News Analysis - After Glow of Games, What Next for China?

162 Comments

stutimandal, on 08/25/2008, -13/+38Back to pollution and Human Resource/Rights abuse.
inactive, on 08/25/2008, -0/+14Should I get ready to welcome our new Chinese overlord?
thelif, on 08/25/2008, -6/+20The main generalized complaints by diggers on China is
1)Human rights abuse - But, the US government can indefinitely arrest and detain any US citizen and somehow it is vastly superior because people can complain about it even though nothing happens.
2)Pollution - China has banned use of plastic bags since June 2008 and the majority of the pollution comes from the manufacturing sector where goods are made for the rest of the world. http://www.worldwatch.org/node/5808

=/
Gerz1219, on 08/25/2008, -2/+14The rest of the world gets it, but if China wants to further its interactions with the West it's going to have to embrace some degree of political liberalization. China can't simultaneously be a dominant world power and cry victim whenever their many human rights abuses are mentioned. If the games helped the Party get over its persecution complex, that's a good first step.
shutaro, on 08/25/2008, -3/+15Remove the chains from their performers and let them go back to making sneakers. *fixed*
thePTS, on 08/25/2008, -0/+12Having been in China, and knowing a little of it's history without being an expert, I have to say I think a lot of people have misunderstood the purpose of the Olympic Games and also much how the government there works.

China has been more or less self-sufficient and "isolated" for thousands of years. The Olympics was China's big "coming out of the basement", and they were genuinely wanting a place in the international community. When the chinese use power-language, it is nothing like this at all. This was China putting on a banquet for the world, meaning to build alliances and get respect. Period.

Secondly, the government is not some "communist party", but rather a very tightly knit "council of elders" who together decide policies. There is no dictator (amazingly enough!), and I don't think a dictator would work in the chinese government either.

There is no "agenda", and China has never been "expansionist" the way Rome, Greece, Mongols, Great Britain etc were. Currently, China only wants to make business and be respected. IMO.
inactive, on 08/25/2008, -0/+11One thing for sure wasnt digitized, the UK FLOAT that looked like something from a small town 4th of july parade.
ddxChrist, on 08/25/2008, -1/+11I spent a few months in Beijing doing research at Peking University. I'm not sure about their social and political issues, but they're certainly churning out top notch students. It was a great environment to work in.
ubtimmay, on 08/25/2008, -0/+9soccer
degol, on 08/25/2008, -1/+10read some history books on how the west achieved their status plz.
tomazws, on 08/25/2008, -2/+10Do what they do to continue growing China.... in their own method..
mediaspree, on 08/25/2008, -0/+8Yea, when they call in the loans of the US we are all *****.
thePTS, on 08/25/2008, -0/+7Things are not ok in the US either, or Russia for that matter (or tons of other countries).

How close is the US to having a one-party state? How many of the top delegates are friends or relatives, Kennedys, Clintons, Bushs? The chinese government is much less active in acts of aggression outside the country, than the US, and seems to have more "impulse control" and dignity.

Also, consider that people actually flee from North Korea to the freedom (!) of China.

Many wrong things, yes. But China as some anti-democratic pole in the spectrum, an example of all that is wrong? No, sorry. Not buying it.
SemiSarcastic, on 08/25/2008, -4/+11China's now a contender that could outrank the US. Get used to it. We can't take back the last eight years, we just have to keep moving forward.
lava, on 08/25/2008, -0/+7which is, by the way, similar to the way the US gained it's status.
MWeather, on 08/25/2008, -5/+10"if China wants to further its interactions with the West it's going to have to embrace some degree of political liberalization"

They only have one less political party than the US does.
ZeeZee2k, on 08/25/2008, -2/+7authoritarianism
BossKey, on 08/25/2008, -0/+5"Are all the foreigners gone? Good. Put the Imperial March CD back in."
umstudent, on 08/25/2008, -2/+7I lived in China for more than 5 years. I guarantee you that they are going to be the center of the world pretty soon. They are improving dramatically in human rights issues too. Go live there yourself and you'll find out how happy people there are.
BossKey, on 08/25/2008, -0/+5"Cheap junk" is such a myopic view. We have China make everything. It doesn't matter what price class your home electronics, computers, or other equipment are in, in most cases even the high-end stuff was made in China.
zerton, on 08/25/2008, -3/+8I foresee ***** music in the future ... "beijing, beijing..."
howufinna, on 08/25/2008, -0/+5You white people like to complain a lot about stuff that doesn't even concern you. Chinese people are capable of achieving human rights for themselves. It just takes time. Nothing is worse then feeling like you've been "freed" by white people which Western society is trying to feel like their doing.
kidtitan, on 08/25/2008, -0/+5For a country that have this massive issues managing it's own 300 million population, it's sure funny to see all the comments about how another country should manage their 1.3 billion (that's a billion more for the mathematically challenged) population.

We need to get US in shape first and end our own hypocrisy BEFORE we start criticizing anyone, especially China.
FredFredrickson, on 08/25/2008, -3/+8What's next?
My prediction: They'll continue making cheap junk for the rest of the world.
DatruKatalyst, on 08/25/2008, -0/+5Gerz,

in all honesty the Communist Party did all this to #1 to its own people. Int'l comes 2nd. They want to show their own ppl - "LOOK, see, me as your gov't, we really can achieve great things! Continue being my cooperative citizens, and we will be successful." It's actually sort of a social contract. Now that capitalism, admittedly understood by the party, is the only way to go, ideals of their communism is dead. They don't have much to hold onto as a governing party. So they hold on by showing the ppl that they can please them, make things better. In return the ppl are happy to be raised from poverty, and support their gov't. These games have been a success to the party's mind, and concurrently because the Chinese ppl saw it as a success.

So in a way, China couldn't care less about int'l factors. Yeah, they are hurt when the West critisizes them. But I think this is a culture gap betwn West and East. It is just very hard for both to understand each other because of divergent histories and ideals.

So in conclusion the party is insecure, they are trying to hold onto its ppl. But as capitalism goes, economical factors carry in also, so it is not a different issue. China has USA by the balls right now. (Of course USA and China are currently a mutual benefit. USA keeps spending, China buys up the $$ debt, and gets to say they have more money now.)
duggynyc, on 08/25/2008, -0/+4My Apple Ipod, Logitech keyboard, speakers, and Sony clock radio seem to stand the test of time.
CementShoes, on 08/25/2008, -1/+5insert mildly racist/ humorless comment
adam71o, on 08/25/2008, -1/+5Mr. drmangrum, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this [forum] is now dumber for having [read] it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.
SemiSarcastic, on 08/25/2008, -2/+6If history can teach us anything you don't have to be a leader in human rights to be another/sole superpower. Just look at Rome.
ap1983, on 08/25/2008, -10/+14China continues to make the statement that it is a force to be reckoned with..if the rest of the world doesn't get it by now then it's just stubborn ignorance.
degol, on 08/25/2008, -0/+4tell me the truth ... are you outside on the street and naked, right now ?
erichw1504, on 08/25/2008, -1/+5Haha, I couldn't help myself from singing along to that song though.
thePTS, on 08/25/2008, -0/+4Comparing the current situation in China, to the days of Mao? Haha. "Getting better"? The country turned around 180 degrees from that time.

Mao is no icon in China today, nor is his image being built up / "idolized" by the government at all. In fact, he's generally regarded as having been a catastrophe for the country. In other words, the chinese agree with you.

Today's China is the businessman's China. Field workers stay in their rice fields, and the poorest of the poor stay the poorest of the poor. There's no communism. The only thing that could be mistaken for communism, is the strict state control and frequent state interventions. But now, in 99% of cases, those interventions serve the purpose of making China grow economically.
inactive, on 08/25/2008, -0/+4you say that as if china cares what "west" thinks of it. western companies only care that manufacturing is cheap. how it's achieved is irrelevant.
inactive, on 08/25/2008, -1/+4They need to invade Vietnam or figure out wtf they are going to do about all the industries leaving China for locations with cheaper labor.

Such is the way of the world. Enjoy your short time with slave labor then move on.
MWeather, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3"Yeah, and every multi-party parliamentary government quickly coalesces into two factions -- the majority and the opposition."

Yes, but generally the majority and opposition are made up of a coalition of parties with widely varying viewpoints, not two parties who are almost identical.

If China took all the left leaning Communists and the right leaning Communists and put them in two different parties, they would have just as much political diversity as the US.
hartley, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3You're right. I didn't emphasize how much when I said it's getting better. It has turned a full 180. Much of China now is how Hong Kong has been for years. For the past 15+ (?) years they have had booming economic growth, mainly due to the limited capitalism they have allowed some of their people.

It's not perfect, but as I said, it's getting better. When you have KFC and McDonalds in China, you know they are becoming more and more part of the world economy. The people are starting to enjoy it as well, its slowly going less from the military *and military assisted private owned businesses* and more towards the people. My main argument is that China is not now what they used to be, and they have a lot of work to do since those darker days. (Mainly speaking on who gets those opportunities for economic growth)
Donwangugi, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3Man, in 5 years your going to look like a tool.
Gerz1219, on 08/25/2008, -2/+5Yeah, and every multi-party parliamentary government quickly coalesces into two factions -- the majority and the opposition. It's rooted in human nature. The problem is that China actively seeks to silence the opposition.
serif69, on 08/25/2008, -6/+9The usual insane mix of oppressive communism and free-market capitalism, I'm guessing.
umstudent, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3"A poll where 85% of the country is happy with the Communist party. I guess the remaining 15% will need to pay a visit to the reeducation camp."

I guess you really have never been to China. The western media are definitely biased in paiting a horrible picture of chinese society. I personally lived many years there and I know chinese society much better than a bunch of "journalists". Chinese government's approval rating of 85% is very credible to me. Most people there could not afford a landline phone just 20 years ago. Now even a beggar on the street carries a call phone (and chances are it's better than the ugly Verizon Wireless phones here in the States). It's not surprising at all to see the high approval rate.

My adivce for you is to stop following blindly the media, but go there yourself.
SemiSarcastic, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3I'm sorry but you forgot to read the last sentence. I as implying that we (Americans) can still rise out of the hole we've dug ourselves into.
tmo72, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3They've caught the US in the former, while the US is trying to catch up to China in the latter...
xtothepowerofx, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3for the last time... no one is gonna suck your *****
xtothepowerofx, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3well said mweather :) dugg
thelif, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3A brief google and .. http://www.alternet.org/rights/55993/

He was just taken off a bus for living near Islamic fundamentalists, not even in the US, how is that any better?
xtothepowerofx, on 08/25/2008, -3/+6everyone gets the whole "economic powerhouse" thing at this point... we're not blind or stupid. but this does not in any way mean the we should (or i will) condone the practices by which they've achieved their status... practices that are almost universally condemned by the rest of the world for very good reasons.
umstudent, on 08/25/2008, -1/+4If you have been living in China, you know that it's exactly the goal of the Chinese government economic policies. THey are trying to build a high-tech based economy, and they are pretty happy seeing the shoe makers going to Vietnam. China is already the largest manufacturer of solar panels. BYD (aka build you dreams) ShenZhen is already selling 100% electric car in Israel. It's a matter of time before China replaces the U.S. as high-tech leader in the world. Personally, I bet it will take 50 years for this to happen.
pathouston22, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3Probably, but a majority of their country will still be poor and still be manfufacturing cheap junk.

A majority middle class is not going to happen for a long time in China.
degol, on 08/25/2008, -0/+3name a stable country that has no government plz.
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