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150 Comments
- banderwocky, on 06/23/2009, -5/+242Sounds like they need more brave people like General Ali Fazli to stand up to the Supreme dick head.
- jjvors, on 06/22/2009, -6/+201Big doings. If the general refused to follow orders to inflict violence, how about the soldiers? How about the next general?
- inactive, on 06/23/2009, -0/+176That dude is so *****.
He's made the first stand, though. That took major courage and hopefully inspires other commanders to do the same. - IrishJoe, on 06/23/2009, -9/+166This is how the Soviet Union fell. Hardliners in the Soviet Government ordered the Red Army to fire on protesters in Moscow including Boris Yeltsin who was leading protests. The Red Army refused to fire on their own people and the Soviet Government fell.
- YokohamaGaijin, on 06/24/2009, -0/+128Evil prevails when good men do nothing. -- E. Burke
Thank you for standing up to evil General Fazli. - treehugger87, on 06/23/2009, -0/+99It has to start somewhere. If this commander is brave enough to stand up maybe others will follow.
- CSFFlame, on 06/24/2009, -0/+81Arresting commanders of armed forces has been a direct cause in the fall of many a regime.
Just sayin... - LouisCipher777, on 06/23/2009, -2/+78freedom is never free, and this man knows it.
- SpookyET, on 06/24/2009, -1/+69I hope he is not executed for treason.
- yutt, on 06/24/2009, -0/+51@NerveBand
How would I like it if commanders in Iraq refused to listen to illegal orders from the President to attack civilians for holding peaceable protests of their government? I would like it a lot.
Maybe you need to familiarize yourself with the concept of Rule of Law, which has been a foundation of democracy. No one, including the President, or those acting on his behalf, are outside the control of the law.
Unfortunately, Iran does not adhere to the Rule of Law, which is why it is necessary for its people, including military commanders, to do what they must to bring about a more true democracy.
You seem to have an extremely perverse understanding of the purpose of laws... they don't exist to forever justify dictatorships. Also read up on the Nuremberg Principles of international law. - inactive, on 06/24/2009, -0/+48That's why the Iranian people need to support him, and demand his release.
Others in the guard will then feel safe to do the same, knowing they have support. - aFoxy21, on 06/24/2009, -9/+54It takes a lot of courage to do what he did - and same goes for all those in Iran who are protesting for fair elections. I don't envy them their fight.
Makes you wonder -- in 2000 the US had many peaceful protests (more peaceful than these, certainly). Would anything have changed if we had, collectively, been more outraged? If we had more forcefully insisted that the recount in Florida be allowed to continue? - Doc123, on 06/24/2009, -0/+38Very brave move.
- Ne007, on 06/24/2009, -9/+47I wish police in the US would have the balls to stand down when they are ordered to bag and tag peaceful protesters.....but yet the police beat protesters down in the US:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9tKCez2r8s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juBhQfgedE0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_l8FRRLkNk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_mAWslHmiok
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGeTmy8CD40
on and on with brutality.... - SwiftKick34, on 06/24/2009, -0/+36This is big, my best wishes for a braver man than I.
- AndrewRidgely, on 06/24/2009, -0/+34@NerveBand
You have a point that we need a chain of command in military. Armies cannot function without commanders having confidence that their order will be carried out. But sometimes an order is given that violates not just judgement or moral certitude, but that violates laws (like the Geneva Convention, Habeus Corpus, etc.) or that violates fundamental human rights (killing innocent civilians holding a protest).
In that case, it is the duty of the officer or trooper to disobey that order and protest. As Coven brought up, "just following orders" was not an acceptable excuse for Hilter's generals and brass, and that is as it should be. - maz2331, on 06/24/2009, -0/+33Part of my training in the USAF was a class that actually discussed how to respond to illegal orders, and that drilled into the student's head that he was responsible for arresting anyone (even an officer) who issued one.
We were specifically taught never to just blindly follow orders, but to absolutely follow lawful orders - and to place even a superior issuing such an order under arrest, if necessary in such a case.
No professional military person ever deliberately shoots an unarmed civillian. It's one thing if they are caught in a crossfire, or are killed in an attack on a militarily significant target, but it's totally wrong to just deliberately kill people who are not part of the fighting. - Totenkopf88, on 06/24/2009, -0/+30As the Russian says; "The fish rots from the head down"
This is good news BTW. - andydumi, on 06/24/2009, -0/+29Its a tipping point. Others will either follow and the revolution is on, or no one follows and he gets eliminated along with any other dissenters, and here comes another couple decades of dictatorship through fear.
- atroxodisse, on 06/24/2009, -0/+28That man has big stones. I applaud him.
- IphtashuFitz, on 06/24/2009, -0/+26Um. It sounds to me like this general did make his own decision.
- Totenkopf88, on 06/24/2009, -1/+27It also means that Soldiers that were on the fence about the issue or felt that felt that shooting at protesters were wrong in the first place have now just got a reason to walk away and switch sides. It may not be apparent now but General Ali Fazli just turned the tide.
- Coven, on 06/24/2009, -2/+27hate to invoke Godwin here but it was better to just be a good little Nazi, eh?
- PirateD00D, on 06/24/2009, -0/+24We salute you General Ali Fazli.
- ZenMojo, on 06/24/2009, -1/+23Mikhail Gorbachev had been working for months on how to slowly cede power while maintaining Soviet Supremacy. Quite to the contrary, it was lower-ranking officers in the KGB and military who defied their superiors by engaging in oppressive activity and plans to usurp Gorbachev and overthrow him in a coup...in order to maintain Soviet power paradoxically.
Gorbachev then decided it would be best if membership in the Soviet Union was voluntary. Few states wanted anything to do with it.
Communist anti-secessionists decided Gorbachev was getting out of hand and finally decide to take him out, so Gorbachev was put under house arrest. By the time he came out Boris Yeltsin had solidified power in his absence.
So it's kind of like what Joe said, except the opposite. In FACT, rogue soldiers had begun attacking civilian protestors in Baltic states and Gorbachev was juggling chainsaws trying to clean up the mess until he finally realized ***** was done. - jsuther, on 06/24/2009, -0/+22Hero
- lolwatermelon, on 06/24/2009, -0/+20"No offense, but in any military setting, I do NOT agree with mutiny or disobeying laws."
If an order is illegal, it is your right and DUTY to refuse it. - atroxodisse, on 06/24/2009, -0/+19Often men are loyal to the man who stands beside them in battle, and not the figurehead who points them in the direction of their doom.
- inactive, on 06/24/2009, -0/+18Ayatollah Khamenei is a foolish man. To think a MAN of GOD in the information age would use deadly force to retain power and cement his rule over a people shows that he is not what he claims to be. He is just a man and his flawed logic shows he is not very forgiving and divine in his thinking.
Power at all costs....even if it means trashing the concept of GOD.
General Ali Fazli it seems has a greater grasp on morality than the supreme leader. He is able to defend his nation while ignoring the crazed cries from his leader which would be extremely hard to do. A true warrior of the people? - inactive, on 06/24/2009, -2/+20The revolution 2009 has begun
- Mship, on 06/24/2009, -2/+19I dont know what country you were in when Obama was running for office but there were plenty of republicans who tried to say that Obama and people who supported him were rigging the election.
The only reason it didnt make it big on the news was because only an idiot would believe such ***** based on the actually turnout for support that happened in this past election. - solid12345, on 06/24/2009, -2/+19Uh how did it happen then?
- dafragsta, on 06/24/2009, -1/+17I'm sorry, but the reason Neda is relevant is because filmed being shot. That's not some staged incident for political gain. It takes a cold callus bastard to insinuate that kind of thing and no one is going to volunteer to be martyred while betraying one of the figureheads of her faith. She has nothing to gain by being dead at a very young age. In the eyes of her religion (assming she was Muslim) she was betraying orders from the Muslim equivalent of the Pope. It doesn't matter how she went out. She went out defying what were then unbeatable odds and under implication of eternal damnation.
You don't get the kind of public backlash that Iran's ruling theocracy because of some staged event. Every single person who protests is in mortal danger and there is plenty of evidence to support that. What you have here is that they went one step too far and started shooting at protesters and they shot and killed a very young woman, which couldn't have possibly been more symbolic of the vicious nature of a power structure that really doesn't give a flying ***** for the people it governs. That pretty much bankrupted any moral leverage they had on their people. - ltethe, on 06/24/2009, -0/+16You need a comma.
- Pyehole, on 06/24/2009, -0/+15If the police would actually police their own members perhaps they wouldn't all be painted with the same broad brushstroke. As it stands, I have no reason to trust the police or even believe them. It seems like there is a story every day about LE malfeasance, lies or criminal activity. And I'm a middle class white guy. What do you think the average minority thinks of them?
- GMills, on 06/24/2009, -0/+13I don't know why but I literally laughed out loud at Supreme Dick Head
- Buckwyld, on 06/24/2009, -2/+15All this means is they put someone in charge with no qualms about shooting at protesters.
- Totenkopf88, on 06/24/2009, -1/+14Better to die standing than live on your knees. Well,that's how I,and many of the Iranians,feel but you can go on living with out dignity I suppose.
- astinus12, on 06/24/2009, -0/+11Dear General Ali Fazli,
Thank you for being human, and just.
Love,
The World - LimeParrot, on 06/24/2009, -0/+11The guy is a hero. He lost an eye in the Iran-Iraq war. He is like pirate-level awesome. My dad showed me a photo but I can't find it.
- Peko, on 06/24/2009, -1/+12I wish there was some sort of security force - like a group that protects and serves the public - that would deal with those loose cannon types.
- bdbr, on 06/24/2009, -0/+11No doubt the odds aren't good for him. That's what made his deed so courageous.
- keviniskool, on 06/24/2009, -2/+13Freedom is a $1.05
- superkendall, on 06/24/2009, -0/+11When they say he was "sacked", they aren't kidding.
- dty2010, on 06/24/2009, -0/+10Now, we must all fear evil men. But, there is another kind of evil which we must all fear most... and that is the indifference of good men.
- dty2010, on 06/24/2009, -0/+10The video of Neda was going around before the MSM picked up on it.
- angryfirelord, on 06/24/2009, -2/+12Granted, it is an oversimplification, but it certainly was a key factor in the Soviet Union's weakening power structure. One of the things that the Soviet Union did was to use force to keep its system in place. When that broke apart, then the government lost control.
- bdbr, on 06/24/2009, -0/+10Just to back up what AndrewRidgely wrote: this duty is taught in officer training school. IIRC, the My Lai Massacre is used as precedence, not anything to do with Hitler's general.
- inactive, on 06/24/2009, -0/+9If the army surrounded the leaders the deaths would end today. Its all it takes...
- agent42, on 06/24/2009, -0/+9I wonder if this marks some kind of important shift in the 'revolution' ?
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