someone feels personal gratification and satisfaction from doing something nice for someone else, they may expend time, energy, and money to do that, but it's still for personal gratification, so you wouldn't call it altruistic. But I could make the same argument for why a psychopath would kill someone. If you apply the principle of self-interest too broadly, it quickly becomes meaningless. That's why most people would consider what the dry cleaners are doing (and most forms of charity that does not materially benefit the one donating) altruistic.
It all depends on your perspective.
/libertarian existentialist - tech42er, on 04/13/2009, -0/+1They're going to job interviews. Same reason the homeless looking for jobs need cell phones.
- tech42er, on 04/14/2009, -0/+1I think he's saying he's an Objectivist, as in the philosophy Ayn Rand started.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Objectivism_(Ayn_Rand ...
Only a small subsection of libertarians are Objectivists.
/libertarian existentialist - gkiltz, on 04/12/2009, -0/+0And the unemployed need to wear "dry clean " clothes because?
- Scuzzle, on 04/11/2009, -1/+1Then, by your own admission, it isn't altruistic at all.
- inactive, on 04/12/2009, -1/+1And if they lose my pants I will sue for 50 milion
- inactive, on 04/11/2009, -8/+8Free?! IT SOCIALISM PEOPLE!
/s
Some people around here read too much of Ayn Rand. - tech42er, on 04/13/2009, -1/+1It's voluntary, so it's not socialism. We libertarians don't object to charity, philanthropy, and human kindness. We object to being "forced" to give up our assets at gunpoint. We don't need the government telling us what to do. And this story is a perfect example of that :)
- brad3378, on 04/11/2009, -3/+2♪♫♫♪♫ Dirty deeds and they're done dirt cheap ♪♫♫♪ ♪♫♫♪♫
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Show 51 - 59 of 59 discussions
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