What is Digg?254 Comments
- iknoritesrsly, on 10/10/2007, -10/+210dugg for de-sensationalizing digg.
- kalidav, on 10/10/2007, -5/+83While the article is right about everythign else, Securom DOES in fact cloak some internal files/registry keys.
- Senn, on 10/10/2007, -3/+73Rootkit or no, SecuROM is an annoying DRM and I'm not supporting it.
- aldenhg, on 10/19/2007, -21/+73Finally a sane voice. I hope this doesn't get buried by people in love with the drama.
- 7of7, on 10/10/2007, -14/+56A story on Digg that needlessly villainizes Sony or Microsoft with FUD? I'm shocked.
- brasso, on 10/10/2007, -9/+50As I understand it securom is hiding data from the operating system so that it cannot easily be reached by for example by regedit.exe, is that right? Now what would you call such a software?
If the rootkit is injected in the kernel, calc.exe or running as a service doesn’t matter; it’s still a rootkit if it hides the current state of your computer or data from the OS and therefore any applications running in it and therefore also from you. A rootkit doesn’t even need to hide itself to be a rootkit, but naturally most do because that’s always preferable for malware.
From wikipedia: "A rootkit is a set of software tools intended to conceal running processes, files or system data from the operating system."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rootkit - inactive, on 10/10/2007, -9/+47"you know, ROOT level access, back when there were root users on computers"
I dont think I need to read another word written by a guy who doesn't actually know that every modern operating system with the exception of the one that he's using has a "root" user. - jdaniel284, on 10/10/2007, -5/+36The word "rootkit" is a relatively new word in modern history. Arguing semantics about the word "rootkit" is probably the silliest thing that I have encountered in awhile. On one side, you have people that are angry that SecureRom is installing system level software that intentionally exploits an OS weakness to get privileges that were never intended, and it does so secretively, and it is impossible to remove. On the other hand, you have these smug arrogant internet denizens that are feeling particularly pretentious because they know what the "root" user is on Linux.
Good grief, guys. - Racerx52, on 10/10/2007, -12/+41Yes
- sleeknerve, on 10/10/2007, -8/+32Dugg for the name Rasputin
- ZenSuckit, on 10/10/2007, -2/+26What exactly is the difference between installing an unwanted service at level 0 and one at level3? It's still unsolicited, invasive software that should not be installed. I am glad I didn't get my hands on a demo before the news came out.
- aryo, on 10/10/2007, -2/+25i totally agree. i think what pisses people off is that it's installed without your consent and there is no (easy) way to get rid of it. it is an invasion of some sort, after all.
- ScorpionV, on 10/10/2007, -3/+26The steam version still has the copy protection...they even had to patch the version on steam after release to make them play nicely with each other.
- Guspaz, on 10/10/2007, -1/+23Does it install itself without asking my permission? Does it remain installed AFTER I uninstall the host application? Is it impossible to remove without downloading "removal" software?
Yes to all three. It hides from the user, so even if it isn't a rootkit, it's still malware. So you can classify it as a rootkit or a virus. Take your pick. - brasso, on 10/10/2007, -1/+22Actually it does, so with Steam you get double copy protection.
- Junkyarddawg, on 10/10/2007, -8/+23It's not a rootkit BUT it's a driver which hides itself from the user (but not from the OS).
Even though it's not a rootkit, it's still intrusive DRM.
In other words, still an excellent excuse to pirate the crap instead of buying it. - Rabbittt, on 10/10/2007, -10/+25It's not a rootkit because it's in Ring 3?
From Wikipedia, the author's own source:
Application level rootkits may replace regular application binaries with trojanized fakes, or they may modify the behavior of existing applications using hooks, patches, injected code, or other means.
Is this article propoganda? - Phyltre, on 10/10/2007, -1/+15That was the point, I'm not buying it for this reason.
- nogami, on 10/10/2007, -7/+21Buried, because no matter what it is, rootkit or not, I didn't knowingly choose to have additional DRM installed on my system. It must go.
- kurtwinter, on 10/10/2007, -4/+17Maybe I don't want the Bioshock *****. Looked like a nice game, but ***** that. I am not going to be bound be some ***** "number of installable times" - I own the game, I can install it on as many machines as I wish and I can sell it, otherwise, its ***** garbage, no better than what the idiots who bought google's videos have - nothing.
- Dylan16807, on 10/10/2007, -4/+17How about this. Is it truly user level if it can't be deleted by an administrator account? Sure, it runs ring 3, but it hooks in, taking advantage of things no user level files should.
- ziffel, on 10/10/2007, -3/+15you can back up steam downloads to dvd. restore them to their folder and Steam will bypass re-downloading.
- fusama, on 10/10/2007, -2/+14FUD, acronym of the week? That one's been around for ages. Heck, its even commonly used outside of technology discussions, for example, gold investing.
- Dylan16807, on 10/10/2007, -3/+14Edit button didn't work...
Note that I'm not calling it a rootkit; I know it's not. But it's not an innocent driver either. Not when you have to either jump through hoops or know the secret handshake to remove it. And the fact that it's not mentioned, can screw up other programs, blacklists process explorer... - inactive, on 10/10/2007, -6/+17Wait, first he claims the Sony rootkit fiasco from a couple years back, wasn't a rootkit (which is wrong), then he claims that this rootkit, that everyone agrees is a rootkit, is not a rootkit.
Why should I listen to this moron? So what if he is a Sony/Bioshock fan boi. - worbd, on 10/10/2007, -2/+13Rootkit or not, it is certainly spyware AND malware.
- Phyltre, on 10/10/2007, -13/+24This is almost as bad as a rootkit, as far as I am concerned. It's my machine--anything that hides any part of itself from me, the owner of said machine, is not welcome.
- gcnaddict, on 10/10/2007, -4/+14Here's the deal: if RootkitRevealer from Mark Russinovich (Microsoft employee now) catches it doing rootkit-like things such as hiding registry entries (Bioshock is on two Microsoft platforms. No agenda here):
It's a rootkit. Final answer. - bonked, on 10/10/2007, -2/+12You need to get a dictionary Phil...
IS and CAN are way different. - robshoy, on 10/10/2007, -1/+10I don't trust men named Rasputin... not since... *flashback*
- MODAT, on 10/10/2007, -23/+32is calling us "idiots" really that necessary?
- PixelVision, on 10/10/2007, -1/+9Just because you've only known what it is for a week doesn't mean it's the acronym of the week.
- Rabbittt, on 10/10/2007, -1/+8http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rootkit
- jrbrewin, on 10/10/2007, -4/+11the story saying it was installing a rootkit should have been marked as inaccurate by anyone with half a clue, anyway.
- nogChoco, on 10/10/2007, -2/+9The game is gonna get cracked anyway so why bother with these complicated schemes that only reduce the enjoyment and rights of paying customers -- many of which will probably still download the cracked version just to have one that doesn't nag for the CD to be in the drive, etc.
- brasso, on 10/10/2007, -4/+11No, it isn’t. That’s why I posted a link to the rest of that article so that you verify it. Go on, try it. Maybe you will like learning real stuff instead of just going with the flow.
- zaul32, on 10/10/2007, -5/+12it's still ***** DRM slowing down my computer.
- HappyScrappy, on 10/10/2007, -8/+13Buried for insulting the reader. Show some respect.
- grumpyrain, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5@Phil
The SecuROM copy protection certainly could be classified as a rootkit using the classic definition. It uses a set of tools to conceal its existence from OS applications. It installs itself as a driver and uses a data after a null in a registry key to conceal the existence of the data from regedit which interprets the key as a null terminated string.
You seem to be mistaking a rootkit to hold the malware connotations of the Sony XCP fiasco. A rootkit can simply be the result of dumb design rather than malice. - Phyltre, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6Or, maybe, I checked the "show Hidden and Operating System files" boxes?
- vhold, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6Yup, I actually tested this with Bioshock. I was using XP when I preloaded it, then copied it to my Vista install when unlocking it. Worked fine.
- Jebral, on 10/10/2007, -7/+12Thank God
- Modulo, on 10/10/2007, -0/+5me am like lurn!
- CrazyPirate, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6Seconded. I love all the stories about how they tried to kill him, and he just wouldn't die. Poison, bombs, you name it. They eventually drowned him I think.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grigori_Rasputin - Cykaos, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5"just because it doesn't yield root or system doesn't mean that it isn't a 'rootkit'".... That is the definition of a rootkit.. If doesn't operate at root/system level then it's not a rootkit. It's more than likely just a lame attempt at a trojan
- the42nddegree, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5I dunno, I'm not feeling so peachy after finding out about this...
- wageslaven, on 10/10/2007, -3/+7How on fcuking earth can this comment have +2? I cannot even begin to explain how wrong this is.
Two things clearly jump out as staggeringly stupid:
"If this game requires you to install as an Administrator...then it is a de-facto rootkit."
and
"Consoles don't have this nanny-corp ***** (do they?)"
Jesus fcuking christ. Has Digg fallen this far? - gage006, on 10/10/2007, -8/+12*goes back to playing 360 version*
- GliTCH82, on 10/10/2007, -4/+8Call me anal-retentive, but I remember back when I could choose what I wanted to keep on my computer. When I install BioShock, it installs DRM software that is not removed when BioShock is uninstalled. I don't think that's a good thing, and I don't trust the programmers that made this program, I have no idea whether they are competent at what they do, and Wikipedia tells me there's a possibility even that this software will prevent me from starting certain software or playing other games even a long time after I uninstall the game it came with, the one I ***** paid $60 for. So, here's the deal. I can bring this issue to light with people and hope the company will change its policy, because I like playing games and I think 2K made a great game, but then I have to deal with pricks who try to belittle the cause, the ones who will probably be saying the exact same ***** in 30 years when companies require you insert a rectal camera in your ass to verify your identity prior to playing a game, or, I can just go on BitTorrent in about 5 days and pirate it without all this extraneous *****, which ultimately does a lot more to serve me and ***** over the company that made the game as well as the people that bought it, in an ultimate, sadistic form of irony.
So, *****, while you sit here and argue about whether this is or isn't a rootkit, I can't help but think it's all too funny that you're missing the main point of all of this; SecuROM is a big piece of ***** for not allowing me to remove it when I'm done playing the game. End of story. - Snarfy, on 10/10/2007, -2/+6According to Mr Rasputin's article, this is a big part of what makes a rootkit a rootkit, i.e. cloaking *****. There really isn't a true definition of the word rootkit. It's all semantic BS.
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