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76 Comments
- strafefire, on 10/11/2007, -6/+111Prepare for legislation to ban backyard wind turbines as of....NOW!
I mean seriously, we can't have consumers making their own power, can we? Where are we going to get more profits from? - floorman56, on 10/11/2007, -4/+79or the server can't handle the digg effect
Or the wind stopped blowing - RyeBrye, on 10/11/2007, -3/+33I don't want my neighbor making nuclear power in his backyard either - regardless of what kind of cars your bosses drive.
- cyberstall, on 10/11/2007, -3/+28http://duggmirror.com/environment/Build_your_own_backyard_wind_turbine_Cut_your_electric_bills/
- scrimaxinc, on 10/11/2007, -6/+29I don't understand how people still don't know that the first thing to try is to replace digg with duggmirror in the URL. I KNOW.... I KNOW.... I'm going to get buried by the hardcore diggers who don't want newbs to know how to use duggmirror, but I'm ***** sick of the "mirror anyone?" comments.
- jabab, on 10/11/2007, -2/+18Typing duggmirror is a lot of effort. I like a link in the comments.
- RyeBrye, on 10/11/2007, -2/+17The power companies are REQUIRED to pay them when they put more in than they take out. It's not like they are philanthropists donating to a children's hospital or anything.
- Suzilla, on 10/11/2007, -1/+14He was fined for using corn oil to fuel his automobile, which engine was converted to burn corn oil. State governments collect taxes on fuel to fund road construction and maintenance, and by not using a conventional auto fuel he was effectively evading paying taxes.
This does bring up an interesting (and virtually never-discussed) point about why we won't shift to renewable sources of energy, such as solar or wind. How would energy derived from these sources be taxed? Taxing fossil fuels is a simple way to pay for common resources according to consumption/use thereof.
You'll hear arguments about efficiency and cost of the technology, but, those are a matter of engineering. The real problem is re-engineering our whole system of how we go about financing the construction, repair, and improvement of our physical infrastructure -- bridges and roads. - BigPapa1974, on 10/11/2007, -0/+11I think the biggest roadblock to this kind of technology is not the government but the Home Owner's Associations.
- roseap, on 10/11/2007, -2/+12Nice article... seems to be more and more of these popping up.
"...and it is not as hard as we have been led to think."
Oh come on... did the you actually read the full article? For most folks, that's not easy, and that's exactly why it's only done by folks who like to putter with that kind of thing. This kind of thing will really only take off when there is an industry built around selling, installing, and maintaining solar/wind generators. - Elliuotatar, on 10/11/2007, -0/+9Apparently his website is off the grid as well.
- scrimaxinc, on 10/11/2007, -3/+12http://duggmirror.com/environment/Build_your_own_backyard_wind_turbine_Cut_your_electric_bills/
- stauken, on 10/11/2007, -0/+9Solar generators have allowed people to pump power BACK into the electric grid, and electric companies have paid them when they put more in than they take out.
http://www.pge.com/suppliers_purchasing/new_generator/solar_wind_generators/standard_e_net/index.html#willigetpaidforelectricityifeedbackintothegrid?
Is just an example of one company alone. Some companies are sending actual checks out to others.
It's already happening, in some areas, and the grids are already a huge mess anyway. - Toshibi, on 10/11/2007, -0/+8But, I swear the pile in my backyard is 100% safe.
- hansonc, on 10/11/2007, -0/+8@scrimaxinc
The real problem is that duggmirror hasn't caught a lot of sites lately so even people who know about it don't bother to check it. - rald84, on 10/11/2007, -3/+11up next, building your own backyard tubes so digg won't crash your internet server.
- nukeworker70, on 10/11/2007, -4/+11Take it from someone who works in the nuclear power industry. They do NOT want us to make our own power. Hell they would not be able to drive new BMW's and live in million dollar homes.
- rento, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7I really wish I could run my little server off a solar panel installation, but those are so expensive!!!
Never mind the money off the bill I wish they were just cheaper in the first place. At the current prices only few can afford it - thcobbs, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7Considering how often duggmirror has missed articles recently, I think it's now becoming valid again to ask if anyone has a working mirror.
- AndrewJC, on 10/11/2007, -2/+8suzilla: The point behind taxing fuels and cars is that you're using state roads, which costs the state money in upkeep and the like. The state would have no legal bearing to require you to pay taxes for building a wind turbine. Not that they wouldn't TRY it, but there's no logical reason that they can try to tax you for something like that, since you're not using the state's property or community, well, anything by creating your own power.
- budgetguitar, on 10/11/2007, -0/+6Bigpapa1974 hit it right on the head. Good luck putting one of these up in your backyard if you live in part of a homeowners association. Those facists hate everything.
- zadadka, on 10/11/2007, -0/+6Either the lights go out, or you switch to the energy you stored up in batteries.....no?....ok......the lights go out.
- mistermick, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5@moocat & ramble
You're correct ramble. A permanent magnet motor uses magnetized metal such as cobalt or nickel, spinning in a coil, to convert mechanical energy into electrical energy. - londubh, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5Wind turbines can on occasion kill birds, but far far more birds are killed by cats, hitting windows, cars, power lines, buildings and other man made structures, and killed by pesticides and air pollution from coal burning power plants than wind turbines could ever possibly kill. The extremely large turbine blades turn so slowly that the risk of a bird striking them is no greater than any other tall structure.
Read all about it here http://www.treehugger.com/files/2006/04/common_misconce.php or here http://www.awea.org/faq/sagrillo/swbirds.html
And if you really want to want to be eco-friendly kill a feral cat for every wind turbine you erect. - Wacer, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5@strafefire "Prepare for legislation to ban backyard wind turbines as of....NOW!"
Congress already added a large piece of legislation into the Energy bill this year. In order to build wind turbines, there has to be environmental surveys done to ensure that they don't kill too many bats and birds. There is also some fees and licenses that have to be dealt with in order to use wind for power. So ya, they are already making it unfeasible for the little guy to even get into this market. - hooksie, on 10/11/2007, -1/+6http://www.mdpub.com.nyud.net:8090/Wind_Turbine/index.html
Coral cache got more than Duggmirror, though not all of it. - BBMonster, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4Hahahaha, thats like here in Hawaii, the electric company was pushing to pass a new tariff on customers that build their own power systems. Lame
- NSMike, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4I worked as a temporary decon tech at Beaver Valley Power Station in Western PA for an outage a few years ago. Nuclear power is pretty awesome stuff. But those yellows really suck in containment in early spring.
- cfpresley, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5There is a good article in Make magazine about this, and much of this looks like it was either inspired by or inspiration for the article.
- gte879p, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3yeah... if it can't generate enough power to keep my computer running, let alone store enough juice to run it when the wind isn't blowing then it can hardly be said to get you off the grid.
"He is off the grid already, and made a turbine to generate some power."
There I fixed that for you. - maino82, on 10/11/2007, -4/+7they're not required to do it, and in fact most power companies don't pay you a dime. they let you roll back your meter to zero, but past that you don't get anything from the power company. it's kind of sad that it is that way because it discourages people from putting in large solar arrays or wind turbine installations that might pump more clean energy onto the grid.
- thcobbs, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3What the summation fails to realize is that some places just aren't capable of supplying enough wind for wind-based power generation to be effective.
It's easy as hell to create a windmill... but you have to have the wind to make it worthwhile. Luckily he lives in AZ... there are very few days of no wind out west. - BESTenemy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3If you want to set up a mini power generator, you can use permanent mangnet 6" fans that are used in PC's (the low RPM kind). They generate up to 10 volts at low RPM's. Make a bigger turbine, or get a model airplane propeller from a hobby store, like I did. Instead of up-converting to 120V, and then down-converting for charging portable electronics, had a capacitor bank and a miniature 12V transformer from radioshack for plugging into car's cigarette socket with 12V, 6V, 3V outputs. Mine had voltage stabilizer in it that was sufficient for dealing with varying capacitor charge. The car adaptor came with a set of plug attachments, so the only thing remained was plugging whatever low-current gadgets I could find. Good enough for running a radio or charging a cell phone.
- bsankr, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3macgyver
- elsJake, on 10/11/2007, -2/+5actually they tax fuel so that they can "help the environment" (get money from you , and not do anything worthwhile with it)
When generating power from wind/sun/whatever that doesn't burn they can't say they have to clean up anything....no tax. - NSMike, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4Well, it stops generating power and the batteries start to drain faster. Simple.
- Otto, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2@maino82: Depends on where you live, but they could indeed be required to pay you back.
Google for "net metering laws". As of right now, 30 states have some form of law that, yes, require the utilities to pay you back in certain circumstances. - malcolmreynolds, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3So, uh, what happens when the wind stops blowing?
- Moocat, on 10/11/2007, -4/+6Can anyone give me a brief description of a "permanent magnet motor"? I wikied it but didn't get a really good idea, I need a simpler explanation for my simple mind :)
- airiox, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Theres a PBS documentary all about Solar Power. Great stuff.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/solar/about.html
In it there highlights what ze Germans have been doing. They have started a program where people can buy solar panels and sell the electricity they produce to the power company for a considerable amount above the normal rate, it's subsidized by the government of course... Farmers have begun to take out loans to put up millions of dollars in solar panels and "raise" those alongside their traditional product. - themajor, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2@ all the people who mentioned putting power back into the grid; its not quite as simple as just plugging in and letting it go. There are issues with system stability and things of that sort. I don't understand it completely, (ME, not an EE) But its an issue to be dealt with.
- RanZom, on 10/11/2007, -3/+5wow, this is an old article! I actually built one of these for a fish house. They do not provide enough power to get off grid... not even close. This works great for keeping a battery charged while in the middle of nowhere
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Yea, it would be horrible to have safety requirements for an electrical generator just like every other electrical generator.
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2There's various ways you can take two sources and balance them into one output. The problem is the turbine doesn't create enough power to run high power appliances. Just think about the fan in your A/C. That fan has to be turned by the generator turbine just as if were mechanically coupled. Using electrons to connect the devices just introduces more thermal loss. The A/C compressor takes even more effort to turn than the fan.
- willtel, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Yup, I'm pretty much screwed for wind power living in Atlanta. Solar on the other hand is available to many more homes.
http://www.eere.energy.gov/windandhydro/windpoweringamerica/wind_maps_none.asp - maino82, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1@Otto
net metering means that they just roll your meter backwards so that they only charge you for your "net" energy usage. unfortunately most utilities still will not issue you a check for excess power consumed. for example, I live in california in a PG&E territory and they have several different types of net metering agreements (based on the size of your system, how often they check your meter, etc) but they all basically boil down to "if you produce Xkwh and consume Ykwh then your net utility bill will be either ((X - Y) * $/kwh) or 0, whichever is greater."
is it fair, not really, but at least it's better than nothing! - Leviathan88, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Title says it all!
[PIC] - ryanmetcalf, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1@willtel
great link.
apparently I'm somewhere between marginal & fair (north-eastern KS) - dracostimpy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Not if you store the lightning too! Found this after googling it... it's a reply by a Fermilab physicist to someone asking about storing lightning:
Good question! Actually, lightning electricity technically does not need to be generated, only transformed into a useful quality. The watts of power in a single bolt of lightning is certainly significant. Unfortunately, since it is a direct current (as opposed to alternating current) it cannot be stepped down by simply running it through the primary coil of a transformer. Also, due to the variability in voltage between bolts transforming it to a specific power quality spec would be a little tricky.
Another issue would be transferring this massive block of power to the electrical transmission grid in a slow enough manner to be absorbed by the system without adversely affecting online generating stations, and without transmitting more power than the grid can use.
These issues all seem to suggest that a storage device is needed for the lightning power which can then be slowly transformed and distributed. Perhaps the new superconductors being developed can make a magnetic energy storage device capable of handling the job (SMES). The issues would involve the cost of such a plant against the amount of lightning one could reliably hope to capture and sell at any one specific location. There are place on earth however, which are known for exceptional lightning activity (such as lightning alley in Florida) which might one day fill the bill for this, much the same as cost effective wind power generators have to be installed at specific locations on earth where air speed is reliably high enough to do the necessary work. - virtualfred, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1@ aldhelm
Nobody is pushing for a 100% solar and wind energy grid. As you said so volubly, it isn't always windy and sunny. On the other hand, hydroelectric dams, coal and gas power station can operate at less than their full capacity. 10-20% solar and wind energy can easily be implemented in current electric grids.
Also, you are thinking locally. On a large geographic scale, the occurrences of wind tend to be decorrelated. This means that chances are that if you have many wind farms on the electric grid, some are producing when others are not. This diminishes the importance of fluctuations in the production in the entire grid. -
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