What is Digg?182 Comments
- inactive, on 12/21/2008, -3/+78It's funny how some Americans freak out over a proposed 2 percentage point rise in the income tax for 1% of Americans, but happily pay a 10-20%+ tax on all their purchases by using credit cards irresponsibly. Buying stuff on credit, unless you're swinging 0% interest, is like voluntarily paying an extra sales tax. Which wouldn't be so bad, except most Americans act like even a 2% tax is basically a fate only marginally better than being tortured to death.
- danthepiercer, on 12/21/2008, -5/+50i dont mean to sound self righteous or anything...but am i the only one who simply chooses to not spend more than he makes?
crazy, i know. - ordig, on 12/21/2008, -2/+42everyone could just max our cards out and refuse to pay them back. It's about the only way we will ever get a bailout.
- northwatuppa, on 12/20/2008, -1/+38This article is from Forbes. It's kind of thin, really. You can't really expect a hard-hitting, in-depth article about credit card issues from Forbes. Credit Card lenders have been massively abusive for many years and these reforms are long, long overdue. The article barely hints at that.
- wassim2k, on 12/20/2008, -0/+30Forbes is so slideshow happy. Too bad their slideshow platform sucks.
- lynosull, on 12/20/2008, -1/+25Remember that the bankers secured credit card debt exclusion from bankruptcy. That was the most vile piece of legislation I ever witnessed. The first thing people in trouble begin to do is pay monthly expenses with credit cards. When bankruptcy occurs the credit card debt remains.
- sockpuppets, on 12/21/2008, -0/+24Ever since I started using my neighbor's credit card my outlook has improved tremendously!
- iamamaniac, on 12/20/2008, -2/+22Good tips!.. I think, everyone should follow this advice and get credit card debt under control.
- scootinger, on 12/21/2008, -1/+21Way to go stupid banks! Rather than sticking to an ethical business model, they've aimed to grub all the money from their customers' pockets that they can via exorbitant interest rates and fees, and handing out credit like candy. As a result, they've ***** themselves and everyone else over.
As a (FINANCIALLY RESPONSIBLE) 19-year-old college sophomore, I've seen their lack of ethics and leniency in offering credit first-hand. (Although the latter is evidently coming to an end.) Shortly after I turned 18, I applied for a Citibank student credit card and was given a $2,000 credit line. What the hell were they thinking? I was expecting something more like $500....nothing above $1,000 at most. Since then, I've managed to acquire over $20,000 in unsecured credit cards (note those are credit lines, NOT debt...I'm responsible) without any cosigner or anything. $14,000 of that is with Chase alone. And most of these cards (save for a USAA credit card with a measly limit of $500) have an APR between 15-18%, with an even higher default rate, as well as loads of fees in the event that one were to screw up.
SHAME ON YOU CREDIT INDUSTRY! - Dailydose4me, on 12/20/2008, -1/+16Give them back to the banks ?
- 11oops, on 12/21/2008, -3/+15You say you're part of that 1%, but then you call people morons that carry a balance. Perhaps you should try to live like millions of Americans; earning less than a decent wage with no raises or bonuses, struggling to cover your families expenses, paying an arm and a leg for insurance or healthcare costs, etc. etc.
Get off your high horse; you're not all that you think you are. - TheNyquilKid, on 12/21/2008, -0/+12What I took for the article, less people are paying back what they owe, as a result credit card companies raise the rate of customers who are paying.
- Slash0, on 12/21/2008, -1/+13You go first
- chancesarent, on 12/21/2008, -2/+13Education costs money. How are you supposed to get an education if you're working 12 hours a day for peanuts?
- wishihadatwitch, on 12/21/2008, -2/+12His name is Robert Paulson.
- DamnMan, on 12/21/2008, -2/+12Chompy, how do you propose they pay for that education? And what do you suppose happens to the pay levels when everyone has the same BA/BS education you have? What happens when everyone stops digging ditches, laying pavement, guarding office buildings, cooking food, picking fruit, mopping floors etc etc to "Stop whining, get an education and get a decent ***** job"
Your cunning plan, You didn't think it all the way through. - Darthyoshiboy, on 12/21/2008, -4/+14LOL. The easy fix? Live within your means and don't use credit cards.
Do this and you'll survive the "Credit Card Crisis" just fine. - CoD4, on 12/21/2008, -0/+9you're jumping too far ahead, i think what he means is: not spending like a ***** idiot and not buying ***** you really really don't need
that nice new cellphone
a huge tv
cars that are out of your league but you need status
high end clothing, shirt for $50? give me a break
JEWELRY
RIMS/***** stuff for cars, expensive stereos - MillionsLivio, on 12/21/2008, -0/+7I do as well; hell I don't even have a credit card, use a debit card instead. I've seen so many young people my age get a credit card and spend like crazy and get into debt, even some are responsible with it and something unforeseen happens and they have no money saved and it spirals out of control. Live within your means, something so simple yet many don’t seem to grasp.
- inactive, on 12/21/2008, -3/+10I love these canned remarks. DO YOU PEOPLE OWN A HOME? HAVE A FAMILY? What happens when your furnace gives out? Now you are looking at possibly a $6000 - $12000 bill. DO YOU have that much in liquid savings? Can you pay that balance off in a month? Or, you wake up one day and your child needs braces. I mean, needs them. Boom, $8000 right there, that your insurance is barely going to cover... Boom, the tran. in your car goes... $3000 right there....
The credit industry in all it's evil exists because life happens.....
The only people I know that operate in the method you do, have no home, no family, or mom and dad are footing the bill.... - Slash0, on 12/21/2008, -0/+6Credit *Card* Crisis
Reading ftw - kuzotz, on 12/21/2008, -2/+8you know what bump this. I know plenty of educated people getting ***** over right now because of the job market. My god companies want to pay new and upcoming professionals unlivable wages. Hell my sister has her CPA and is an accountant, and has a masters in the degree, and the best she could get was an accounting job that once use to pay her 50k a yr, but then they fired her and rehired her, and made her pay non-negotiable at $15 an hour. She can't even pay off her student loans with that. Of course student loans won't be my problem as I am one of the few who was able to get scholarships.
But when I get my economics Bachelor's. I'm going straight to graduate school in either Singapore or Canada, and after that I'm working outside of the US for a looongggg time. The pay isn't as good as it use to be in America. And trust me I am studying in Japan right now, and I have a part time job that pays the equilvalent of 21 dollars an hour, roughly 2,000 yen an hour. (though I don't work many hours as I am studying). Anyway A lot of people here are disconnected with what millions of Americans go through. This is why I left America, and I won't be coming back(only to finish my degree, and then I am back into the outside world). - olenick, on 12/21/2008, -0/+5Nope -- this is a misconception the CC companies lie about a lot. One project I'm working on is automation software for bankruptcy lawyers and I've learned lots about bankruptcy (for the uber-Right Digg heads no, I'm not bankrupt -- actually it's a good time to sell bankruptcy automation software).
What can't be discharged is money spent over a prior time-frame on your credit-card. Have a card where you owe, say $10K, and all of $9,800 of it is a couple years old? All but the $200 is going away.
The other change that's poorly understood is Ch 13 vs Ch 7: the former is a five year (sometimes less; ask a lawyer) repayment plan on terms you should be able to afford; the latter just wipes out your debt. It used to be easier to choose but now many people are forced to go through Ch 13. The former stays on your credit seven years from filing; the latter ten years. It's rare that people have to repay all their debt -- it's more like a consolidation service where you make a smaller payment and whatever's left at the end is thrown out.
Some debts cannot be discharged (thrown out). These include back child support, student loans, and damage you intentionally caused (not by breaching a contract; usually by physically hurting somebody or stealing) and ... the one that's destroying our economy ... first mortgages on a house that you're living in. Second and later mortgages can be thrown out, as can mortgages on houses you don't live in. Note that all of this -- especially the rule about the first mortgages -- are very likely to change in the next couple months: it's a high priority for the incoming Obama administration. - Larsonal777, on 12/21/2008, -2/+7You can raise sales tax all you want... you ***** raise my income tax... and i'll beat you with a wet noodle.
I don't want to ***** pay taxes on money I'm working for. Taxing the dumbasses that are spending more money than they can afford... thats fine.
in a perfect system no one would pay income tax on the first 20,000 (or whatever we decide is the poverty line). Then everyone pays a straight percentage on money made over that line. Something like 15%. No tax brackets thats just a bunch of bull. - doiveo, on 12/21/2008, -2/+7No actually, that isn't how it works. Having "potential debt" is called credibility as some one saw fit to give you that limit. It is a good thing because you don't have large unsecured liens. If you have managed your dept and all these cards are in order then you are demonstrating you can repay. Only if you are not going to use a recently established cards should you actually cancel them. That said, don't rush out and get more cards. Much, much better to routinely ask your current card issuers to increase their limits.
If you do carry +50% balances, calculate the actual interest payments per card. Pay the minimum on all the lowest and then pay everything you can spare on the highest. Repeat this every month until you have paid them off. But don't cancel the cards!
If you are going to miss a payment - call them! They are ready to help and may not report it if you work with them.
You might be thinking of secured debt which represents a portion against your income. Even then you can handle up to about 60% and still be in ok shape.
It might not be what your Grandpa told you about money but this is how the credit market works. - inactive, on 12/21/2008, -1/+6Glad I got rid of those damn things years ago.
- AlienMushroom, on 12/21/2008, -0/+5Oh yeah, I'm a Chinese (seriously) and I do need some of your "traslation".
- insanebrain, on 12/21/2008, -0/+5You are actually saying. . "without prove of having debt, you can't get any more debt".
In Europe it's the other way around, without creditcard debt, you are able to get a mortgage. - AmusedToDeath, on 12/21/2008, -2/+7What dummies like you fail to realize, is that if you don't have any debt and save carefully, you can buy things like cars and houses with CASH. You may still need a partial loan after saving for 5-7 years for the house, but no matter what your credit history looks like, any bank in the country will give you a reasonable home loan if you have a job and can put down 30% or more. Most banks are perfectly willing to do even a no-doc loan with 40% down. 50% down? They will kiss your ass like there's no tomorrow while lining up to make you a loan. Why? Because you're the safest bet in the world. If you avoid bad debt like cars and credit cards, you can essentially work outside the credit system for all practical purposes. But credit card companies LOVE dupes like you who insist that loads of credit is a necessary part of "the system".
- killdashnine, on 12/21/2008, -0/+5Citibank just tried to jump my credit from a nice 6.9% to something like 15%. They have an "opt-out" policy ... call them if you have a Citi card and take advantage of it. The good part is that they allow you to continue using the card under present terms until expiry, and then close it but allow you to pay it off under the present terms.
- inactive, on 12/21/2008, -0/+5Nothing in my comment referred to every American, but only to some groups. So you are replying to an argument I didn't make.
- Tyrghast, on 12/21/2008, -1/+5Paying off most of the credit card debt would probably be cheaper than the wasted bailouts already paid out this year to groups like AIG.
- computershack, on 12/21/2008, -1/+5The only reason I have a credit card is to earn money from it. I get 1% cashback on purchases, 1.5% on grocery shopping and 2% on fuel. It gets paid off in full every month and ever since I've had it, I've never failed to get paid by THEM to use my card.
Footnote:
I live in the UK so don't know if you've heard of cashback credit cards in the USA or not... - kdor, on 12/21/2008, -0/+4Dump all your credit cards. Cut them up. We were $20K in debt after the business tanked post-2001. We cut them up. Paid everyone off in about 4 years. Now only use cash, checks or a debit card. Have not missed it. Have saved thousands in interest. You DON"T need a credit card to get a good credit score. Pay your bills, pay your mortgage, pay your car payment and you'll have a phenomonal credit score. This last year we bought three used cars for cash. Each time it hurt for a couple of months, but no shelling out interest every month for five or more years. Look at a credit score as a 'just in case' not as an opportunity for more crap.
- loki77, on 12/21/2008, -0/+4If you can't afford kids? Don't have them. If you can't afford to pay for the repairs of your own home? Don't buy a house.
Seriously, the world has too many people as is- stop making babies, especially if you can't afford it. Save for your kids college, and then make them work to pay off the rest. My wife did just that, and she's one of the more financially responsible people I've met. - chrissku, on 12/21/2008, -2/+6Things are starting to get bad. I don't mean to sound so pessimistic....but I just had two friends get laid off. I really hate it when companies lay people off two weeks before the holidays. At least have the decency to wait until like January 3rd. Anyhow, my buddy is a bartender and he's telling me a lot of ***** up stories. He said that every week he has more and more people up there getting drunk because they lost their jobs. Bartenders hear lots of *****, and lately he said the ***** he's hearing is worse and worse. You'd be surprised at how precisely they feel the mood of the public. He said it's getting depressing. That's not good.
- insertnamepls, on 12/21/2008, -0/+4@CrazyZ
Since you are wondering - I had a student loan - I paid it off myself. - trollick, on 12/21/2008, -0/+4Don't buy stuff you cannot afford.
- inactive, on 12/21/2008, -0/+4I watched a show about credit card companies. They actually refer to people who pay their bills ON TIME as "deadbeats." Credit card companies want nothing to do with people who they can't rape with interest.
- FreddieD, on 12/21/2008, -5/+9You just need to read the bible for not getting into credit card debt: Don't Buy Stuff You Can't Afford
http://www.hulu.com/watch/1389/saturday-night-live ...
Q: Wait a minute, what if I want to buy something, but I can't afford it.
A: Then you don't buy it.
Q: Well, let's say I don't have enough money but I want it. Should I buy it anyway?
A: No.
(my apologies, non US based readers...) - inactive, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3Here's how it's going to go. You pay your bill on time every month, have good credit etc... Basically you "fight the good fight" and handling your *****. The banks raise your rates in order to rape the cow because the other cows aren't giving enough milk. You have two choices. Keep fighting the good fight, look for better rates etc. or you finally say "***** it" and just blow them off, credit score be damned. They start to fail, they ask for bailout, they get bailout... you are left screwed... either way we LOSE.
The American dream........ - inactive, on 12/21/2008, -2/+5It blows my mind. Spend what you have, idiots. It's not rocket surgery.
- DamnMan, on 12/21/2008, -1/+4all the people who seem to think the banks are innocent babes, really?
Sure free will, no ones holding a gun... whatever. Your missing the point. If everyone got a credit card and payed it off every month perfectly, credit companies would be even more ***** than they are now. No, what they do, and do on purpose, is lure (arguably stupid, hence the term "predatory lending") and indenture people with big slick credit lines and insane interest rates. That is the root. Their entire business model is designed to work on stupidity/naivety/ignorance from the users. Now that they have leeched that particular corpse dry they have to find something else to feed off of. - inactive, on 12/21/2008, -1/+4Well, that's whats happening. The problem is, the people who do this will trash their credit rating even more so, the credit companies will ask for a bailout, will get it, and the only people ***** are once again, the people.......
- maz2331, on 12/22/2008, -0/+3I could give a ***** less about credit scores, since I won't be using credit anyway.
- mehan, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3Why? They will immediately cut your credit lines to as close to your balance as possible. And then you're ***** - no cash and no credit.
- StillAnonymous, on 12/21/2008, -3/+6CrazyZ: You mentioned, but didn't seem to notice, the root cause of the problem in your post. It's the house. Most people overpaid for one, and they're now slaves to the payments, which allows all those other problems to cripple you. The car would be the #2 problem you mention. Why do so many people feel they have to spend $20k on a car? If you bought a cheaper, used one, these problems wouldn't be as damning either.
But hey, enjoy the American Dream... - Anomaly100, on 12/21/2008, -0/+3I don't live beyond my means either, but, be careful when you gloat. You never know when an emergency could force a little humble pie down your throat at the worst of times. Some folks have a higher credit limit for many reasons other than what you stated. Medical emergencies for instance.
Try having a little empathy instead of laughing so hard when others are having a difficult time. You would have been a riot during the depression- - DangerCollie, on 12/22/2008, -0/+3Credit card companies are the most vile cartel most people choose to deal with. If they're all using the same language in their contracts...and trust me, it's no accident they all have pretty much the same language in their contracts...then there are no "market forces" at work. You have to play by the cartel's rules or you don't play at all.
Another change I'd suggest is make companies do business by the laws in the state the card is issued. If you don't like the rules in Wisconsin, don't issue cards there. And the same with court venues. If the dispute is in Minnesota, then MN courts have jurisdiction. That would cut down on a lot of the silliness. -
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