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213 Comments
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+43Nah, Google is a search engine.
- TonyCubed, on 10/12/2007, -3/+27Thing is though. Microsoft might get IPTV out of the door first. They have the hardware on the market (PC's with Media Center and Xbox360's). Let's hope we all win! :D
But come on, you must admit. This year is going to be quite different from any other Microsoft year. Basically everything they have been doing over the past few years is coming out this year! - Speed, on 10/12/2007, -1/+24broomet, many people use Google Maps and Gmail, including myself. And love them both.
- geoken, on 10/12/2007, -20/+41Microsoft may have a long way to catch up with iTunes, but Apple has just as much catching up to do on the hardware side with the 360 already claiming over 10 million units sold.
As for user freindly software, MS has shown with Media Centre that they are able to compete with Apple when they want to. - iching, on 10/12/2007, -1/+15The battle is good for the consumer in the next revolution of home media.
It will be interesting to see what Steve will bring to the table tomorrow.
I think the home server is a great idea for home media and maybe one day it could also address other aspects of the home such as energy consumption, but that would require either new wireless connections, interface abilities and thinking.
The growing use of solar panels and fuel cells in the home are growing worldwide, ie.Japan, in which a home server could grow in its role limited now to just thinking it is a media function. - Terc, on 10/12/2007, -35/+48Microsoft will lose this. Apple has practically already won over the home media market. With iTunes being the long standing leader in online music sales and with movies following in the wake, Microsoft has a long way to go to catch up.
Why will Apple win?
Their DRM is nearly transparent (though I still hate the fact that it exists)
Their software is user friendly, and works on install instead of needing complicated setup.
Apple is "cool" right now, and the next few years will decide the leader in home media devices. - giddytonk, on 10/12/2007, -1/+13I like Apple, but frankly MS already has it's foot in the door in a big way with the Xbox 360. As soon as Hank the Halo gamer figures out he can download movies instead of going to Blockbuster or Netflix it's gonna be the rage.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12Geek wars!
- ramdaffe, on 10/12/2007, -5/+14it's IPTV vs. iTV...
...and CES vs. MacWorld...
let's see who can innovate better! - xuanyan, on 10/12/2007, -5/+14Did anyone else notice that the guy from Ford mentioned the iPod right in the middle of the Microsoft keynote? I bet Bill was pissed.
- KSUdesigner, on 10/12/2007, -10/+19"Microsoft may have a long way to catch up with iTunes, but Apple has just as much catching up to do on the hardware side with the 360 already claiming over 10 million units sold."
I disagree. The way the 360 is marketed at the moment, people don't look to it as a home media solution. Most people see it as a gaming device and that's it. Now if the marketing department at MS gets off their asses and markets the thing as a gaming device AND media center, then they may have something. Until they do that, it's just a gaming machine and isn't a big factor in the Apple vs. MS debate, IMO. - 1021, on 10/12/2007, -6/+14little too harsh but yes, that keynote was bad.
- ibolt, on 10/12/2007, -6/+14I don't think Apple has the strongest position on the Home Media Market, but I do think they can get it. If they focus on this they can probably do a hell of a better job, and maybe they already have. We will see tomorrow.
- djSyndrome, on 10/12/2007, -4/+12Better question for Broomett: do you have a Zune? No? I didn't think so.
- allanpat, on 10/12/2007, -3/+11"Now if the marketing department at MS gets off their asses and markets the thing as a gaming device AND media center, then they may have something."
You're totally right. The average consumer has no idea that the XBox is anything other than a video game system. As of now, I guarantee that someone with no interest in video games would even remotely consider buying an XBox as a digital media center. It'll need significant rebranding to overcome that hurdle.
iTV, however, is straight to the point, and consumers will understand it. - GraceMolloy, on 10/12/2007, -3/+11I agree Apple is the mountain which Microsoft must climb, but that Xbox 360 integration into Media Center is one damn powerful set of rocket propelled climbin' shoes. [Al-La Spock from Star Trek V]
- Speed, on 10/12/2007, -11/+19Terc, Microsoft is NOT behind. Don't belive me? Look at market share of Windows vs. market share of MacOS. How many people have Microsoft products but no Apple products vs. how many have Apple products but not Microsoft products. Total number of people with Microsoft products vs. total number of people with
Apple products. I know I'm going to be dugg down for my statement, because Digg is an Apple fanboy site. Not saying it to be mean, but it's true. The bulk of the users are blind Apple users or blind Microsoft haters. - TheAkolyte, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10So a universal remote that will REALLY piss you off when you lose it?
- flashboy131, on 10/12/2007, -7/+14I agree Apple is ahead right now, but they shouldn't rest on the lead they have. They need to gain market share with more entry points for PC owners, like how they did with the iPod and iTunes.
lack of a serious gaming angle has always slowed Apple against MS. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7next thing rocky will be doing is underground fights in his nursing home
- mandarin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6What sells now doesnt mean will sell tomorrow.
Compare PS3 and WII. Who would have thought Nintendo had a chance against Sony? - dognose, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7I do believe Google also has the lead in contextually targeted Ads with AdSense. Just look at the ads on this page! It's almost 1/2 their profits.
It's quite a myth that Google is ONLY good at search. - firemillen2, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8Go Bill Go !!!! Smack these kool-aid drinking iFanboys back to 1984.
- deadbaby, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7It's going to be an interesting battle. I'd love to see the market share split 50/50 so competition improves both companies products. I think the 360 has been a successful product mostly because Microsoft has to fight so hard with Sony & Nintendo. If Apple starts feeling the pressure from Microsoft they will be forced to make even better products. I doubt any one company will dominate however. Those days are over. (and yes, the iPod dominates but that's mostly because Microsoft totally missed the boat on it. They won't make that mistake again)
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9why isnt this in the Microsoft section on digg........ :)
- DarkSideofMoon, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7@zybch
"Now Jobby boy would be pissed if the same thing happened to him but 'zune' was said in the middle of one of his slick but content free presentations!"
The hell? The great thing about Jobs' presentations is that he *actually* shows products! Unlike most of Gates' presentation yesterday which was full of 'great things to come! second half of 2007! in the pipeline!', Jobs' presentations usually reveals the product at the show. He delivers on entertainment and on his products. - ArizonaKid, on 10/12/2007, -6/+10The title would have been accurate 15 years ago. Microsoft's size pretty much puts Bill Gates in the winner's chair for, perhaps, the rest of his life.
I have to say I think Bill Gates just likes being on stage for tech related events. Bill Gates already won the war many times over, and he even stated on stage his interest are going elsewhere...elsewhere being charity and helping alleviate infectious diseases. But this is already old news. - MrMcGuire, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Bill's keynote was pretty interesting. A lot of the technologies he showed made me think of some of the movies done in the 80's and 90's showing 'what the future will be like'. No flying cars yet, but I think Microsoft may have a clearer view of Technology in the future than we think. For now, a lot of it doesn't seem practical, but I can definitely see some of this tech coming into fruition when the cost to build it subsides.
Vista looks extremely polished and seems like it will take Windows up quite a few steps from XP (at least from what I've seen in the developments of security, ease of use, searchability). I haven't done any beta testing, so I can't really boast it's successes. What I will say is that it looks like a promising future for Windows users. I have had an excellent experience with XP and can't wait to try use Vista.
Their live services seem to be pretty well thought out. I like the idea of being able to play with xbox users from my PC. Hopefully they get more games than UNO (haha). Their map services look like they work just as well as Google's, but I don't think I'll be making the switch in that realm. I've had hotmail for years, so I do use Windows live mail which works pretty nicely. Although, I've been most impressed with Yahoo's mail as of late!
Whether or not Microsoft can really make this all connected experience between all of these realms is something else entirely. That's quite a lot of forefronts for one company to compete on much less dominate.
I look forward to seeing what Apple and indeed everyone in this market brings to the table in this realm. If it can be done by one company, it will be great for everyone! But don't put it past Microsoft to become a competitor. Money can't buy everything (like user trust and devotion), but it can sure buy a lot. In the end, it's up to us to decide what the best product is. We all already know that the consumer is going to come out the winner in the end no matter what, so let's sit back and enjoy the ride. - fallenone05, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5LET THE WAR BEGIN! I HAVE MY RIGHT CLICKING MOUSES READY! LET'S GET THOSE MAC HIPSTERS! FREEEEDOOOOM!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7thanks for proving my point djSyndrome
the majority of people have iPods in this country. Probably half of Digg users have iPods. How many people rushed out to get a Zune? Not enough to compete with Apple. - Doughboy, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5In the demos (at least the ones I saw) they didn't really elaborate or get into much detail how easy it is to run and setup. It basically boiled down to some guy saying how iPTV is the greatest thing and not really showing how it fully works other than 30 seconds of changing channels, or accepting a Gears of War invite (which was also pretty vague). I expect Steve Jobs to go into much more detail how Apple's system will work when it is announced.
How much do you wanna bet that all this stuff is going to be a big mess with interopability problems and a lack of consistency between Vista, 360 and whatever else they got (eg. Zune). Let's say as an example... You purchase an HD movie directly off the Xbox 360 an watch it there but you won't be able to view it on an Xbox 360 elsewhere in the house or on a Vista PC. What about a Zune?. What if you download HD content onto Vista to watch on the 360 as an extender - now the difference is that you will require your Vista PC to be on where the previous way didn't. And with IPTV, will PVR recordings set on a 360 be able to be viewed on a Zune or Vista PC? Can everything be stored and shared on the new Windows Home Server and solve all of the preceding issues?
The above will be too much for the average consumer to grasp.
Another thing that nobody has mentioned... it is common knowlege that the Xbox 360 runs very hot! Now how about having it run 24x7? Is the 360 designed for this much use in an environment where a regular set top box will live?
The 10 Million + Xbox 360 units sold is meaningless. Everyone that bought one used it to play games! Only a small fraction of current owners will use it for IPTV. Same argument is used against Sony PS3 and BlueRay so why not apply here? - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5broomett, it is not that Apple has "failed" against Microsoft is the OS war, but rather the "stubbornness" of Apple not wanting to license OS X on computers other than the ones they make. There ARE a lot of interest in OS X, but people are not willing to pay for Apple machines. If only Apple would license OS X on normal PC, I am definitely sure the marketshare of Apple will improve dramatically, or even surpass Windows uptake. As long as Jobs kept being stubborn about not licensing OS X, Apple computers will remain being the minority.
- zdiggler, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I don't like Microsoft either. I hate apple because of fan boys.
I like PC because so many hardware choices.
Actually when MS make something good for PC market, its actually good for economy across the board, Asus, De ll, HP, iBuypower, NewEgg, Nvidia, ATI, Abit, MSI, Acer, there are thousands of companies out there etc. Even the Linux community get benefit form it. The coder geeks can work on new hardware to work with linux which lead to better linux etc.
When apple make something good only Apple and manufactures for apple make the money. - Reno582, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5Well its a Rental Service, and other than that, the movies on Live are much much higher quality then any itune-bought movie.
- danielwsmithee, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3That is because the only thing you can put them on currently is an iPod. The second iTV is released their entire collection will be available in HD.
- mabhatter, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3i don't think Apple is that far behind Microsoft. According to Wikipedia (before holiday sales!) they have sold 67 million ipods in roughly the same time MS has sold Xboxes... they've sold nearly 9 million in the single quarter before Christmas this year... considering the average iPod price (over it's life) is probably between $200 and $300 they're making money hand over fist compared to Microsoft in the entertainment division... considering MS LOST $5Billion in the same time frame. The target price for iTV was going to be $299... slightly more than an iPod and less than a Xbox setup. I'd say they're still in the fight
- KSUdesigner, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4"Most people don't know about Xbox's media capabilities? What a lame argument.
Xboxes are known for being modded for all purposes. People use them and playstations for DVD players. You can buy a damn TV remote for the thing."
No, they are not known for being modded, not to the general public. You are talking about GAMERS here, the whole digital living room is about EVERYBODY, not just gamers. Yes the gamers know this stuff already, but everybody else does not. Most people do not just go out and buy an xbox or playstation to use as a DVD player...they buy them FIRST AND FOREMOST AS A GAMING DEVICE. I don't get why people can't understand this. You ask any schmuck on the street who has never touched a 360 in their life and I'll guarantee you that they have absolutely no clue about the machine's capabilities outside of gaming.
"Most people don't know Apple is making iTV, and even when it's out, most people still won't know."
I SERIOUSLY doubt that. People may not know now, but Apple has one hell of a marketing team and you can bet those ads will be plastered ALL OVER primetime television. I don't know how you even thought that was a logical statement. Apple is no longer the quiet little company it once was. They are very much in the spotlight right now and many people are paying attention.
"Oh wait, I forgot I'm not allowed to hold Apple in anything but the highest reverence lest I be Dugg down, blocked, or responded to with some card carrying argument."
Comments like that are annoying as hell. Anybody is free to have their opinion on anything, however you need to realize that there is ALWAYS an opposing opinion to yours. I'm not saying Apple is going to win this war, because there's a damn good chance that they won't. I DO think that the 360 has much better potential than Apple does at this point, providing that Microsoft's marketing team can get the word out to the general public that the 360 is capable of so much more than gaming. XBOX has ALWAYS been synonymous with video games and they're going to have a damn hard time breaking away from that. Cost will be a factor too...if Apple can produce something much cheaper than the XBOX with just as many features (minus gaming obviously) the general public may just go for it. There are (probably) more non-gamers in the world than there are gamers and those people couldn't give a ***** if their media center can also play the latest version of Halo. - pabloD, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3lmao @ "content free"
Darkside ftw. - axiomflash, on 10/12/2007, -7/+10i think a lot of people dont realize the potential for the new devices to replace existing ones. i have seen everyone from technies on digg to electronics ceo's saying "There isn't a market for more devices for televisions." And while I totally agree, a device like the iTV could easily begin to replace other input devices. it could be the one box to unite them all. i would buy an itv if it lets me get rid of my dvd player. im willing to bet it will do a lot more than that as itunes and other subscriptions services advance.
- consonance, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5@winnch
>iTunes, iPod, and iTV all work great with a PC, so you're dead wrong there. As for your second point, Microsoft software doesn't simply
>run on hardware made by different companies. All those companies MUST use Windows for their software to run. So you're actually
>making the wrong point.
iTV isn't out yet, and details about if are fuzzy. We don't even know if it will work with PCs. Second, PCs are built around several form factors: The older AT standard, the common ATX standard, and the newer BTX standard. Microsoft Windows will run on these standards. (I don't think Windows Vista will run on AT hardware, however.) I'm not really sure what the argument is about. It's not like form factors were developed around Windows.
>And I know more and more people who are interested in a real digital lifestyle, and the Mac is becoming the only game in town. Apple
>knows how to do it, they have a clear strategy.
You're saying that Apple will have a monopoly on the "digital lifestyle," whatever that is? Are you talking about music and movie producers? There are plenty of entertainment professionals on both sides of the aisle who prefer Windows or Apple OS. You're a fool if you think that Apple is getting a stranglehold on media producers.
>Microsoft's strategy is always to get in a game late, throw together their technology, and then try to push out innovation and competition.
>It's worked before. But as we're seeing, that strategy is awfully suited for convergence because it lacks the key ingredients of success.
Over generalizations like that show a lack of depth of analysis and research.
>Sony exploded in the 80s and prospered for decades and grew explosively because it created an early "lifestyle" around CE. Expect the
>same for Apple.
Enlighten me: What does CE stand for?Is that a brand name? I Googled "Sony CE," and I came up with nothing. Not even Wikipedia mentions this Sony CE. Does it stand for "customer experience"? Honestly, I really don't think you know what you're talking about here. - SilverhammerMBA, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Maybe I'm crazy, but I don't need or want a device that connects my computer, tv, car, mp3 player, vacuum cleaner, bathrobe etc. It seems like each new "time saving" device nowadays just brings with just as many problems as it fixes. Plus integrating technology like this will remain flawed and incomplete until the technology market becomes more standardized. Right now there are so many different kinds of formats, operating systems, and connections that buying one of these "all in one" devices often requires that you repurchase half of your existing hardware in compatible forms.
All of this "innovating" stuff is crap in my opinion. Until someone actually thinks of real innovation (rather than just cramming as much technological crap as possible into one device), I'd prefer better, more streamlined versions of currently existing technology. - danielwsmithee, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Your comment reminds me of the fiasco that Microsoft created with plays4sure and Zune Marketplace. One would think that two Microsoft products that do the same thing would be somewhat inter-operable!
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8"a real digital lifestyle?" please spare me the mindless marketing *****, thank you. What Speed is saying is it's not just Apple vs. Microsoft, because Apple has positioned themselves as the sole hardware provider for their systems. Hardware wise, it's Apple vs. Everyone Else. It's not iTV vs. 360 (which is already unwinnable for apple), it's iTV vs. Linksys and Gateway and Sony and Dell and anyone else who is interested in producing hardware for one's living room. Apple hasn't always made the wisest business decisions, and I'm sorry to say that iTV is just another poor decision.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3you got to give Microsoft their props... they sure now how to name their consumer products to maximize their sexiness. Microsoft Home Server. That'll make all the hip young housewives rush to best buy.
- riceguitar, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Microsoft invites hardware manufacturers into the picture. Apple kicks them out. Apple's stuff is much cooler. Microsoft's is clunky. I think the winner will be whoever can pull the most companies onto its band wagon.
- bleutuna, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4I like Microsoft and I like their products. Not an MS fanboys, are there are Apple fanboys, but when it comes down to it, I prefer MS over Apple. If I didn't already have an iPod, I'd get a Zune instead. Though, I'll admit that iTunes is a much better piece of for managing music and video than WMP. WMP is a great player, but its number one focus isn't organization. iTunes seems to be built, from the ground up, as an organization tool with player capabilities.
Oh, and I'll say it again - Apple should release FinalCut for PC. They'd kill. - captjc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@consonance
CE = Consumer Electronics (e.g VCRs, stereos, game consoles, DVD Players, TVs, Walkmans, Discmans, etc) as in CES
Sony is and will probably always be a Consumer Electronics company. Just like Microsoft is and will probably always be a software company. - Terc, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5I'm glad to see I've sparked a little conversation. Arguments on both sides have some good points, but I think it's Apple's seamless integration between hardware and software combined with ease of use that will always give them the edge. Their huge market lead can never hurt though. I can tell you one thing I've learned as a network admin, people always want the simple, familiar answer. In thinking "I want to listen to music on the go" they are familiar with an iPod (Assuming of course, they didn't just think "I want an iPod" first. Next step is "how do I put my music on it?" They most likely have heard of iTunes. Finally, "How do I get new music?" They know (or a friend tells them) about buying music/videos on iTunes. What it boils down to is this: lot of non-tech savvy people know what an iPod is, what iTunes is, and that they can get music for their iPod from iTunes. A much smaller percentage of people have ever heard of a "Zune" or "Urge" (I had to search for the name of Microsoft's online music store myself)
- nicheplayer, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4"They won't make that mistake again."
Tee hee. Ya think? - Neorio, on 10/12/2007, -6/+8Is it just me, or does Bill Gates make absolutely NO sense at all everytime he opens his mouth?
It seems that all he does is spout buzzwords in interviews and in conferences, and I doubt anyone has any idea what he raves on about. -
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