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AMD's ATI Hits a Home Run with 3800 Series

enthusiast.hardocp.com — ATI Radeon HD 3800 Series - The ATI Radeon HD 3800 series graphics cards are here. We will explore performance in Crysis, Unreal Tournament 3, NFS: Pro Street, and TimeShift. We can now recommend two ATI graphics cards for your gaming needs.

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  • daifeichu, on 11/15/2007, -6/+22Hmmm, with xmas around the corner that HD 3850 would look good in my pc.

    twatt
    • dsmx, on 11/16/2007, -1/+6Except that the next generation of nvidea cards are due out soon...
    • blapierre, on 11/16/2007, -4/+10This review is pretty misleading using different settings on the different cards. A much better review can be found here: http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3151
      • pathy, on 11/16/2007, -1/+3That's how [H] do their reviews. They're not misleading at all to anyone that reads them.
        • dsmx, on 11/16/2007, -1/+3I wrote that to sum it up for people who couldn't be bothered to read it all.
      • dsmx, on 11/16/2007, -0/+11What that review basically says is that the 8800GT still is better if you can get hold of one.
    • TotalCarb, on 11/16/2007, -15/+3Who the hell buys crap like this? If you buy this, do you expect to game on anything bigger than a 20 or 22 inch screen? What kinds of games do you think will have good frame rates with these cards? Why the hell buy a card that was outdated and outclassed, severely, before it was even released?
      People shouldn't be lauding AMD for this non-accomplishment. It is crap like this that dumbs down the entire pc gaming world. This card lowers the bar for the mid-range where the 8800GT raised it. The lower the mid-range bar is the longer it will take for truly innovative games to be released as developers will be stuck coding for the same crappy low end consumer install base. We should be pushing for the best at all times, not constant rehashes of the same mid range product. AMD's lack of progress has allowed Nvidia to stand still.
      What are you going to do with that shiny new 3870? You can't play Crysis with it or Gears of war. You sure as hell can't play supreme commander or any other various 07 games at reasonable resolutions. What do you expect to play in 08? With this card and resource heavy games that are coming out, you'll be able to play the sequel to Bass Fisher Pro, maybe, as long as you don't enable AA.
      • dsmx, on 11/16/2007, -2/+9So your saying it's a bad thing that ATI and Nvidia are concentrating on developing smaller, more power efficient cards that still churn out photo realistic graphics?
        • TotalCarb, on 11/16/2007, -6/+1Yup, I could care less about power efficiency when it means slow and inferior technology. I want a new high end card from either company. One that wowed me as much as the GTX. Power efficiency in an enthusiast product would be icing on the cake. I didn't get into PC gaming because it's cheap. Remember how much money you saved as you watch your 2 frames per second tick by in Oregon Trail.
          • dsmx, on 11/16/2007, -1/+4So your saying that the 8800GT which every reviewer says obsoletes the entire nvidia line is a bad card? It's arseholes like you who give PC gamers a bad name.
          • TotalCarb, on 11/16/2007, -1/+3It's a fine card, if you don't mind having a new paper weight. GTX is the minimum performance people should demand nowadays. Why? because it is already being taxed by current games. If the best is being stressed what do you think you're gonna get with a lower end card? What is the point of being a PC gamer if you buy a video card, even a new one, that can't play games? You are most definitely gonna have to upgrade your card in under a year if you go with this pos. If you're cool with 30 fps or low res gaming then you aren't a gamer. With this card you will have to choose between moderate frame rates at low res with the candy turned off or low frame rates at moderate resolutions with the candy turned off.
      • Phasmorphage, on 11/16/2007, -4/+7Well some of us don't have hundreds of dollars to dish out on expensive graphic cards.

        the 8800GTX costs almost as much as my entire COMPUTER
    • salomejones, on 11/16/2007, -3/+1Excellent. Does it do OpenGL yet?
    • TotalCarb, on 11/16/2007, -4/+2I wanna make this easy for all you new 3800 series owners and save a lot of forums a lot of time. When you inevitably go and ask, "will my ATI 38XX play *insert any 08 game*" the answer is no.
    • TotalCarb, on 11/16/2007, -4/+1.
    • keyo, on 11/16/2007, -0/+5http://www.legionhardware.com/document.php?id=703& ...

      AMD owns themselves once again, for ***** sake come up with something good or you'll go bust. I gotta go with the value and get 8800gt, which will only get cheaper.
  • AtlanticVortex, on 11/15/2007, -7/+38Finally, and ATI card I actually want. Took long enough...
    • superal1394, on 11/16/2007, -2/+7As a long time fan of ATI cards, I have been sorely disappointed by them for the past couple years. It is nice to see them getting their heads into the game. Perhaps some real competition will return to drive down prices
    • stoanhart, on 11/16/2007, -1/+2In my price range too! I'm excited; I would love to get one, BUT......

      ATI, we still don't have those GPU specs you promised... kinda need them too :(
    • keyo, on 11/16/2007, -1/+4Nvidia will just roll out some price drops or newer models soon. I think I'll wait for that. I like amd but they keep coming out with crap products. The price difference between the 8800gt and 3970 is about $20 in my country, I'll get the nvidia until amd offers more value for money.
  • Superdemon, on 11/15/2007, -6/+26It's about damn time AMD did something right. They have really been slipping lately.
    • Asianwaste, on 11/16/2007, -2/+2They're planning something... they've got to be.
      • TotalCarb, on 11/16/2007, -1/+8Nope, this is the best they have right now. It's pretty sad.
    • lump1, on 11/16/2007, -3/+1I think this isn't so much about AMD getting it right. It seems to me that what went right happened at TSMC. I was especially blown away by the power consuption figures - they're really amazing, as if the performance on it's own wasn't enough. Sounds to me like that's all about the 55nm process. I thought this was going to be a fanboi Digg, but it's really hard to dispute that AMD now have the best graphics card on the market. I'd love to see it benched in a crossfire motherboard with an AMD chipset, rather than an NVidia chipset. Two of those 3850's are within the range of affordability for many gamers. Hopefully, good Linux drivers will be available at launch!

      With this success, maybe AMD should get TSMC to also fab some Barcelona CPU's shrunk to 55nm!
    • keyo, on 11/16/2007, -0/+5I don't think they did anything right, it has 2/3 - 3/4 the performance of the 8800gt, big whoop. AMD still havn't got anywhere near the high end of the market where the money is to be made. Also that title is massively misleading, I was expecting something better then the 8800gtx, all I saw was a mediocre mid-range card.
  • LordSeth, on 11/15/2007, -5/+5I cant wait to see Crossfire benchmarks as thats the moneyshot
    • Seaton, on 11/16/2007, -0/+1OMG CrossFire Benchmarks? http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3151 ... Anandtech put TWO 3850s together and it "comes close" to the performance of ONE 8800GTX. You mean I can cut my GPU in half and sell it to an ATI fanboy for $200? Wow.
    • SmokeMeAKipper, on 11/16/2007, -0/+1I just want to see what the AGP version can do for us poor people still on AGP based systems.
  • Gnerma, on 11/15/2007, -5/+16I like the new ATi cards, they're pretty impressive. They're the most advanced GPUs on the market (DX10.1, 55nm, PCIe 2.0, UVD). The idle power (which is all that really matters when considering video card power consumption) is just amazing. Plus they're quiet. Otherwise same disadvantages as 2900. I would consider a 3870 if I didn't already own a 8800 GT. It would be a tough choice.
    • borninda818, on 11/15/2007, -4/+12I'd go with the 8800 GT. As of now the 8 series is still the better choice with new high end card just around the corner.
      • lump1, on 11/16/2007, -11/+2Did you not read as far as the benchmarks? Did you not see the power consuption? Did you not see the prices? Did you not read about the noise?

        Oh, I see, you're one of *those*...
        • borninda818, on 11/16/2007, -0/+7I have one...it is NOT loud as all. The benchmarks are equal or better than ATI. Often ATI scores are higher but you have to take into consideration that the testers for some odd reason did the NV benchmarks at a higher resolution. I personally don't give a ***** about power consumption, the difference will not stop global warming. I can't say much about price, obviously ATI is trying to gain some new customers because everyone is buying NV. I don't know, I like buying from the "leading company," or the company that currently holds the top card. I find it pretty pathetic that ATI is still struggling to catch up to a year old card. Plus, NV has good linux drivers :p
        • inotocracy, on 11/16/2007, -0/+2I've avoided ATI cards for years because of bad linux support, but their latest driver release I've read mostly took care of that issue.
        • astyler, on 11/16/2007, -1/+3[H] OCP posts benchmarks for a card at the maximum playable resolution. The assumption is if the 8800gt can play crysis at 1600x1200 at a framerate > 30 and the ATI 38x0 cannot, it is strictly better (this is the case.) At 1280x1024, it would likely blow the ATI out of the water. However, it does come in at a good price point for loyal ATI fans
    • Asianwaste, on 11/16/2007, -5/+2I've always loved the All-In-Wonder series... but they stopped making them because Vista doesn't support TV-cards (or so I've heard). I figure it has something to do with the upcoming standards change into digital, but that's just high hopes for me that the TV-card isn't dead. I'm more than sure it has some underhanded deal in attempt to squash TV-piracy.
      • amphibem, on 11/16/2007, -1/+4You should spend 30 seconds on Google: Vista Home Premium and Ultimate have Windows Media Center which surprise surprise, supports suitable (MPEG2 hardware encoding) TV cards. Other cards still work with the standard manufacture software. Nothing under-handed, AIW cards just aren't that good a deal for there cost and given that a stand-alone TV will last through many graphics card upgrades.
      • amphibem, on 11/16/2007, -6/+1You should spend 30 seconds on Google: Vista Home Premium and Ultimate have Windows Media Center which surprise surprise, supports suitable (MPEG2 hardware encoding) TV cards. Other cards still work with the standard manufacture software.Nothing under-handed, AIW cards just aren't that good a deal for there cost and given that a stand-alone TV will last through many graphics card upgrades.
  • 0mega, on 11/15/2007, -19/+7you people are scaring me, why are you prasing ATi? not only is it STILL being beat by the 8800GT, but they need to be ready to compete with the NEXT generation, not this one... so what the hell :S nV did a die shrink and sent out the G92 (why the hell it has a next gen name ill never know. ) where as ATi is putting a bunch of effort into making an impact in this generation, WHY! work on the next generation, anyone who calls themselves an enthusiast already has a card for this generation. [/Rant]

    [edit] im comparing an 8800GT @ MSRP, not newegg's terrible mark up :P

    Awesome review.
    • Gnerma, on 11/15/2007, -3/+7The phrase at play here is, "viable alternative" as used by TheBiggG. When you look at the cards with any consideration of things other than performance, things aren't nearly as cut and dry as you seem to imply. Performance of the 3870 is not as good as the 8800 GT, but it's close enough. The $30 cheaper price tag makes up for that well enough. Add to that the significantly lower idle power consumption (23w according to Brent) which in my area (California) equals about $50 less spent on the power bill per year assuming 24 hour operation. Even if you subtract 10 bucks for gaming time (2 - 6 hours a day) where power consumption is about equal between the two cards, that's still $80 of hidden cost saved over a 2 year span.

      This is bang for buck we're talking about. If you have to have the absolutely best performing system you should have had a 8800 Ultra SLI setup that chews up 250w+ at idle and cost $1000 bucks, for months now.
      • 0mega, on 11/15/2007, -6/+3yes it is a viable alternative now, but with all the effort being put in to THIS generation, what is going to happen in the NEXT generation? ATi has put so much work in to this one... and its going to hurt them later im thinking,
        • TotalCarb, on 11/16/2007, -1/+1No kidding. All the power savings in the world doesn't matter when it can't even play current games at reasonable resolutions (1920x1200) without them turning into a slide show. If it can't perform with todays games, how will it do in 08? You are better off throwing your money down the drain. Modern games require beasts to play them. This is nowhere close.
    • CoolGoose, on 11/15/2007, -1/+2I don't really care about the HD 3870. I care about HD 3850. It's great!.
      • breaks, on 11/15/2007, -1/+2i'm with you there. the 3850 is awesome.
    • carl25, on 11/16/2007, -3/+1also the 2900 series and up are pci-e2 compatible. Full compatible, not backwards like the 8800 series
    • Asianwaste, on 11/16/2007, -2/+1ATI == Better power for your wattage.
      I have a 8800 GTS, which I'm sticking with because I intend to SLI the thing when I need to. However I do actually wish that ATI had a good equivalent alternative when I bought it. Chances are that I wouldn't have to buy another power supply to Crossfire it.
      • kidcodea, on 11/16/2007, -0/+5sure, crossfire doesnt need as much juice as sli. but then crossfire is usually incompatible, slower!!!! or marginally faster than single card.
        sli actually works, go figure
  • TheBiggG, on 11/15/2007, -6/+1Looks like a viable alternative especially with two 3850's in 512MB form (you can bet the AIB partners will be putting them out) for slightly more money than I paid for my GeForce 8800GTS 320MB. However I won't buy Sapphire, but that's another dish.
  • snowysnowcones, on 11/15/2007, -5/+4W00t! This is going on my Christmas list! :D
  • secretwhistle, on 11/15/2007, -5/+9Unfortunately, due to "alleged" performance enhancement use, the card will always be listed as the ATI Radeon HD 3800*.
  • Drizzt81, on 11/15/2007, -1/+5now if you can fold on the 3850, I am buying one :)
  • raynman68, on 11/15/2007, -2/+3It looks like AMD has taken a step in the right direction regarding video cards. It may not be perfect but they are at least giving people a viable alternative to NVIDIA. Now F@H can get a GPU client for it I will be all over these cards.
  • wolvyne, on 11/15/2007, -1/+6Damn the 3870 or the Nvidia 8800GT... Think I'm going to wait for a few driver updates from AMD to see. Plus we need to wait and see what type of overclocking overhead there is for the 3870. Thanks AMD!!!
  • AceGoober, on 11/15/2007, -1/+5The 3870 is tempting due to its price / performance. I just might have to get one and see for myself how it handles the games I play.
  • breaks, on 11/15/2007, -1/+6the 3850 looks like an awesome HTPC card... decisions decisions. :D
  • iXneonXi, on 11/15/2007, -3/+16Anyone else notice the 666 transistors?
    • thushan, on 11/16/2007, -0/+3The Inquirer:
      http://tinyurl.com/3bvel9

      "The number of the beast is HD3800"
    • lump1, on 11/16/2007, -0/+5I certainly did! That suits my gaming style just fine. Unfortunately, the core of the 3850 runs at a numerically unsatisfying 670MHz. Maybe I'd underclock mine by four. Then I could say "Woe to you, o earth and sea, for my graphics card has 666 Million transistors, switching 666 Million times per second!"
      • JapaneseEconomy, on 11/17/2007, -0/+1Great, do that and you'll open a portal to hell and all Satan's demon spawn will pour out.

        I should really digg you down so the satanic worshippers don't get ahold of this, but I can't because your comment was so clever.
  • mrogi, on 11/16/2007, -10/+5Nvidia is Michael Jordan. ATI is Scotty Pippen.
    • SoundScape, on 11/16/2007, -1/+4No. The difference is Scott Pippen never had a chance of being better than MJ. He was a God.
      • catfud, on 11/16/2007, -1/+3neither does ATI being better then nvidia
        • SoundScape, on 11/20/2007, -0/+1You sound like a fanboy. Remember you're talking about companies. Marketing, R&D, Management Structures. Not human beings with natural-born talents.
    • UtopiaInTheSky, on 11/19/2007, -0/+1When it comes to video drivers, Nvidia is the garbage man taking out Scotty Pippen's trash.
  • spunkmyer, on 11/16/2007, -8/+1Any word if Amd is going to ship one of these for the Apple mac pros? The high-end selection of graphic cards offered from Apple for the pros are starting to wear thin.


  • majortom1981, on 11/16/2007, -5/+3their price of the 8800gt is wrong. New egg has atleast 2 8800gt 512mb cards for $269 . these prices ahve to be at this price point or will lose out to the 8800gt.

    I will get a 3870 if it is at that price and the 8800gt doesnt get reduced in price.
    • kineticarl, on 11/16/2007, -0/+6Everyone is price-gouging for the 8800GT right now. Wait a few weeks when they're widely available, and the price should come down to Nvidia's msrp (hopefully).
  • tweetsa, on 11/16/2007, -9/+30what a stupid review. Whats the point of reviewing each card with different levels of AA/AF on them? I was surprised AMD/ATi had a better card than the 8800gt but then I saw they had the 8800gt at high AF/AA. So I went and looked at other reviews and the 3870 is slower than the 8800gt.

    Looks like Nvidia has a home run hitter while ATi is stuck on second.
    • ferrariman60, on 11/16/2007, -5/+2That's the point of [H] reviews, man. It is an evaluation of how the cards are to the consumer. It looks at the overall gameplay experience. I love [H] for that reason. Great review format. I'm not sure how the 3870 competes with the 8800GT though, price excluded. In all the tests, the GT was running either a higher resultion or AA on top of what the 3870 was doing. When the 8800 comes down to MSRP, I don't think there will be any question who's better for the $220, but as [H] is about the impact on the consumer, it may be a while until the 8800gt is affordable, so I don't mind it in this case. Really, as long as these guys continue to drive innovation between themselves, I'm fine, because I want a card that doesn't self-destruct when presented with Crysis. My GT handled it pretty well for the $270 I paid, but it was far from smooth or top graphics settings.
    • lump1, on 11/16/2007, -7/+5Do you people not know how to read? They chose the "best playable settings" for each card. That's actually a very useful comparison! I don't care about frames/s that I can't see. If I'm getting enough frames, I want higher resolution, detail and image processing. So does everyone. This is relevant information.

      So we learn that in most tings the 3870 is playable at the same settings as the 8800GT - sometimes better, but in some cases worse. The conclusion said "slightly slower overall" - but if you would actually take as much time reading as you do whining, you would have seen that yourselves (I mean tweesta and ferariman).
      • ferrariman60, on 11/16/2007, -1/+11Lol, now I ask you to do some reading, since you're so proud of your apparent ability. Some graph reading in here to; think you're up to it? Here we go: If you look at the 4 games they tested, the 8800GT has either a higher resolution or higher AA settings in ALL 4 GAMES. Did you even look at the graphs? Be sure to do so next time. But the fact is, the 8800GT is a more powerful card if you count the 4 games they tested. In no cases is the 3870 better, sorry. Unless you count lower resolution or reduced (or no) AA to be better. I don't, I like my games to look good. That requires (In this order) native resolution, AA, or best, both.
      • britishrob, on 11/16/2007, -1/+1"best playable settings" is purely subjective. some people dont mind 25fps with pretty graphics, while others demand >50fps.

        Your obvious confusion between the performance of the 8800gt and the 3870 proves that thier comparisons are downright misleading. Absolute rubbish.
    • inf0, on 11/16/2007, -1/+4stupid review, same settings or what's the point?
    • akkuma, on 11/16/2007, -0/+6HardOCP games Digg extremely hard I've come to find out. The best reviews I've found come from anandtech, yet are never on this site. They just don't do one resolution, they do numerous different settings, which in turn unlike the god awful way to review from HardOCP allows you the consumer to make the most informed decision and decide for yourself what is best. What if you're only getting 20-30fps at best and that is perfectly acceptable to you if you can save $50+? SOL with HardOCP style reviews.
  • pantuky, on 11/16/2007, -1/+12This is a questionable title for an article. Most of the benchmarks I have seen indicate that the Geforce 8800GT is winning all of the benchmarks. It is close most of the time. Sometimes it isn't. Geforce 8800GT costs a bit more right now. Good luck in finding either one of them on any shelf anywhere. 8800GT flew out of stock before you could say "Jack Rabbit". It looks like the HD38xx is a paper launch.
    • Tenoq, on 11/16/2007, -1/+7Wrong. nVidia went to launch with 50,000 8800GT cards. AMD is launching with 250,000 cards. Who paper launched? :p
  • bonds, on 11/16/2007, -3/+6Man video cards look so awesome these days.
  • bluemist, on 11/16/2007, -1/+5I'm trying to justify my purchase of a 250$ 8800GT by downplaying the importance of DX10.1 and pointing out how comparably low the 3870 is in terms of performance. But those two are admittedly great cards and should obliterate the entire NVIDIA lineup in price-performance except 8800GT (especially if the latter card's mark-up price finally drops).

    On the other hand, seeing that games like Crysis push the boundaries even with my own card, I dunno if neither video card makers really hit the sweet spot of what gamers are demanding in their graphics nowadays.

    On the other other hand, some game makers like Infinity Ward are nice enough to provide beautiful enough graphics (COD4 has a highly efficient game engine!) without ridiculous system requirements.
  • britishrob, on 11/16/2007, -5/+36I can't believe their benchmarking methods, they use different settings/resolutions for each card?!!
    I can see how this gives a an indication of how the games would be run on a real life setup, but it defeats the point of these articles - to COMPARE the cards on an even standing!
    • johnthedebs, on 11/16/2007, -2/+13I can't believe you're the first one to comment on that...their benchmarking method was atrocious.

      What the hell were they thinking?
      • breaks, on 11/16/2007, -9/+5apparently you're new to reading [H] articles and fail at science.
      • ferrariman60, on 11/16/2007, -7/+4If you want benchmarks, go elsewhere. [H] tests hardware and gives us readers some good real world stuff in return. Honestly, I don't care if my card gets 7 more FPS than a 3870..... I want to know how that affects my gaming, and what kind of settings I can get away with for each card. This tells us that, and I don't know of any other site that uses that test method. I love it, if you don't, then go the firing squad (or to any other hardware review site).
        • britishrob, on 11/16/2007, -0/+6Yes but your missing the point. Framerates benchmarks are merely indicative of PERFORMACE. Once you've bought the components and get into a game you put your settings as high as you can while keeping an acceptable framerate.
    • Seaton, on 11/16/2007, -0/+1THANK YOU britishrob! My thoughts exactly. If I buy a BRAND NEW video card and I then have to go into the game settings and tweak to achieve an acceptable framerate...I would be pissed. The point of upgrading to a new video card is so you can throw ANYTHING at it.
    • UtopiaInTheSky, on 11/19/2007, -0/+1I mentioned this before in a previous HardOCP benchmark and I was dugg down to oblivion.
  • scabbers, on 11/16/2007, -0/+21Wow Crysis really is a demanding little bitch.
    • PATSCRU, on 11/16/2007, -4/+2yeah, what's weird is that the unreal 3 engine and the crysis engine are comparable, but crysis is like twice as demanding on graphics cards.. I can run the ut3 demo at 1680x1050 without aa and full settings completely fine, but i can't even run the crysis demo at 1280x800 on medium....seems like crysis is a bit of a ineffiecient bitch also....oh well, one less game to buy.
      • kidcodea, on 11/16/2007, -0/+7errr... comparable? ut looks like a videogame. crysis is a breakthrough
    • herrshuster, on 11/16/2007, -0/+1i just ran it on my x700 with a gig of ram...LOW graphics look like freaking photos
  • antdude, on 11/16/2007, -1/+14ATI/AMD better have working Linux drivers for these new cards.
  • TheFinaleofSeem, on 11/16/2007, -2/+12What the hell kind of benchmark is that? The benches for each card were at a different resolution/detail level than any others. That's not a goddamn benchmark because there's no common point of reference. Show us the performance of each with the same specs at multiple resolutions, you idiots. Otherwise we're left wondering how each would perform if matched with the other.
    • breaks, on 11/16/2007, -7/+1some people just can't comprehend how the tests are done. that's ok.
      • britishrob, on 11/16/2007, -0/+1I see the reasoning behind it - to show what kind of results users would use... but if your not comparing cards, then why bother mentioning the other cards?? Why not use the whole article to demonstrate how the single card performs on the latest games?

        My point is: either make it a comparison article or don't compare at all
  • Stonekeeper, on 11/16/2007, -3/+5But will it run (in) linux?
  • rjinswand, on 11/16/2007, -3/+4seems really quite biased to me... no digg.
    • Seaton, on 11/16/2007, -0/+1The submitter is incredibly biased. I see no Home Run.
  • diggmodsaregay, on 11/16/2007, -5/+2at least it didnt use steroids
  • Uchikoma, on 11/16/2007, -7/+2I've seen the synthetic benchmarks, and now I've seen benchmarks performed on real games. The synthetic ones I've seen have shown 8800gt faster than the 3870. But, if real game performance is better? Synthetic is worth nothing.

    To the person complaining about different AA/AF, I take it you didn't really read the article where it stated that for UT, AA was not available for DX9, but you were able to force it for Nvidia and not ATI. [Page 5, UT demo]
    • UtopiaInTheSky, on 11/19/2007, -0/+1How can you have a "synthetic" benchmark in a game?
  • nycmac247, on 11/16/2007, -16/+2please god(s), put it in the new Mac Pro
    (although to use a computer not console for gaming is dumbbbbbb!!!!)
    • breaks, on 11/16/2007, -3/+1no, it's frivelous. you know, for people who have cash for the best graphics possible.
  • necbone, on 11/16/2007, -1/+27pfft....i mess with nvidia because of the drivers... i hold no allegiance to any company... best product wins... burn in hell fanboys
  • marvinmatthew, on 11/16/2007, -2/+2I bet we'll see Nvidia price drops before Christmas to keep up with these new AMD cards.
    • ArrakisDune, on 11/16/2007, -0/+2Only if the demand can be met.
      Here in the UK their is major shortages of the 8800GT. So much so that retailers are making a huge mark-up over the RRP on them, making them less competitive than Nvidia intended. Whats it like elsewhere? Im guessing the same?
      • ferrariman60, on 11/16/2007, -0/+1Price drops to what, MSRP? MSRP on the 8800GT is $220, if I'm not mistaken. But since they had around 40,000 at launch according to toms hardware, the demand far exceeded the supply. Know what happens to price in that case? It goes up! As far as I'm concerned, the 8800GT I got at $270 is a killer deal anyways....... I'd buy it again. I only regret not being able to wait for the next gen Nvidia part, but Crysis could not wait. :)
      • IndigoMoss, on 11/16/2007, -0/+2It's definitely the same. Newegg has it marked up a good deal, which really sucks for people that love to use Newegg for all technology related purposes. They did the same thing when the Core 2 Duo's first launched. I bought my e6300 for $230 bucks from Newegg, two weeks later they sold it for $179.
  • Arkavus, on 11/16/2007, -2/+4I love that theres real competition between ATI and nVidia. Just means more badass video cards for the consumers.
    • PATSCRU, on 11/16/2007, -0/+1i'd also like the companies to start working on getting cheaper models out there that kick ass rather than platform refreshes every 10 months or so...like the anandtech article said:
      "While this may seem like a blip in an otherwise very profit-centric product lineup, we'd love to see similar performance revolutions at other price points in the graphics market. Give us a $100 graphics card that's actually worth something, and maybe we'll end up seeing a resurgence in PC gaming after all."
  • Endeavorer, on 11/16/2007, -1/+7http://www.tomshardware.com/2007/11/15/amd_radeon_ ...
    Another review just if your curious (I'm a fan of tomsharware...)
  • WolverineBlue, on 11/16/2007, -1/+6I remember a time when benchmarks were run at the same settings for each system... seriously, this data is worthless.
  • Acidrain77, on 11/16/2007, -2/+17Running the Geforce @ a higher Res and comparing FPS... to the ATi at a lower Res
    Quality Reporting.Geforce Blows ATI out of the water
  • lalanis, on 11/16/2007, -1/+1Well in Europe we can get 8800GT for appr. 220€...
    If 3870 can be around 170-180 then it may stand a chance....
  • HumanRecall, on 11/16/2007, -7/+1DIRECT X 10 .1 ? WTF
  • HumanRecall, on 11/16/2007, -9/+1OBLIVION TASTE IT AGAIN FOR THE FIRST TIME :)

    FINALLY BE ABLE TO PLAY OBLIVION THE RIGHT :) ..........I have a Quad core with 4 gigs , 700 gig HD with this ATi card i will be a GOD !!!!!!
    • PATSCRU, on 11/16/2007, -0/+4"with this ATi card i will be a GOD !!!!!!"
      In your bedroom at your mom's house.
  • Raystonn, on 11/16/2007, -2/+1I think many of you are missing the fact that this benchmark pits ATI's new card against the GeForce 8600 GTS, not the new 8800 GT. That's right, it's comparable to a lowly 8600.
    • amphibem, on 11/16/2007, -2/+2In price maybe (have to wait and see on street prices), It thrashes the 8600GTS in performance. Can't tell if that's what you you meant..
    • amphibem, on 11/16/2007, -6/+0In price maybe (have to wait and see on street prices), It thrashes the 8600GTS in performance. Can't tell if that's what you you meant..
  • YojimboJango, on 11/16/2007, -0/+2Article summary: If you're spending over $220 go with a geForce. Under $220 your money is best spent on AMD.
    I'm still waiting for the cross fire results to see what would be more affordable: dual ATI 3850's or a single geForce 8800 GTS (they both cost about the same), or the power of 4 crossfired 3970's vs a sli 8800 gts.
  • yunus, on 11/16/2007, -2/+1If the price stays at 200 and the 8800GT stays at 270 then I will seriously consider the ATI, especially because they have shown much better linux drivers than Nvidia. But if the price of the 8800GT drops to compete then I will stick with what I know. My last few cards have been Nvidia and I have not had any problems.
    • SanjayM, on 11/16/2007, -0/+3Errr.. WHAT? Since When have ATI released a decent driver? The newest revision may support AIGLX in some basic forms, but is still lightyears behind the Nvidia drivers in every aspect.
  • handler, on 11/16/2007, -0/+3I just got my 8800GT last week for $300, now this is released. The 8800GT seems to perform better still but at $100 more I'm not sure if the extra jump is worth it. Overall I'm very happy with my card though.
  • Ellipsys, on 11/16/2007, -0/+2After the pain and suffering trying to get 3D application support in linux on my laptop with a Mobility x600 - I don't think I'll be purchasing another ATI card until I see demonstrated, better than Nvidia drivers for Linux and Windows. No matter how powerful the card is, if the drivers are for *****, its not worth it. Also, since ATI is launching a DX10.1 card, it will only be a matter of time before Nvidia gets the 9xxx series out.
  • inf0, on 11/16/2007, -4/+3anyone who buys ATI or AMD doesn't value their money.. imo

  • frsrblch, on 11/16/2007, -1/+2Didn't the x2*** series just come out a couple months ago? Looks like a decent card, but I'm not sure why it has a new number.

    I'm also not sure why they compared it to a 8800GT running at 40% higher resolution. In fact, how come all the resolutions are screwy?
  • Calculon64, on 11/16/2007, -4/+2AMD is bankrupt
  • kansai22, on 11/16/2007, -7/+5I cant believe people posted and dugg up a review from that site. Isnt that site banned from digg's front page for completely bias reviews.


    Look at the settings on the graphics cards the 8800 is almost always run with higher settings than the ATI cards.

    Dugg down as inaccurate.
  • Arramol, on 11/16/2007, -2/+3To the people complaining about the different settings, [H] does their tests a bit differently. Other sites test for highest framerate at a given set of settings, [H] tests each card to identify the highest playable settings it can achieve. If you want a more conventional apples-to-apples set of benchmarks, try Anandtech. Personally, I like having both sets of test results.
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