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The pleasure that Hezbollah takes in torture
haaretz.com — Tomorrow the barbaric assassin Samir Kuntar will be returned to his "brothers",without doubt amidst lots of shooting in the air and grandiose welcome speeches.He is fat,healthy,and well-kept.Israel is set to receive two soldiers in unknown condition,who never met a Red Cross representative,and whose families have no idea of their status.
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- foopirata, on 07/15/2008, -3/+32Israel is letting free a barbaric killer who has already promised to try and kill more http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3549774, ... , ... a man who while in Israeli jail finished a degree in an Israeli university,whose wife got a pension from the Israeli government,and that got regular visits of a lawyer and the Red Cross despite his admission of his crime. In exchange,two families and a country will finally learn the fate of two of their sons,who for 2 years haven't been heard of,haven't seen a Red Cross representative,and might even not be alive at all.Rumors and grand-standing are Hizzb"Allah's way of sending "news" to our side. This is the "glorious resistance" that brings so much grief to Lebanon, and only aims for more power, to the benefit of their Syrian and Iranian controllers.
We must make these facts known. - spongya77, on 07/15/2008, -32/+4And how about the hundreds, possibly thousands who are not militants, yet are held in Israeli prisons? Not saying the dude is great (the world probably would be better off without him), but let's put things into perspective, shall we? And let's review why Hezbollah came into being, too, while we're at it...
Buried as one-sided and demagogue.- franklymister, on 07/15/2008, -2/+27So you're saying that because Israel won two wars against their neighbors, that excuses the existence of people that would brutally murder a 4-year old child because she was a Jew?
Over and over and over again, Palestinian terrorists deliberately target children for death because they have been taught to see all Jews as animals, not even human beings, worthy of nothing but destruction.
I can show you lots of people who are imprisoned in the United States for what I consider no good reason, such as possession of marijuana. That doesn't mean NORML should become a terrorist organization.
I can give you explanations for why the Mafia came into being, or the Crips or the Bloods or the Latin Kings. That doesn't mean they should be able to murder, rape and torture people.- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -12/+1You might want to read up on the statistics of Israeli children getting killed and Palestinian children getting killed. http://www.btselem.org/english/statistics/Casualti ...
You will find that many more Palestinian children get killed and maimed by Israelis than vice versa.
The difference between a terrorist organisation and an army is non-existent. It is a matter of degree. The Irish army, the Israeli army and most of the armies of former colonies started out as a terrorist group. Terrorism is just what you do if you are not strong enough to shell or bomb civilians with guns or planes. The Israelis have shown they are quite capable of that.
- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -12/+1You might want to read up on the statistics of Israeli children getting killed and Palestinian children getting killed. http://www.btselem.org/english/statistics/Casualti ...
- tazd1010, on 07/15/2008, -3/+27who isnt a militant or criminal and is held in israeli prisons? Care to cite examples?
- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -11/+2Here for example is a story of a minor (13) held in an Israeli prison for two months:
http://www.btselem.org/english/Detainees_and_Priso ...
People who are not charged are innocent by definition (until proven guilty). Here are statistics which include 'administrative detainees', that is people detained without any trial and who will probably be released without any trial whatsoever: http://www.btselem.org/english/Statistics/Detainee ... - foopirata, on 07/16/2008, -1/+4From your link: "The youth was convicted of stone throwing and sentenced to two months’ imprisonment, which he served among many adult prisoners and three other minors."
Conviction in a court of law means the imprisoned person has been proven guilty to the satisfaction of the court.
Administrative detention is used (and justly so!) against Israeli settlers regularly to limit their movements in case they may be planning some kind of anti-Palestinian action.
- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -11/+2Here for example is a story of a minor (13) held in an Israeli prison for two months:
- foopirata, on 07/15/2008, -4/+27"And how about the hundreds, possibly thousands who are not militants, yet are held in Israeli prisons?" - I'd like to see some substantiation to that declaration. And even so, and I am not in any way saying that there are no cases of wrongful imprisonment (there ARE), these people are given proper medical care, access to (as in Kuntar's case) the same rights as an Israeli inmate, access to lawyers and due process before a court of law.
"let's put things into perspective, shall we?" - yes, we shall. The Regev and Goldwasser families had to learn yesterday from the Lebanese press that "one of the soldiers is dead". Not which. One of them. Not the status of the other one. Can you imagine what's going thru the hearts of those mothers? There's your perspective for you, apologist.
"And let's review why Hezbollah came into being, too, while we're at it..." - PLO attacks from Lebanon, Israel invades South Lebanon, Hezzbolah emerges as a liberation movement. How's that for a review. Also, what's that to do with the way they deal with their prisoners and the way they consider their killers rock-stars?- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -10/+2You do EXACTLY the same thing to Palestinian and Lebanese, we don't hear about it in the press is all.
- foopirata, on 07/16/2008, -1/+7Really, we do "EXACTLY" the same thing? Go ahead and show me where Palestinian prisoners are denied Red Cross visitations and lawyers. Show me where it says that their families go on for years without knowing the fate of their loved ones.
I will show you Samir Kuntar's Israeli Open University diploma in Political Sciences, and Dirani and Obeid appealling to the Israeli High Court. I'll show you the Palestinian prisioners receiving medical attention at top Israeli hospitals.
Your attempt at moral equivalency, once more, fails miserably.
Have you bought your "I heart Kuntar" t-shirt already ? You'll look just precious and oh so avant-garde and progressive on it.
- franklymister, on 07/15/2008, -2/+27So you're saying that because Israel won two wars against their neighbors, that excuses the existence of people that would brutally murder a 4-year old child because she was a Jew?
- franklymister, on 07/15/2008, -2/+27Civilization versus barbarism. Israel may commit crimes of their own in this conflict, but the core difference between the two combatants is that one is guided by rule of law, and the other by blind vengeance.
- rareimagery, on 07/15/2008, -10/+2Why is the blood of an Israeli more precious than that of a Palestinian or a Lebanese civilian..two wrongs don't make a right but their is such as thing as cause and effect. People don't resort to such desperate acts such as a beautiful Palestinian girl blowing herself up...These people have a collective PTSD. They've lived in refugee camps while Israel controls the purse strings $$$. Look at it from both sides. It's political crap that is the causation of most of this carnage and mayhem.
- franklymister, on 07/16/2008, -1/+7Why does it matter if the girl who decided to murder others by blowing herself up in a cafe or a schoolyard was beautiful or not?
No one ever said anyone's blood was more precious than another's.
There are problems all over the world, but most oppressed people don't respond by bashing infant's skulls in with rifle butts, firing missiles into city centers, beheading hostages, and sending brainwashed youth onto school buses to blow students up.
My point stands. Civilization vs. savagery. - foopirata, on 07/16/2008, -1/+5"These people have a collective PTSD. They've lived in refugee camps while Israel controls the purse strings $$$" - your ignorance is telling. The Arab states have repeatedly stated that the Palestinians should not leave the camps or that would lead them away from their refugee status; they have repeatedly kept the Palestinians away from any possibility of receiving other Arab citizenship; they have used the Palestinians as pawns for their own political games and as cannon fodder for their military adventures.
"Initially the response of host Arab states to the incoming Palestinian refugees was to offer them refuge on the assumption that it would be temporary. When it became obvious that the problem would be protracted, the policies of Arab states toward the refugees changed, and the initial sympathy was coupled with an insistence on Israel's ultimate responsibility for them. As a result most Arab governments strongly opposed resettlement and naturalization of the refugees. Instead, they adopted policies and procedures aimed at preserving the Palestinian identity of the individuals and their status as refugees. "
http://www.hrw.org/campaigns/israel/return/arab-rt ...
Contrast that with "According to official Arab statistics, 856,000 Jews left their homes in Arab countries from 1948 until the early 1970s. Some 600,000 resettled in Israel. Their descendants, and those of Iranian and Turkish Jews, now number 3.06 million of Israel's 5.4 to 5.8 million Jewish citizens." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Ar ...
Those Jewish refugees have been completely absorbed by Israel. The Palestinians, on the other hand, are kept separate and in bad conditions, by design. Don't you think Saudi Arabia has more than enough money to help the Palestinians directly, if they ever felt like it?
- franklymister, on 07/16/2008, -1/+7Why does it matter if the girl who decided to murder others by blowing herself up in a cafe or a schoolyard was beautiful or not?
- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -5/+2Hahaha, what a ***** joke. Both sides do the most horrible things, but one side is considered terrorists and one side is not, when the latter is actually carrying out terrorism on a much larger scale.
- rareimagery, on 07/15/2008, -10/+2Why is the blood of an Israeli more precious than that of a Palestinian or a Lebanese civilian..two wrongs don't make a right but their is such as thing as cause and effect. People don't resort to such desperate acts such as a beautiful Palestinian girl blowing herself up...These people have a collective PTSD. They've lived in refugee camps while Israel controls the purse strings $$$. Look at it from both sides. It's political crap that is the causation of most of this carnage and mayhem.
- itstodd, on 07/15/2008, -3/+21what an absolute bunch of cowards...
- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -6/+2Oh yes, it is so much braver to drop bombs from an aircraft than to deliver them in person.
- itstodd, on 07/17/2008, -0/+1cowards target innocent. the military targets enemy soldiers. You could actually defend Hezbollah's actions?
- foopirata, on 07/16/2008, -1/+3Actually it is braver to make peace and keep it. Like Israel has done with Egypt and Jordan.
- itstodd, on 07/17/2008, -0/+1if that were an option i might agree. How successful do you think we would have trying to make peace with Hitler? If we would stepped in sooner, there might be 6 million more happy Israelies
- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -6/+2Oh yes, it is so much braver to drop bombs from an aircraft than to deliver them in person.
- hadees, on 07/15/2008, -3/+18What is hilarious about this entire thing is that Samir Kuntar is a Druze and the Druze aren't particularly treated well by the Shia. They only want him released because it was an easy pretext for staying relevant since Israel doesn't occupy Lebanon.
- franklymister, on 07/16/2008, -1/+5Tragic news.
BOTH soldiers are dead. http://digg.com/world_news/Hezbollah_lied_BOTH_Isr ... - jabberwolf, on 07/16/2008, -2/+5"In the Gaza Strip, controlled by the violently anti-Israel Hamas group, people celebrated in the streets and handed out sweets in support of Hezbollah. " in other news.
This does not happen in Israel, but liberals seem to think that dealing with Palestinians is an easy job.
Lest they forget they also celebrated in the streets after 9/11 !!!- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -6/+1No, they do that indoors. Give me a ***** break. I have seen Israeli idiots in the streets holding up signs cheering the killing of 'Arabs'. They don't make it to the US news of course, as it would not confirm your precious stereotypes.
- urik88, on 07/17/2008, -0/+3Funny. I lived for 6.5 years in Israel, and never saw them.
- Kizilbash, on 07/16/2008, -6/+1No, they do that indoors. Give me a ***** break. I have seen Israeli idiots in the streets holding up signs cheering the killing of 'Arabs'. They don't make it to the US news of course, as it would not confirm your precious stereotypes.
- yellowcakewalk, on 07/16/2008, -10/+2Pot meet kettle.
- yellowcakewalk, on 07/16/2008, -15/+2Israeli terrorists have killed and tortured far more people than their rivals. Why are Israeli terrorists not called out for what they are?
- oyagev, on 07/17/2008, -0/+0Kuntar Vs. Hitler:
http://digg.com/world_news/Hitler_VS_Samir_Kuntar_ ...
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