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Hybrid Cars' Fantasy Mileage Ratings Drive Into the Sunset
wired.com — This year, new test standards have forced manufacturers to lower advertised efficiency claims on most models compared to previous years, and car lots are bracing for a tougher environment for hybrid sales.
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- The_Wallbanger, on 10/11/2007, -13/+20The mileage may not seem as impressive with the new standards, but hybrids are still the most fuel efficient cars on the road. The chart seems to reduce all vehicle's mileage by about 10%.
- NICU, on 10/11/2007, -3/+25This is great that the EPA is actually doing their jobs after 20 years - they're giving accurate numbers finally.
Next, consumers have to learn to drive correctly so they'll get decent mileage out of their vehicles. If you drive over 55-60mph your gas mileage will decrease. If you go over 70 or 80 your mileage decreases dramatically. Too many people think that driving on a road that's a highway will magically increase their mileage, they don't understand the difference in wind resistance between 60mph and 80mph. - neiltc13, on 10/11/2007, -26/+5I wish people would label their stories as "US Only" if they are. These rules do not apply to other countries, yet if I posted a similar story about my country everyone would cry out that it was specific.
- MisterRik, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10Really? If you look at some of the small diesels available (although not in the US markets for some reason) like the VW Lupo you'll see some damn impressive figures
- thcobbs, on 10/11/2007, -11/+4@netic
Quit bitching... No one gives a ***** - okaroleo, on 10/11/2007, -1/+16@NICU
Damn right, very few people know that speed limit of 55 was established not to save lives but fuel. it was the most economical speed in 70s and still is today. For some reason politicians take the view of "low speed limit saves lives" which is not quite true. States and countries with high speed limits get same or less # of casualties from high speed accidents.
@MisterRik
Diesel VW Lupo is awesome!! 70 miles per gallon straight out of factory, it's twice as efficient as Lupo with regular gasoline engine. It's an awesome commute car. - mrswirl, on 10/11/2007, -1/+14@NICU -
All I know is that if I tried going 60mph on the highway I would get rear-ended pretty quickly. 75 mph is the posted speed limit in my area and you'd better stick to the right lane if you're doing anything less than 80.
With that being said, I commute 45 miles each way every day in a 4 cylinder Nissan. I consistently get 30-32 mpg no matter if I'm doing 60 mph on the city highways or 80 out in the country. Increasing my mileage to 34 mpg is just not worth the honking and one-fingered salutes. - ThinkBox, on 10/11/2007, -2/+9What gets better gas mileage than a hybrid?
How about a VW Diesel Golf?
With 38/46 and a cheaper price tag.
In fact the VW Diesels are well known for beating hybrids. Watch any top gear - they rip hybrids and mention the VWs every single time it comes up.
http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/FEG2005.pdf
Check for yourself - SOS84, on 10/11/2007, -4/+2The new standards have been set up to more reflect the average American's driving habits. Unfortunately, drivers of hybrids do not typically possess these habits. We do tend to drive slower and drive shorter distances without rapid acceleration. I drive an Outback and with my driving style usually achieve close to the EPA estimate of 28 mpg on the highway, around town it is a little lower. In our commuter car, a Civic Hybrid, I regularly exceed the old EPA estimates. Of course living in central PA, if I were to leave the valley that I live in, I would get less due to the hills but in my normal days commute, it is golden.
- emfb, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3VW pulled all their diesel options from the us market this year due to higher emission standards that went into effect. You can already see the effect of this in the used VW diesel market, I know this because I was considering downsizing from my truck to a small diesel car but not at these prices.
The diesels will be back soon though 'greener' and higher technology.
I heard that they are going to be putting them into Chrysler cars and Jeeps in exchange for a VW re-branded chrysler minivan. Supposedly they are already putting them into the Jeep Liberty but I haven't looked into it yet.
My next car will be a diesel. I can only hope the market gives me a good selection to choose from. - toppgun, on 10/11/2007, -2/+1nelitc
digg is a USA based site, so that means it is mostly about USA based news
Not only should they accurately market the milage, but they should also raise the minimum standards. - manicallday, on 10/11/2007, -1/+0Not true. A 1990's honda vx used to get just as good gas mileage.
- swordedge, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3The thing about Hybrids is that their mileage is very dependent on both the type of driving and the driver. I highly doubt the new test procedures allow for driving hybrids in the way that gets decent mileage. If you mostly do highway driving, then a hybrid won't help much. If you deliver pizza, then you will get killer mileage with a hybrid.
- NSMike, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Hybrids are a gimmick for green-lovers.
They're roughly $10,000 more expensive than their old-fashioned internal combustion cousins, and sometimes don't even provide any advantages.
That's not to say there's no room for improvement, but at the moment, Hybrids are an expensive experiment in marketing and nothing more. - pirategaspard, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Love my VW Jetta TDI. 40-45mpg and I do 80-90mph on the highway. Too bad diesel isn't "sexy" like the hybrids. Can't wait for the new greener models next year!
- danarama, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1@neiltc13
agreed. amerocentric digg. - semvhu, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I have a 1999 Pontiac Grand Prix GTP (3.8L supercharged V6). I had some go-faster modifications for awhile and didn't care about mileage so much. I have recently changed the car back to stock configuration and am attempting to get the best mileage possible. With a bit of mixture of city and highway driving, I am extremely light on the gas from a start, don't let the engine speed get over 2000 RPM if possible, and use the cruise control whenever possible. I am averaging 26 mpg in a 240 hp car since attempting these methods. It's all in how you drive.
- NICU, on 10/11/2007, -3/+25This is great that the EPA is actually doing their jobs after 20 years - they're giving accurate numbers finally.
- flyingelvis, on 10/11/2007, -10/+13I get 51-53 in my 2006 Prius; without trying. EPA testers suck.
- jmpeagle, on 10/11/2007, -0/+12these are merely averages. My parents prius gets routinely better than 55 mpg but that is because they do mostly city driving where the electric motor does all the work...if they were to drive on the highway more...their mpg would decrease.
EPA results used to be based on how someone who knows how to maximize mpg out of there care...now they are tailoring it to the average idiot who owns a car making mpg much lower. - fotoman, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Funny, but we've found that with our 2007 Prius we actually get better mileage on the highway. The gas motor kicks in too quickly in my opinion when driving around town, kinda pisses me off! When I'm on the highway, I can usually coast a bit a when I have a lite foot average 70+ mpg sometimes.
We're averaging about 48 mpg overall, which is still better than the 28 that a lot of smaller cars get. With gas a $3.55/gallon here in California, I am so glad we bought the Prius when we did. 20mpg for 12,000 miles = 600 gallons of gas = $2130 per year in gas.
It is nice to see these numbers come back down to a realistic number as opposed to the estimated numbers given over the last few decades.
BTW, we knew we were not going to get 60mpg, we were hoping for 50, but 48 will do :) - cogit0, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3In my Honda Civic Hybrid, I get about 45 on average for just regular street driving. The lifetime average for the car over the 5 years we've had it is about 43.1 mpg (instant & average on-dash mpg ftw!). We have adjusted our driving style to get the near maximal gas mileage possible.
I like the new changes. They seem more accurate than the initial theoretical mpgs from the EPA. - solemnraven, on 10/11/2007, -3/+4I get about 18 in my rx-8 ^_^
- Altotus, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3I've got a 2003 Civic Hybrid. I rarely see less than 50 MPG commuting. If I travel long distances on the highway (e.g., Boston to northern Maine), I average above 60 MPG round-trip. Granted, I don't drive like a NASCAR wannabe, but not like a grandmother either.
- shaun944, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Yep, this is anti-hybrid propaganda being pushed and lobbied for by the American car makers that are WAY behind the curve on hybrid technology. For starters, every time you see this revised EPA stuff, they say how much hybrids will be affected, but fact is the EPA has been wrong for conventional cars too, and all of those will now be rated lower, so your Ford Excursion will actually be listed at the 12 mpg you get instead of 15-20... not to mention that these EPA estimates are lower than what most Prius owners I know are getting in real world driving.
I've owned a prius for 2 years. I avg. ~47-50 mpg, I get better gas mileage on the highway because where I live in Orange County, the city streets have a high speed limit (45-50 generally) and lots of lights that are improperly timed so you have to start and stop often. I also live atop a hill and it burns more gas driving up the hill than you save coasting down. However in Los Angeles I average ~ 57 mpg in the city because speed limits are lower and lights are timed better to reduce stops and thereby reduce traffic.
On the highway I avg ~ 52mpg.
- jmpeagle, on 10/11/2007, -0/+12these are merely averages. My parents prius gets routinely better than 55 mpg but that is because they do mostly city driving where the electric motor does all the work...if they were to drive on the highway more...their mpg would decrease.
- Drexus, on 10/11/2007, -8/+7Wow! So my wife's 98 non-diesel Passat gets better milage then the Ford Escape Hybrid, Saturn Vu Hybrid, or even the Toyota Camry Hybrid. Are we getting ahead with all the cost of a Hybrid?
- HappyPig, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2No.
- mynameistim, on 10/11/2007, -3/+6my car is rated at 29mpg hwy. I get 19-20mpg hwy.
epa ratings are for assholes. if you want a good laugh, look up their testing standards. The acceleration rates are a joke.- rollem, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5The tag line for this article makes it sound like the car companies are trying to fool the consumers. Actually, the car companies aren't allowed to tell consumers that the real mileage will be different from the EPA ratings. This rule was made to prevent companies from making even easier testing procedures and adversing those numbers instead, but also applies when the car companies would want to advertise lower than official numbers.
- way2muchsense, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4The truth is, the cars sent to the EPA for testing are hand-built to optimize gas mileage when driven according to the test. These are not the production cars the consumer is getting, and that is why actual mileage is significantly lower.
/source: Consumer Reports
- jpt62089, on 10/11/2007, -5/+2I know someone who gets 62mpg in her Prius... This is just bullcrap.
- yunus, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3"The new EPA tests factor in real-world conditions such as speeding, varying weather and lead-footed driving."
So the EPA is saying its ok to speed?- rollem, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1No, they're just replicating what people do.
- djjuice, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3seriously its about damn time we see REAL results from a more accurate test. Running a car on a machine is crap and tests from the 70's would make any hybrid look great. Now we can see how the auto industry is still ripping you off. the current hybrids are crap.
/rant - ajkrik, on 10/11/2007, -0/+32005 honda civic hybrid:
Highway: 52-53 (at 70mph) - 56-58 (65mph)
80% city streets: 38-39 miles per gallon.
We have over 30,000 on it in two years and buy gas every two weeks. We can get from Albuquerque to LA on 15 gallons of gas.
Not mileage estimates :)
- kungfujedis, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Seems suspicious to me that the car makers that have the most influence on the EPA (domestic ones) are the ones whose numbers most beneift from the revised mileage rules. A H3 only loses 1 mpg, while a Prius loses more than 10. That may be similar percentage wise, but looks like a much bigger difference to your average consumer. Why shouldn't a hyprid benefit from the fact that is shuts its engine off when it is idling? The criteria have been manipulated to make SUVs and trucks look better.
- cogit0, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3That's because hybrid owners over the past few years have been complaining that their car did not meet the mpg listed by the EPA. This is of course ignoring the fact that most other car, hybrid or not, don't get the listed mpg either, just to a lesser extent. The complaint was brought about by a self-selected group that are by nature more sensitive to the mpg rating.
- HappyPig, on 10/11/2007, -1/+1That's funny - I could have sworn I was getting 48 mpg in my Prius this morning. Maybe my division is wrong. Or maybe the ratings, while better than before, still aren't really reflective of driving.
- ozydingo, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Prius, according to EPA: 48/45/46. Your mileage: 48. Am i missing some reason that made you decide to complain?
- HappyPig, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Yes, you did. The title of this article is enormously incorrect. For those of us driving hybrids, the mileage has never been fantasy. The title just feeds the standard chucklehead hybrid-hater reaction on Digg. So do you get it now or should I try to explain again?
- mattmollysdad, on 10/11/2007, -7/+1I think it is cool that u guys care about ur MPG, it's best for our Country. Keep pushing the auto companies and things will only improve... but please can't someone do something about the styling... most of the hybrids r ugly... small is ok, , VW's, MG's, Triumphs, Corvettes, Zs, G35 Coupes r great looking but Prius... if u demand better styling u'll get it.
signed Old Guy - mattmollysdad, on 10/11/2007, -7/+1I think it is cool that u guys care about ur MPG, it's best for our Country. Keep pushing the auto companies and things will only improve... but please can't someone do something about the styling... most of the hybrids r ugly... small is ok, , VW's, MG's, Triumphs, Corvettes, Zs, G35 Coupes, and Subarus r great looking but Prius... if u demand better styling u'll get it.
signed Old Guy - trollick, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2So, Hummer ratings were the most honest?
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1It's an empirical test. Honesty is not an element.
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1It's an empirical test. Honesty is not an element.
- HappyScrappy, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2All cars ratings dropped. Hybrid ratings, being highest, dropped the most in absolute figures.
- kemal34, on 10/11/2007, -3/+0very nice information thanks... www.nakliyatcim.biz
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0I always thought they should ditch testing completely and use a statistical sampling of actual drivers. Once you set a specific test, you end up with people engineering for the best test results and not the best actual results. The problem of course is that brand new cars won't have any statistical data available.
- KaiserSousa, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2The key point is that the assumptions are based on 15,000 miles per year and $2.70 per gallon. If you drive 50,000 miles per year and pay $4.00 per gallon, a hybrid pays out five times faster than shown in the calculations. In other words, the people who drive the most have the biggest incentive to switch, which is as it should be.
- devlindark, on 10/11/2007, -4/+0for anyone here who believes all this hybrid crap, go to this link because it says it all, we have been lied to for decade after decade after decade and the technology has been there all along so jump in your hybrid and brag about your 60 miles per gallon record and remember that it's all BS
http://www.byronwine.com/files/Shell%20P221.pdf- ajkrik, on 10/11/2007, -2/+1WTF?
- DECwakeboarder, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I think this is a good effort by the EPA, finally.
Although I do believe the new system may be a bit too strict, we just bought a 2008 Escape Hybrid which is rated at 34 mpg and we haven't seen much under 37 since we bought it. - jrieth50, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3"The new mileage estimates mean it will take longer to recoup that extra cost in money saved on gas."
Who wrote this crap? If they're the SAME cars and the PERCENT difference in EPA mileage between them remains the same, then it will not take any longer to recoup the extra cost. It will be exactly the same. They didn't change the cars people, they changed the STICKER. - RhinoSS, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1While I'm glad that the EPA is starting to more accurately reflect the average driver, current EPA estimates aren't that far off. With that said, it does require changing your driving habits. My 2002 Camaro w/ V8 is rated at 26 highway MPG. I routinely get 27-28 MPG on the highway by insuring I keep out of the throttle and using terrain to your advantage. Rolling down a valley you can easily gain extra momentum to be used when rolling up the other side.
It takes practice, but If you can learn how to lighten your right foot, you'd be amazed at the gas mileage you can get out of any car.
Additionally, the use of predictive driving has shown huge benefits in gas mileage when driving in town. Don't make sudden stops and starts. The more you can average out engine load, the greater your fuel economy will be.
To me, it's not about the equipment. Its more about learning how to use it. - tmcdigg, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Cars should be smart enough to "tune" themselves to be efficient at ANY SPEED.. this is the premise behind HYBRID-SMART technology.. synergy drive, gasoline-electric hybrid, fuel cell, electric motor, etc.. take the BEST OF THE BEST FEATURES and get all you can for your energy cost...
This will make it worth fueling up each day and not be fleeced by big oil as much.. also make alternatives cheaper.. don't see ethanol pumps in many areas of the northeast yet.. - diggless, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I still get 48mpg in my civic hybrid, the EPA isnt going to change what I actually get, only what is advertised.
why dont they collect real data from real drivers? - Irrenhaus, on 10/11/2007, -1/+0Damm I own a Durango right now and get about 13/17 but don't drive it so much only about 37k and is 2002, that's why I don't worry so much about the gas prices at least for now. But on the subject I am no impress and I really not Impress by hybrids, cool technology but I believe this is 2007 or the 21st century and to have an average of 48mpg on a car witha 1.5l engine and the electric motor and about 110hp. Remember the Honda CRX HF that was introduce around 1985 that one had a 1.3l engine, only 62hp but 90feet pounds of torque so this was a good city driver and had an average of 52 city and 57 highway. And if you take into consideration today's new changes it will average around 45mpg for a car that was made 22 YEARS AGO. I think technology is moving forward only because people are now starting to demand more fuel efficient cars and I can see that every day now on the ads for new cars they always point out is the fuel economy of the car. I don't believe that will see any big changes until the gas pass the $4.00 per gallon and stays there for a long time. And here in CA were are very close to that mark. LOL
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