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40 Comments
- schestowitz, on 10/12/2007, -9/+37Ubuntu is becoming a buzzword (just look at Digg), so it needs to be protected, just like "Linux", or else companies will abuse the hype and ride the wave.
- coredump0x01, on 10/12/2007, -1/+22"No one refers to a Mac as "Windows"."
You'd be surprised at how untrue that statement is if you dealt with some of my clients =)
Few examples I've heard:
"If my Windows is broken, could I install Mac?"
"Could we try to install that other Windows? What was it called again, [yoo]buntu?"
"I really like this new Windows." (note I had installed Kubuntu for him :) - ner0tic, on 10/12/2007, -0/+19constantly dicking around in config files would be to "gentoo"
- flossgeek, on 10/12/2007, -0/+13There is nothing wrong with protecting your identity, trademarks are fine, patents are the problem in software.
- misterhardcore, on 10/12/2007, -0/+13Isn't there a Adobe® Photoshop® joke somewhere here?
- GnuTzu, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14Renaming a project without legitimately forking a project somehow seems a bit off.
But then, how much of your own work do you need to add in creating a fork before is seems fair to come up with your own name?
I'd like to see credit given where credit is due, but some might find this a bit messy. - GMorgan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12Mozilla were forced by American law to protect their trademarks.
- mgrucker, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12I think you mean "What if you manipulate the logo using Adobe® Photoshop® software?"
- gnufan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11A rather distorted comment I think. Debian was forced to rename its browser in order to comply with their own rules, and those imposed by Mozilla.
In that sense it was Mozilla beating the trademark drum in the same fashion as Ubuntu is now.
To an extent this is all dictated by trademark law, that says you have to protect it, or lose it, so making them ask permission allows Ubuntu to say "sure", whilst recording the fact they agreed allows them to say they are protecting the name, for when some starts using the name in a way they disagree with. - generalloy, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10Common misconception:
"The issue is actually quite simple:
-- Debian needs the ability to modify the code that they ship. This is necessary, first, to provide bugfixes for versions that are no longer supported upstream; and second, some changes are necessary for integration with the Debian system. And third, just because they want to. The ability to make code changes is fundamental to Debian's purpose.
-- Mozilla doesn't allow anyone to make unapproved changes and still use the name and logo.
The change in name and logo was thus forced by Mozilla, not Debian. SJVN even acknowledges this in his article, but inexplicably still blames Debian for the incident. And yes, both the name and the logo had to be changed, not just the logo.
By the way, Iceweasel is not a "fork". It follows the upstream Firefox package closely.
Jerry Epplin"
This is also coming to a bit of a head with Mozilla discontinuing 1.5 support, while distros like sarge and Dapper Drake still ship it. They'll need to apply their own security patches then. But anyways digg me down, I know I'm off topic but I just felt like getting that out there. - GawtMilk, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7***** spammers. Go die, I command it.
- shanesemler, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6These rules seem very reasonable to me. Also, they seem very easy to me and I like the sound of "remixes." I'm sure someone will find a reason complain about them anyway.
- coredump0x01, on 10/12/2007, -5/+11@cacoe
Which is not necessarily a bad thing. At least people are beginning to recognize Linux as a viable OS and not just a toy. And as Linux's position on the desktop matures further and Ubuntu users become more skilled/comfortable with Linux, they may well move on to other distributions, Even though there really isn't anything wrong with Ubuntu politically or within the realm of the non-technical arguments I see used against it's popularity. Really the only one losing out on this is Microsoft, The users learn and Linux gains some much needed and well deserved mainstream attention. - underthelinux, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5pfs1 - isn't that already done? I mean, most of the articles about ubuntu (on digg atleast) could really pertain to any flavor of linux. (and thats even before talking about linux being the kernel yadda yadda)
My point, people here atleast take ubuntu to mean linux. just like kleenex to mean tissue - and thats not really a verb. - jumpfroggy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6The article was interesting, as well as the one on the original 'IceWeasel' renaming. But it goes deeper than that. How do open source organizations/companies and trademarks mix? One of the articles talks about how ironic it is that the Debian community rejects Mozilla's iron-fist trademark stance, seeing how they prevented the DCC (formed from all-Debian companies) from using Debian in their name.
Ubuntu's stance seems pretty even-keeled; use Ubuntu in a clear way. You can use Ubuntu in the name, but not in a confusing manner. You can say "based on Ubuntu", which seems like it should always be legal. It's an interesting gray area where commercial/proprietary meets openness, and something I hadn't considered before. - PFS1, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6A trademark isn't necessarily genericized by becoming a verb....look at "Kleenex" or "Band-Aid". The word "Ubuntu" could become genericized by people who don't know much about OSes to mean "that free one that isn't windows". Long shot, but absolutely possible.
- Wootery, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5That's some good trolling, ilgaz.
- warkro, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5sudo killall spammer
- salmonmoose, on 10/12/2007, -8/+12Good point. It's not like you can actually do anything with linux, no matter the distribution. Maybe to Ubuntu could represent constantly dicking around in config files :P
/troll - coredump0x01, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3@underthelinux
This is true. I think perhaps it'd be better for everyone if they had trademarked the term "Ubuntu Linux" This way users will see the word Linux and be able to bridge the disambiguation gap between "Ubuntu" and general "Linux" related items. In any case, Mark Shuttleworth is a smart man and I'm sure he'll make the right decision with this. - chad78, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3So much for FluxBuntu, Aqubuntu, IceBuntu, MacBuntu, WinBuntu, iBuntu, WiiBuntu, #@XBuntu,733TBuntu, MythBuntu, and so many other shattered dreams...
- gravityboy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2How is that behavior ironic (although I think the word you're hinting at is "hypocritical") at all? Mozilla said "Debian, you can't ship something called Firefox if it's modified at all because then it's not Firefox," and Debian said "Ok, then we won't call it Firefox." Similarly, Debian said "DCC, you can't ship something called Debian if it's modified at all because then it's not Debian." The behavior is consistent and sensible. Debian as a whole didn't complain about this. The tantrums were, as usual, from the peanut gallery.
- Wootery, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Teetbuntu?
- stealthyninja, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3flossgeek, shanesemler and jumpfroggy: +1.
raynevandunem: I'd prefer a company to be open and honest about their trademarks and rights now rather than the "six years into the future" or to have it remain obscure/hidden in some legalese-laden ToS just waiting to bite you/your company in the ass. I also don't see anything wrong with Canonical, Mozilla or any other company taking steps in protecting their identity or the setting up of rules to dictate what changes to their code falls under. - btipling, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4No, I think you mean "What if you manipulate the "Based on Ubuntu®" logo and trademark using Adobe® Photoshop® software?"
- ksadya, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1copyright and/or trademark infringement. I donno, you could always try it and see what they say.
- ksadya, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1except when your identity is a common word or phrase... 'Windows' should have never been allowed, because sometimes I say "I need to clean my windows", and other times I say, "I need to clean my Windows"* Man, they both get dirty so fast...
*stretching it just a little - writerboyVSgod, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2What if you photoshop the logo?
- Stemp, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Yep good trolling, but BTW :
«The Ubuntu Promise
* Ubuntu will always be free of charge, including enterprise releases and security updates.»
http://www.ubuntu.com/ - Derrekito, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2There already is a "733TBuntu" it's called Slackware. :)
- Derrekito, on 10/12/2007, -4/+5From MY experience any flack Linux gets as not being a good OS is based on ignorance.
- Derrekito, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3@diggcopblowme
bant. - raynevandunem, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3Right now, patents (of every type) are being ruled as irrelevant and useless.
Someday, I'm sure, we're gonna get to a point where trademarks and copyrights will be ruled as irrelevant and useless,where the corporate legal need to protect your own identity will become unnecessary and unbearably restrictive. Just not right now, of course.
Wikipedia's own struggles over copyrighted and trademarked images and videos uploaded to their servers are the first signs that the current laws will be in an increasingly greater need for reform in the years to come.
People may cheer Canonical for enforcing their trademark now, but just wait for, say, 6 years into the future.
Trust me, you won't. - ilgaz, on 10/12/2007, -4/+3So what if Apple names next version to OS X Ubuntu? They have all the right since they copied OS X interface bit by bit, behaviour by behaviour.
Trademarking is the first step to commercialisation, I will love to see those fans faces when it happens. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2What about CockInUBuntu?
- GawtMilk, on 10/12/2007, -5/+2I'm not implying that Ubuntu is useless, I'm just saying Ubuntu is in the operating system market, a market that's not had an genericized trademarks in twenty years of existance. No one refers to a Mac as "Windows".
- elnerdo, on 10/12/2007, -13/+7The jokes on you. Ubuntu fangirl is an oxymoron.
- mash8591, on 10/12/2007, -10/+4Well said my friend - VISTA FTW!
- GawtMilk, on 10/12/2007, -14/+3How is going Ubuntu going to become genericized? It represents an un-verbable action. Why would there be another term for operating system, and if there was going to be one, why would it be Ubuntu? It doesn't really make sense. Google became a verb because it represents an action...to search for websites only. Photoshop became a verb because it represents an action...to manipulate images in realtime on a computer.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -51/+6Ubuntu may lay down the LAW, but I'm laying down my ballsack on the foreheads of you ubuntu fangirls.
***** the ubuntu hype.
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