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Why did Congress kill online gambling?

mises.org — Whose values was Congress protecting? It had nothing to do upholding virtue. Congress was protecting the "values" of brick-and-mortar casino owners and those who live off the state lottery racket.

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  • CaptA, on 10/12/2007, -1/+21The American government, the Congruous Congress (minus one, Ron Paul) is engaged in a serious circle-jerk. (The sign on the door says, "Please don't disturb!")

    Beatle drummer Ringo Starr: "Everything the government touches turns to crap."

    I second that!

    Anyone who wishes to continue "their sport" can and will find the necessary measures (“offshore”) to continue unimpeded by Leviathan’s continuous onslaught against freedom. Just another example of how UN-FREE Americans are -- and in the river of "denial."

    Ck 6
    *******
  • zxcv1234, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Can you get around this law with egold?
    • CaptA, on 10/12/2007, -5/+3To zxcv1234.

      I personally don't know. But those people who wish to indulge WILL find out what it takes to continue exercising their "vices!"

      That's the part of human nature I place trust in. Whether egold is the answer or opening a bank account offshore and establishing a credit card for such purposes, there will be ways to conduct private transactions, still using the Internet via SSL if necessary. What a tragedy that the social engineers and tax authorities are "making crooks" out of all honest individuals that merely wish to be free from the egregious tactics of government.

      Government is force. Nothing more. It isn't your friend. In the end-game, government will lose, driving even more money offshore to tax havens where greater freedom reigns. YES!

      Ck 6
      *******
    • ImOscar, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Online poker is still legal in most states. Hopefully the financial institutions in the U.S. will still be allowed to do business with those that are legal. Poker only sites are not breaking any laws in most states, however sites that allow poker AND casino gaming will most likely no longer be able to initiate financial transactions in the US.
    • Misesean, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"Can you get around this law with egold?"

      Sure you can; click here: http://4861766.thegoldcasino.com
    • Misesean, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Oh, by the way, e-gold's servers are in the US; if you care that the Feds have easy access to your account data, sign up with 1MDC and transfer your balance there - you can still make payments to e-gold accounts, but your transaction record isn't on their servers. (You also save on fees!)
  • guytoronto, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12I'll bet it had something to do with money.

    Wait, I can't bet! Congress made it illegal. D'oh!
    • pensivewombat, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Yeah, but it probably had more to do with elections. If it was about protecting casinos and lotterys why did representatives from Nevada protest the bill? I think this was more about a bunch of reps and senators trying desperately to attatch their name to something so that they can run ads saying that they stamped gambling and grab some votes from christians and old people.

      Most americans don't gamble online, so those that strongly oppose it were pleased, and most other people were unaffected.
  • procdaddy, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10http://www.sportsinteraction.com

    or

    http://www.bodog.com

    still take U.S. accounts, ***** Bush for signing this stupid ass law.
    • RuffRidr, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10Ya, and ***** all the idiots in congress (Dems too) who put this on George's desk.
    • lidflipper, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Yea, this law really didn't do anything except scare away a few sites. I'm sure PartyPoker would still be allowing US players if it were not a publicly traded company. I've been playing poker online for four years. I'm still playing as of today and so no reason to think that I will not be playing a year or more from now.
    • Hickeroar, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Poker wouldn't be covered in this. It's person to person gambling....not traditional casino gambling...
    • SeanFL, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3correct...money probably had a lot more to do with it than good intentions as is usually the case with out government.

      Let's not forget it was plenty of dems and repubs who crafted the law and presented it to the president.

      I for one believe gambling is a scourge on the nation. There's no way to be sure of age when it's done online. We don't allow folks to internet / mail order alcohol. Gambling is now the same way.
    • weirdone, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1The problem isn't that the casino sites will still keep operations going. They definitely will because they knew that they had customers in the US playing illegally and they didn't care then. PartyPoker even put it in their prospectus when they went public.

      The problem is that the sites that make transactions to these sites currently possible, firepay, neteller, etc. won't do business in the US anymore because they were on the legal side of things because they were just a middle man sending money from one account to another. Now they're illegal so those companies will stop transactions and then most likely another site will come along that will do business illegally and send to the casinos

      And no I don't think this has anything to do with brick and mortar casinos lobbying for this. They're not losing money to these sites. The only way they can benefit from it actually is if there is a public backlash to this and then online gambling is legalized which allows harrahs and the rest to create their own online casinos.
    • etruscan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5All I know is I lost my job due to this bill - and I wasn't very happy about it. The truth of the matter is - there was no logical reason for stopping it and essentially making online gambling transactions illegal. It was a crackdown move by a government that couldn't figure out a way to tax this money - plain and simple.

  • doktorrocket, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8Online casinos have payout rates that are much more generous than the typical state lottery. Can't have anyone undercutting the state-run monopoly.
  • alecm3, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2The rationale may be that the money gambled away in traditional lotteries and in Vegas stay in the US, whereas many online casino operators are based abroad.
    • vericjunk, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3so? does that mean we can't buy brie or a toyota either?
  • nuklear, on 10/12/2007, -5/+1http://www.neteller.com
    • weirdone, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3neteller announced they aren't accepting transactions from the US to online casinos anymore.

      firepay has done the same.
    • ImOscar, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1False.
      http://investors.neteller.com/neteller/upload/Pressreleaseupdate19oct06Final.pdf

      "...The Company also continues to closely monitor the regulatory situation and is determining what actions to take well before the conclusion of the 270-day rulemaking period.
      In the interim, US-resident customers are able to use the NETELLER service as
      normal. The funds of US-resident customers are held in trust accounts and will be
      available for withdrawal, on demand. The ability to withdraw funds will exist
      regardless of the customer’s location or ability to transfer to any site."

      This was as of Oct. 19th, please correct me if I'm wrong, but they have posted no further updates.
  • tominabox1, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4It's because the chips get stuck in the Tubes and the only things that can get them out are PowerBalls.

    Race Horses of course dont get stuck though because they can just run through.
  • daborg, on 10/12/2007, -13/+2A more pertinent question might be: Who gives a *****?

    *prepares to get dugg down*
    • weirdone, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10easy answer: online gamblers, which apparently you aren't but literally millions of others are, legally or otherwise.
    • Archon810, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4god damnit. did you really have to ask this question? wasn't the answer obvious?
  • geojams, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1As the wise Daddy Bender said, “I’ll go build my own amusement-park…with blackjack…and HOOKERS! In fact, forget the park!”




  • Nightfall, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Congress didn't protect anyone. A lot of these sites are run in other countries where the US can't govern them. Internet gambling is a multi-billion dollar industry. Congress won't be able to just pull the plug on something like that.
  • SlackerCSB, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2Just sign-up with Neteller. They are an offshore bank and you can still fund your poker/gambling accounts. It gets around everything, legally.

    https://www.neteller.com/signup/step1.jsf?pei=null&refId=23-58-212-68-0-170-98-57-25-191-229-196-218-33-159-207
    • ImOscar, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Neteller is also a publicly traded company and will comply with whatever resolutions are set into place. Online poker is still legal in most states and this bill doesn't change that. This bill puts the burden on financial institutions to not accept or initiate transactions from illegal gaming sites. We'll see what comes to pass, hopefully legal poker sites will continue to be able to do business with US financial institutions.
    • weirdone, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1once again...if you were a neteller customer you would have received a letter from them stating that they aren't making any transactions to or from casinos if the end user is in the USA. They are complying with the regulations.
    • ImOscar, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1I'd like to see the text from this letter. I did not receive one, and I have been a neteller customer for a long time. Please refer to my post above where I quote an Oct. 19th press release that states
      "In the interim, US-resident customers are able to use the NETELLER service as normal."
      There have been no further press releases on the subject.
  • Antimatter3009, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3One reason is because it was tacked on to a port security bill, and who's going to vote against that? This sort of last second tacking-on and changing of bills just before they go to a vote is a huge problem with our government. For this reason, I'd recommend supporting this:
    http://www.downsizedc.org/read_the_laws.shtml

    There's a link to mail your Senators/Reps in the last paragraph on that page. If you agree that putting online gambling and port security in the same bill is stupid, you should support this.
  • mlsj1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1the answer is tax money, the two gambling segment still legal are betting on horse racing and the lotto, why? Taxes. brick and mortar casinos bring in so much money to local and state governments that they want to ensure that money keeps on coming. they have been losing tax money from buying anything on line, since it not taxed yet. they are trying to guard current revenue sources
  • IanRReardon, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1Gambling and the Lottory is a tax on the poor/stupid.

    I love the comment where he said along the lines that losing money gambling is like buying things at the grocery store. It's more like going to the grocery store, paying for your food and then having a 30% chance of getting to bring it home.
  • teclo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2It is a clear case of protectionsim, a large percentage of the Online Gambling sites are located outside the US, around the UK and Channel Islands I think. This means that the American dollar is not going to paying for this idiotic war, but is actually going outside the country.

    Just a thought but I could be wrong.
  • Toast1185, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I thought that was rather obvious.
  • Greenfday6, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1epassporte.com a virtual credit card
  • mpschan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0Why'd they ban online gambling ...

    It's due to money, yes. But not because they are protecting casinos profits.

    Casinos produce serious income for state and local governments because they reside inside their jurisdiction. They are heavily taxed and regulated on their income and operations.

    Online gambling doesn't need to reside inside the United States. Case and point the sites based in London. Therefore, the US has no jurisdiction for taxation purposes. The US can't sue or take the defendants to court because the warrants are meaningless.

    Do you think the state of Nevada and New Jersey, as well as others, are willing to give up on millions of dollars in gambling income from casinos to online sites? If you were a Senator or Congressman of that state, would you want the people living in your state paying higher taxes or dealing with decreased funding of services (schools, roads, etc)?
  • frogpelt, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Every time someone wins the lottery or hits the jackpot the government does too. I bet (no pun intended) online winnings are much harder to track for taxation.
  • jbrevik, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Brick and mortar casinos? I live in Phoenix and most of the casinos out here are under a massive reinforced vinyl tents.
  • jacon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1"...Online companies who "play by the rules" will exit the market. Other companies will operate in the underground economy. New companies will enter the market using techniques to get around the legislation."

    This will hurt users that will never stop gambling and will be playing in less reliable gambling sites.
    I give it no more than one year to change or be reversed!

  • best5casino, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0These days gambling games are loosing popularity due to US laws. Several offshore gaming websites have suffered a major set back after FBI started poking its nose in poker and casino related gambling websites.

    It is quite strange the U.S govt is also banning non-gambling related websites. So basically any website which promotes the idea of online games are under scrutiny. Several recreation gaming websites are facing the brunt of U.S gambling laws.

    Please join our online discussion group on gambling at : http://groups.google.com/group/gambling_games , regards, http://www.cystalpalacecasino.com
  • secondtbocro, on 03/28/2008, -0/+0This site has a list of casino's currently accepting U.S. players.
    http://thebestonlinecasinosreviewsonline.com
  •  

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