What is Digg?45 Comments
- Trunkmonkey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7"a lot of these mobile linux distros are horrible. the manufacturer will use some custom linux distro"
I'm a Pepper employee; we're using Fedora Core as the underlying OS. Anything Fedora Core can do you can do on the Pad. ;) - evilTak, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5I have a 770 as well. It's a great little tool! My fiancee uses it for a portable music and movie player, and it's handy to have a web browser in your pocket whenever you need one. Also, there's nothing like seeing the looks people give you as (surprisingly loud) sounds of gunfire and zombie death screams emanate from your tiny handheld. Finally, it's a great platform to hack on, if you're into that - the SDK is available to everyone, its UI is a superset of Gtk+, and there are great tutorials on maemo.org.
- evilTak, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5In that case, http://www.nokia.com/770
- Wootery, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5"thats great keep it to yourself"
thats great keep it to yourself.
(His post was informative - you're just an idiot.) - claco, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5For $850, I'll take an ultra portable laptop instead. Still, cool hardware one the less.
- tmcc, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5My Nokia 770 is the first handheld computer that has actually been worth a damn.
I have it setup with OpenVPN, VNC and SSH. I can access my other computers from anywhere with my EVDO bluetooth phone (at broadband speed).
The nokia freaking rocks! - Ratteler, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4First of all, the article has a bunch of wrong info.It links to specs for PP2, not the PP3. The PP2 was an Xscale processor, and larger.
The PP3 kicks the Nokia 770 ass.
Thumbboards are great when you want to type and MOVE at the same time. The only thing I liked about my Palm Tungsen C was it's thumbboard. You can STILL plug a full USB Keyboard and mouse into the PP3 if you want to sit down and surf like a normal laptop. Or you can even whip out your favorite Bloetooth 2.0 compatible keyboard.
Can a Nokia770 do that?
It runs a real upgradable Fedora Core 4 Linux 2.6 Kernal. That means the PP3 will be devoloped for long after Nokia has forgetent hey ever made a 770.
The AMD Geode is 500Mhz and x86 compatble Vs the Nokia 770's very weak, incompatible 220Mhz ARM processor.
The PP3 will run just about any Linux app that there are RPM's for, while the Nokia is not really Linux at all, and needs cutom ARM software, and I doubt Nokia has opened it up to the programming community as much as Pepper has/will.
PP3 has 256MB ROM Vs Nokia's128MB Flash, and 256MB RAM, Vs Nokia's 64MB.
Nokia's RS-MMC is costly and maxes out at measly 1GB I think. The PP3 has a real 1.8" hard drivejust like the ones used in iPods. So it is theoretically upgradable to whatever drive get's mad in that form factor. 120GB are definatly on the way.
Want to run Windows? VMWare runs on the PP3. Try that with your Nokia.
Basically, the PP3 is a real laptop disguised as a PSP. The Nokia is a "Me too" PSP wann be. - AkiraXXX, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4I agree with the 770 mob. Let's hope that the next iteration of the 770 will have mass-storage of appreciable, er, mass. These days a bluetooth keyboard and mouse as an accessory with just about anything portable is a given. I don't know why the screen resolution is so bad. And, IMHO, it is ugly. Apart from that, it is fine.
- moylan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3>The PP3 kicks the Nokia 770 ass.
different devices for different tasks i think.
>Thumbboards are great when you want to type and MOVE at the same time. The only thing I liked about my Palm Tungsen C was it's thumbboard.
very handy all right
>You can STILL plug a full USB Keyboard and mouse into the PP3 if you want to sit down and surf like a normal laptop. Or you can even whip out your favorite Bloetooth 2.0 compatible keyboard.
>Can a Nokia770 do that?
there are people who have added usb keyboards. it requires a bit of hardware know how as you you need to supply the keyboard with power as the 770 won't supply it.
i'm getting a bluetooth keyboard for my 770 in a few days. no mouse but the touch screen is excellent. it'll also work with my phone as well.
>It runs a real upgradable Fedora Core 4 Linux 2.6 Kernal. That means the PP3 will be devoloped for long after Nokia has forgetent hey ever made a 770.
as long as one 770 is around somebody will develop for it. that is the beauty of linux. it may be a smaller development pool but look at the sharp zaurus. all but killed off and people still develop for it. even if nokia were to pull the whole project the standard battery and chargers would still be available.
>The AMD Geode is 500Mhz and x86 compatble Vs the Nokia 770's very weak, incompatible 220Mhz ARM processor.
very true. however the 770 has an insane battery life. palm also do this. they run a processor at a slower speed to eek out the battery. me i prefer battery life every time.
>The PP3 will run just about any Linux app that there are RPM's for,
again true but the 770 runs everything that i want it to. it has drawn in a skilled pool of developers who release their software.
>while the Nokia is not really Linux at all, and needs cutom ARM software, and I doubt Nokia has opened it up to the programming community as much as Pepper has/will.
arm architecture is well catered for as most portable pda type devices use some variant. nokia have paid the developer behind the window manager and he sings their praises in the interviews that i have read.
>PP3 has 256MB ROM Vs Nokia's128MB Flash, and 256MB RAM, Vs Nokia's 64MB.
my psion organiser had 8 mb back in the day. i used to have 10 apps open at once. it is how the ram is used rather than how much there is. you paid more than twice the price of a 770 for a pp3. you got what you paid for.
>Nokia's RS-MMC is costly and maxes out at measly 1GB I think.
2gb actually. still a little low. mind you i can bluetooth from the 770 filemanager to my nokia n70 phone in my pocket and viola double that!
>The PP3 has a real 1.8" hard drivejust like the ones used in iPods. So it is theoretically upgradable to whatever drive get's mad in that form factor. 120GB are definatly on the way.
if the device has wifi why not just link to a local storage system and use that. i do. but yeah i may actually look to see if i can get a usb hard disk up and going on the 770. some people have connected an ipod to the 770 to act as storage.
>Want to run Windows? VMWare runs on the PP3. Try that with your Nokia.
why would i sully such a beautiful little device with ms bloatware? i can vnc to a local system running windows if i need it. i wouldn't.
>Basically, the PP3 is a real laptop disguised as a PSP. The Nokia is a "Me too" PSP wanna be.
the pp3 is nice and i did consider buying one but found the price a little high. the 770 has nothing to do with the psp. for a start i prefer the games on the 770 :-) the browser on the 770 really gains from the touchscreen so entering long urls is much easier. and the battery life is far better.
these are different linux devices and as such are aiming at different markets. i hope the pp3 does well as it's a very interesting experiment in creating a new form for mobile computing. the 770 is for me a nice comfy way to improve my nokia n70 phone and replace my laptop. - Trunkmonkey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3In theory, you can install any OS you want. But that relies on Windows having drivers that can drive our LCD, touchscreen, Wi-Fi card, etc. The Pad 3 is X86-based with a BIOS so Windows should start to boot; whether or not it will be usable is an exercise for the driver hacker. ;)
- berwiki, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4I think it is a fine addition, it doesn't add to its depth, just the width.
Have you ever flipped one of those tablet pc's around and actually tried to function without a keyboard? It gets annoying really fast without keys present. This should improve with time, but for now, the keyboard would be extremely helpful. - Trunkmonkey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"Everyone hacked into the pepper pad"
And how exactly did people "hack" into the Pad? The Pepper Pad that Tom was using was our first generation model. It ran no services other than chat. No open ports. Nothing to connect to. With nothing to connect to, there's nothing to hack into. - jeremy66158, on 10/12/2007, -5/+7Looks like a silly buy. The desktop software is made for windows conputers only! I would rather have a nokia 770
- GameCat, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5I would prefer one without the keyboard and the ability to write/type on the screen. I could easily plug a keyboard and mouse in if required.
- heydigital, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I used one. Not to shabby, but the keyboard was horriable. Still, web tablets have yet to fully catch on.
- Ratteler, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Well. That was more diplomatic than I'm used to on Digg. Thank you for that by the way.
I wasn't the one who originally compared the N770 to the PP3, but I did feel compelled to point out the major difference between the 2 platforms.
Yes. Different devices for different needs/wants.
For me, all the "remoting" in the world isn't enough. If it was I have 2 ageing laptops more than capable of remoting into my main equipment. A Powerbook 1400 and an old 166Mhz Toshiba.
I like having my local resources in unit since I'm not connected to the net everywhere I go.
For me, it boils down to this. Which one will I be able to run OpenOffice On. That's not going to happen for the Nokia. But it probably is for the PP3.
I've always hated handwriting recognition. My handwriting has always been terrible. Some times even I can't read it. On my old Cassepiea 125, I always needed to popup the on screen keyboard, and would race those who claimed they could JOT faster than I could tap. I never lost.
On my T|C, once I found a halfway decent Word Processor for Palm, I wrote several hundred pages of material on the thumb board while in transit to places. I actually shut the Handwriting recognition off all together.
Those who put down a thumbboard obviously haven't used one. With very little effort you can learn to thumb almsot as fast as you can type. - hypercube33, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2That stand does look quite crappy for $850!
- Ratteler, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Yes. You can install Windows under VMware. Not the BEST solution, but it does work.
- raptordrew, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Hey Trunkmonkey, I know people probably dont want me asking this, but can you install Windows on this thing? I love linux like everyone else, but sometimes Windows is nice, especially if I want my parents to be able to use it
- CoolWind, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Nice hardware, but the retail price needs to be much lower. I hope it includes an ethernet connector.
- nofxjunkee, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3"The desktop software is made for windows conputers only!"
Nokia 770s run Linux. - AaronCompNetSys, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1This would be a great addition to you Media Center PC folks (Windows and Linux). I have 2, which I currently VNC to set up shows and slide shows. A mobile peripheral input and auxiliary screen over WiFi would be fantastic. Blackberry and smartphone replacement here I come.
- raindog469, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I agree, berwiki, but I still saw that thumbboard layout and immediately thought, "Man, that Game Gear has a lot of buttons."
- hypercube33, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1After you've mentioned it on digg, it wont be cheap as dirt, or there.
- Ratteler, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1OpenOffice runs effectively on my 166Mhz 144MB Toshiba laptop, so a 500Mhz Geode with 256MB should do the job.
For me a strong word processor is essential to me mobile needs. I don't write as much code as I do commentary and content.
Things like this break down to location. I'm in New York City where mass transit is the most effective way to travel and real estate is no so expensive a closet cost as much as a small house some where else.
A device like the PP3 fits this evironment very nicely. I've avoided things like the PSP and Nokia 770 because they just didn't fit the bill.
That second BT keyboard I almost bought. But it has the same problem as any other keyboard. I need a desk to put the display on even if I thumb type.
So fart he PP3 is the only device that's put everything on one platform that I can hold and use without trouble. - bgladden, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I use a NEC Mobilepro 780 for just about the same thing and it has a near full sized qwerty keyboard. I use it when it's not feasable to haul around a normal sized laptop, and aside from being a tad sluggish on the internet it serves it's purpose well. If anyone is looking to buy a Pepper Pad, you might want to check on an older HP Jornada or newer Mobilepro; cheap as dirt on ebay.
Looks very cool though if they weren't so expensive I'd jump all over this. - JQP123, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I don't touch type but those who do tell me I'm pretty good with my "unorthodox" style. I don't have a clue where the keys are, my fingers just know and expect the QWERTY layout and are lost without it.
- alettieri, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I like it... still not ready to purchase a pad though.
- moylan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1>Well. That was more diplomatic than I'm used to on Digg. Thank you for that by the way.
no worries. i use digg less now as the 'fanbois' shout down reason but you asked questions which is always a sign of intelligence as far as i'm concerned.
>Yes. Different devices for different needs/wants.
i think their overlap is that some people are replacing huge laptops with both. small functional devices. it is only that people carry laptops for different reasons. up till now we have a used a one size fits all philosophy, now...
>For me, all the "remoting" in the world isn't enough. If it was I have 2 ageing laptops more than capable of remoting into my main equipment. A Powerbook 1400 and an old 166Mhz Toshiba.
i carry a ton of data on my 2 * 1 gb cards. 1 in my phone and 1 in my 770. think about it 4-5 years ago your desktop had 4gb. i just like to keep all my data in txt, html, rtf, jpeg formats so that i can view them in the future.
>I like having my local resources in unit since I'm not connected to the net everywhere I go.
small files go a long way for me. what data are you storing if i may ask?
>For me, it boils down to this. Which one will I be able to run OpenOffice On. That's not going to happen for the Nokia. But it probably is for the PP3.
open office is a bit over kill for me. i like it on my desktop but it is resource hungry. would it be usable on the pp3? the slow processor and limited ram (compared to what it's used to) might degrade its performance to unacceptable levels? i use small simple text editor called leafpad on the 770. suits me to the ground. must look at learning console vim. know my way around it a little but should put the time in.
>I've always hated handwriting recognition. My handwriting has always been terrible. Some times even I can't read it. On my old Cassepiea 125, I always needed to popup the on screen keyboard, and would race those who claimed they could JOT faster than I could tap. I never lost.
as a programmer i'm right there with you. my handwriting has degraded over the years to a pitiful mess unless i spend a silly amount of time on it. however when i got my zaurus a few years back i taught it palm grafitti which i found acceptable (grafitti 1 and not the version 2 silliness), though i used the built in keyboard 99% of the time ;-) . i think the 770 has a learn facility. been using the pop up keyboard till i get a bluetooth version. it does have a very good finger keyboard wereby if you touch the screen for a few seconds a big on screen keyboard appears that takes 90% of the screen.
>On my T|C, once I found a halfway decent Word Processor for Palm, I wrote several hundred pages of material on the thumb board while in transit to places. I actually shut the Handwriting recognition off all together.
using graffitti i entered 100s of pages onto various palms before giving up when grafitti 2 came in. the accuracy rate dropped off from 99% to 90% :-(
>Those who put down a thumbboard obviously haven't used one. With very little effort you can learn to thumb almsot as fast as you can type.
i would love a good thumb board but most people take one look and dismiss them. this reduces the ability for them to take off.
i'm getting a plain old bluetooth keyboard but only because i have no credit card at the moment. otherwise i would look at;
http://www.expansys.ie/product.asp?code=118018
or
http://www.expansys.ie/product.asp?code=124250
not sure if either of these would work with the 770 but if they did they would be my first choice. - Trunkmonkey, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1More Pepper Pad 3 diggs, if you're in to that sort of thing: ;)
http://digg.com/gadgets/Video_Hands_On_Pepper_Pad_3
http://digg.com/gadgets/PepperPad_3_Hands_On
http://digg.com/gadgets/PepperPad_3_Pre_Happiness - raptordrew, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Excellent; thank you! If anything, I can teach 'em how to use Linux (haha, maybe not).
- raindog469, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I would rather have an ultraportable as well, but I paid $2500 for the one I'm using right now.
Can you point to an ultraportable laptop (3 pounds or less) for 800 bucks that's new, not overstock, refurb or used? sub300.com used to sell one (running Linspire) but now they're up to a grand. - MacBrowser, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0nice one, hope the price will go down to about $500
- cabazorro, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2$850 is not worth the sneeze. Also the thumb buttons are dumb. For a tablet to work must be under $250, recognize hand writing and the stylus to get a paper feel feedback on the screen so you don't feel you are driping some pixelated crap on a piece of glass.
- nixdoctor, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Can I get a foldable laptop screen for $850 instead???
- HisTumness, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3What is the point of having the keys arranged in QWERTY if you can't use the keypad to type?
- rally25rs, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1loose the 'wings' on the side and I'd buy one. Otherwise, while a cool chunk of hardware, it looks kinda silly IMO.
- macewan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1850 is probably 300 too much -
- raabco, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0That looks to be quite the laptop...
I do need my coat hanger back, though. - machsFuel, on 10/12/2007, -4/+2second that - i've been looking for a 770, anyone know where they are avail in canada?
- krinthekuz, on 09/16/2008, -5/+3for anyone who does not know, a lot of these mobile linux distros are horrible. the manufacturer will use some custom linux distro to cut costs in windows licensing, and the OS has little or nothing to do with linux that we know and love. as a linux geek, i find this completely out of whack. my linux mobile cellphone has no command line and basically everything is hidden as much as possible. i'll basically have to get a developers manual (which they dont provide to anyone) in order to do anything with it. at least windows mobile runs ppc applications.
- Noloco, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1Tom Green had the pepper pad to take calls. Everyone hacked into the pepper pad so Tom with an land line phone system.
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