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- lnf69, on 02/05/2008, -154/+447This helped remind why I don't want religious fanatics running our country.
- swordedge, on 02/05/2008, -29/+272There are many many that say its a child, not a choice.
There are many that can't have a child.
Practice birth control before getting pregnant.
Educate all the young, the ones that know all about it have fewer children. The ignorant ones have more. - lokee73, on 02/05/2008, -121/+285I believe we should outlaw abortion as soon as there are no children left in the world that need to be adopted.
The anti-abortion crowd screams about the rights of the unborn. But what about after they are born? I would be willing to bet most of these people are also against universal health care, head start programs, and other “Socialist” programs; programs that can help a child AFTER it’s born. But they don’t think that far ahead. Hell, I doubt they even think.
Save the embryo, but screw the child!
***** all of you and your hypocrisy. - lnf69, on 02/05/2008, -83/+231It's still your choice, don't take it away from others.
My baby will never be your baby.
Worry about your own life, and let me deal with mine, especially since my life has almost nothing to do with yours.
Live and let live. - EatingPie, on 02/05/2008, -79/+213I found the article enlightening, and there are good reasons to help women get abortions. I absolutely cannot deny this. However, from my point of view, I cannot discount that I see a fetus as a living human being, though not fully-formed. I site simply the case of parents' excitement over ultrasounds of their unborn child.
In my view, indeed the doctor sites good reasons for what he does. But that does not mean he's doing what is right. It's possible to do something wrong for a good reason, and this is one of those cases... as I see it. I believe the unborn fetus involved is indeed alive, and that isn't sufficiently taken into account by doctors such as this man. His concern begins with the woman's life -- and indeed that IS important -- but it also ends there.
-Pie - LadyDub, on 02/05/2008, -69/+198How refreshing to see a well-written *personal* story of one man's personal convictions and contributions. Shame on people for seeing issues as so black and white- without taking into account the individual lives that are affected.
- lukemann, on 02/05/2008, -23/+122Dugg! Use a condom, take the pill, and if the condom breaks take the morning after pill. But using abortion as a form of birth control is disgusting. There are legitimate reasons, but making up for your own stupidity is not one of them. Also no one should be getting an abortion after the first trimester if they all of the sudden decide they don't want the baby. You should be able to do it for medical reasons, but I think 90 days should be enough to figure out if you really want that baby or not. We need to come to a sensible conclusion on this issue so politicians don't use it as a wedge issue anymore.
- romistrub, on 02/05/2008, -20/+105Oh great, this debate again.
- Del129, on 02/05/2008, -69/+145I'm not that religious, but I believe that killing any form of human life isn't right.
- ggnictee, on 02/05/2008, -13/+80true and untrue all in one go. What you don't want is intolerant, stuborn, short sighted, jerks running your government. I'd actually like to see some religious fanatics in office. Someone who takes Christ seriously when He said "Love one another." I'm not sure how abortion became a religious debate (well that's a lie. I know exactly how it happened. It's about people in power using emotions to stay in power) but it really isn't. There are (almost) no Christians who think that a woman shouldn't be able to do what she wants. And there are equally few people who would advocate killing babies. The problem is we (as a nation) aren't actually debating whether or not it's a baby. Both sides are all rhetoric and anger. but it really boils down to that if it's a baby: it's murder. If it's not a baby: it's her choice not yours.
What Christians need to do is make cookies. (stay with me now) We need to bake cookies, make hot coco, and sit outside of abortion clinics. And when a woman walks up to the clinic we should jump up, grab her hand and tell her everything will be ok and that she is loved. If she needs to talk: listen. If she needs money: give her money. If she needs someone to sit and hold her hand while she talks to the doctor, to explain medical and legal terms: do it. But do NOT under any circumstances open your mouth. This is not an appropriate time to tell her that abortion is wrong. If she's worried about being able to take care of the baby when it's born: clean out the spare room and set an extra plate. If she doesn't ask: don't answer. Your job is to make sure that woman feels the love of Christ. period. and if she does get an abortion you should be there waiting, holding her hand, making sure dinner is made, helping pay bills. Don't tell her how much God loves her. SHOW HER.
God bless digg. Please, be patient with eachother. Be kind to eachother. We are, each of us, doing our best. - CraigJ, on 02/05/2008, -26/+90I'm not a fan of abortion as birth control, but I say it is up to the woman to make the decision and live with the consequences, if any, whatever they might be. If you are going to tell a woman that she has to have a child because YOU think abortion is bad, then I charge YOU with paying for all incurred medical expenses for prenatal care, delivery, etc, compensate the woman for her lost time from work/school, etc, adopt the child and pay to raise and school he or she, all without any government aid. Put up or shut up.
- TheKillDoctor, on 02/05/2008, -31/+93If you don't agree with the abortion issue, don't have one.
- CraigJ, on 02/05/2008, -9/+68I completely disagree with you, but dug up for being rational and not screaming "baby killer"
- romistrub, on 02/05/2008, -35/+94*****' *****. This topic is going to stir up a bunch of undereducated, undercritical banter like it always does. Abortion touches on the very nature of personhood: what it means to define something as living, and how to decide when living things are human persons worthy of human rights. It's not simple, and anybody that treats this as black and white, or anything but a serious philosophical discussion, should not waste their, or anybody else's, time.
kthx - aliengoods, on 02/05/2008, -36/+91Unborn baby is a loaded way of saying potential person. POTENTIAL. It is not actually a person yet.
And if people like you were really concerned about stopping abortion you would have comprehensive sex education in the schools and make contraception available to students free of charge. Abstinence only education doesn't work. Every scientific study done has proven that. - pintomp3, on 02/05/2008, -51/+103a zygote is not a person. until they start issuing social security numbers for zygotes and have funerals for miscarriages, abortion is not murder.
- dienaked, on 02/05/2008, -21/+71It's not always religion telling people abortion is wrong. It's their conscience
- romistrub, on 02/05/2008, -18/+67Nothing goes over like a dead fetus joke ;)
- bigjoeportagee, on 02/05/2008, -71/+114Abortion is an integral right to a healthy society and this man is a hero. A collection of cells should not dictate a young women's life, a mistake should not strip her away a opportunity at a successful happy life. Many women who have abortions go on to become good mothers, it is women who have children beyond their means that cause the majority of societies problems. Women have a right to be sexually active and if needed women have a right to abort a child to protect her future and her potential children's future. The right will remain despite misogynistic our religious bigotry.
Many comments above condemn abortions but not the attacks on this brave man's life. The idiotic eye for and eye (or cells for a father husband doctor) shows the lack of sophistication and morals on this issue. - lnf69, on 02/05/2008, -19/+62Actually the title is very straight forward and very clear, as well as unbiased.
Please tell me what "lies" this article might be hiding?
Perhaps you would like to explain why killing this doctor can be justified by religious beliefs? - Jsmuli2, on 02/05/2008, -28/+70What I don't understand is how these "pro-life" people are willing to kill people....isn't that hypocritical?
I mean, I know that the term "pro-life" is used primarily in discussions about abortion but what the hell? If you are a pro-lifer, shouldn't you be pro-life across the board? Like, anti-violence, anti-war? - EatingPie, on 02/05/2008, -12/+51Lots of assumptions there. None of them apply to me. I even have a friend who runs a pro-life organization, and their focus is specifically upon the joy of a child's life after it's born. That also includes caring for the child after birth.
I admit that what you've said is the case for many groups. However, whether abortion is right or wrong does not lie in whether someone has hypocritical (as you put it) beliefs. And indeed, social programs such as guaranteed insurance or better adoption services would be great. Though virtually all babies get adopted, it's older children that aren't.
-Pie - ryodoan, on 02/05/2008, -23/+61I just want to analyze that one sentence you shouted. "abortion is also about a woman's right to choose to kill or not to kill"
So you believe that a woman should have the choice to kill her children? Lets say they are 1 year old, whining all the time, she cant support her children properly, cant go to school, is working in a dead end job.
Would it be ok for her to drown them in the bathtub? Throw them into the river? Take them to the doctor and say, "Please kill my children, They are ruining my life."
Of course that is not OK. She could offer her children up for adoption and sign her rights to them over to the state.
I am not a religious person, but I still feel that when you go to get an abortion, you might as well be killing a child. That baby that is growing inside a woman has the potential to grow up into an adult. Is it all right to walk around offing people just because you dont want to deal with them? - thanakar, on 02/05/2008, -15/+52You don't have to be religious to believe that abortion is murder.
- Maciula, on 02/05/2008, -46/+82And the best title for you my friend would be "Why am I close-minded, thick-sculled religious freak?"
- jark, on 02/05/2008, -19/+53So a social security number defines humanity? I myself have had a late term miscarriage and had a funeral for her. There are many others that do the same
- inactive, on 02/05/2008, -36/+69you should kill off your unborn thoughts from now on
- Shiftgood, on 02/05/2008, -35/+67go ahead, ask a pile of cells for its opinion.
do you not realize the disasterous effects eliminating abortion would have on our society? Stop playing make believe with your magical religion and think like a rational adult for just one ***** second and vote to let people do what they need to do.. if its not hurting you then who the hell cares?. Then you can go back to your fairy tales i dont care.. and thats the point.. i dont care what you do as long as it doesnt influence me. - saltinekracka20, on 02/05/2008, -12/+42WTH is all I can say to your comment. If I drop some flour, sugar and milk on the floor, I don't care. If I drop my pan of cookies on the floor, I'm pissed.
The moral of the story here, the ingredients are not the same as the product. - thefandango, on 02/05/2008, -5/+34you know, if more christians thought like you, i'd respect them more as a group.
but for now, i think i'll just digg you up. - bernandoo, on 02/05/2008, -8/+36to play devil's advocate: you can go to jail for killing a fetus.
- zaptoman, on 02/05/2008, -4/+31Often. Killing a pregnant woman is often considered a double homicide, or single homicide and a manslaughter charge.
- Shiftgood, on 02/05/2008, -20/+47Smoking directly affects other people.. thats why they put on a ban. If she gets an abortion it doesnt affect you life in any way. The ban was made for waitresses that were coming down with lung cancer from being in smoking restaurants.
THINK!! THINK ABOUT THINGS BEFORE YOU SPEAK... jesus ***** christ you republicans have the foresight of a 6 year old. - Shiftgood, on 02/05/2008, -7/+33Using YOUR logic.
If you dont WANT TO HAVE AN ABORTION>>> THEN DONT GET ONE.
high fives anyone? - djbon2112, on 02/05/2008, -2/+27You'd actually be surprised... however, as in all other things, it's the minority who is the most vocal and most self-righteous.
- The_Wallbanger, on 02/05/2008, -12/+37It's a complicated issue, but refreshing to hear both sides. I've seen many photos of aborted fetuses provided by pro-life groups. I wonder how one would react to pictures of disembowlment caused by botched abortions?
- inactive, on 02/05/2008, -13/+37I used to play games with my son while he was still in the womb. I would push his hand and he would it, then push me back.
- Jsmuli2, on 02/05/2008, -7/+30You guys must have missed the part of the article where the doctor was almost murdered twice....those people who tried to kill him were obviously pro-lifers.....think about it.
- lnf69, on 02/05/2008, -37/+60You don't have to be religious to believe that. I also agree that killing ANY form of life is not RIGHT.
But very often life offers only a series of wrong choices. But be that as it may, abortion is ALSO ABOUT A WOMAN'S RIGHT TO CHOOSE TO KILL OR NOT TO KILL. It is not your right, or mine, to choose for others. - lnf69, on 02/05/2008, -11/+34I'm saying that while the baby's life is dependent exclusively on the mother's existence, that while we can't save the baby and respect the mother's choice at the same time, the mother's choice should have precedent on the right/wrong scales of morality. Obviously this is my opinion. I respect yours, and do not support "murder" or "killing", but recognize that everyone has a right to do whatever they want to their own body.
Show us a way to take unwanted embryos out of the womb, and still remain viable, then it would be all right for me to be against abortion in general. Barring that, let's keep it a legal choice.
It's just like prohibition, the illegality is much more dangerous to society as whole, then allowing ppl to choose. - romistrub, on 02/05/2008, -1/+23That's my personal philosophy. Never take away the ability to have an abortion, but do everything in your power to prevent the need for abortions in the first place.
- slantyeyed, on 02/05/2008, -1/+23i don't like how vegetarians kill innocent vegetables.
- pintomp3, on 02/05/2008, -13/+34there is no birth control method that is 100% fool proof. and many rapists don't use any protection.
- simVsim, on 02/05/2008, -3/+23I think because he got the "required second opinion" it was ok.
- DeFex, on 02/05/2008, -20/+40religious fanatics love killing humans, just not unborn ones.
- kilofox, on 02/05/2008, -6/+25Two women are driving to an abortion clinic, both are pregnant. One woman will be having an aborttion, the other wants to keep her baby but is going to support the other.
A driver of another car runs a red light and crashes into the car carrying the two pregnant women. The woman that wanted to keep her baby is injured to the point that her fetus is dies. The other woman is not seriously injured and is able to have her abortion procedure later.
The driver of the other car is charged with Fetal Homicide. Thirty-five states currently recognize the "unborn child" (the term usually used) or fetus as a homicide victim, and 25 of those states apply this principle throughout the period of pre-natal development. These laws do not apply to legal induced abortions. Federal and state courts have consistently held that these laws do not contradict the U.S. Supreme Court's rulings on abortion.
What I find ironic is that, with the result being the same (a dead fetus), one dead fetus is a homicide victim because the woman "wanted" to have the baby, the other is simply a legal abortion. - MrsSpooky, on 02/05/2008, -68/+87
"But I feel that the greatest destroyer of peace today is abortion, because it is a war against the child - a direct killing of the innocent child - murder by the mother herself. And if we accept that a mother can kill even her own child, how can we tell other people not to kill one another? How do we persuade a woman not to have an abortion? As always, we must persuade her with love, and we remind ourselves that love means to be willing to give until it hurts. Jesus gave even his life to love us. So the mother who is thinking of abortion, should be helped to love - that is, to give until it hurts her plans, or her free time, to respect the life of her child. The father of that child, whoever he is, must also give until it hurts. By abortion, the mother does not learn to love, but kills even her own child to solve her problems. And by abortion, the father is told that he does not have to take any responsibility at all for the child he has brought into the world. That father is likely to put other women into the same trouble. So abortion just leads to more abortion. Any country that accepts abortion is not teaching the people to love, but to use any violence to get what they want. That is why the greatest destroyer of love and peace is abortion. "
Mother Theresa of Calcutta - JoeliusZ28, on 02/05/2008, -7/+26since when is human life based on supply and demand?
- ncairns, on 02/05/2008, -22/+41As soon as you start referring to a gob of cytoplasm clinging parasitically to a uterine wall as 'the baby', you lose the argument.
- spidamonkey, on 02/05/2008, -16/+34***** this debate gives me a headache. I would just like to ask anyone who thinks it should be outlawed to learn about El Salvador http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_El_Salvad ... and then think a bit about whether the goal should be to make abortions less necessary and then whether your personal views on contraception, sex ed, women's rights will help that goal.
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