What is Digg?206 Comments
- geekee, on 10/22/2007, -11/+216"If they really had those features for years, why haven't we heard about it?"
Because you're an American? - harumph, on 10/12/2007, -10/+100even older phones in japan can do things way beyond our phones. you can pay for things with your cell phone and easily (stress easily) check maps, train schedules and anything else. they operate on a frequency that no other country in the world uses so their phones don't make it elsewhere. the iphone may be impressive but its cost and size relative to its features will make it a tough sell over there. phones come really cheap with plans in japan too.
- dtd00d, on 10/12/2007, -17/+78@MBX1
Did you not see the digg homepage today?
http://digg.com/apple/iPhone_LG_KE850_separated_at_birth
I realize we love Apple, yes they are nice; but really it's not like they invented God. Yet. (Maybe at Macworld 2008?) - mikesbaker, on 10/12/2007, -12/+51@MBX1
because you have your head up your ass. you can get a phone that does everything the iPhone does thats barely bigger than a credit card over there - frem001, on 10/22/2007, -7/+42the only thing the iPhone has going for it is it's ties to iTunes and it's elegant operating system + UI interaction, but in terms of functions Europe and Japan (more japan) have had the same ones for years. I am surprised that Jobs didn't release the device in those markets first (and make it 3G) people there are more used to using such advanced functions, it's kind of like he's not serious about competing with the other manufacturers.
The US doesn't have the infrastructure in place to make use of the technologies that would be possible with this device. The speech that the cingular/at&t guy gave, didn't give me any more confidence that the US could keep up with the rest of the world. the country is too big and as soon as an update comes along for the network they have to update every single hub, just so you can have a video conference. this is not a diss, it's true - imhigh, on 10/19/2007, -6/+35Prepare to be flamed by the thousands of Steve Job sex slaves who frequent this site.
- 1qazxsw2, on 10/12/2007, -6/+34I'm in Korea as we speak. My Samsung Anycall does mp3, gps, television, music videos, email, web browsing, camera - all the ***** that Apple is touting but for only $300 new, no plan - basically free on a $30-40/mo plan. My particular model doesn't have touch screen but most do. The data rates here are wicked fast and dirt cheap. You have your head up your own ass if you think the iPhone is something new and revolutionary.
- scubajim, on 10/22/2007, -5/+26You are wrong. The Japanese have had these things for years. I have sponsored exchange students for years (from Japan) and their phones won't work over here because we don't have the G3 standard. No, they don't have the particular interface Apple created, but their phone has more functions.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+22Rosie O'Donnell is a digg member!
- endekks, on 10/22/2007, -3/+23I've been living in Japan since 2002 and am currently on my 4th ketai (mobile phone). First I had a crappy J-Phone which did have a decent enough camera in it (for 2002) but that was about it. It was still better than any phone I had in the US - or the piece of ***** I was given in Europe when I was working there. Then in 2004 I got a P900i from DoCoMo. The mini web browser was cool enough, though too slow and severely limited for me to actually use. The SWF playback was cool, and it allowed me to custmise my phone in interesting ways, but the service was *****. Then I switched to au with a W21SA, which - form factor-wise - was one of the coolest phones I ever saw. It was straight from the movie "2001: A Space Odyssey", and had GPS in it, which came in very handy. But the antenna wasn't so great so I needed another one. I ended up staying with au - since their coverage is spectacular, and my wife wanted to keep our au family plan - and got a spiffy new W42CA. It's a little bulkier than the W21SA, but it's water proof and shock resistant and has a slew of cool features - like a compass.
I've always been into technology, and there is no doubt that Japan has much better phones than what you can get in the US. But there are several issues which many people who DO NOT LIVE IN JAPAN fail to realise... Firstly, all the cool features are rarely bundled into one phone. My wife's Sony ketai has a great music interface. Mine does not. Mine has a compass and flashlight and better camera. Hers is not water proof or shock resistant. Secondly, many of the features that we all share aren't really all that well thought out or refined. We both can look up web pages with our included "PC browser", but they are so grotesquely limited in what they will display and how they function, that we NEVER use them. My wife will look up train schedules and find restaurants, but that is through the standard mobile interface system - which functions well, but sucks balls. And as far as PDA features are concerned, I don't know ANYONE here who uses them. Not the calendar, or scheduler, or to-do lists, or notes, or anything.
The fact is, Japan does have a high appreciation level for Apple products, and they LOVE innovation in new ketais. Several times a year each of the major mobile companies unveil new models, and they get eaten up constantly - so it is not as if people are married to their phone for an inordinate amount of time. Plans are easily switched and modified, and they JUST made it possible for you to switch carriers and still retain the same number. I doubt they would institute such a change unless it was something which a lot of people wanted.
Also, if you go to http://www.apple.com/jp/ you will see that Apple isn't even making a big deal about the iPhone now, because it WON'T BE OUT HERE UNTIL 2008. People aren't yawning here at the iPhone - because most people here have no idea it exists. Refreshing the top page several times shows that they focus primarily on the new iPod shuffle, iTV - errrr - Apple TV, and MacBook Pros. Nary a mention of the phone. I guess by the article's logic that everyone in the world is yawning at the inclusion of SUICA in some newer phones in Japan. Sure, they don't know what SUICA is, or why it is convenient, but they aren't all crazy and excited about it, so they MUST be yawning.
Now it is true that the iPhone is larger than most phones in Japan - even the crappy grandma TuKa phones. And it is true that overall PDAs don't sell for ***** here. But PCs in the home didn't start selling well until Apple made them "fashionable" again. Digital music players didn't thrive here until Apple introduced the iPod here. Online music stores didn't have success until ITMS came into being. So even though EVERYONE in Japan may not get as excited about the iPhone WHEN IT GETS ANNOUNCED, that doesn't mean that it won't do well.
Article is buried as lame and inaccurate. FUD rules the day, it seems. - wphj, on 10/22/2007, -4/+22frem001 is exactly right. Japan has a different infrastructure, making their phones and services much harder to match.
Look at a map, you'll see what I mean. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -10/+28Its an article lacking HUGE details.
Of the features mentioned you have to choose - do you get one that can be an electronic wallet, or can play music? Not all of the latest phones can do both, or either. The interface for getting music on is slow, clunky and a real PITA. I should know, I have one (KDDI/AU W45T phone if you are interested).
There was alot of interest in my IT office here among the Japanese staff, they thought it was cool. $500? Pff, thats nothing.
I don't know anyone who downloads music on their phone, nor comic books (manga) - data transfers are expensive, and the time and money it takes to download a manga, you could have walked to the nearest 7-11, and just bought the paper version for the same price.
I hate articles like this. - DelSolMan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+18...because South Korea will always be Japan's Canada?
- djSyndrome, on 10/12/2007, -14/+29Except for women's rights, disabled access, non-smoking laws, immigrants' rights, and a host of other things that most westerners take for granted. Nothing important, really.
- rrrampant, on 10/12/2007, -3/+18obviously america's cheap food is really working out
what is it, 70% of america is overweight?
laugh at that - Calypsoaf, on 10/19/2007, -0/+14No suprise, I mean, look how far behind we still are in the "Giant Flying Robot" department.
- djSyndrome, on 10/19/2007, -1/+15I doubt Apple had Japan in mind when they were developing the iPhone - right now it's GSM only (a standard virtually unheard of in Japan).
- mikesbaker, on 10/19/2007, -8/+21uninformed consumers with too much money who believe what ever the TV tells them to believe
- biiscit, on 10/12/2007, -2/+14@superal: Then I guess you haven't seen all of the japanese phones, eh?
- annoia, on 10/12/2007, -0/+11USA != The western world! Europe (at least Denmark) has had 3G for a couple of years now.
- ShrimpCrackers, on 10/12/2007, -1/+12Ah yes, iPhone is great... but does it allow you to watch Live-TV on the subway? Can you play games with nifty graphics that rival the Nintendo DS? Do you get GPS along with Friend-Tracking with it? Could you do video conferencing or send videos to a friend's cellphone instantly? Can you browse the web and order clothes and do almost everything can you do with your PC online? Can you use the touch screen and write in script to friends (& drawing cute sticky pics style in real-time to each other) instead of having to tap at a dull virtual keyboard MMS style? Does it allow you to post in message boards and forums designed specifically for the Japanese market?
So before pointing out the iPhone's nifty but limited features, think again why the Japanese market doesn't really care.
Facts are most of the Japanese phones for Japan aren't covered in many English language sites simply because it doesn't work anywhere else but in Japan. Plus they are generally bigger, and flashy colored. - NoBullet2, on 10/19/2007, -2/+13"To wait for a light on a Tokyo street corner or to ride a train is to see crowds of people with their heads down, thumbs pumping as they send photos, write text messages or play online games on their phones."
Welcome to the anti-social. - aznron911, on 10/19/2007, -9/+19Japan FTW!!!
- Kanna, on 10/12/2007, -5/+15Different culture and customs. Not everyone thinks like an American.
- TheSavageNation, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11@superal1394
"making the relatively tiny Japanese phones very difficult for most Americans to use effectivley,"
While in Japan I actually noticed that the phones were not small at all. They are rather big rectangle flip phones with large screens, but the phones do everything we wish for. - ksoon, on 10/19/2007, -2/+11I've always heard of Japan being way ahead of us in the tech game, but I'm far more curious as to why the US can't be (and isn't) at that same level? It's 2007 and even basic technology is foreign to some people here...
- ch28kid, on 10/19/2007, -3/+12I agree with this article
I've live in Japan for 3 months and iPhone technology such as video / internet / email / mp3 is very common in Japan. I remember watching my cousin streaming live television, ordering movie tickets and surfing the web with their cellphone. Steve Jobs did create something new from a American stand point, but compare to high tech cities like Hong Kong, Taiwan and Tokyo, they are very far behind. I still like the iPhone because it does look very sexy and the touch screen does stand out compare to the phones out in the US and Canada. - xhan104, on 10/19/2007, -2/+11phones in asia have been more advanced for years. Their cameras have more megapixels, they have TV, music, video (and more memory!) everything we've been left out on over here. Some of the high tech stuff is from Nokia, I dont know about you but nokia hasn;t changed since I had my 3210.
- barnis, on 10/19/2007, -3/+12As a resident of Japan I can confirm that a lot of this article is just yeah yeah Japanese is so high tech American ignorance...everyone in America likes to talk about how Japan is leading the way and that the rest of the world is being left behind..people have the image that everyone is buying dinner and movies tickets with their cell phones...this is totally FALSE!
Firt os all the IPHONE announcement was BIG news here and I think will be a radical change for many Japanese. I'm sure when the phone is released here that 3G functionality will be added (since CDMA doesn't really exist here)...my Japanese wife's friend's mixi (much like myspace) pages were full of people talking about how much they want one..and my students were talking too...
Yes people do write a lot of email with their phones and yes maybe people do read certain websites and play games on the trains with their phones...but this is mainly due to the fact that people here ride the train a lot and as a society don't like to talk with strangers (or even friends) in public places like trains...advanced services like TV watching and video calling are really only uses by the bleeding edge due to both consumer ignorance and the ridiculously high cost of cell service here
Many people's phones can be used to enter train stations or buy things but in 1.5 years I have NEVER seen or even heard of anyone who has used this service...I even ask my 20-year old students regularly if they even use their phone to buy a drink at the vending machines down the hall and NONE have.
I think the IPHONE will shake up a very stagnant phone market here and be a BIG hit. - Hirusan, on 10/19/2007, -1/+10I live in Japan and own a Sharp SH901i on a Docomo contract. I wanted to mention that while they are powerful phones and they do many things, they aren't the easiest to use. Let me explain. My phone can,
1. Be and RFID swipe card, a good Camera, a really crappy Internet terminal, an okay email client, a platform for proprietary gaming. I also use it as an alarm clock. And it is capable of playing music(AAC)
But here is where it fails.
I can't sync up my calendar and contacts unless I buy expensive and hard to use syncing software. I also use a mac, and there is no mac version of the music transfer software.
The menus are hard to navigate and the Internet is a joke on that small screen.
I think the iphone would do well here. And I know of many people who would pay good money to be able to Sync everything instantly. - inactive, on 10/19/2007, -4/+12Not only that, but their cell phone bills are DIRT CHEAP compared to ours over here. If they heard what we pay in monthly charges, they'd probably laugh until they cried.
- mikesbaker, on 10/12/2007, -11/+19@superal1394
im not saying I want it... which brings me to my point about the iPhone. I use a brick of a nokia because I can't break it. I mean the iPhone is a woman's device. Meant for a purse. That thing would last a week in my pocket.
also 7:00 central seems like a really strange time to do site maintenance. Is digg US based? - aegis9975, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8Aside from the basics media playback (music and videos), web browsing, etc. . .
Here's an example of what Japan already has:
Sharp TV phone; using terrestrial digital TV broadcast watch TV (on most phones)
http://www.sharp.co.jp/products/905sh/
http://www.itechnews.net/2006/12/08/itusoftbanksharp-911sh-tv-phone-video-preview/
Also most cell phone games in Japan already have PS1 level graphics
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/3186345.stm - atashijp, on 10/19/2007, -1/+8Here is some of the latest phones here in Japan. I know they are all in Japanese, but you will get the idea. They are nowhere near as cool as the iphone. Basically minor upgrades over the years, no suprises really.
Smartphones never really picked up here, people are so damn fast at typing on the ten keys we don't need a QWERTY keyboard, and as it saids in this article, phones have been smart for years. Photos, video, GPS, train tickets, use it to buy things, as a credit card, use it as coupons at shops, without even opening it up, you just place it on the sensor. Music (music video) downloads, full browsers, HTML mails, conference calls, etc etc usually Priced around $200 US. Check for yourself.
SONY ERICSSON
http://www.sonyericsson.co.jp/product/docomo/so903i/premiumav/showcase/index.html
http://www.sonyericsson.co.jp/product/au/w44s/ad/index.html
FUJITSU
http://www.fmworld.net/product/phone/f903i/info.html?fmwfrom=f903i_index
NEC
http://www.n-keitai.com/pickup/n903i/index.html
PANASONIC
http://panasonic.jp/mobile/p903i/index.html
SHARP
http://www.sharp.co.jp/products/sh903i/index.html
The only Made in Japan "Smart phones" on the market
http://www.sharp.co.jp/ws/special/007sh/ - SillyRabbits, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11Why grab a iPhone when you can get something like this? It even has GPS, radio, and will actually run 3rd party software. Oh, and it's already on the market - no vaporware here..... http://www.my-xda.com/doesXdaOrbit.html
- mikesbaker, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11i laugh about how much they pay for food
- UGM2099, on 10/19/2007, -0/+6Thanks for pointing out how primitive our phones are in America. My phone is about as smart as a retarded tiger.
- rcomegys, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9I agree, I have a top of the line Japanese phone, but I'm chomping at the bit to buy an iPhone, but we won't have it for a while now. It's about how easy it is to use, how accessible it is. Sure, I can watch TV on my phone and get 3d walking directions around major cities... but it's just not as smooth and slick. You can get a cheap/old mp3 player that has the same functionality as an iPod, and it's just nowhere near as sleek and well thought out. As with the iPod, I'm sure we'll hold the iPhone in our hand and when we want to do something, it'll be obvious how to do it.
- yeahbuddy, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8I don't get it. I do all these things on my PPC-6700 on the Sprint network.
Nothing to see here. Move along folks... - Nogger, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6The have the laundry list of features, but Apple does not want to have the longest feature list. Apple seems to have created a phone interface that does not suck. That would be a first to the market.
- Morky, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Steve Jobs said EXPLICITLY during the keynote that they will be putting 3G in these phones, just not in the first generation. Do you really think they would leave that out when trying to enter the Japanese market in 2008? The US cell phone infrastructure sucks, but this phone is better than anything out there in any market. The Japanese won't yawn at it when they see it in stores.
- tkcom, on 10/19/2007, -0/+6What if Apple decide to be their own carrier and be the first to roll out 3G in North America? Then I can hear the sound of old-world carriers crumbling down from not-so-distance future.
- laplacian, on 10/12/2007, -9/+14I hate apple fanboys as much as the next guy, but this article misses the point of what's revolutionary about the iphone. it has nothing to do with searching the web, listening to mp3s, or watching videos. It has to do with its design and its interface. Nothing in Japan has multi-touch, inertial sensors for screen orientation, proximity sensors for illumination, and os x. The combination of these features simply didnt exist before the iphone. I should know, I recently purchased a Japanese phone and all my friends buy the latest imports as well.
- NoBullet2, on 10/19/2007, -1/+6@Kaz
Uhhhh..Steve Sasson, an engineer at Eastman Kodak (American) invented the digital camera in 1972. . The first commercially available digital camera was the 1991 Kodak DCS-100.
Go compare the list of american/japanese notable inventors. You'll see how small a list Japan has. Heck Japan even tried to study the US wondering why so many inventions came from the US. Stop weabooing. - barnis, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7this is SOOOOOO wrong...I have 20-year-old students here in Japan that are paying like $300/month for cell service.
Most place are something like $50 for 150 minutes of calling (and incoming calls are NOT free) data charges are even more ridiculously over-priced...but at least there's no contract here and phones are relatively cheap - coopa, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7I cannot see what the Iphone has going for it, the phone i recently upgraded to here in UK is a great music player, has a fairly good phone camera, came with a memory stick (only 1gb but i can upgrade it quite cheaply) and the cable/software needed to hook it upto my pc to transfer files. And it's 3G compatible...though not fully 3G :
The next model up and at least one other model here has touch screen and they're supposed to be quite temperamental, especially when dropped a few times - I have a tendency to drop mine a lot.
And it cost me £40, as i was upgrading a month early, though to buy 2nd hand i;ve seen it for £300 now. - thedzyan, on 10/19/2007, -2/+7South Korea also has phones way ahead of ours also. Why does everyone always give the love to Japan. And who makes a lot of the chips in the ipod? Samsung, a korean company. They're right up there with Japan in terms of innovation and technology.
I read an article in Business 2.0 about the services they have. Things like buddy finders taht show where your friends are in the city. And the cameras are 5 or 6 megapixel unlike the US ones that seem to be 2 to 3. If our country was that tiny we'd be able to have those types of things too. - ybfree, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5But if they are text-messaging are they anti-social? But isn't being on Digg a little anti-social? *ducks*
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8Most Americans have no concept as to what the rest of the world is like.
Sorry to inform you, but the US of A is no longer the leader in technology.
Japan has had this ***** for years.
Hell, we're hardly past the 10 mbps broadband mark while they've been basking in 30-40 mbps connections for quite some time.
Blame greedy corporations for that. Too busy trying to nickel and dime people instead of making worthwhile innovations and achievements. - goodoldharris, on 10/12/2007, -6/+11NOTHING like the iPhone exists in Japan. Not even close. I also have the most recent and top end docomo F903iX. Sure, you can watch TV, listen to music, and send (docomo) email. All these things miss the point. The LA Times article entirely misses the point too.
1. The OS running on keitais in Japan are not a full fledged OS. Third party software is required for any syncing to a PC or Mac, and in my experience is a pain in the ass to use, and provides very limited functionality. This doesn't bother most Japanese consumers for the same reason it doesn't bother 95% of mobile phone owners in the US - they couldn't care less about "syncing".
2. The user interface and firmware/software running in Japanese phones suck just like in the US. Jobs in the keynote said this himself and his criticism applies just as much to phones here in Japan. The layouts and menus are inefficient, ugly, and make poor use of the screen (which, BTW, is nowhere near as nice is the screen that will be on the iPhone). 95% of the owners of these phones don't even look at their phones PDA-like features because of the bad interface and bad usability, let alone bother to try and use them. But again, how many people consciously care about interface details? Truth is, most people in Japan, just like most people in the US, have no real idea what an interface is.
3. The touch screen interface does not exist. Nothing like it. The phones here use the same ***** phone keyboard used everywhere else. (SMS has taken off here despite the keyboard limitations. The main reason for this is that Japanese words contain far fewer letters than English, ie. the same sentence can be typed in Japanese with far fewer keystrokes, and hence the crippled keyboard is not as much of a barrier to typing Japanese as it is to typing English.)
4. There is no phone here with a screen like the iPhone. They are crappy little screens.
5. Japanese mainly use their phones to take pictures and send email. But the email Japanese people use on these phones not web email. It's an address attached to their phone, ie. docomo mail. For many of them, that's their primary email so that's fine. But access to web mail is a completely different thing and not a common function of phones here.
6. Web-browsing on my latest and greatest docomo phone SUCKS. It shows me only crippled hobbled versions of web pages.
I could go on. The point is that nothing like the iPhone exists here. The reason 95% of Japanese consumers are unimpressed is the same reason 95% of US consumers are unimpressed - they're not tech nerds and they don't give a ***** about the OS, software, or user interfaces. They're not itching to sync their contacts, calendars, and other info between their mac/pc and their phone. They don't want a PDA - they write their schedule in a paper diary with pen. With their phone, they just want to take photos and talk and SMS their friends.
But what about the people that care about the OS and the user interface? Who get annoyed when they have to go through 6 steps to delete a single message? And want to use web email and see full-blown web pages on their phone? And want to run OS X apps on their phone? And who want to sync information between their phone and computer? Plenty of these people are here too.
Here's a video of the line up at the first Apple store to open in Japan a few years ago: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TyR3fyLO_I
I'll bet a new iPhone that when the iPhone is released in Japan in 2008 you'll see another line like that. -
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