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326 Comments
- ReinMasamuri, on 03/04/2009, -32/+121Secret ballots started so that companies couldn't retaliate against workers.
Now the unions want it out so THEY can retaliate against workers that don't become union. - Wosat, on 03/04/2009, -29/+102How does abolishing the secret ballot NOT make union voting less democratic? This is such a blatant payoff to the unions, it's sickening.
- Kangaroo12001, on 03/04/2009, -57/+113Hope and Change, let's become the USSA....
- BohicaTwentyTwo, on 03/04/2009, -31/+83Obama signaled support for a law that would make union intimidation easier, in a speech to the AFL-CIO.
FIXED - davebg8r, on 03/04/2009, -27/+68Because people dont have the free choice for unions now? How free will it be with 2 goons at your door seeing what you decide? God forbid businesses be able to put their case forward against the union. Wouldnt want any sort of fairness and hear both sides first now would we?
But they still wont allow government workers to unionize. If the unions are so wonderful, why not? Our media is so worthless that it wont even ask the simple, basic, common sense questions. They let it all go unchallenged. - Buckwyld, on 03/04/2009, -31/+66I predict a stock market plunge the day this is passed. More "good news" coming from our government.
- thoughtsonthis, on 03/04/2009, -25/+58Is this a surprise to anyone?
- Solkre, on 03/04/2009, -20/+48Do the unions do any of the members any good anymore?
- yarcod, on 03/04/2009, -13/+40How does this "make it easier" for unions to form. It sounds like it makes it easier for unions to know who's in and who's out so they can pester the people who are out.
This seems like lose-lose to me. - inactive, on 03/04/2009, -30/+57The attack on production continues.
- kanawa, on 03/04/2009, -14/+37LOL...just looked and I see you're all of 18 years old...LOL
Take some advice from Thoreau...
"How vain it is to sit down to write when you have not stood up to live" - inactive, on 03/04/2009, -30/+53Bring down the rest of the US economy by enabling more union thugs to do to what's left of US industry exactly what they did to Detroit.
Go Obama! Change the formerly richest country on the planet into a turd world rathole.
Bend over folks, this change is going to hurt.
This dope will go down in history as the very worst President ever. - Bloodwine, on 03/04/2009, -22/+45Unions have done wonders for the state of California. Let's just bankrupt the rest of the U.S. and drive businesses away.
Look, I'm not for executives and corporations mistreating the employees. I am thankful for the contributions that unions have given us, such as 40-hour work weeks. However, I think we've reached a point that unions are as bad (if not worse) than the employers themselves, though. - inactive, on 03/04/2009, -19/+40Payback to the unions for getting him elected. Change we can believe in. This guy is a walking talking contradiction to change.
- plaguepony, on 03/04/2009, -6/+26How does this empower the worker?
- kanawa, on 03/04/2009, -42/+61One more step towards total control by Obama's Thugocracy
- Ironmom61, on 03/04/2009, -15/+34Oh aren't you so darling! Look how cute you are with your little rant. Honey, my husband was teaching computers in the Marines while your mommy was wiping the poo off your butt. Don't think you hold exclusivity on the megapixels. As for Reddit, Slashdot, Gizmodo, etc they will become irrelevent in your life when you grow up.
When you get on your big boy pants, get a real job and stop typing from the computer your parents bought, come see us again. Bu-bye! - kanawa, on 03/04/2009, -22/+40George McGovern speaks out against the assault on the private vote..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=afjp4Cx-3W0 - AriKant, on 03/04/2009, -14/+32Unions were great back during the 19th century. They changed laws and gave workers their rights.
Today, unions are giant leeches on companies and the American economy. A drain on the productivity of hardworking Americans.
They no longer have a purpose in today's society. - johnyaya137, on 03/04/2009, -17/+33We wouldn't want to live in the world you want to create.
If successful, you'll eventually find you don't like living in it, either. - ChiliMac, on 03/04/2009, -6/+20This is taking power AWAY from the workers.
- TenaciousG86, on 03/04/2009, -16/+30"because employer opposition to the bill is "overwhelming."
Ah, duh! Companies don't want to go the way of the Big 3 - inactive, on 03/04/2009, -21/+34Yeah Obama, stick it to the companies that will probably just go to China anyhow.
I thought something was actually learned from the car industry collapse.
But I guess since we have spent and will spend billions bailing them out, and homeowners who probably knew on a 30,000 dollar paycheck they could never afford a home, and then turned around and took out mortgages to pay bills on top of that, I am not surprised.
Bailing out California will be a yearly exercise because Unions rule that state. Only question is how many billions will California need next year?
P.S.
AIG wants their 85 billion US dollars bailout converted into pesos - Tenareth, on 03/04/2009, -2/+15It's a lot easier when you know who you have to pressure into changing their votes.
- Tenareth, on 03/04/2009, -7/+19Unions do NOT empower employees, they empower a few Union bosses. Labor laws empower employees, as well as several other laws that protect you from discrimination, unions are not needed to empower people anymore.
- youareretarded, on 03/04/2009, -7/+19Yeah they take money out of your paycheck so that the government can't take it.
- kanawa, on 03/04/2009, -15/+26Why bother taking up your time and the obvious effort you put into your post chastising what you deem irrelevant? Don't you have anything better to do then spew your hate?
The internet is essentially conservative because it allows freedom of expression. It will only become liberal when folks like yourself are successful in your attempts to control it, to limit who can and can't opine. Liberalism is facism and it will come back to bite you on the ass unless you plan on becoming one of the oppressors. Do you? It sounds like it from your post.
Individual freedom is neither young nor old it is timeless
as is the hubris of know-it-all youngsters. - DanThePainter, on 03/04/2009, -22/+33At HotAir, Ed Morrissey comments: >...After six weeks of market crashes, it’s hard to see how Obama could foul things up any further — but this would do it. Passing Card Check at this time, with its bypass of the secret ballot and the force of government arbitration behind labor disputes, would send the few capital venture groups screaming out of the marketplace. With assets losing value by the minute and consumer spending at a standstill, the last thing the private sector needs is a hike in labor costs, which is exactly what the EFCA would provide, even disregarding its abuse of American workers.
It’s interesting that Obama isn’t talking about this in public. In the context of today’s market turmoil, it’s understandable, but what does it mean? Does Obama intend on pushing Card Check and stripping American workers of the protection of the secret ballot? Or is Obama pandering to union leaders while keeping his powder dry on labor?...>>
http://hotair.com/archives/2009/03/04/obama-tells- ... - Bloodwine, on 03/04/2009, -8/+19If this passes, I wonder what Wal-mart is going to do. How many stores will they shut down to send a message to the employees? How much can they afford to lose to fight off the unions? Because you know Wal-Mart will be the #1 target of union organizers.
- ExStatic, on 03/04/2009, -4/+14Then why can't I get a job in a closed-shop company without becoming a union member first and giving them my money? Even if I'm part-time and don't actually get any union benefits or the right to vote? It's not the idea of unions that is the problem, it's the way that many of them have been set up, which prevents free enterprise and an open market. The same thing goes for some companies, like ones who try to unfairly monopolize a market or use one monopoly to bully themselves into another market. Remember that the organization of a union is often a bunch of lawyers who get paid a lot of dues, and they end up controlling the union, not the members themselves. I'm all for organization, but not some of the practices of unions as well as corporations, which take away from the peoples' ability to make an honest wage and get somewhere in life.
- RonPauls, on 03/04/2009, -6/+15they do good for the members, and screw everyone else because the wage rates are taken out of equilibrium levels. Unemployment results, and the unionized companies fail and/or move overseas.
- kanawa, on 03/04/2009, -10/+19Yeah he hit a nerve alright...the one that triggers the gag reflex. (rare triple entendre alert)
- ITguy88, on 03/04/2009, -0/+8@ zeitgueist
Why do we have secret ballots for elections?
Why don't we just all stand in front of the voting places and yell who we want?
Because secret ballot elections allow people to choose freely without individual consequence. We don't want elections to have a "everyone else is doing it" effect, think of the old, if your friends jumped off a bridge sang. Also, like some else said earlier intimidation could come into play at the very least peer pressure would be a factor.
Unionization has been falling in every sector of the economy, except the government. Employees and workplaces are choosing not to be apart of unions not because of intimidation but freely choosing so. The US has brought great freedom with that freedom has come job mobility. That means people can change jobs more. If they feel like the company doesn't have enough benefits or compensation they leave for a better one. Which reduces the desire for unions.
Businesses are very realistic. For example, if they can't make money building cars in the US they will absolute find somewhere they can, like Mexico. Either that or they will cease to exist. Almost all parts in a car are now made outside the US. They are just assembled here. If unions continue to seek unrealistic goals, union members will be out of a job.
To sum it up. This is like a last stand for unions they know full well what I said above. If this fails to pass they will become irrelevant to the better system of labor supply and demand.
Graduate Level Economics Major
Please don't say a bunch of crap you can't backup and please don't attack me personally, debate the ideas maybe try to answer the questons :-) - davewelsh79, on 03/04/2009, -4/+12You moron. It effectively does ban secret ballots. Do you think the unions will give their members a choice of multiple voting methods? The union leaders will dictate the voting method and some union leaders will chose something other than secret ballot. Try again.
- ironhide, on 03/04/2009, -3/+11So all left leaning people have to agree with all other left leaning people?
- davewelsh79, on 03/04/2009, -3/+11You moron. It effectively does ban secret ballots. Do you think the unions will give their members a choice of multiple voting methods? The union leaders will dictate the voting method and some union leaders will chose something other than secret ballot. Try again.
- epos159, on 03/04/2009, -8/+16Empower the already struggling American worker to demand more from his employer which will either lead to higher prices for the products produced, cut backs in jobs, or a combination of the two... that's what we want!
- RonPauls, on 03/04/2009, -18/+26Unions... pushing wage rates above equilibrium levels, abridging freedom of contract, and creating unemployment since olden times
Obama says you should be buying stocks at these market prices, and then does this? Talk about mixed signals. - reaper527, on 03/04/2009, -0/+7"It is possible that unionization of health care employees would actually lower costs and improve health care in this country."
got an explanation on how this would be possible? this would simply raise the pay rates for health care employees across the board while protecting those who don't do their job, making it more difficult to get a productive work force. that doesn't sound like a cost cutter to me.
and i don't know about you, but i don't want to hear about a health care strike if i need treatment. health care is too important to take unnecessary risks with, and it would be idiotic to let unions sink their corrupt fangs into the industry - wwestbrook, on 03/04/2009, -7/+14I dont want to rain on your crazy parade but if American businesses can't afford to hire then there will not be any American workers.
- LeftieLucy, on 03/04/2009, -4/+11With all of the recent publicity surrounding ridiculously enormous CEO bonuses, I'm really amazed to see such a strong anti-union outcry here. Employees and unions don't want to bankrupt their employers - that would be a bad outcome for everyone - they are just looking for a bit of equality in how the money is divvied up.
This graph illustrates the ever expand gap between worker pay and CEO pay quite well:
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2006/04/08/bus ...
Employees are working their fingers to the bone through declining conditions and lower pay so that CEOs can rake in more and more, and it's just wacky that so many people are practically shouting, "Bleed me dry! You obviously need that private jet more than I need decent working conditions!" - inactive, on 03/04/2009, -20/+27yay more jobs to leave the country. Obama is going to make GW look like a walk in the park. I can see the possibility of even quite a bit of domestic fighting over this new socialized country.
- Tenareth, on 03/04/2009, -4/+11Actually, as a whole, they do not do well for their members. They tend to decrease the number of active workers over time (to deal with the extra labor costs), and they do not allow talented people to progress based on merit and skill.
They help the incompetent and those that do not want to earn their keep, as they are just kept around as dead wait in labor areas that probably shouldn't exist anymore. - BillE3, on 03/04/2009, -3/+10Pester or ostracize? Black listing, anyone?
- RonPauls, on 03/04/2009, -8/+15if by empower worker you mean create unemployment and crush businesses until they go bankrupt or move overseas... then yes
- diggduggjoe, on 03/05/2009, -0/+7Unions have done some good, but have brought a lot bad, too. Such as, lazy workers who are tough to fire. There was a guy at the plant I worked at that got fired. He was an extreme ***** in addition to being late often, coming to work drunk and slacking off. We all were pissed when the union saved his job for him. Sorry, but some union guys need to be fired.
They tend to prevent companies from moving workers around to maximize the effectiveness of the plant. Classifications for every job just get in the way of efficiency and weaken the company.
Another bad thing about unions are the greed they have at the expense of the health of the company. Having lived in a union town most of my life and being union myself at one time, it became clear to me the brotherhood were clueless to the health of the company. They just assumed the company was rich and could afford whatever they asked for in pay and benefits. Several of the victims of those unions went ***** up.
Obviously, it is not just management that has to be smart in a company. The union, too, has a great responsibility to be wise. - rehwaldt, on 03/04/2009, -1/+8The disparities between the workers and the CEOs is shameful. My friends and I have pondered what exactly makes these CEO's so special?
Absolutely nothing, anyone that has managed a budget could do just as good of a job as anyone of these elite executives.
What has occurred beneath our noses is that we now have a aristocracy of business elites that has risen to the top of our democracy.
Their compensation is astounding when their performance is evaluated.
Why are they not going to prison for their poor management and being held accountable for their role in our current economic crisis.
Believe me people, it is not the working class that caused this economic crisis. It was decisions that were made by the greedy elite that pushed our economy to the breaking point. - CaptainAmerica1, on 03/04/2009, -1/+8Most liberals with half a brain become conservatives after they have grown up.
Also, most liberals are conservatives who just haven't been mugged yet. - youareretarded, on 03/04/2009, -10/+16If it actually empowered the worker you would probably be right.
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