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'Water wars' with U.S. in our future: experts

thespec.com — Parched U.S. states could start "water wars" in the years ahead and fight for access to Great Lakes resources as they become more desperate to meet growing needs, Canadian and American experts said yesterday at a water conference.

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  • allowners, on 04/27/2008, -6/+31There's a reason why that land "out west" in the US was / is so cheap.
    • FatLoser, on 04/27/2008, -22/+3Here's a map of land prices by region... how do you figure land in the West is cheap?
      http://www.stat.duke.edu/~ervance/Greatphotos/West ...
      • MasterChief4134, on 04/28/2008, -6/+3You really are a fat loser huh?
    • marsh283, on 04/27/2008, -6/+11I can see Michigan's economy coming back in the near future...I'm glad I live here.
      • Waterrat, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1 Not if the rest of the country sucks the great lakes dry in a year you won't be.
        I for see the end of plush golf courses and manicured lawns..And al those thirsty people moving back east...Unless,of corse,they can come up with a cheap way to use the ocean.
    • woofers07, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2IS cheap??? Yeah, cheap compared to Manhattan. I really hope you're talking about the mid-west and not the west coast
      • InferiorWang, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1coast == water
        no we're not talking about the coast
    • lhbaker, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1China has it even worse. 7% of the world's fresh water, 20% of its population, and serious problems with desertifcation and pollution.
  • tbhurst, on 04/27/2008, -2/+31You know what they say about the west? Whiskey is for drinkin' and water is for fightin' about.
    • TobiasParker, on 04/28/2008, -12/+1THIS IS WATER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
      • TobiasParker, on 04/28/2008, -2/+8*****...i am so fail lately.
      • EvilGunOwner, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2"That does not make sense!" "Look at the monkey! Look at the monkey!"
  • aimhelix, on 04/27/2008, -2/+57I have an idea, let's melt icebergs!
    • SitPoMk, on 04/27/2008, -7/+15They're way ahead of you
    • jgtg32a, on 04/27/2008, -10/+7One step ahead of you.
    • soundman7718, on 04/27/2008, -3/+13Just how ahead? Is it "way ahead", or "one step" ahead...I'm confused.
    • goldenratiophi, on 04/27/2008, -6/+7Global warming to the rescue?
    • S5Z2, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4But with no Ice we won't be able to create Ice creams.
    • Metalcastr, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2I'll get the heatgun, you bring the buckets.
    • Risingashes, on 04/28/2008, -3/+1Not sure how well people will take to drinking sea water.
      • InferiorWang, on 04/28/2008, -0/+5They might just have to, I don't know, desalinate it first.
  • SitPoMk, on 04/27/2008, -2/+8If there were flying and teleporting future probes involved I could swear this would be taken from Popular Science
    • bjornski, on 04/27/2008, -1/+9Yeah. Popular Science and Popular Mechanics have become "the suck" when it comes to anything factual.
  • ohmahgawd, on 04/27/2008, -2/+109I'm scared to live in Canada. We have a huge amount of oil, fresh water, uncut forests, and unmined minerals, and a military you could push over with a stick to guard it all.
    • rileyhallwood, on 04/27/2008, -0/+48its all tactical, we give people a guilty concience for attacking us, its practically a cheap shot.
    • jmpeagle, on 04/27/2008, -6/+55interesting......the unrest between the quebecois and the rest on Canada could degenerate into civil war. The U.S. must be prepared to keep the peace by sending in 250,000 peacekeepers to quell the violence and secure the resources.
      • rileyhallwood, on 04/27/2008, -2/+18maybe thirty years ago. quebec won't do *****, they're all talk.
        • synaesthesia, on 04/27/2008, -1/+17Just like early 2003 Iraq.
        • iMike360, on 04/28/2008, -6/+1Guess you don't remember the October Crisis.
          • ohmahgawd, on 04/28/2008, -0/+5That was over 30 years ago. Try rereading his comment.
          • iMike360, on 04/28/2008, -0/+5Ya, need to read more carefully, bury away.
        • Seidoger, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3Its not just talk, but it's not the same game. And i don't see it happening anytime soon. The portrait is changing.
      • Jo9100, on 04/28/2008, -2/+2no civil war please :( and we surely do not want the US army bringing all the mess here too...
      • Punkazz189, on 04/28/2008, -4/+4Quebec is practically France. Which means they will just give up as soon as anything starts.
        • rottencod, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3The French haven't won a war since they fought themselves.
      • dig1x, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3"......the unrest between the quebecois and the rest on Canada could degenerate into civil war."

        Not going to happen. Please, people, stop voting this up.
        • Continuum, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3I assumed he meant this as sarcasm, hence my thumbs up... I thought it was hilarious.
      • GhostyBoy, on 04/28/2008, -1/+6^^Whole lotta WHOOSH.
    • cheezintern, on 04/27/2008, -4/+19Better hope we (the U.S.) don't find any terrorists or evil doers, or we'll be rolling through with our tanks in no time to bring freedom.
    • Louis11, on 04/27/2008, -3/+14*Eyes Canada*

      Suddenly America's hat isn't looking so lame.
      • Seidoger, on 04/28/2008, -3/+5But America still is, though.
      • bosssmiley, on 04/28/2008, -2/+2Canada's bigger, and it's on top. That makes America...
      • ghuytro, on 04/28/2008, -2/+3And America is Canada's crotch.

        You wear the pants but are often full of *****, make strange noises and always think with the wrong head.
    • boomernet, on 04/28/2008, -7/+18fortunately attacking Canada would result in the US losing support from the UK, Australia, and many other European nations they currently rely upon. Plus there's way too many white people. The US only attacks brown people, or white people really, really far away.
      • supras, on 04/28/2008, -10/+1***** them. After we seize your oil, who the hell needs to kill brown people in the Middle East =P
      • Risingashes, on 04/28/2008, -0/+5Not sure where you got this 'relies upon' stuff from, but America doesn't need us.
        -Australia
      • atarijedi, on 04/28/2008, -3/+7Not to mention it would force UK and Australia to attack the US. Canada's Queen is the Queen of the UK, and the Queen of Australia, and maybe all the other nations still somewhat tied to the Monarchy.

        At least this is what I hope would happen.
        • localhost6881, on 04/28/2008, -0/+6yeah, we could conquer the american rebels once and for all =)
      • Punkazz189, on 04/28/2008, -2/+5Canadian's still have accents though.
        America HATES the word "eh"
        • LupeFiasco, on 04/28/2008, -0/+8And American's don't have accents?
      • dickybrown, on 04/28/2008, -3/+3"...losing support from the UK, Australia, and many other European nations..." you do know Australia isn't in Europe, right?
        :)
      • craighoxton, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2"Leave Canada alone"
    • kapsar, on 04/28/2008, -1/+4Canada will freely join the US and then we'll all have our years named after some product, ie Year of the Whooper, the Quebec wheel chair assassins will try to destroy the US. O and we'll turn part of Canada into a giant garbage dump. Then some one will come out with a movie that you'll want to watch till you die. If you don't believe me it's in this book from the future called "infinite Jest"
    • unorginalityftw, on 04/28/2008, -0/+6The only problem with our military is numbers, and to some extent, technology. (We aren't the most up to date.) Aside from that you could hardly push it over with a 'stick'.
      • supras, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4And the fact that every major city is like 10 miles from the border..
      • Sinnic, on 04/28/2008, -1/+3Broom? Cricket bat? Leftover ice-hockey stick?
    • sponeil, on 04/28/2008, -0/+9@ohmahgawd, have you seen this one?

      Arabian Sea (SatireWire.com) — Canadian television reported Friday that a Canadian warship in the Arabian Sea had seized a tanker suspected of smuggling oil from Iraq, leading many to suspect that the report was a hoax.

      "You're kidding, right? Canada has a warship?" asked U.S. Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld. "Like for war?

      "Does Canada know?" he added.

      "Nobody was more stunned than we were," said Kali Omari, first mate of the seized vessel. "We saw this frigate steaming toward us, and we were worried, but then we saw the maple leaf on the flag, and we thought, 'Oh, Canadians. What the hell do they want?'"
      • ohmahgawd, on 04/28/2008, -0/+7lol
        There was a long running joke in Alberta that WES (West Edmonton Mall) had more submarines than the Canadian military. It was true for a while too. And the subs used in WES were for an amusement park!
    • jloutey, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3Up here in the Pacific Northwest Seattle and Vancouver have formed a secret alliance to protect our Cascade water ways from all the hillbillies, yokels, and Quebecers east of the mountains.
    • craighoxton, on 04/28/2008, -1/+3America's welcome to Quebec - they can have all the poutine and strippers they ever need
  • killbert24, on 04/27/2008, -9/+3So it'll be like that movie Water World where Kevin Costner has to drink his *****?
    • Conwaysb0718, on 04/27/2008, -1/+1no no... think "The Road Warrior"...
  • DonSlice, on 04/27/2008, -2/+25"Michigan: The Last Bastion of Civilization" just doesn't have a nice ring to it.
    • FatLoser, on 04/27/2008, -2/+18"Detroit" just doesn't have a nice ring to it.
      • Target91, on 04/27/2008, -3/+6There's more to Michigan than Detroit Dumbass.
        • FatLoser, on 04/28/2008, -3/+4LOL, I had no idea there was a city called Detroit Dumbass.
        • 13B1303, on 04/28/2008, -1/+4Yay Flint!
        • EvilGunOwner, on 04/28/2008, -1/+3@13B1309

          Michael Moore, is that you?
      • Punkazz189, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2But, "Detroit: Murder capital of the world" is oh so bad ass.
    • richman241, on 04/28/2008, -3/+1Wisconsin has a nice ring to it also
    • eximious, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1I hate to say it, but Florida will probably be the last bastion (at least what doesn't submerge in rising sea levels). Florida has the most productive aquifer system in the world. Michigan has the lakes, sure, but they can be easily polluted if not protected vigilantly (and are still recovering from the pollution of the 20th century).
      • SpaceMonkeyZero, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1The great lakes are bigger than all of florida.
        Great Lakes: 94,710 sq miles
        Florida: 65,795 sq miles.
  • llama5492, on 04/27/2008, -9/+69Cheney: Mr. President, we're out of water sir!
    Bush: So let them drink Kool-Aid.
    • AirRaven, on 04/27/2008, -4/+12...=D
      Cleverly done.
    • RepubOperative, on 04/28/2008, -4/+6Obama: You Can't! All my folks are on the Kool-Aid.
    • TrevaLVF, on 04/28/2008, -2/+2Plenty of people were drinking the Bush/Cheney Kool-Aid. It's a good thing that many of them have slacked off and some others quit drinking it. Pity, too little, too late because too much damage has been done.
    • RealHyperX, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2Clinton: Mr. President we are out of water
      Obama: Let's teach them to chuck spears!
  • FizzanoMatrix, on 04/27/2008, -5/+47I'll be headin out Californee way.
    • lengau, on 04/27/2008, -3/+10Riiiight... Because they have so much water...
    • Rodalli, on 04/28/2008, -2/+9I heard they got internet out there.
    • Gerz1219, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2In all seriousness, Netflix Chinatown. It's very entertaining and you'll gain a much better understanding of California's water needs.
  • cipher64, on 04/27/2008, -2/+26It's just my feeling or is the world really headed towards bad times no matter how you look at it?
    • nodong, on 04/27/2008, -1/+6Soylent Green is people!
      • bjornski, on 04/27/2008, -1/+2"Is that really meat?"

        The days are coming.
    • noahhoward, on 04/27/2008, -1/+10Depends on point of view, if you look at it like a collective us, then yeah there's gong to be trouble. From a personal point of view, things will be a lot less crowded and people will be a lot less stupid. Survival of the fittest will finally be back behind the helm.
      • Waterrat, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1 Or survival of the baddest,depending on how you look at it,but yup,we have evaded mother nature's laws far too long...It's not looking so good for the human team.

    • OrangeCrush, on 04/28/2008, -0/+8Only if you look at it from the perspective of "let's sit on our asses and do nothing to mitigate or prevent future problems." There's plenty of water on this planet, it's just a matter of getting it purified and delivered where it's needed. Rather than starting wars, we can invest in infrastructure--pipelines and water treatment plants--maybe even replace a few crumbling bridges and roadways while we're at it. It'll be good for the economy, create jobs, help out the ailing construction industry, and nobody has to get shot at for it.
    • SeekerDarksteel, on 04/28/2008, -1/+9People have been declaring the world is heading towards bad times every day of every year for the past ever.

      • bjornski, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1"....for the past ever".

        I like that. Dugg up.
    • JYoungest1, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1The world is heading to bad times, if you look at it through the media. Were going to run out of salt way before water if I keep taking a grain of it with every article I read. Then to think if they are right about the water thing, I'm going to be so dehydrated.
      • bjornski, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1I'm in Minnesota. I'll find a lake and a Brita filter if things get bad. "Land of 10,000 lakes" has certain benefits
  • michlibrarian, on 04/27/2008, -4/+11What appalling arrogance that an international water source could be "nationalized."
    • bradsh, on 04/27/2008, -0/+12The idea is going from a state resource to a national resource, not international to national. People without water want to open up our precious great lakes so they can get their greedy paws on our mercury poisoned water. For whatever reason.
      • bjornski, on 04/27/2008, -1/+10Because they've already used their own as sewers and to water their golf courses.

        Plus absolutely *****-poor land management and planning.
        • Justice101, on 04/28/2008, -0/+10Absolutely, they should conserve water better, and start setting up desalinization plants.
        • Waterrat, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2Don't leave out the hog "lagoons."
      • senae, on 04/28/2008, -1/+7The point Michlibrarian is trying to make is that the Great lakes are owned by both the Canadians AND the Americans, and therefore the idea that they can just decide who gets all the water is very arrogant.
        Next thing you know they'll be charging us for the right to sell them wood and making our fish go extinct.

        Wait a second...
        • korvan504521, on 04/28/2008, -1/+3look, we both stole all our land from the indians, can't we just get along? i mean, i love canada. you guys send us hockey players to beat your hockey teams with!
    • madroneDorf, on 04/28/2008, -1/+5It's not really an international water source. Its a bi-national water source.

      Mexico certainly has no claim to them, Only Canada and the United States
    • 0Xonox0, on 04/28/2008, -2/+2Don't all international water sources belong to the US anyway?
      • pkoerner, on 04/28/2008, -0/+0Actually, Lake Michigan is entirely in the United States.
  • Pg5of16, on 04/27/2008, -9/+3Will this be anything like the movie 'Water World'?
    • synaesthesia, on 04/27/2008, -0/+23Yes, a situation involving the desperate scarcity and rarity of water is exactly like a movie wherein the entire earth was overrun with water.
      • senae, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2I don't think you actually saw waterworld at all.
        This will be the exact same, expensive, drawn out longer then rational people would ever drag it out, and full of far to many inexplicable explosions.
    • GhostyBoy, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1Yes. It will cost a ridiculous amount of money and absolutely no one will like it.
  • cmccool, on 04/27/2008, -8/+12i think a good trivia question might be, "when was the last time there was a major water war?" you will find that there have been surprisingly few and most did not escalate. this environmental pish-posh is just another scare tactic.
    • eximious, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4I respect your critical eye, but water resources *are* a serious issue. Population growth, increasing power demands (and more water for cooling), increasing agricultural demands, and the growth of industry overseas (especially in China) is demanding more water than in the past. Further, global climate change is reducing Winter snow deposits which then in turn reduce the water available in the melt. Corporations are buying up water rights like no tomorrow. The CIA has said numerous times that water will be the oil of the 21st century.

      Do you know anything about the history of water use and conflict? Or are you just talking out of your arse? A "scare tactic?" What few conflicts are you talking about? When President Anwar Sadat made peace with Israel in 1979, he said Egypt would only go to war again to protect its water resources. King Hussein of Jordan said he would only ever go to war again over water.

      Then there's pollution to worry about and water quality. Water isn't much useful to human consumption if it isn't potable. Many pollutants dissolve into the organic compounds in lake and river sediments, persisting in the environment for decades. There's no reason to be scared. Just water your lawn a little less, take shorter showers when you can, and don't use water like it's a limitless luxury.
  • rileyhallwood, on 04/27/2008, -16/+10gtfo our lakes america.
  • thelastcivilian, on 04/27/2008, -5/+63Stay away Yankees! We're getting ready to fight!

    Canada, as a nation, has already mobilized 80% of its population to within 100 miles of the border with the United States.
    • urgeigh, on 04/27/2008, -2/+12I don't know why people are digging you down, that's funny right there!
    • kh99, on 04/27/2008, -1/+21Don't worry, eh? We'll stay oot.
    • gak001, on 04/28/2008, -2/+1Whatev - we have the Bomb.
      • dig1x, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3And Canada has the rest of the planet as Allies. Doubt it at your peril.
        • korvan504521, on 04/28/2008, -3/+1I've never understood that about canada. The rest of the world doesn't actually love you, but you think they do. Most of the rest of the world doesn't even know who you are. . .

          sure they hate our guts, but at least they know our name.
          • Continuum, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4that's why when you wear a Canadian flag in Europe you tend to get treated nicer than if you were to wear a US flag... Oh right, American's will often wear Canadian flags in Europe too. National pride what?
    • IAmTheGuy, on 04/28/2008, -0/+7The fact that you have mobilized 80% of your population to the border is actually a good thing for us Yanks because I hear there's not a locked door in the country. We'll just march in while you're sleeping and take over.
      • atarijedi, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3Then we will just lock our doors, and your feeble minds will be stumped!

        "The Doors are Locked Sir! What do we do now? Go back home?"
        • korvan504521, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1yeah, but first grab anything that isn't nailed down!

          culturally, canada and the US get along better (in general) than democrats and republicans. There's zero chance of any sort of international disputes. We're moving slowly (but steadily) towards a north american union, and personally I think its a great idea.
    • Harbinger67, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4Like maple syrup, Canada's evil oozes over the United States.
    • geddon, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1Get ready for the Louisiana Purchase: Part Deux. Coming soon to a Canada near you!
  • jmpeagle, on 04/27/2008, -3/+8this is hwy Michigan should continue deindustrialization so that jobs move elsewhere and there demand for water falls. Populations should move towards the coasts and we should build desalinization plants like they have in the Middle East and even Spain.
    • BriVaps, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3you do realize that michigan is surounded on 3 sides by the great lakes
      • jmpeagle, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1which have falling levels, whereas the oceans are rising
  • dancercotillion, on 04/27/2008, -0/+11No, this will not be like Waterworld. This will be more Tank Girl.
    I'd be killed for my body's water by Malcolm McDowell anyday.
  • urgeigh, on 04/27/2008, -0/+10I guess that's at least one positive aspect of living in Michigan. Kind of puts things in perspective, we might have the highest unemployment and one of the worst economies in the country but hey, at least I won't be dying of dehydration any time soon.
  • bakegreg, on 04/27/2008, -0/+24Water is about the only thing we have left in Michigan...
    • KarthVader, on 04/27/2008, -1/+4They want to take away our Great Lakes?
      Over my dead body...
      • dig1x, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3Canadians dont want your great lakes brother. The rest of the USA wants *our* great lakes.

        -Ontario.
    • BedPost, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3We Michiganders are the most depressed people on the web... :(
    • TrevaLVF, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2It's rough for most of us, but I know that the situation up in Michigan is really bad. Damned greedy corporate executives should have never outsourced the manufacturing and other production jobs, as well as, the phone work (customer service jobs to India). They caused a chain reaction to other industries, to other people. Those gluttons are too stupid to realize, the workers they dumped were also consumers that bought and promoted their products. Now, they cry about how we're not spending money buying their stuff, as if we're all sitting on piles of money that magically appear.
  • soundman7718, on 04/27/2008, -1/+11I had something like this years ago in my backyard titled the exact same thing...it involved super soakers.
    • boomernet, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1fell off my chair

      lmao
      • soundman7718, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1thanks buddy...I guess I'm a natural comedian, huh? :p
  • MacDevyn, on 04/27/2008, -1/+7While we're working our asses off, and paying tax money the government is having fun at a water conference...
    • comrade693, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3It's called planning for the future. Perhaps you should look into it...
  • tatroc, on 04/27/2008, -1/+2Water for oil?
    • jorisb, on 04/28/2008, -1/+6Canada has more of both, we'll take money though.
      • senae, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2Eh, not really.
        Alberta was stupid and sold the rights to most of the oil to US-based multinationals.
        • Seidoger, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1Or Royal and Dutch ones, haha..
        • dig1x, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1No worries, we'll just tax or nationalize.
      • crowbar77, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2Just not american money aka monopoly money. Sound familiar? :P
    • EvilGunOwner, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3No blood for water!
      But wait, blood is 70% water. WWDD? (What Would Dracula Do?)
    • 0Xonox0, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1***** it, we'll take them both! This is America after all!
  • goldenratiophi, on 04/27/2008, -0/+5oh *****
  • ConfirmedCynic, on 04/27/2008, -0/+31Maybe those states should start living within their means, by imposing water conversation methods? Instead of looking to pillage their neighbors and waste their water too?
    • arcusMae, on 04/27/2008, -0/+9I totally agree. If they want to come and get my water then they should come and live here. Otherwise stay there and adapt.
    • Metalcastr, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2I already talk to water.
    • GhostyBoy, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3That's hardly the American way.
      • Waterrat, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1 No,the American way is:"We want it,we take it."
  • theferno, on 04/27/2008, -2/+8i hope we run out of water so doctors can start recommending 8 glasses of beer a day instead
    • goldenratiophi, on 04/27/2008, -0/+7I bet you can't guess what substance makes up the, erm, watery base of beer!
      • FatLoser, on 04/27/2008, -11/+2I'm pretty sure beer is made out of none other than... beer. ***** idiot. Just because something is liquid that doesn't mean it's water. Iron is liquid at relatively high temperatures... does that mean iron is water? I'm shocked that diggers manage to operate in the real world on a level that enables basic survival... it's both a mystery and a surprise.
        • goldenratiophi, on 04/27/2008, -1/+4I can't tell if you're being sarcastic, but:

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beer#Ingredients

          "Beer is composed mostly of water"
          • FatLoser, on 04/28/2008, -7/+1Anybody can go on Wikipedia and make up *****. You probably changed it right before linking us to it. Nice try, but no cigar.
          • Justice101, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2Beer isn't a hundred percent alcohol buddy, just FYI.
          • tschau, on 04/28/2008, -3/+4I've got this feeling that you're not his buddy, friend!
          • bjornski, on 04/28/2008, -1/+3He's just trolling. Ignore him.
          • BrewBeau, on 04/28/2008, -1/+3Not only is beer about 90% water, but it takes about 8-10 gallons of water to make a gallon of beer, when you factor in all the cleaning and sanitizing you have to do in a brewery.
          • theferno, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3i guaranteed they changed wikipedia because my uncle owns a brewery in st paul and he says they use like a gallon of water per year to make like 4 million beers, but he's been trollin' lately
        • Travelsonic, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2...

          ignorance is truth, I guess.

          also, instead of advocating responsible uses (as basic knowledge only, using links in the references, etc), can I safely guess that you buy into the hysteria and fear mongering surrounding the 'pedia?
    • bjornski, on 04/27/2008, -0/+5Or as I call it, "fortified water".
  • bjornski, on 04/27/2008, -3/+7Go ahead and use it up! We can't affect our environment! You can't prove humans caused it!

    /sits down with a bowl of popcorn to watch the deniers.
    //lots of popcorn, I'll share.
    • masterm1nd, on 04/27/2008, -2/+2Ok, don't use the water then.

      /sits and waits for certain death
    • noahhoward, on 04/27/2008, -9/+4You're a ***** moron, using up limited fresh water resources is a hell of a lot different than warming the entire planet.
      • bjornski, on 04/27/2008, -3/+9Wrong. Same attitude prevails.

        "We can't affect this! So let's use it all up and trash it! Let's just dump our chemicals into the lake. We can't hurt anything!"
        • BrewBeau, on 04/28/2008, -0/+5It's like when people get busted in a water restriction period trying to water their precious lawns in the middle of the hot day when most of the water evaporates. Morons.
    • goldenratiophi, on 04/28/2008, -1/+3fo' sho', I want me some popcorn!

      /sits down next to bjornski and steals popcorn
  • benitojuarez, on 04/27/2008, -1/+6i dont know what theyll be fighting over, half the time the beaches are closed in chicago due to e coli outbreaks or some other form of contamination.
  • briguymich, on 04/27/2008, -1/+8I guess that is the trade off. Live somewhere beautiful, and warm, but with no resources to sustain a population. Or deal with snow and cloudy days and don't die from lack of water.
    • OrangeCrush, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2Hey, Florida's pretty warm and usually has enough water (there's been the occasional drought, but they just tell you not to water your lawn or fill your pool for a while). Of course, we do have occasional hurricanes . . . and lots of lightning strikes . . . sometimes a tornado here or there . . . those might kill you. But you certainly won't die from a lack of water, that's for sure!
    • crowbar77, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1You haven't been to Canada before have you?
      • briguymich, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1I grew up starting at Canada across lake Superior. I spent most of my time between ages 19 and 21 in Canada. Are you trying to tell me it's sunny, hot, and has very little fresh water?
  • Picaroon, on 04/27/2008, -1/+3Yeah, or they might just trade like we do with oil.
    Give me a break.
  • ajhunte, on 04/27/2008, -1/+6I live right on Lake Erie, we can sell them the water for super cheap as long as they agree to buy the thousands of filters they would need to make it drinkable from us.
    • cyberwarriorx, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4Forget Lake Erie, give them Lake Ontario water. It's what they deserve :)
      • limerope, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2Oh, man, thats just cruel! I live on lake Ontario... you don't touch that stuff for fear of mutation!
  • stack3r, on 04/27/2008, -1/+28Stop softdrink manufacture have 3/4 of your water back and a healthier population.
    • zephyear, on 04/27/2008, -5/+2shut up you, i need my dr pepper
    • OrangeCrush, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2I'm gonna go out on a limb here and suggest that perhaps soft drink bottling plants *don't* consume anywhere near 3/4 of the water supply. Granted, this is purely anecdotal, as I've never witnessed anyone bath in, wash with, irrigate crops with soda. I also have never seen factories or buildings that use soda for cooling and heating either.
      • jonnymj, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3Brawndo: The Thirst Mutilator
        It's got what plants crave.
        It's got electrolytes.
      • fantasmacanino, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3I'm sorry I don't want your word for it, ORANGECRUSH.
        • OrangeCrush, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1LOL! Well played. You win this round, but beware!
    • senae, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1As hippy-ish as that was, I would totally be behind this idea.

      Assuming it were to ever have a chance of occuring.
    • madroneDorf, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2Most water is used for agricultural reasons. The agricultural sector has little to no motivation for reducing water use because its essentially subsidized to be free for them.

      • coreman, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1Uh...no it's not. Industrial processes, including those in our homes: toilets, baths & showers, dish washing machines, clothes washers, lawn watering.
  • vw2005, on 04/27/2008, -3/+15desalinsation.... dudes and dudettes.

    It'll become cheap/profitable to do so .... if it's not already right now.
    • noahhoward, on 04/27/2008, -8/+7Desalinsation would eventually cause more problems than it is worth.
      The real answer is to start living within our means.
      • noahhoward, on 04/28/2008, -0/+5So at least four people don't see the problem with turning the earths salt water to fresh water?
        • spectecjr, on 04/28/2008, -2/+3Not really. After we're done with it, it'll flow back out to the ocean again, and get all its salt back.
        • BrewBeau, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1With the icebergs melting and desalinizing the oceans, the sea water will need to supplemented with the extra salt extracted from the drinking water. It's win-win.
      • korvan504521, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2The human population of this planet couldn't make a dent in the oceans by turning it into fresh water. Maybe if we were trying to extra hydrogen from it on a massive scale, but turning it into fresh water just leaves you with a pile of salt and a lot of water. Anyone can do that with just the power of the sun. Get three plast bowls of varying size. The smallest one is full of salt water, place it in the largest one. Take the middle one and flip it over on top of the smallest one. Now put it outside.

        You now have a desalination plant. Congrats!
    • tschau, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3It is most definitely not right now. Who knows when it'll be cheap and profitable, but I see no reason to think that'll happen before some of the southwest states start running out of water.
    • lhbaker, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1Not so much. The brine is a bit of a problem.
  • SemiSarcastic, on 04/27/2008, -1/+16Digg: where optimism and pragmatism goes to die.
    • JYoungest1, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1I know, right.

      But seriously where the hell does the water go if its disappearing, maybe all the hot air these people who write these comments blow is actually steam. Now that I think about it, wouldn't that just cycle back?
  • joeanon, on 04/27/2008, -17/+6MORE Doomsday BS.

    Desalinization technology has improved greatly and use nanotech we can push it even further.

    The realiy is, there is no drinking water problem in North America yet that's where the majority of the worlds technology comes from.

    Making water cost more is a good enough though, most people use 2-3 as much as water as they need for reasonable use.

    Now technologies in dish and clothes washers reduce water use also.

    WE could also build more reservoirs, turn them into national parks and have more water to seep into the subsurface. Beyond that, salt water is very plentiful, and not all that difficult to turn into drinking water.

    As it stands water hardly costs anything unless you buy the Spring Water, which is usually filtered tap water.

    I don't see how it's a big problem. With the ice caps melting using excess salt water for drinking water is no bid deal .. unless your stupid and use 50 year old technology. They have flash distillers already and that's just the tip of the iceburg.

    There is NO WATER, FOOD, or OIL shortage. The wealthy are just playing the stock market, creating spikes to sell their products, knowing damn well it's all BS.

    These guys pay smart people enough to tell them whats really happened to the energy infrastructure. And they wealthy aren't interested in sharing the info with you on who will be the new Bio OIL Barron.

    Don't worry, there is NO sign of long term disaster... other than climate change, which we really have no idea whats going to happen. North America needs temperate weather that's for sure, or the bread basket becomes a dust basket.

    Still, we have SO much farm land spread all throughout the nation. Food prices haven't gone up around here at.

    What we need is proper water cycling using waste water as fertilizer for biofuel, then biofuel left overs as dry fertilizer for cropland.

    We make oil and fertilizer while removing tons of CO2 and cleaning sewage...

    THATS the way to run biofuel.

    So, whatever candidate wants me in their administration... feel free to sign up to be my fanboy :P

    DON'T LISTEN TO THE STOCK MARKET.

    These are desperate wealthy people who have NO IDEA what they are investing in other than statistics and market trends. It's just a trade for profit, not a way to transparently invest in quality businesses.

    People simply should make money like that. The rich should be taxed more because they are not competent enough to use the stock market to make anything other than profit driven decisions.

    So BUY defense contracts and PUSH the war, somehow becomes a profit model to these guys. They don't are it results in borrow and spend tactics... at least.... not until the dollar plummets. Now they are confused and think the end of the world is coming.

    It's truly laughable watching the idiots of the world like Warren Buffet preach of the upcoming doomsday for the US while he quietly moves his wealth to foreign markets.

    The man said mankind would soon resort to cannabilism..... and

    HE IS THE WEALTHIEST MAN IN THE WORLD.

    Corporate America is the real enemy and has been since the rail roads and before. They people have been bending the law with their wealth for FAR too long. They will always create profit for themselves at the expensive of the rest of the nation until We The People legislate against their traitor like behavior toward their own nation.

    You'd think the dollar falling would be enough to wake up these moronic mega corporations. BUT, we are still dragging our feet, people are still afraid to push radical new ideas. They are looking for a couple tweaks to a dying economic model. NEVER GONNA WORK.

    If Obama wins and isn't careful he will live up to the democratic name of massive inefficient social programs and the GOP will spin that on him for the rest of his life.

    National Health Care is a great idea, because it's proven to work all over the world under different cultures and tax systems.

    Obama's plan is just more of the same really. He will keep letting Corporate America get off and use federal money to subsidize.

    We spend 2.1 trillion or more a year on health care between government and mostly citizens out of pocket costs. Both systems are horrible inefficient.

    Things like insurance companies simply have no logic place in the mix. There is no reason the federal government can't offer you non profit insurance. We already pay taxes, so we already have a shared pool of money. Every ONE of the nations that moved over to national health care are saving 2-3 times as much per year than the US and they have higher lifespans, smarter kids, and lower infant mortality. Canada even has national education and 5% LOWER taxes.

    So... national health care would save us around 1 trillion dollars a year. In the big picture that means business can afford to pay higher salaries, the mentally ill can get real help, you can just walk in without paperwork so long as you're a citizen. It saves us BILLIONS just in paper work alone. It saves us BILLIONS in taking the insurance companies profit out of the picture. It saves us BILLIONS by removing idiotic things like Medical Claim processors. These guys actually charge a PERCENT of your doctor fee. Instead of some flat rate system, it works right over the internet. You can't tell me it makes sense to charge a percentage of the claim when all your doing is sending a claim to the insurance company through a third party.

    THATS WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT... why is their a third party EVERYWHERE you go in the micro managed super privatized sector.

    So, I'd like to save 1 trillion per year and keep rising medical costs under control.
    • zeusthemoose, on 04/28/2008, -0/+4A giant wall of ***** won't help your cause.
  • Emrtr4, on 04/27/2008, -3/+9There are companies prepared to deal with this-there is a technological answer; desalination, trust me this has been discussed in depth for many years (I was involved with a start up) and this article is nothing more than alarmist garbage.
    • eximious, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1Except for the fact that desalinization consumes massive amounts of power and is useful only to coastal regions until extensive piping infrastructure is laid down?
    • lhbaker, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1So where's your start-up now?
  • kylere, on 04/27/2008, -3/+19I welcome the new parched earth, I live in Michigan and when water hits $117 a barrel we will be living like Dubai :-)
    • bjornski, on 04/27/2008, -9/+3"We"?

      You honestly think you'd get one cent of that?
      • zeusthemoose, on 04/28/2008, -2/+8Seeing how Alaskans see a big check from their oil, yes I do think that.
    • ConfirmedCynic, on 04/28/2008, -2/+2Some corporation and its shareholders would, but not you nor most others in your state. Meanwhile you'd be left wondering why your water bill is now so high.
  • geyq, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1like to star wars ?
  • prometheanspark, on 04/28/2008, -0/+15The thing is that at least in California, more than half of the water goes to growing oranges, tomatoes and other fruits in the central valleys, which are basically a desert during the summers. The farmers that irrigates these crops pay about 1/10 of 1% of what urban water users pay for water, based on 'contracts' for water that can have terms beyond 50 years. Some contracts have such low prices that the farmers that have them turn around and sell their contracted water at a profit to someone else. Since the contracts gurantee water to the farmers, in drought years the rest of us are left with what's left after the contract water is taken out and the price can be changed at will by the water authority. Pretty much since there's a monopoly the water utility charges us as much as they think we're willing to pay.

    The best way to ensure water security in the west is to end the practice of granting such long termed water contracts, and instead grant them with 1-5 year terms, or simply bill farmers for water at the spot price as they take the water from the canals. We should be getting our fruit from high rainfall areas of central America instead because those regions are better suited to that industry. The deserts can replace the economic loss of agriculture with solar energy and perhaps everyone can be happy and have enough water at the same time.

    As long as we're still farming in the desert, there is no water shortage. Just a make-believe one to justify price increases for the water utility companies.
    • senae, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2You guys farm... in the desert?
      Why exactly did we trust you enough to let you keep the bomb again?
      • prometheanspark, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3People all over the world farm in the desert. It used to be, around 100 years ago, that everywhere people went they had to bring agriculture in order to feed themselves. So they set up systems for making food in desert areas. That's just continued on, and in some areas, like CA, where the climate is mild (though very dry) they found that some things grew better there with artificial irrigation than elsewhere in the US. These days with your strawberries being as likely from Chile and New Zealand as down the street we should stop subsidizing the production of food in areas that aren't suited for it.

        Since it does rain during the winter in California, it's actually well suited to growing beans, wheat, barley, and other winter crops. They go for the oranges and tomatoes though because they're higher margin, and the water is dirt cheap - for now.

        Salmon and steelhead trout are also endangered in most of the state due to damming of the rivers to provide water to everyone, so environmental agencies are exacerbating the water problems as well to some extent by demanding water be let out of the dams in certain seasons for these fish. Since this is the very southern edge of their distribution, they're likely to be extirpated by global warming, in which case I guess the EPA won't stand in the way of a more extensive system of dams for hydro-electricity and water supply.

        At least we had the sense to test the bombs in the desert too. We've got a lot of it. ;)
    • eximious, on 04/28/2008, -0/+3Very true. Nationwide, agriculture uses about 40% of all water consumed. But, to expect all farming to stop anytime soon is nothing short of a fantasy.
      • coreman, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1Yep. So let's export all the agriculture to South America. Where is that land coming from, exactly? Hmm... Amazon rainforest deforestation?

        OK.

    • lhbaker, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1Nationwide, agriculture uses a lot of water, but they also happen to be in the business of feeding the rest of us. If they were charged like the rest of us, lettuce would be about $20 a head.
  • insanebrain, on 04/28/2008, -14/+3"Dear jebus. . could you please wipeout that ***** they call America... thanx"
    • lhbaker, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1If you don't live here, it's not really your problem, is it?
  • Ihatenicks, on 04/28/2008, -9/+1What's new?
    America will start a war with anyone for any reason.
  • Chaoticfist, on 04/28/2008, -4/+3If the Americans think hey are just going to drain the lakes of water they had better remember where that water comes from. We in canada could just block the majority of river from going south. Live within your means. Conserve water and use desalinization plants. Dont steal our water.
    • DeepNarcosis, on 04/28/2008, -2/+4Don't worry, you're New American Occupiers will treat you well, just see Iraq if any questions...
    • pinguwin, on 04/28/2008, -1/+0Uh, that water also comes from the U.S. and many American's live in the Great Lakes watershed. Do you live in the area that drains to the lakes? I do. So maybe you should change your statement to address this fact.
  • kb9rlf, on 04/28/2008, -2/+8Why do people thinks the Great Lakes belong to everyone? Does Florida Heat (in the winter) belong to people up north? Every state has a natural resource needed/wanted somewhere else, is everyone entitled to them as they live next door? Then I want, Niagra Falls, at easy access, and MN lakes at easy access. I want CA Beaches at easy access.

    DO NOT MAKE ME PAY MORE FOR WHAT MY STATE HAS!!!!

    We dont have a water need, have not in 20 years or so, and back then we delt with it. b/c we dont have the population base to be heard.

    I will personally apose anything in my state that wants to sell our water to another.

    I was in Atlanta, GA about a month ago, most lawns were dry, but some of the affluent people still had green lawns, etc.

    But if your lawn is not big enough to hide from the street, you can not water dew to a shortage. I have a great pic I will post when I was flying over atlanta to show what I mean. The pic will be on flicker.
    • mlavergn, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2I'd like to see that ... but keep in mind that it's early spring and Atlanta has had above average rainfall this spring, it might just be dead grass from the winter ... got a link?
  • revarien, on 04/28/2008, -1/+9We damn well better not have a 'water war'... 70% of the earth's surface is covered with it. Lrn2distillation
  • zeusthemoose, on 04/28/2008, -0/+6Fine, but if they take our water, we will tax the ***** out of them for it. People in Texas and Alaska have been taxing us for their oil, so its only fair that we tax them for our water.
  • mrzack, on 04/28/2008, -7/+5China's got plenty of fresh water up north near the northern Mongolian border. Americans need to stop eating so much meat. Corn needs fresh water, which is wasted on feeding the cows and pigs.
    • zoto, on 04/28/2008, -4/+3you gave me a good laugh, thanks!
      • mrzack, on 04/28/2008, -2/+5you make me sad with your arrogant ignorance...
  • fnordy, on 04/28/2008, -1/+7Most Americans don't know that Canada is the US's *TOP* trading partner. Every day, Billions of dollars of commerce goes across the river at the Detroit-Windsor board area. Canada is the number one supplier of Oil and Natural Gas to the US, as well as Uranium. That water should be on the table is not surprising, considering that Canada has a large percentage of the fresh water in the world....then again,Canada *is* the second largest country in the world.
    • crowbar77, on 04/28/2008, -3/+1Actually ***china*** is the now the ***TOP*** trading partner of the *US*.
      • ArchiTech, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2More like, China owns most of America's Debt...
    • senae, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2Damn you russia...

      Some day we'll have our revenge.
    • zacharytelschow, on 04/28/2008, -1/+1I don't know that I buy any of those claims... (except for maybe the most fresh water one).
      • banderwocky, on 04/29/2008, -0/+1From the CIA World Factbook website;
        "Canada enjoys a substantial trade surplus with its principal trading partner, the US, which absorbs 80% of Canadian exports each year. Canada is the US's largest foreign supplier of energy, including oil, gas, uranium, and electric power."
        https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world ...
  • SilverBlade2k, on 04/28/2008, -3/+3"Canada has water..and oil...and they also have terrorists...INVADE!"
  • Beave0101, on 04/28/2008, -4/+1Chinatown was a good movie
  • killdefenses, on 04/28/2008, -0/+2yay for the ever growing need to consume, consume, consume!
  • localzuk, on 04/28/2008, -1/+2Why is there water shortage on a planet which is 70% water?
    • zeusthemoose, on 04/28/2008, -0/+1A pesky little mineral called salt is the culprit.
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