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131 Comments
- SqueakyWheel, on 10/10/2007, -10/+45Xbox 360 has the games right now to make you happy to purchase it right now.
Since you have a 3-year warranty on the console anyway I don't see why not no buy one now.
Even if your 360 red-lights, the time you'll have to wait for the hardware revision is going to be longer than the 30 days repair time. - username9000, on 10/10/2007, -2/+33Actually, the smaller the chip the less power it needs, and the less heat it generates....so you are wrong.
- ahatter, on 10/10/2007, -1/+25are you trying to tell me 45 is smaller than 65?!?!?1
- username9000, on 10/10/2007, -2/+26That kind of common sense thinking will not be tolerated here!
- username9000, on 10/10/2007, -3/+18no.
- username9000, on 10/10/2007, -1/+16The new second heatsink on the gpu does, so going 65nm can only help.
- gwolf, on 10/10/2007, -1/+16You really don't have the slightest idea what your talking about do you. Don't guess, read something before you post nonsense.
- terminalpariah, on 10/10/2007, -1/+15I'm almost hoping that my 360 will red-ring as soon as the 65nm chips are approved. I can live without it for a few weeks if it comes back cool and quiet. :)
- Skitals, on 10/10/2007, -1/+151. they could already be in retail. Not every Xbox that gets sold is cracked open, and not every one that is cracked open do people have a clue what to look for if it has changed.
2. They won't. Microsoft isn't going to want to devalue their current retail supplies. Their policy has always been that changes are constantly made, but they do not release details of what and when it happens.
3. They have already stated the problem has been solved. They haven't attributed that to any one change because they both wont tell when has changed over the years, and insist it is not one single problem. They have already stated the problems have been solved, whether that has to do with 65nm or not, they won't say (although the last two quaters remark here coincides with that rather well) - Ub3rg33k, on 10/10/2007, -1/+14The three biggest questions :
1. If they've been in production for two quarters, why the hell is it taking so long to get out in to the retail chain?
2. Once they're available, how will someone know a 65nm box from a 90nm box?
3. Will MS make a statement when the 65nm box is available saying that "this solves the problem"? - username9000, on 10/10/2007, -1/+13I know, it sounds like crazy talk but its true! I must stop commenting while I am on the phone at work. :)
- scooterbaga, on 10/10/2007, -0/+10Does anyone actually know if the new 65nm chips actually solves the overheating problem?
- username9000, on 10/10/2007, -2/+12Ecerything else is covered on the 1 year warranty, just like any other console. I knew common sense would lose on digg.
- smergs, on 10/10/2007, -1/+10"You never wondered why an Intel Pentium 4 is hotter than an Intel 386 ?"
Because it was a hell of a lot faster and used a hell of a lot more power? - inajeep, on 10/10/2007, -0/+9"The HD-DVD is one of the most compelling reasons to buy an XBox360"
Huh? Games, you tart, are the most compelling reason to buy any of the consoles. MS is updating the chipset to run cooler, that's the whole point of this thread. Did you read it or are you just bashing it to be cool? - ICSU, on 10/10/2007, -1/+10Wow, a post from the future.
- Skitals, on 10/10/2007, -2/+11You know anyone that has had to send in their 360 for anything BESIDES the red rings?
- norman619, on 10/10/2007, -0/+9Wrong
- Phyltre, on 10/10/2007, -1/+9You had me until you said that the HD-DVD drive is one of the most compelling reasons to buy a 360. It's a video game console with multimedia capabilities, not a multimedia box with video game capabilities.
- norman619, on 10/10/2007, -1/+9I already know your true form. It's a very large VD infected dick.
- HappyScrappy, on 10/10/2007, -4/+11Not in Premiums.
MS is geared up to make 10M 360s a year. That's 0.8M a month. They only sold 0.9M 360s to retail (of all sorts) the between January and July of this year. That means that they made the Premiums and Cores that are selling right now in February or so. It also means they probably have a LOT more in warehouses (like just like the PS3) to sell.
There not going to make new Premiums until these sell off. So don't expect to see any Premiums with 65nm CPUs for a couple months, maybe the rest of the year, depending on sales.
So now you know. The current Premium is discounted the most because it's on "clearance" to make room for the new ones they'll start making at some point which will have a 65nm CPU (maybe GPU) and likely HDMI. - HappyScrappy, on 10/10/2007, -1/+7I do work for a company that makes consumer products and has to deal with issues like this all the time. We also (concindentally) have been working with 65nm chips for 6 months now, and have yet to ship ours either. These 65nm chips they got were likely samples up until recently, not suitable for production. And we work with a pretty big chip manufacturer, not a contract house like TSMC (they follow about 3-6 months behind).
Since you're questioning me, I'll make my or tenuous claims:
I would suggest likely there has not been a non-HDMI 360 made since the first HDMI 360 was made (the Elite) in April/May. That is, the non-HDMI is the "old design", and the HDMI one is the new design. And as such, any non-HDMI unit you see is older than 4 months and will not have a 65nm chip in it.
I would suggest MS had enough Cores and Premiums stacked up for a long time, and it is not terribly cost effective to source both ANA (the non-HDMI video output chip) and HANA (the HDMI video output chip) at the same time, and thus they stopped buying ANA months and will not resume. Essentially, once you design a newer chip (HANA), buying ANA makes no sense, as the new chip (even if a little more capable) is likely cheaper than the old one anyway. - Codicier, on 10/10/2007, -1/+7It might come back cool, but it probably won't come back much quieter since the DVD drive is what generates most of the noise.
- username9000, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6To assume MS put in an extra heatsink for no reason is more stupid. Are you an xbox 360 design engineer or something? I love how MS gets slammed for fixing their problems and extending the warranty 2 years. They are not going to recall so get over it, buy a 360 and enjoy it for what it is made for....gaming. If it breaks you have a nice cuddly warranty to snuggle up with, and if it does break I am sure the 65nm or even 45 nm chips would be be inside your replacement.
- griffeycom, on 10/10/2007, -1/+6Cooler running chips will be less noisy too!
- Bakkster, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4Actually, this is only really true for incredibly small sizes. The 65nm chips should still be an improvement, since the lower power requirements should still be outweighing the increase in current leakage.
- gwolf, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4I think you should wait until 2015 and keep being a Sony tool, it seems to make you happy.
- pak314, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4A Pentium 4 is hotter than a 386 because it has a lot more transistors and a much higher frequency. But the smaller geometry and reduced voltage help counteract some of this. However the smaller geometry also means greater resistance on the wires in the chip and greater leakage on transistors. This is most noticeable with chips that power down to sleep.
- MaynardJK, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5beta
- AwesomeAndy, on 10/10/2007, -0/+4I've only read of a few isolated cases of this. Certainly far fewer than I hear for RROD.
- postal21, on 10/10/2007, -2/+6They all scratch discs, youtube search "xbox scratch" just dont reorientate the system while its on. Ivehad friends move mine when its on and it will definetly give them a nasty scratch. Luckily it hasnt been bad enough that the discs no longer work.
- catalysis, on 10/10/2007, -1/+5I didn't think they actually replace your whole system.
- djphatjive, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3You need to find a new hobby!
- dataset, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4If that's true and the new chips are hotter and, as a result, require more cooling thus making the 360 louder, what does Microsoft have to gain by replacing the processor? If there's no improvement, why waste the money on R&D?
- DarKnight90, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3No. Only if you move it. Would you move any other system while a disc was spinning in it?
- jostheller, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4good post, and I couldn't agree more. Honestly if Microsoft released a "360 HD elite" that included the HD-DVD drive and 65 nm chips, I would buy it today at a 600 dollar price tag. They want to be labeled as the cheaper system but dammit I don't want the cheaper system. I want a full featured high definition gaming console made by Microsoft. I love my PS3, Microsoft give me a new sku!
IF Microsoft was smart they should approach the HD-DVD backers and work out some sort of deal that they (the HD-DVD backers) subsidize 360 HD-DVD drives. Like if Microsoft is paying 30 dollars for their current DVD drives, and Toshiba can manufacture the HD-DVD drives for say 50 dollars... Microsoft should work out a deal with Toshiba to buy the drives from them for 30 dollars. If the HD-DVD backers want that format to "win" then they need to take drastic actions like that. Bluray is probably winning simply because it is included in the PS3. - HappyScrappy, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3Going to a smaller process will halve the cost, regardless of yields.
Do you have any info that Cell is having a yield problem now? - Skitals, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3You clearly have no clue what you are talking about, because Xbox 360 can "pump perfect DTS" via optical. That's full 1.5Mbps DTS. It samples any of the audio tracks you please to "perfect DTS."
You can thank the Spring HD DVD update for that. - Codicier, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3They do. My system was replaced when I had to send it in with a Red Ring two days after I opened the box.
- Francky, on 10/10/2007, -4/+7Yes, thats brilliant SqueakyWheel, encourage people to buy a sub par product. Doing so is just encouraging companies to release Crap after Crap. We have to vote with our money and not buy broken products.
Dammit, aren't you tired of buying ***** that breaks all the time ?! I know I am, and here you are encouraging it. Most of the time now, it's a gamble when you buy something, as there's a 10% chance it will be broken, 33% in the case of the xbox. Don't make 33% the new acceptable level, 10% is already way to high in my book. - chris9902, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3it's the DVD drive that makes all the noise.
- KMartSheriff, on 10/10/2007, -0/+3You have failed. Please die.
- gwolf, on 10/10/2007, -1/+4I build water cooled PC's, very experimental setups where I have to monitor temps very closely. A die shrink gives a considerable improvement in the amount of heat a cpu can shed. Smaller dies are coveted by overclockers because it makes it possible to push your system a lot further. Five degrees Centigrade can make all the difference when you are pushing a system to it's limits. The 360 CPU will not get pushed any harder than it is now but it will have more overhead for when it's in an unfavorable environment.
I would say this coupled with additional heat sinks will make it much harder for it to reach it's limit. I suspect that the placement of the GPU heat sink just under the DVD drive could cause problems for the drive. The way the new heat sinks siphon heat away from that area is a very good thing for the drives reliability. A year from now I don't think you will be hearing much about RROD. - NSMike, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3To turn them around faster, they keep a stock of refurbs there and just send a new one out for any issue. It's annoying with your live content being tied to your original console, but that's the way it is.
- afx1, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2was with u on the first comment but now not so sure
- shervinater, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3Thank God I got mine from Costco, I will just return it and buy another
GO COSTO!!!!!!!!!! - MWeather, on 10/10/2007, -4/+6You mean like the system constantly scratching disks?
- jostheller, on 10/10/2007, -1/+3That isn't really how Microsoft has been marketing their 360... They want to be the center multimedia hub to your house, with the ability to play games. I don't see the harm in supplying a 600 dollar HD-DVD 360. I would buy one.
- xino, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2I maybe wrong, but I think digg's comment system caused his comment to post twice. I see this a lot since the new comment system came out and have heard a couple times that digg itself is the cause.
- AwesomeAndy, on 10/10/2007, -0/+2Models with the extra heat sink are in stores now. There's just no way of knowing which ones have them. In a few months they all will, and that includes the Halo 3 edition (which will likely also be 65nm).
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