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Chasing D&D: A History of RPGs

1up.com — The history of computer role-playing games (RPGs) starts not with a bang, but a dice roll. Here is 1up's history of RPGs, from D&D all the way to MMO.

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  • dinkinflicka, on 06/05/2008, -11/+16No mention of titles on the NES such as Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior?
    • JAVandiver, on 06/06/2008, -2/+16The article was about PC RGG's not JRPG's. Different genre.
  • trujillonorte, on 06/05/2008, -1/+22dugg for bard's tale!
  • zen53, on 06/06/2008, -0/+7The first ever rpg I played was on a spectrum 128k +2. It blew my mind! It wasn't about your weapon stats, kills etc it was about the story ... something that I feel is lacking from moden day rpg's.
    • dadioflex, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1What was it? I'm from that era and can't remember any RPGs prior to the Amiga/ST days. And even then the only one I clearly remember was Rogue on the ST.

      Was it Valhalla? That was more of an adventure game though.
  • JAVandiver, on 06/06/2008, -0/+12Too many classic RPG flashbacks... The Ultima series and the Eye of the Beholder are some of my favorite games ever! Who ever coded DOS Box, thanks, we can keep on playing them! Was I the only one who liked Menzoberranzan? The Baldur's Gate & Icewind Dale series... Nuts to this! I am just going stay home, drink whiskey, and play old CRPG's all weekend!
    • Brownds, on 06/06/2008, -2/+0" am just going stay home, drink whiskey, and play old CRPG's all weekend!"

      Average Diggers weekend?

    • 4bit, on 06/06/2008, -2/+1Did I miss it, or was their no mention of any of the 'Gold Box games'?
    • BTime, on 06/08/2008, -0/+1I think Eye of the Beholder didn't need to be mentioned as it was primarily influenced from Dungeon Master.
  • zombie210, on 06/06/2008, -0/+12Dugg for the memories.
  • ih2000, on 06/06/2008, -2/+15There is *way* too much hand-holding in RPG's today. I guess the kids playing them just don't want to take the time to solve a hard puzzle, or search a long time for a prized item. I particularly hate the compass which so many games have, showing me not only the right way to go, but how far it is to get there. I'm not in a rush to finish these games, I want to enjoy the challenge of playing and figuring things out. Eye of the Beholder had some great puzzles that worked into the game's plot nicely.
    • DrDragun, on 06/06/2008, -1/+5Eye of the Beholder series was AWESOME.

      I agree with you about puzzles, but searching a long time for an item? Ever play Diablo 2 online and see the effort people put into getting the endgame rune words?
      • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1You don't need runewords to beat the game. Those are added for multiplayer purposes to make it more enjoyable and interesting.
    • Godlike, on 06/06/2008, -1/+4If I want a puzzle game I will play Tetris, thanks. I am in an RPG for the story, not for the 45 hours it might take to find the first starting cave that a minimap could easily guide me to.

      Before you bury me, there ARE TONS of puzzle RPG's. There is no reason for Morrowwind or WoW to be that when the genre already exists.
      • ih2000, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2You have a point, not everyone wants hard puzzles in their RPG's. Perhaps you could name a few that exist today? I'm really not seeing them, and I'd love to play one.
        • Godlike, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1Probably a good place to start is Final Fantasy Tactics or Advance Wars. If that's not your breed of those, check out the flash gaming sites - they have hundreds upon hundreds of story-based puzzle games.

          Also, check out a flash game called "Sonny"... it is a flash RPG though of a more puzzle-oriented breed - how you use what you've got type of game.
        • stk198323, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1There is a lot of other games for you to play if you want a puzzle game...

          The same way I hate resident evil when there's some random puzzle not related in anywayto the story, exemple: Resident Evil 4, the bloc you have to move to make the picture when playing ashley. Useless, and a waste of time.

          There are so many games to play that will gladly send to you a hundred useless puzzle, some of them incorporating other style of play, some of them being only puzzle.

          I do understand why you would like more challenging puzzle in rpg's, but you are a part of a small minority so developpers can not afford to put such puzzle that will piss off most people, it's money lost because more people won't buy the game if theres hard and useless puzzle in them then there's people who will buy it because of those puzzle.
        • Elranzer, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1@ih2000: Try Puzzle Quest. It's available for pretty much everything.
        • Godlike, on 06/07/2008, -0/+1LOL we are all so silly, how about

          MYST OR RIVEN rofl.

          Or even WEEN: THE PROPHECY from WAAAAAY back... Did anybody else play that one? Sierra game? Bat that eats strawberries?
    • Cate320, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1I get annoyed when there is too many puzzles in my RPGs. I just want to kill stuff, level, explore and follow the story. The puzzles really are pointless time sinks. What dungeon would seriously have complicated puzzles in it in the real world (if such things existed)?

      Also what respectable adventurer would NOT arm himself with a map and a compass before setting out? These items don't hurt games, they make them far less tedious for those of us with poor direction sense :P I do agree that in dungeons, maps should be "uncovered" instead of visible from the start though. If I were exploring a dungeon for real, of course I would map the place as I go along!
    • cryoknight, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1Try Gothic 2. Best RPG in years. No hand holding - if you walk into the wrong area at too low a level, you're history. Great storyline too! It has a bit of an odd interface, but the game is pure gold.
  • spoo71, on 06/06/2008, -3/+14Would it have killed whoever put this together to have included captions for the pics from the games? Call me anal, but I like to know what I'm looking at.
  • brickwalkway, on 06/06/2008, -10/+1You call those RPG's??!?! Now this is an RPG..... http://randomish4.blogspot.com/2008/06/rpg-fishing ...
  • badenglishihave, on 06/06/2008, -0/+6I thought the most interesting part of the article was right at the end where he talks about the cost of making innovative RPGs today and how muddled the industry has become.
  • TheDeepFriar, on 06/06/2008, -5/+0dugg for spam-y picture
    /sarc
  • DrDragun, on 06/06/2008, -0/+15Time to reinstall Baldur's Gate and Diablo 2.
  • dagnabbit, on 06/06/2008, -1/+8I was never all that in to RPGs, until I got FF3 (VI) for the SNES. I can still hear the Japanese flute song on the intro, as the Magiteks marched through the snow.

    Best game ever.
    • madhouseradio, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3Yep, that was my first RPG and I played it for about 12 hrs straight on my first time sitting with it. I also got a beat down from my old man for a 10 minute call to that Nintendo support line.
  • hagis, on 06/06/2008, -7/+4this is like 8 years old.. must have been some powerful necromancer to bring this crap back from the dead.
    • Godlike, on 06/06/2008, -0/+5Yes, it's 8 years old. WoW and Oblivion were around then.

      Epic fail. From the article that YOU DIDN'T EVEN READ BEFORE COMMENTING ON:

      BioWare has released several excellent games, including Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic and Neverwinter Nights. Bethesda too has continued to shine with Morrowind and Oblivion.
      • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -4/+2I disagree with the Oblivion part. How is that game anywhere close to KOTOR or NWN? How is it even considered an RPG?
        • Godlike, on 06/06/2008, -1/+5The Elder Scrolls: Oblivion? How is that an RPG???

          Someone please turn the valve off on the fail hose.

          RPG of the Year

          IGN, IGN Reader's Choice, G4
          GameSpy, GameSpy Gamer's Choice awards,
          GameSpot, Gamespot Readers Choice
          Game Revolution, Interactive Achievement Awards
        • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -5/+1Your proof is game awards? Are you kidding me?
          *COUGH* LEVEL SCALING *COUGH*
        • mooseofshadows, on 06/06/2008, -1/+2if you actually played D&D level scaling is what made RPGs fun. It allowed everyone to have a challenge regardless of how you attempted to powerlevel. Level scaling, in effect, is like having a DM that's still trying to let you have a good time and not get too bored. It's not perfect in a computer game, but the idea is the same.
        • Godlike, on 06/06/2008, -1/+1Level scaling? WTF dude... if the people that made it call it an RPG, and the people that judge it call it an RPG, and everyone that plays it besides you calls it an RPG, that makes it an RPG.

          Of course, it might be some wacky sub-genre, what with the first person sandbox style... but it seriously is an RPG.

          You PLAY the ROLE of a character in a GAME... you decide what he says and where he goes and what he does, what his (or I guess her) ambitions and goals are, and when he dies.

          ARE PEE GEE!
  • orangefly, on 06/06/2008, -0/+7ultima online was like crack....
  • orangefly, on 06/06/2008, -7/+2leisure suit larry was a personal favorite....
  • tardmaster, on 06/06/2008, -2/+11He left out online MUDs MUSHes and MUSEs. WTF. I was playing text based DND type games with 40 other people realtime in 1991 (and my grades showed it). Many of these existed for years and are still around today.
    • milkmit, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2Yeah, some of those MUDs were as close to D&D as you can get on a computer, and offered the ONLY multiplayer option (some upwards of 100 people at any one time!) at the time.

      There's something pure about those old text-based games (single-player as well as online) that made them so much (addictive) fun.

      Then UO came along, and I all but stopped playing MUDs while I nurtured a 5-year UO addiction, starting from beta. Those were the days...
    • dadioflex, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1I used to play the original SX MUD over JANET at 300 baud using a local dialup to the QUB hookup. This was actually a huge improvement over the 1200/75 link dialup to the London JANET number which cost something like five quid an hour in phone charges (in the early 80s). I was 19 at the time and had to jump through hoops so I could use my Demon modem to dial out without anyone hearing because when it dialed it made every phone in the house tinkle, so I opened up the phone in my parents bedroom and sabotaged the bell (yes, bell. I seem to remember loosening the bolt that held the bell so I could tilt it away from the ringer.) in it and after everyone went to bed (Essex didn't open the MUD until after 1am from what I can remember) I'd go downstairs and unplug the main house phone.

      Of course MUD was too much like hard work so I'd play MIST or ROCK.

      Very very occasionally I run across people online who were there at the time and it's incredible when we talk about how far things have come. I pretty much complain about nothing pertaining to what I'm paying for my internet connection, how it's monitored or what my download limits are because in every way shape and form things have gotten so much better for me.

      The first quarter's phone bill after I discovered MUD was for 350 quid, which was a fortune back then. The next quarter I had my own phone line and a cloud hanging over my head that if I stepped out of line I'd be looking for my own digs.

      And I know a lot of you will have been living away from home from your late teens. I'm an Irish lad - usually we only leave home when we find a wife or girlfriend to look after us.
  • Joeyrev, on 06/06/2008, -0/+10I think I put more hours into the Baldur's Gate series than any game I've played in the last 5 years. I would love to see a third installment with modern graphics.
    • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2I agree, but I hope they keep the same view point but with enhanced graphics and a 3d engine and the ability to tilt the camera. I feel if they make it like NWN it takes away from the uniqueness of the game.
    • blatantninja, on 06/09/2008, -0/+1Just finished BG in TuTu. It was every bit as good as I remembered!

      I agree, I'd love to see a third installment, but it won't happen. The big studios all want 3-D, and no small studio could afford the license.
  • elhaf, on 06/06/2008, -2/+2Sorry, Adventure predates Akalabeth by two years. Atari 2600 role playing game that was also available on the apple. Granted it had no leveling up, etc.
  • Shadowgamers, on 06/06/2008, -3/+6Gygax rolled a 20 in his grave.
  • Tsukassa, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2"Forget the inventories and weapon stats and remember the storytelling, the roleplaying -- the transformation of ordinary gamers into extraordinary heroes. Remember the magic"

    Can't beleive someone actually thinks like me... let's hope together for a better future!

    ....
  • twylight, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2The pictures aren't correct in the story - referencing the wrong games or the wrong ones in the series...im old, played all these, but still young enough to remember which is which.

    Good story, bad editing. Old RPGs are great - nothing made you try harder after getting STOMPED in some old rpg. New ones are too easy.
    • dadioflex, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2I'm the exact opposite. Now that I'm older I have zero patience for the mindless make-work of most RPGs. This is what I have minions for now. I want to be able to order somebody else to go search the woods for the missing child while I can chill out back at my mansion.
  • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -5/+15Its a shame that gaming media calls games like Oblivion an RPG. It blows my mind. And usually the kids who would digg me down have never played a real RPG. They are completely stupid and like games that require no intelligence to play. I played Oblivion for about an hour, I realized it was one of the biggest pieces of ***** ever made in the history of RPG's. Yet it got game of the year and a number of award, and it was even considered an RPG. Bethesda is even butchering great RPG series called Fallout. But Bethesda has found a way to enable all mainstream gamers to call me a crazy fan boy. I'm sorry but, when you change a game from isometric view and get rid of turn based and make it real time; how the ***** can you call it a sequel? They completely ***** the entire spirit and purpose of the game. I wouldn't mind if you didn't call it Fallout 3, but you did anyway and it is nothing like the originals. Some good RPG's I've played:
    Baldur's Gate 1/2+ expansions
    Fallout 1/2
    Icewindale 1/2+ expansions
    Vampire - Blood Lines
    Planescape Torment

    Sorry a bit of a Black Isle/Interplay fan. But those are some amazing games. I have played a lot of others but those stood out the most for me. It was the story, the music, the art style/quality(I'm not talking about lame graphics; because art direction is more important then graphics. And lets not forget; THE GAME MECHANICS! Yes, games back then had a system that made it unique and different then other games.

    Baldur's Gate opened me up to D&D and showed me that its a pretty kick ass set of rules and a very interesting world.
    The gaming industry has turned into a sellout industry like MTV!

    Though I enjoyed Diablo 1/2, I do not consider it a true RPG. It was more of a hack and slash RPG. But yet had a pretty cool story and other aspects. The whole time your killing things, your not really solving problems or doing anything interesting. After awhile you think; "Damn, I killed 12000000 demons, whats the point of this game again?"
    • bagelmaster, on 06/06/2008, -5/+9Somebody is having trouble coming to grips with an evolving genre...
      • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -4/+7Someone doesn't know what they're talking about...
      • Tyrghast, on 06/06/2008, -2/+3Agreed. He also probably loved Oblivion until the Zero Punctuation video about it.
      • AriaGloris, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3Fallout 2 is my personal favorite RPG I've played - I do have worries for Fallout 3, They have said there will be no level scaling (ala oblivion) so that calms some of my worries.

        Like Bag said, the genre is changing - I'm hoping Fallout 3 is going to be awesome, Im begging for it to be awesome really, but I'm somewhat glad its reinventing and not cloning it predeccessors.
    • SuperDevil, on 06/06/2008, -1/+2I'd agree that Oblivion is a pretty ***** RPG. The level scaling ruined that game, because there were no off limits areas and therefore nothing to work for or look forward to. It also all looked the same no matter where you were landscapes, towns, and people... that game was a let down.

      But I guess it's a generational thing as far as classifying video game RPGs go. For me, when thinking of RPGs I think of Phantasy Star, Y's and Rings of Power, but I guess those are considered JRPGs or CRPGs. And while these games were fairly linear they weren't easy and did involve a lot of puzzle solving as well... Though this genre does suck ass now, the mid to late 80's and early 90's was were it was at for CRPGs... Today’s variety sucks ass IMO.

      But, the thing that bothered me with isometric view games was the point and click control scheme. My brother loved those games (Baldur's Gate, Diablo & Fallout) but every time I tried to get into the point and clicking would annoy the ***** out of me... just seemed awkward and clunky. The King's Quest series was probably my favorite RPG on the computer... although I'm sure that's not really considered a traditional RPG either is it?
    • stk198323, on 06/06/2008, -3/+4I do agree with you on the oblivion thing, that game is so far from bein an rpg... and it's crap!

      For Diablo 1 and 2... it depends on what you want to call an RPG. It has the level up system, stats you can change and affect the gameplay, weapon upgrades, etc. I don't know what else would make it more RPG like for you, for me I consider it a regular RPG...
      • mooseofshadows, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3wow, all these things do not define an RPG. you really don't know at all what you're talking about.

        there are lots of RPGs without level up systems or any of these things. It's just about the role-playing.
        • goffy59, on 06/07/2008, -0/+1By your standard, every game on the market is an RPG. Its not just a leveling up system. Its classes, skills that are actually useful and effect the game. This could go on. But I say a good character system, not just the ability to level up. Like fallouts SPECIAL system. Thats total RPG style!
    • dadioflex, on 06/06/2008, -2/+4Oblivion is a great game. It may not be a great RPG but neither was Icewind Dale1 or 2, both of which were conceived as action-lite Diablo combat RPGs with beefed up tactics. Oblivion was fine, not as good as Morrowind, but fine nonetheless. I played over 300 hours of it thanks to Oscuro.

      Nor do you mention 2 of the best RPGs of recent years Gothic 1 and 2, or the bijou Arx Fatalis which is an awesome dungeon crawl. Were they real RPGs in your opinion? If you haven't played them then you're not exactly an RPG expert are you?
    • mooseofshadows, on 06/06/2008, -0/+4It's pretty clear that you're nothing more than a roll-player.

      You can't screw up the spirit of the game by changing combat. The spirit of RPGs has, and will always be, role-playing. Oblivion actually had the variability and choice options to allow you to be what you wanted to be. In fact, I don't really think you understand what role-playing came from.

      I mean, honestly, what specifically are your problems with oblivion?
      • goffy59, on 06/07/2008, -0/+2It wasn't just combat. Its many things. You would actually have to beat Fallout 1 and 2 to understand. Most people who support Fallout 3 haven't even played Fallout 1 or 2. Bethesda is just trying to make money. Back when those games were created. Money was in mind, but the creators actually wanted to make something to be proud of. Bethesda could care less about quality. They go for quantity. That is why the gaming industry is pretty horrible right now. People like myself, who actually want to play good games get the short end of the stick; just like people who want to see good movies have to put up with ridiculous plots and schemes.
    • Koush, on 06/06/2008, -0/+5It's always nice when people think exactly like you do. I kinda liked Morrowind, but i found Oblivion to be complete crap. I was struggling to play it after a hour...

      The RPG's i've wasted unlimited hours upon are the FF's and the Fallouts.

      Anyone else panic when they heard Bethesda was developing Fallout 3?
  • elhaf, on 06/06/2008, -0/+5Odd that they don't mention D&D online.
    • dadioflex, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1Very odd, true. Rare to see such kindness on the internet.
  • Corbo88, on 06/06/2008, -0/+4This is cleary a story on PC RPGs only, so you won't see anything about console games.

    Whoever wrote this forgot to mention Everquest, which came out in '99 and broke nearly all previous barriers in the RPG/MMORPG realm.
    • Elohir, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2Also no mention of it breaking the barriers of sitting doing nothing for 72 hours at a spawn point before being rushed to hospital on a drip.
    • JAVandiver, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2I will tell you the same thing that I told an earlier poster when he asked about JRPG's... This article was about RPG's not MMORPG's. Different genre.
      • Corbo88, on 06/07/2008, -2/+0Not only are you wrong, but your comment has no relevance to mine...
    • stk198323, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3It's an article about single player RPG not MMORPG... they don't mention WOW, FFXI, etc...
      • Corbo88, on 06/07/2008, -2/+0Wrong... they mention both... did you not read it?
  • hermslice, on 06/06/2008, -1/+1Agreed *corbo88

    they also didnt mention WoW, which has become the biggest selling MMORPG ever.
    something like 10million accounts!
    with all the great games that have come before it is interesting to watch and see where this could be going
    • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3I don't think you can compare WOW to any single player RPG. Seriously. I play WOW all the time but whenever I finish a quest, is my effect on the world permanent. I believe MMO's do not belong in this discussion.
  • punkcat, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1Wizardry: Proving Grounds of the Mad Overlord, loved the game but the one i played was back and white not color like they suggest.

    it did have one stupid mechanic, to level you had to sleep at an Inn, but in so doing there was a chance your guy would retire or die in his sleep, aka be deleted.
  • Borgcube636, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3< Roll's d20 to see if article should be dugg >
  • Kypt, on 06/06/2008, -0/+4Dugg for Planescape Torment. My very first real D&D RPG (didn't get earlier ones since I didn't speak English back then). I ADORED that game, even though it was confusing at first. It is still up on my top 5 RPGs of all time. Maybe is nostalgic but everything about that game felt epic to me even if it was just about finding one's self.
  • dmkirt, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2"Remember the magic." Yeah!
  • Penguinsushi, on 06/06/2008, -3/+1The so-called video game "RPG's" are not really roleplaying games. Anything that can be programmed is by definition too limited to be true roleplaying - not that I don't enjoy such games, mind you. Basically, the addition of technology to rpgs (and even other aids/accessories, such as table-top miniatures, etc to some extent) is a trade off: enhanced sensory experience for the limitation of the scope of what is possible in terms of actions & story.
    • doctechnical, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1You're absolutely right, you can no more "role play" with a computer than you can have an intelligent conversation with it.
    • dmsteg, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3I don't think it's fair to say that PC RPG's are not really roleplaying games because of the technological limitations.

      One could argue that tabletop pen and paper RPG's are not really roleplaying because your sitting in the kitchen eating doritos and drinking mountain dew in a t-shirt and blue jeans.

      The idea is to loose yourself in an emmersive experience and become someone else that has capabilities far beyond your own using whatever media provides that experience.

      Heck... I remember watching my favorite superhero cartoons dressed as my favorite heroes pretending that I was said hero. Those were my adventures and my pitfalls and triumps that were on the tv.

      THAT was roleplaying.

      And fortunatly, I find that I am lucky enough to find a game like Oblivion or in the past Ultima Online (when it first came out) that once I can find my way past the technical limitation, I can loose myself in a world where I am someone other than myself doing things I would otherwise never be able to do.

      And to me, that is what the RPG experience is all about.
    • Cate320, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1I don't think it is THAT much different, I mean sure, for each game there is a set story-line and set characters that limit things, but the same is true in table top RPGs. Even though you may have some options along the way, the DM typically has a plot in his head and for the most part you follow along.

      My DM writes his modules weeks in advance and always seems so flustered when we do something unexpected. He grumbles "you think you know what they're going to do...". He is good at improvising but eventually gets us back on track to where he wanted in the first place.
    • stk198323, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1Say what? Are you dumb or something? Of course you are not a pure knight with a sword and a full body armor! The point is to take you into how that person would feel and react... there is no REAL role playing in the world! If you go to medieval recreation, would you say it's not role playing because the sword are not metallic? If you go to a murder and mystery night, you are not role playing: you don't have acces to all of the object your caracter would have in real life, etc! There is no REAL role playing, it's only a simulation for you to experience it the best you can with what you have right now. And in the case of the video games it's all about storyline and controlling a caracter playing like if you would be in his job: knight, rogue, sorcerer, etc!
    • Penguinsushi, on 06/06/2008, -0/+0No, that's not the point i'm making. I'm not saying that computer rpgs aren't real roleplaying because you're sitting in front of a tv instead of swinging a sword. As was mentioned, you're not swinging a sword when you sit at a table either.

      The opinion i'm trying to express is that computer rpg's aren't real rpg's because they're too limited - they're SCRIPTED. There are a very, very finite number of things you can do in a game that has to be programmed - whereas with a pen & paper or live-action game, you can go/do/say/attempt whatever you want. There was some mention of table-top games being somewhat scripted as well, but it's much less so and if the gm's any good, he/she can allow and roll with anything the players come up with.

      How many times have you been playing a computer-based rpg and you're in conversation with some NPC and it gives you two options for responses and you think "i don't want either of those - one makes me sound like a coward, the other makes me sound like a prick"? That's the kind of thing i'm talking about.

      Also, like i said, i *like* those games - they're just not what i think of when i think of "roleplaying"
      • dmsteg, on 06/07/2008, -0/+1I see what your saying now... in a computer RPG, all of your options have been pre-determined by the developers of the game before it even hits the shelf.

        Tho that point does give much value to games like Neverwinter Knights and Oblivion/Morrowind that give you the tools to open up those options a bit further.

        Tho you are absolutly correct... a computer RPG will never be organic or dynamic enough to throw you an unexpected twist based on how things are panning out like a live GM can.
  • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -5/+4Go play Oblivion and don't try to level your character. I promise you can beat the game at an extremely low level without any effort except running around which you can do on any map editor. Level scaling is a horrible feature. And so are fed ex quests and mindless killing. Oh and ***** dialog. That is why you see me criticizing Oblivion on most of my posts. Just go out and play the game and just think outside the box. You will see its nothing more then an action adventure game. You can't even pick most of your character stats, everything is simplified for the average gamer which consists of twitch gamers that enjoy mindless killing and HATE puzzles!
    • NecroDigg, on 06/06/2008, -2/+3Sigh, typical whiny digger. Is there anything you don't hate? other than Firefox and Nintendo?

      Seriously, I loved Oblivion, very well done. Good stories, Good graphics, High quality voiceovers.
      And the rest of the world agrees with me.
      • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -3/+1You just mentioned the parts of the games that really aren't that bad. Graphics are good, but Art direction is terrible. I'm not whiny, I just grew up in a time where game developers cared about the games they released. I just expect more from the industry. Just like many people on here have a problem with "I Am Legend" or "Indiana Jones 4". I have a problem with second rate games that weren't very innovative or creative. Oblivion is lacking in so many degrees. There is no challenge in playing Oblivion.
      • Cate320, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1Actually I agree with him. Oblivion was boring. I'm convinced it is one of those games that is so over-hyped it becomes "cool" to like it, even though many people really don't. I know tons of people that have tried it and didn't play it for more than a day.
    • slogged, on 06/06/2008, -1/+2Funny how the mere mention of role-playing or D&D brings people like this out of their caves, as they finally have something to relate to. I once tried to have a conversation with someone like this, he just sat in awkward silence until I hit on a topic he could steer towards role-playing/oblivion hating.

      I about level scaling though. But, there's a mod for Oblivion that fixes it.
      • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -1/+1There is a mod.... Yeah. Bethesda should have released a polished product, not have people fix it for them. I'm not talking about mods. I'm talking about game quality.
    • dmsteg, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1Just get past the 0's and 1's and have fun.
  • jeremyduffy, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3"Remember the Magic"

    Truer words were never spoken.
  • milkmit, on 06/06/2008, -0/+5CORP POR!
    CORP POR!
    CORP POR!
    • dmsteg, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2followed by "AAaaaaauuuhhh"
      followed by ooOoOOoo
    • dominikkom, on 06/07/2008, -0/+11. In Sanct Ylem dungeon exit
      2. Wait for adventurers
      3. ?????
      4. PROFIT!
  • RevEng, on 06/06/2008, -0/+3Escapist Magazine had an article in their last edition on this same topic. They focused more on how RPGs came to be and why they remain popular, as opposed to following a history of how they evolved in the PC world. Take a look at http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/issu ...
  • NecroDigg, on 06/06/2008, -9/+3WERLD OF WARKRAFT IS DA BEST RPG EVER.
    U DO QESTS N ***** AND KILL MOSTERS, AND GET GOLDS
    AND BY STUFF WITH DA GOLDS FOR TO KILL MORE MOSTERS
    AND SUMTIMES KILL PEOPEL
    • goffy59, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1You do the same on any "RPG" of today. The RPG genre has seen better days. At least Bioware and Obsidian keep with the old RPG spirit while satisfying the dumb gamers of today. Yeah, WOW's questing is pretty horrible. But doing end game bosses with 10-40 people working as a team is one hell of an experience.
  • Cate320, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2That was an interesting article. Brings back memories of some of my favorite games.

    I agree with their last couple paragraphs though, it does seem to be a dying genre. My first experience with PC gaming was with Diablo II and I played that game for like 2 years during much of my free time. However, once I played my first MMORPG , single player RPGs don't hold my attention like they used to. I have reinstalled Diablo and Diablo II, Baldur's Gate, Wizardry, Might and Magic as well as trying some of the newer RPGs multiple times over the past 7 years and can't get interested in any of them for more than like a day. There just seems to be something lacking playing in an empty world.
  • Tyrghast, on 06/06/2008, -0/+21up.com: The place where people who have been living in a hole for 25 years go to get caught up.
  • phoenixshard, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2Great story, it took me back many years. I still remember sitting in awe the first time I played Baldur's Gate.
  • Narcowski, on 06/06/2008, -0/+2Why isn't Rogue mentioned except in reference to Diablo?
  • mnemy, on 06/06/2008, -2/+1I think the reason the RPG genre that the author defines has basically died out is because it has been over done. We've all sat through the wall of text to read the same basic story line of those old fashioned D&D RPGs a million times. I mean, you could pretty much predict what was going to happen. Now we have MMOs to do our RPG action in a different way. We can immerse ourselves in RPG storylines, or we can go slaughter chuds. It's the player's choice. I for one am no longer interested in reading about how goblins whisked away a man's wife or child or whatever, or stole some important item, etc. Or saving the world from an evil wizard who has gotten his hands on some powerful orb or what not. That's why the genre has died. Maybe in 10 years they can try reviving interest in that kind of game.
  • RevEng, on 06/06/2008, -0/+6Being a fan of RPGs when I was a kid, it makes me sad to see modern RPGs, especially the grind-fests that are termed MMORPGs. An RPG was about developing a character, learning about the world you were in, and making a difference (being a hero) in that world.

    Modern RPGs and MMORPGs have lost the "magic" that made RPGs special. Fighting was part of the adventure, but it wasn't the purpose. Gear was only necessary because, as your character would grow more powerful, you needed more than rags to go along with it. Inventory was directed at items that you would collect that would be needed to survive and to solve puzzles. Storylines, quests, and (moreso in the tabletop versions) working together as a team is what made RPGs fun to play. If all you wanted to do was kill things and get better weapons, you played a FPS. Now, the quests are all tediously boring, focusing more on how many things you can kill rather than playing a character or solving puzzles. Even major encounters generally consist of a large creature with way too many hitpoints that you just beat repeatedly until it dies. Whatever happened to finding weaknesses, developing strategies, and using lore from your adventures?

    In the interest of making RPGs more accessible to the masses, it seems we've dumbed them down. You no longer play the game, the game plays you; you follow its instructions and pull its levers and it rewards you with particle effects and pretty clothing. I miss having to outsmart the opponent and trying to unravel the DMs evil plans.

    RPGs are in need of a major resurgence, not in the form of more half-assed knockoffs, but some original, compelling stories, like Baldur's Gate, Planescape: Torment, and Fallout.
    • smashhell, on 06/07/2008, -0/+1Very well said.
      It's really sad looking at RPGs these days.
      Well, at least we can still look forward to the RPGs that are being made over in Japan.
  • krucz36, on 06/06/2008, -0/+1i gotta say, as far as an "RPG" goes, the computer games all lack some important factors, the most important being actual interaction with human beings. up until the various online games and MMORPGs came along, the single-player games were just video games, not RPGs. Selecting a name and class does not an RPG make.
  • lheat123, on 06/06/2008, -0/+0i I must say, as far as an "RPG" goes, the computer games all lack some key things.
    Social Networks are catching up in those weekness
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W__uztA6htE

  • NiGHTSChao, on 06/07/2008, -0/+3Dugg for Fallout, the greatest RPG of all time
  • AEastep, on 06/07/2008, -0/+2Dugg for Baldur's Gate, to this day it is one of the best games I have ever played, or will play.
  • Solafein, on 06/07/2008, -0/+2Honestly I think the heavy emphasis that today's gaming community places on graphics is what is killing the genre. Take Oblivion, for example. Bethesda was ultimately much more concerned with being the latest and greatest in the game presentation. And I bet they spent more time figuring out how to make NPCs feed their freaking dogs than they did thinking of an actual story.

    Kick*** graphics make a game appealing at release, but they don't make it a timeless classic. Look at Planescape: Torment. Hell, I still go back and play that game despite the graphics almost being painful. I still play it a hell of a lot more than I'll ever play Oblivion.

    Still...I do appreciate Bethesda trying to put out some quality SINGLE PLAYER rpgs. And I'll buy whatever game they put out in order to support them. At least they are staying alive amidst a flood of grind fest MMOs.

    cRPG games will make a comeback....they did in the late 90s, and they'll do it again. All it will take is one awesome game to grab the public's attention.
  • LilRabbitFooFoo, on 08/11/2008, -0/+2Dugg up because the writer actually mentions the REAL creator of D&D, Dave Arneson.

    Note that Gary Gygax was just an editor/publisher of the game that Arneson created in its entirely. Gary spent his life trying to rob Dave of the credit for his own creation until Arneson forced Gary/TSR/WotC to settle a lawsuit to that effect. Just because Gary put his own name on books he didn't write, don't forget the real genius who created all of these industries...Dave Arneson. :)
  • Spoomeister, on 06/07/2008, -0/+3Buried for being about a bunch of computer games, instead of *real* RPGs.

    My lawn. Off it.
    • BTime, on 06/08/2008, -0/+1I'll admit that's what I thought the article was going to be about, however for what it was I think they did a good job on it.
  •  

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