What is Digg?216 Comments
- roxya, on 10/11/2007, -14/+84legit backups
lol :) good one - CLShortFuse, on 10/11/2007, -10/+75If anything had a bug, it'd be the hacked firmware. Microsoft exploited a one a hacker's bug/hole and was able to ban modders.
And the title is sorta inaccurate. They didn't get around the banning. If you're banned, you're banned. That's it. They got around the ban detection, yes.
It's a cat & mouse game, hackers are in the lead now, but don't think Microsoft is going to twiddle their thumbs, especially with Halo 3 around the corner.
I personally don't care for the Live Gold package, but Microsoft should at least let banned people buy downloadable content - chris9902, on 10/11/2007, -28/+90because you "back up your game because you don't want to damage the original". That's right isn't it?
If you're going to steal games at least man up and say that instead of using the oldest excuse in the book. - roosterjm2k2, on 10/11/2007, -37/+89MS Will fix it.
The whole banning deal this time around was executed perfectly. Did they catch everyone? Of Course not...but how they did it was the best plan I've seen come from MS in a long time.
Instead of just catching individuals and banning them immediately, they data mined for a while. They waited till they had a huge list of offenders, and dumped them all at once (relatively...over the span of a day or two). 2 Of my buddies on XBL were banned, and they hadn't actually turned their boxes on in more than a month. If MS had just been banning all along, it wouldnt take long for modders to fix the problem (ex. this article), and relatively simply since it would just be a matter of getting another console each time ... which isnt a big deal to the mod producers.. Then its just one at a time... This way, they can say "hey, I'm signed in, it works!" and now you're flagged by MS ... and whenever they decide to do their next round of dumps, you'll be history to.
Good riddance to bad garbage.
Mod if you want, but stay off of XBL. Cheating *****, and lazy thieving ***** don't get the full experience anymore, too bad. Play fair, buy the game, and enjoy it with the rest of us, or enjoy single player mode... - Flynnz, on 10/11/2007, -12/+53yeah cause that's what most people have ..legit back ups.
I agree if you have kids or what not, its nice to have the ability to make back ups. But we all know that 99% of the people who mod their machines don't buy ANY games at all. - mrASSMAN, on 10/11/2007, -5/+36No.. you can play all original xbox games that are --supported-- by 360.. nothing has changed there.
Title is somewhat inaccurate.. from what I've heard, this won't unban currently banned people, it will only prevent people from getting banned (like myself). - chris9902, on 10/11/2007, -14/+43you mean like their Disk Replacement Program?
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/support/systemuse/xbox360/gameplay/discreplacement-program.htm - condorhauck, on 10/11/2007, -2/+27@ Agret
Yeah, you actually can modify game content, at least you could on the XBOX. I don't know if anyone has yet with the 360, but it will eventually happen.
A hex editor made warthogs fly on Halo 2, guns that looked like pistols would fire rockets, people could run across the map like Spartans on crystal meth. If you were playing on your console only, you could even play with custom textures, so containment could be volcanoes instead of snow capped mountains.
It was kinda cool to look at and tinker with, but using against people playing legitimately on XBL became a big problem and caused a lot of people (self included) to quit playing H2 on-line in matchmaking. Once you have control of the system you can do a lot of things to it. Not just play "backups" *cough* of your games. - jshadow, on 10/11/2007, -8/+33Too bad the disc replacement program is only for MS titles. My three year old got ahold of my Oblivion and now I have to pay $20 plus shipping to get it replaced.
- TheCheeks, on 10/11/2007, -2/+26fool proof?
- shit, on 10/11/2007, -3/+25What a fullish comment.
- mrASSMAN, on 10/11/2007, -14/+35holy *****! You people have a difficult time understanding. I will repeat it again though and hopefully the same topic won't come up continuously.
THIS HAS _NOTHING_ TO DO WITH CHEATING! The bans were made for people who had modified firmware, there is no hack that will currently let you cheat online. If someone cheats, it's because the game was released with unpatched bugs and people exploit them, they don't need a hacked xbox to do so. - Sektor, on 10/11/2007, -5/+24If someone modified their game then it would be detectable and they would risk being banned. This shouldn't really help cheats but it will help pirates.
- nattybohman, on 10/11/2007, -13/+31I'm all for banning modded xbox live accounts. Cheaters can ruin a great game.
However, stating that there is NO reason for backups is not true. As a father of a toddler and a ten month old, I've had several discs scratched and you can't teach a ten month old not to scratch a DVD. You can make sure you put the discs away in a high place each time, but I've slipped up before.
I'd love a disc replacement program for all titles, not just first party. It should be free other than shipping. (DVD's only cost me 20 cents, I'm sure MS gets a better deal)
This would take away any excuse for backups.
That said, if banning modded 360s keeps cheaters out of my games. I'm all for it.
Even if it means I have to pay full price for replacements of the odd toddler scratched game. - Bara, on 10/11/2007, -24/+41Meh, I don't see how this is a good thing at all. I'm all for cheating in single player games just to mess around and see the odd glitch or secret, but doing it for online play and making it frustrating for everyone but yourself? Come on now... we don't need to support this kind of crap.
- davidrools, on 10/11/2007, -11/+28@chris
They charge $20 to replace your damaged disc. Did you read the link you posted? - D1PHAM, on 10/11/2007, -1/+17Nope...if you are banned you are banned.... :(
- LaSepultura, on 10/11/2007, -20/+34Just keep your cheating out of my Xbox Live games.
- aggies11, on 10/11/2007, -7/+20Re: Flynz
"But we all know that 99% of the people who mod their machines don't buy ANY games at all."
Yes, and 95% of all statistics about "piracy" are pulled out of someone's ass right there on the spot.
Aggies - noogiewoo, on 10/11/2007, -9/+21cheating isn't even currently possible on the 360.
- g33b33, on 10/11/2007, -1/+13@bersh31
no it doesnt. You lie like a cheap watch. - rderveloy, on 10/11/2007, -3/+15@ThE0eNiGmA
"Not speaking from experience with a hacked xbox, but why should it matter to you if other xboxes are hacked/modded? From what I understand there is no "cheating" involved, nothing to do with altering game data. It is more to do with getting the console to do things you MS doesn't want you to do, like running things like XMBC or playing backups of games, or by modifying it's existing hardware, such as putting in a bigger hard drive. How is this "cheating?" It is almost like saying upgrading your computer with a bigger hard drive and putting some non microsoft software on a Windows computer and then playing online is cheating. Almost. If anything, from what I hear modding an Xbox typically has little to do with Live, and the majority of the time (can't say all) there is no intention of unevening the playing field. "
This isn't about adding hardware (aka a bigger hard drive), it's modifying the firmware. The firmware, on a very simplified level, basically acts like the operating system for the machine. From Microsoft's standpoint, once you change the firmware to something that Microsoft hasn't come up with, then it's impossible for them to tell weather or not you did so for relatively innocent (playing purchased imported games) or nefarious (cheating) purposes. To be safe, they take a chemo therapy approach in which they go after everyone with modified firmware. Yes, it's not fair to those who don't cheat. However, given the results Microsoft's relatively lax banning practice of last gen, I personally applaud the new method and Xbox Live is a much more level playing field because of it. - g33b33, on 10/11/2007, -11/+22What has this got to do with cheating online? Do you even know what the modded 360s can do?
- g33b33, on 10/11/2007, -1/+12@bersh31
You lie again...is it compulsive?
Once you are banned you are BANNED. Get a new console is the only answer. This fw is for people who havent been banned yet to hopefully avoid being so.
http://forums.xbox-scene.com/index.php?showtopic=605805# - joper90, on 10/11/2007, -5/+15@noogiewoo - wrong.. it is possible.. google Gear of war and ini file..
- chris9902, on 10/11/2007, -17/+27The argument is water thin. The only people who want "backups" are those that don't buy the originals. you know it, I know it and they know it.
- webguru, on 10/11/2007, -4/+13The "to prevent cheating" statements that Microsoft makes to ban these consoles is just a trick to justify the fact that they ban these consoles because of piracy. It's all about piracy, let's be honest here.
I don't know of any Xbox360 hacking sites that would create hacks for online game play. If you do a Google search for it nothing comes up. This means there are only a few people that know to cheat, if that's even possible in these games because a lot can be detected server-side.
Also, I think it's a good thing these firmwares are created. It indirectly helps MS in preventing future mistakes or loopholes in the security of their consoles. It supports piracy, yes, but I think that if you want to pirate copies for your 360 you will make sure the console can be cracked first anyway. - ThE0eNiGmA, on 10/11/2007, -15/+24@ roosterjim
Not speaking from experience with a hacked xbox, but why should it matter to you if other xboxes are hacked/modded? From what I understand there is no "cheating" involved, nothing to do with altering game data. It is more to do with getting the console to do things you MS doesn't want you to do, like running things like XMBC or playing backups of games, or by modifying it's existing hardware, such as putting in a bigger hard drive. How is this "cheating?" It is almost like saying upgrading your computer with a bigger hard drive and putting some non microsoft software on a Windows computer and then playing online is cheating. Almost. If anything, from what I hear modding an Xbox typically has little to do with Live, and the majority of the time (can't say all) there is no intention of unevening the playing field. - misterB1138, on 10/11/2007, -16/+25If MS were to offer a scheme where by you returned a faulty disk to a store and the disk was swapped for a new one no questions asked, would this nullify the backup argument
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10It's interesting to see how modding anything is always a hot topic. Personally I stand in the middle, first I truly believe you should buy your games. Would be nice to see those who put hard long hours get paid for there work. Second, I believe you have the right to do whatever you want with the hardware/software you purchased, you paid for it do whatever the hell you want with it.
Example I have an Xbox modded with a 250 Gig HD in it. Do I copy games to it? Hell yes. Did I pirate those games? Not a single one. Why mod the Xbox if I buy my games? Simple, I HATE load times, and living in a rather modest apartment (a tiny ***** shack) I keep many of my unused items at my parent’s house an hour away from me. (not just my games) so finding a game to play at times is a bit annoying seeing I’m not well organized, (place is a mess) I also like watching videos and streaming shoutcast to my Xbox. There are other things I use my Xbox for, but you get the idea.
I also have an Xbox360 (it's so Shiny) is it modded? Nope, No need to mod it yet. I haven't found any applications for it that would make me say ok, lets mod this bugger.
So are all modders cheaters and thieves? No. and to lump them ALL together like that is unfair. Do many modders rip off the games they play? Sadly yes.
Many age nest modding say "there is no legit use for modding" "It's just for cheats and thieves"
I don't believe that’s true,
So please pay for your games, and Do mod your gear. Do what lets YOU enjoy your system.
So you know I am a programmer. So that next game you DL and don't pay for could be taking money from my paycheck.
/opinion - GravitySpec, on 10/11/2007, -13/+22@chris9902
"because you "back up your game because you don't want to damage the original". That's right isn't it?
If you're going to steal games at least man up and say that instead of using the oldest excuse in the book."
Honestly, I couldn't be happier when I modded my old Xbox... it breathed new life into it. I now watch videos that are on my local network through it on my TV so I don't have to sit at my computer to watch everything. I also like being able to rip my games to the hard drive inside so I could simply turn on the box, pick a game and start playing without having to shuffle through my mountain of discs looking for my game of choice. - triPzZz, on 10/11/2007, -0/+9Anybody who uses an exploit to cheat / hack on Xbox Live or any other online service where the playing ground should be equal, needs to die. I for one will never understand, how, cheating could be remotely fun.
- thushan, on 10/11/2007, -3/+12your an idiot. Buried.
- shit, on 10/11/2007, -5/+14"What has this got to do with cheating online? Do you even know what the modded 360s can do?"
http://forums.maxconsole.net/showthread.php?t=45086 - taintedzodiac, on 10/11/2007, -1/+10"owner of modded 360 that isn't banned because I don't take it online"
Isn't that a self-imposed ban, in reality? - mrASSMAN, on 10/11/2007, -7/+14I love how Digg becomes all anti-piracy all the sudden when Xbox 360 is mentioned. At the same time I know that everyone viewing this comment has commits some form of piracy on a regular basis. Pathetic. Many people aren't even committing piracy, they are just copying their original store-bought discs. I miss the geek/hacker community we used to have at Digg. Ah well..
- SomaSynth, on 10/11/2007, -5/+11"THIS HAS _NOTHING_ TO DO WITH CHEATING! The bans were made for people who had modified firmware, there is no hack that will currently let you cheat online. If someone cheats, it's because the game was released with unpatched bugs and people exploit them, they don't need a hacked xbox to do so."
You sure got a lot of things wrong for someone who seems so sure of himself :) Modified firmware allows cheaters to boot trainers and network filters. Even without modded firmware an experienced hacker can still re-route packets without modifying the hardware. Hacked firmware also allows for booting modified game files and even without firmware modifications you can still modify downloaded content. To think there are no cheaters out there that know how to do this is naive. On the contrary, many find cheating on consoles easier because developers don't put the effort into packet encryption, server side checks and local memory hash checks that are now mostly standard for PC games. - phaed, on 10/11/2007, -2/+8***** I pirate things all the time. Im Pirating things as we speak. I pirated things yesterday, before yesterday, last week. Heck I pirate things all day every day at a speed of 5mbits/sec. When im not home i enjoy ssh-ing into my box at home just to get some pirating done. When im not pirating im working on DC++ mod which thousands of people all around the world use to pirate at their leisure. Sue me.
- wrtpeeps, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7you're a joke mate...
If you hacked your xbox, be a man, take responsability. Don't dump the problem on somebody else. It was your stupidity after all.. - sasha0, on 10/11/2007, -5/+11@roosterjm2k2
> The backup argument is just toooo funny.
> If you can't keep your discs in good shape, thats YOUR problem.
It was about $30 CDN and two weeks wait to replace scratched Oblivion disk. At that time that was only game played on X360 and it was not leaving console at all. It was scratched by the console.
Right now my son is playing gears of war. We already had to replace it once at the retail store where we bought it (they offer free replacement for the first 3 months). After about a month since replacement the game starting giving "dirty disk" errors. I wipe it off with the cloth i use for my lenses but eventually that will not help. The same thing that happened to Oblivion is happening to it. That is the only game he plays on 360 and it never leaves the console. Retail store will not replace it second time, so that will probably be another $30 CDN.
Maybe it would be good idea just to get one of those mod-chip things and use only backups from now on. It makes no sense at all to keep paying for the same thing over and over. - roosterjm2k2, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7handoflettuce...
MS is actually supporting homebrew. Look at the XNA.
You can make games for the 360... You just have to have them verified before being able to release them publicly. They don't allow pure homebrew for obvious reasons. If you allow homebrew, you open the door to all kinds of cheats (think pc games...with ram modifiers running in the background, you can overwrite the game itself while its in memory...a flawless cheat) ... so to allow pure homebrew would most likely ruin the experience of alot of legit gamers... - merlingen, on 10/11/2007, -3/+9It's not ALL about piracy.
They also want to prevent people from using legit back-ups, so they make more profits from people re-buying games because of scratches etc.
If they only wanted to prevent piracy, they would require unique cd-keys to play online, and stop bothering people who make legal back-ups.
But they don't. - Agret, on 10/11/2007, -6/+12@nattybohman
Modded 360's can't be used for cheating, it just changes the DVD firmware to report all discs as real. They still have to have 100% original content, any modified content and the disc is corrupt as it no longer matches the checksum. - roosterjm2k2, on 10/11/2007, -0/+6Kelpdip,
Good luck with that. At my local EB, they have been given instructions now to test for that. On returns or trades, they take it to the back, hook it up, and log in with a XBL gamertag. If they get the banned error message, they give the console back to you and say have a nice day. - HsoKinees, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7damaging originals.. geez.. i remember something that happened a few months ago.. my dad bought a new/sealed FF7(retro!) off ebay.co.uk.. his PStwo(slimline) scratched it to buggery within a few plays :/
- g33b33, on 10/11/2007, -1/+7@ardnut
no, looks like you CAN modify some ini files in a few games. - ardnut, on 10/11/2007, -2/+7Most people are saying there is no way to cheat, but google turns up several tutorials on how to change ini files and hex edit others, e.g. looks like you can do that with Gears of War.
Or are these all fake? - nattybohman, on 10/11/2007, -3/+8somasynth is right on the money.
Modding allows you to play unsigned code which in turn allows you to boot trainers and other altered code with your game. This allows you to cheat online.
The point of this entire conversation has somehow gone right over some heads. (mrassman) - MaynardJK, on 10/11/2007, -4/+9"The argument is water thin. The only people who want "backups" are those that don't buy the originals. you know it, I know it and they know it."
Tell that to my friend whose system ate his Vegas and Gears disks. We all know the hardware problems with the system. Why is it that no one believes that they will scratch the ***** out of disks that get heavy use? You anti-modders spew more FUD than Fox News. - chris9902, on 10/11/2007, -2/+7It bans the console serial number. So unless you find out a way to change that you're not getting on Live.
(hint: they don't put it in the DVD firmware) -
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