What is Digg?443 Comments
- Kelgann, on 10/14/2007, -21/+227Christians love to preach and preach and preach their views, but when someone disagrees with them publicly, they scream bigotry and prejudice. It's an objective fact that the Bible's stories are simply (in almost every case) not literally true. It has nothing to do with attacking any specific religion, and everything to do with honest, unhindered academic truth.
- coolboy0286, on 10/10/2007, -31/+183There is no god. Let the burying of my comment begin.
- 28dayslater, on 10/10/2007, -7/+134Do you mean 'fired' in the literal 'consumed in a ball of heavenly fire' sense?
- Richandler, on 10/10/2007, -8/+130Let's see who got hurt more:
Students: Offended at the most, educated in the least.
Teacher: Lost the sole means of making money and living. - christopheles, on 11/03/2007, -10/+114They're there to teach facts. Such as the age of the world and the universe, the laws of the land and that the Bible is not a history text but a book of Jewish folklore and mythology similar to the holy books of every other religion. You can learn from the Bible but it's not a very good place to learn about sumerians, dinosaurs or trilobites. Unicorns however. . .
- EdgarVerona, on 10/14/2007, -6/+70FTA: Steve Bitterman, 60, said officials at Southwestern Community College sided with a handful of students who threatened legal action over his remarks in a western civilization class Tuesday. He said he was fired Thursday.
It sounds like you'd believe that the above was a coincidence then? There's a strong implication of causality in that timeline unless there's something we don't know about that he did on Wednesday. ;)
And "have other profs been fired for teaching evolution", if you're saying "probably not" as your response then there's probably not enough data to know for sure one way or the other besides presumption. - Al89, on 10/10/2007, -7/+61Has God been busy for the last few years? I don't see as many miracles or talking snakes as before.
- nevesis, on 10/10/2007, -4/+58This reminds me of a letter to Dr. Laura about taking the Bible literally:
Dear Dr. Laura:
Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God's Law. I
have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that
knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend the
homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that Leviticus
18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. I do need
some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other specific laws
and how to follow them:
When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a
pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. They
claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them?
I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in Exodus
21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair price for
her?
I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in her
period of menstrual uncleanliness - Lev.15:19- 24. The problem is, how
do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offense.
Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and
female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend
of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can you
clarify? Why can't I own Canadians?
I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus 35:2
clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated to kill
him myself?
A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an
abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than homosexuality.
I don't agree. Can you settle this?
Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I have a
defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading glasses. Does my
vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room here?
Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair
around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev.
19:27. How should they die?
I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes me
unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves?
My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two different
crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing garments made of
two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester blend). He also tends to
curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really necessary that we go to all the
trouble of getting the whole town together to stone them? -
Lev.24:10-16. Couldn't we just burn them to death at a private family
affair like we do with people who sleep with their in-laws? (Lev. 20:14)
I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident you
can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God's word is eternal
and unchanging.
Your devoted fan,
Jim - RockTheWall, on 10/14/2007, -3/+57No such thing as scientific guessing, sir; that would be an oxymoron. Scientific development of theories based on experimentation and data analysis, maybe, but scientific guessing? No dice. Back to Scientific Method 101 with you.
- inactive, on 10/10/2007, -8/+60Might as well fire teachers for saying that Santa Clause isn't real, or the Easter Bunny: The evidence supporting those two figures is the same as what supports religion, Tall Tales.
- EdgarVerona, on 10/14/2007, -1/+38Aye, that's the thing. The question becomes "in what context can you teach something from the Bible?" Unless you take a particular religion's side, you can't really teach it aside from a mythological/storytelling standpoint, which is what it sounded like the teacher was trying to do.
- Hoov, on 10/10/2007, -5/+39Holy crap you reminded me of a guy I worked with over the summer. A born again Christian and possibly America's #1 fan, it was absolutely impossible to disagree with him on either religion or the US. Didn't help he had temper problems as well. In no time flat he'd be yelling and carrying on with his beliefs.
Of course, this is also coming from the guy who spewed out, "Bush is saving the world right now. We're fighting them over there so we don't have to fight them over here."
Sorry to get off topic, but I feel like these people with that type of mentality are the ones who will drag us further into trouble. - insinuate, on 10/10/2007, -6/+40What?! the flood story wasn't true?! zomg!!
- fotbr, on 10/10/2007, -6/+39Sure they do. As long as they're presented as fairy tales.
- Pake, on 10/14/2007, -1/+33Was reading through the comments on the article's page and it really comes down to knowing more about what happened instead of taking one side or another. Basically it's this one comment from someone with the screen name of kizzie06 who may or may not be a student (seeing as this is the internet) as follow:
"Our class didn't ask for him to be fired. That wasn't our goal. Someone complained about him, I dont know why, but the next day in class, while taking attendence, he called her out on it. In front of everyone. He had no right to do that. The issue was between the two of them. Then, as the rest of us were trying to defend her, and tell him what we thought of the situation, he was laughing at us, and at her for walking out. Then proceed to say something VERY wrong to another student. She also walked out. If the comment he made to her, was made to me, i too would walk out. He had absolutely no right to say that. Not to her, not to anyone. Then, as she walked out of class, he sat there and laughed at her too.
The bible has nothing to do with this. If the 1st person who had an issue with him b/c of what he said about the bible, then fine. Leave it at that. He has his opinions and thats fine, he can state them, but when we can't state our own without him laughing at us for beliving in it, then he has gone too far. And it's obvious that a couple people reading this have had Bitterman in the past, and know what I'm talking about. So its not just the few of us that were in his class this semester...hes done this before, we're just the first ones with the balls to do something about it." - ZenMojo, on 10/10/2007, -4/+36Burying of atheist comments on a digg board? Yeah, you might as well pad your diggs with a "Ron Paul Rules" comment (because he does).
- compgeek, on 10/10/2007, -10/+39this is just retarded. granted I am a christian but I also realize that a lot of things in the bible are metaphorical I do believe the new testament mostly (some things like being tempted by the devil aren't true obviously) but this person being fired for teaching what is known fact (snakes don't talk come on people) it's pure BS.
- phantom42, on 10/10/2007, -1/+30he's just changed up his tactics.
in the old days, it was talking snakes and burning bushes.
nowadays, he puts images of the virgin mary on grilled cheese sandwiches. - Turambar, on 10/14/2007, -1/+25i do it, but mostly cause i like salt
- Indyanna, on 10/14/2007, -60/+84FTA: The school's president, Barbara Crittenden, said Bitterman taught one course at Southwest. She would not comment, however, on his claim that he was fired over the Bible reference, saying it was a personnel issue. "I can assure you that the college understands our employees' free-speech rights," she said. "There was no action taken that violated the First Amendment."
I think I'd take Bitterman's side of the story with a grain of salt. Have other profs been fired, for teaching evolution for example? Probably not. Me thinkest Bitterman protesteth too much. - jcaino, on 10/14/2007, -10/+34as a christian, i know the bible isn't to be taken literally. parables people, parables.
- DeFex, on 10/10/2007, -4/+27What backward country did this happen in?
"have to teach that there were such things as talking snakes or lose their job" - Brianguy2000, on 10/10/2007, -1/+24This can't be all to the story. He must have done something else, c'mon it's a friggin community college! My cousin went to a catholic high school and even the teachers said not to take the bible literally.
- pinguwin, on 10/10/2007, -6/+24This is as narrow minded as can be imagined. To deny the influence, for better or for worse, of religion on human history is to put your head in the sand. My Jewish atheist Marxist professor (yep, all them) said when I asked him why he had it on his shelf, 'It's one of the most influential books in history. Why wouldn't I have it?" You can't pretend it religion and its influence doesn't exist, no matter how much you want to, period.
- aadsm, on 10/10/2007, -1/+17well, the roman catholic church happens to agree with the teacher, they say that the bible isn't a science book and it is not to be taken literally.
- inactive, on 10/10/2007, -2/+17Welcome to 1984. Ideas are SO dangerous.
- ninethirty, on 10/10/2007, -5/+20Most level headed christians will agree that the Adam and Eve story is just that: a story, and that it's not meant to be interpreted literally. It's sad that a man lost his job over this..***** idiots.
- Flufflebuns, on 10/10/2007, -7/+22The bible has a good recipe for bread in it somewhere...other than that it pretty much is a load of horse *****.
- 28dayslater, on 10/10/2007, -2/+16I remember once a long time ago, when I used to smoke, an old lady approached me on the street and told me that if God wanted me to smoke he would have put a chimney on my head. I remember not being able to come up with anything in retort, I just stood there, and she kept looking at me and my cigarette with a twisted, imbecilic grin.
- UtopiaInTheSky, on 10/10/2007, -1/+15If that's the case, I'm taking my ass to church immediately.
- acidbathfan, on 10/10/2007, -1/+15I'd hate to see these same students in a class that was teaching about Voltaire or the Enlightenment
- maz2331, on 10/10/2007, -3/+16The proper response in such a situation is a simple: "***** you."
- insinuate, on 10/14/2007, -0/+13* 1-800-ACLU.
- thefinger, on 10/10/2007, -0/+13It can be in school SO LONG as it's presented in the same way as Greek or Roman mythology, tales, legends, etc.
- bugsy187, on 10/10/2007, -1/+14Of course he was fired in the literal sense. Any of you who disagree will be reported for offending my beliefs.
- grabastic, on 10/10/2007, -0/+12Right on point, Hoov! People who rely on a higher power to sort out the world's problems are the ones with the least compunction about relieving themselves of responsibility for ***** it up in the first place.
- GMorgan, on 10/10/2007, -0/+12This evidence isn't useful to the religious though. All it does is reduce Noah to some flood that covered a tiny section of the earth.
- moskaudancer, on 10/10/2007, -0/+11It's often difficult to form an intelligent response to an idiotic statement.
So I won't try.
YEEEAAAAAAAAAHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
Do ya see what I did there? :) - Ghoztt, on 10/10/2007, -10/+21I believe in God. But I am a man of whom looks at the Bible, as a historical record that has truth and lies in it at the same time. Have we not learned from historians that the Bible has been censored? Has it not been voted upon to take certain books of the Bible OUT? (The Gospel of Thomas, Essene Gospel of Peace?) We must take everything that is given to us and judge it by our best understanding of logic and common sense. If I am given a book, can I not edit it and produce my own version of it? How can God be contained to a material object which is so temporary and so easy to change? Is God not a living God who governs all Truth? All Love? All Peace? I believe God is found within these ACTIONS of Truth. These ACTIONS of Love, and ACTIONS of Peace. Not just mere words of those that build their own Dogma of lies and half-truths to keep themselves happily contained within their own ignorance.
Each person must not take the word of another for their own truth. Truth must be experienced for YOURSELF. Don't take someone's word for it ever. EXPERIENCE what you find to be true. And experience it without bias. Without your ego. I know it's hard. But I believe that is the path to true understanding.
Peace out. o/ - Alphabet, on 10/10/2007, -1/+11It seems to me that "the naked archaeologist" uses the same flawed science that every other creationist uses. They have the final conclusion set in stone, and now look for evidence to support it while disregarding any opposing view points.
- ZenMojo, on 10/10/2007, -5/+15That is to say, the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence. :)
- vanlawrence, on 10/10/2007, -2/+12There's more evidence for Santa
- phlebitis, on 10/14/2007, -2/+12Although firing a teacher for expressing his views is inexcusable, based on this comment, it sounds like this particular teacher is unfit to be leading a class of that sort. A teacher may guide the discussion, but cannot dominate it with his side or ridicule those who disagree with him. You attend college to explore ideas, not to be preached at. That is why we have church.
And no university administration will or should ever comment to the press on the firing of any of it's professors, no matter how high profile. We will only hear both sides if it ends up in court. - iruber1337, on 10/10/2007, -2/+12"I put the Hebrew religion on the same plane as any other religion. Their god wasn't given any more credibility than any other god," Bitterman said.
Just because you believe your god is better doesn't mean he has to modify his whole curriculum for you.
This is the exact reason so many religions bother me, they have no problem believing this magical man walked around on water but then someone talks about multiple gods, and even gods impregnating women and suddenly they're laughable beliefs. Same goes vice-versa. - Klinky, on 10/10/2007, -1/+11That is why they're called "theories" and not facts. There are plenty of scientists who think string theory is hogwash. There are others who definitely believe it. No one specifically knows at this time which is true. They are merely ideas/theories on the matter. No one purports that you are going to string hell if you don't believe string theory and follow it's guidelines.
- spudfrog, on 10/10/2007, -3/+12Legal action??? What kind of legal action can be taken by students that don't agree with their professor's teaching (that wouldn't be thrown out by any civil-minded judge)?
- inactive, on 10/10/2007, -21/+30Sorry Americans, you're ***** UP.
To sack a teacher in a 'modern' society because he attempted to teach students a balanced point of view, is very very very sad.
I must admit, to meet one of these Christians would be like meeting a ***** Cylon, no common point of reference, no human common sense.
And I thought MY country was ***** up.... - GMorgan, on 10/10/2007, -1/+10There is however quite a large margin for error in age of the universe figures (about 17% of the actual figure given 12.5B +/- 2.5B). This is entirely different to guessing though. Error margins are a valid scientific tool totally separated from guessing in every imaginable way.
- ronaldinho, on 10/10/2007, -2/+11I'm a Christian, but as a student, you are in school to learn new knowledge as well as to challenge what you already know. If someone says something trying to discredit your faith, then you should try to defend it instead of just kicking the teacher out. If your faith doesn't get challenged, it won't grow
- Urusai, on 10/10/2007, -3/+12I think it explains a lot about the mentality of the students when they feel like pressing a lawsuit when they hear something they don't agree with. Most fundies of all stripes are like that--silence the infidels, rather than talk with them. That is why they must be removed from civilized society. Maybe we can relocate them all to Antarctica, just call it "God's Chosen Land" or something, drop a piece of toast with the Virgin Mary's face at the south pole.
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