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145 Comments
- faskill, on 03/16/2009, -0/+66It would seem that if the property owner is walking away, that should do away with any legal obligation to fulfill a previously existing lease. The lease is a two way contract.
- inactive, on 04/03/2009, -0/+47"In one abandoned Bethany property — the 500-plus-unit Granite Bay in Phoenix — tenants were served notice by the water company on March 6 that their water would be shut off in five days because of an outstanding $64,000 bill."
I hope these tenants find a legal recourse soon. It's unbelievable that they can keep paying their rent and their bills and still be denied running water. - REBECCAFRIEDMAN, on 03/16/2009, -6/+52Yet one more disgusting example of how the middle class is being sold down the river - hardworking renters getting screwed by corporations who drop their underperforming investment properties, with little to no fear of any legal repercussions.
- zacharytelschow, on 03/16/2009, -0/+28That had been my thought as well; once one side declares a contract null and void the other side has no obligation to fulfill that same contract.
- inactive, on 03/16/2009, -1/+19except one is a corporation and one is just a peon, guess who the law favors.
(try charging a company a late fee for late delivery of good or service) - KimmyGibbler, on 03/16/2009, -0/+18Point taken, but it shouldn't matter as long as they get their check in on time
- Taiyoryu, on 03/16/2009, -3/+19Granting corporations personhood was one of the biggest mistakes this country has committed.
- directedition, on 03/16/2009, -0/+15"For example, in Arizona and at least 30 other states, there is no legal requirement to notify tenants that the property is going through foreclosure, it said. And only New Jersey and the District of Columbia explicitly preserve tenants’ rights in the lease after a foreclosure."
WTF?! How in the hell did this happen? Did this just slip everyone's mind? Did the concept of foreclosing a rental property never come to mind? - byronm, on 03/16/2009, -0/+13Its only going to get worse.. Many builders hoped that Property values would continue to climb so they could inflate rents as much as possible and forecasted those inflations into their growth. Once the growth stagnated the only way they can stay in business is to cut costs however you can't cut costs when operating expenses are still growing beyond your revenue.
Everyone wanted to be a property manager when the going was good, yet its saddening how many of them never planned for the innevitable bad. - localsheriff, on 03/16/2009, -4/+16OMG! That is a shame. There should be some kind of law to protect the tenants. I am outraged!
- zacharytelschow, on 03/16/2009, -1/+13Free slum housing FTW.
- durruticolumn, on 09/18/2009, -1/+12
Here's a solution: Form a tenant's union, get a lawyer, and petition the city to take the complex over as a cooperative. - tgjerusalem, on 03/16/2009, -0/+11I wonder if this is what happened with my building. It's always been decrepit (the joys of slumlords - apparently exploding toilets and non-functional electricity aren't his problem), but we haven't even seen the landlord since the start of February. He never came by to get March's rent, we have no idea where he is, and we have no contact information.
- freedomischaos, on 03/16/2009, -0/+10Why did the police break up the meeting at the end? I thought we had the RIGHT to assemble peacefully. We own our choices, if I decide to break lease legally or illegally, it is still MY choice. I hope that any judge in their right mind would understand why a person broke a lease if the mother company simply abandoned multiple complexes around the US. It shows no incentive to stay, no incentive that things are being worked on, and it is not what I am paying for. I guess, we really don't own anything, not even our choices.
- Solkre, on 03/16/2009, -1/+10If the owner walks off on me, I'm walking off on the lease.
- jpop, on 03/16/2009, -0/+9Same way the house flippers "didn't know". ie. they did, but they thought they were going to be able to get out in time before everything went to crap...
- phosphite, on 03/16/2009, -4/+11Pic of the officer in the story looks like he's just seen goatse the first time.
- durruticolumn, on 09/18/2009, -2/+9
No, actually, if it's abandoned, most cities have eminent domain laws that allow them to sieze abandoned properties. - Demener, on 03/16/2009, -1/+8"How do you know they are hardworking?"
$850/month for a 1 bedroom is generally not affordable on unemployment. - tgjerusalem, on 03/16/2009, -2/+9Because most people who have to pay rent are. And even most who don't currently have a job are trying desperately to find one before whatever savings they have are gone.
- Wolfboy, on 03/16/2009, -0/+7It's likely the bill is for more than one month.
- inactive, on 03/16/2009, -0/+7then enjoy living rent free and save up your cash! But realize that you should probably look elsewhere to live :) if your utilities bill is included in the rent, then call up the electric company and discuss your options with them. they may offer you a budget package. however, im not a lawyer so don't take this as legal advice - just a renters experience.
- leandra, on 03/16/2009, -0/+7There are some who'd prefer to live in an apartment, yes. But most I know do it because they have to. You say "to save money" like it's a bad thing. On the other side of the coin it's called, "living within your means". Renters aren't the ones foreclosing on homes they couldn't afford. And during the bubble, mortgage payments were considerably higher than rent. Only now as housing prices come down is it starting to come closer together.
The fuss is because:
1) You gave someone money as part of your contract, your lease, and they aren't holding up their end. That's annoying no matter what.
2) Because the landlord ran off, they're unlikely to get their last month/security deposits back. Again, that's a bitch when it's 2 months worth of rent lost.
3) They have to come up with a new first/last/security deposits for new apartments pretty damn quick.
4) Moving is always a bitch. - Dustin00, on 03/16/2009, -1/+8A wild guess here: in Phoenix water costs a bit more than most other places.
- Solkre, on 03/16/2009, -0/+7You walk off to a new place with hopefully responsible owner, or see if it's time to buy a house.
You've never moved before? - Khast, on 03/16/2009, -1/+8Well, that depends on your situation. I don't qualify for a home loan...so therefore what are my options? It sure in the hell isn't to "save money"
- jonathanseely, on 03/16/2009, -0/+6Dear Landlord: Please don't abandon our house.
- Sinnocent, on 03/16/2009, -0/+6Just had this happen to me and my husband. We're now living with MY family, in another state, until we can find a suitable replacement home. It's so sickening.
- smurfsahoy, on 03/16/2009, -0/+6Its called contract law. Whether it's being upheld or not is a different issue.
- MindStalker, on 03/16/2009, -0/+5All that means is that the company hasn't paid for water for many, many months.
- publiclurker, on 03/16/2009, -0/+5Don't worry about people like that. If you were to stretch things to buy a house, they'd then blame you for doing something you couldn't afford. They are only interested in finding a way to blame the victims.
- jeremyosborne81, on 03/16/2009, -0/+5Considering the "Middle Class" is anybody who makes more than "poverty level" but under $250,000 per year, yes they do.
- darkstar949, on 03/16/2009, -0/+5That raises a good question, shouldn't the renter's be treated as creditors to the complex due to their security deposit? A bit of a lawyer question there, but I am curious. I know that in NH they are required to put your security deposit in an interest bearing account and must also pay you that interest when you move out less any charges.
- tgjerusalem, on 03/16/2009, -0/+5When you're living close to the edge having several month's rent set aside is a lot easier said than done.
Losing my deposit is by now an unfortunately routine experience regardless of how well I care for the apartment, but it isn't supposed to be like this! That's a goddamn contract, and my landlord should have to abide by it as much as I do!
Just because it's routine theft to disappear with someone's deposit, doesn't mean it isn't still theft! And the poor are the most vulnerable, because they can take our money and run knowing we have little or no legal recourse! - rahsut, on 03/16/2009, -0/+5the sad part is the security deposits disappearing, you can't expect the new landlord to refund the deposit since you didn't give it to him and the old landlord is gone leaving you with the loss
- crawfishsoul, on 03/16/2009, -0/+5$200 is pretty damn high for a one month water bill in Phoenix. My water bill never goes over $90-100 even in the dead of summer and I've got a yard to water.
Hell, my dad has a 15,000 gallon swimming pool and a full lawn front and back and usually never tips over the $200 mark unless the pool is getting a lot of use. - darkstar949, on 03/16/2009, -0/+5If the bank is in foreclosure proceedings you might even be able to go directly to the bank in that situation.
- DangerMouse9, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4@baddigga
What the ***** does one have to do with the other? Is your definition of hard working someone who doesn't gamble away 401k money and get a bail out and then pay themselves a bonus?
Your argument makes as much sense as "I do not see a tiger in front of me, therefore tigers don't exist."
Or, here let me put it in your words:
I am not a *****, stupid moron.
You are not me.
Therefore, you are a *****, stupid moron. - inactive, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4But defex, you don't pay a delivery company for a guaranteed delivery of service. the law permits a reasonable amount of time for said contractual obligations to be fulfilled. If I request next-day service, and the package comes in two days - as long I didn't occur any damage, then there is no fault. However, if said package doesn't arrive for three months, then yes - you do have legal recourse.
- KimmyGibbler, on 03/16/2009, -1/+5My landlord is a peon. I think most are, unless we are talking high-rise apartments or office buildings
- CookieM, on 03/16/2009, -1/+5Last summer my roommates and I were served an eviction notice by the bank. The owner didn't tell us he was in foreclosure. The prick kept our huge deposit, now we can’t find him to serve him the small claims court papers.
.
Annoying part is that we loved the place and we offered the bank our rent but they couldn’t handle it. Now the new owner is renting it for the same rate!!! GRRR!!
. - blacktriangle, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4How did the apartment complex flippers not know this was going to go bad?
- smurfsahoy, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4I don't get it. The article keep saying things like "Yeah, you could sue, but where would the money come from?" I don't know, perhaps the 80 huge residential complexes that are all available for repossession and paying off the company's debts? Sell the refrigerator in my apartment and give me back my security deposit when I leave.
This is not a company that existed as a PO box and a chair and a desk somewhere. It has tons of stuff that can cover these claims. - jsffive, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4And the landlord also pays for upkeep, and the renter can shop around for lower rents, and move.
If you're not actually planning on OWNING THE HOME at some point (meaning, having the deed in hand), it makes no sense to BUY a home. The only advantage to buying a home is that, at some point down the road, you're going to live rent-free, IF you actually finish buying the house! That's a "nuance" that has been completely lost upon this generation of "house flippers"...
A renter can shop around for lower rents. A fixed rate loan only becomes cost-effective after the first couple of years, when the mortgage dips below the average rent of a particular region. And a variable rate loan is just a game of Three-card Monte, in which the home buyer is BANKING on being able to sell the house before the higher mortgage payment kicks in.
With an over abundance of empty houses now on the market, that game is over. And it's about high time. - jsffive, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4The only reason why someone would buy a home is because, at some point, they're planing on actually OWNING THE HOME! Actually having the deed in hand means that you go rent-free... with the exception of paying property tax.
But how many "home owners" in this country, are in fact, going to spend the rest of their lives... PAYING A MORTGAGE?
That's not "home ownership", that's "home BUYERSHIP"! And our culture is so screwed up about this, that my spell checker actually flags the word "buyership". It doesn't even recognize it as a word! And yet, that's what MOST home buyers are doing, "buyership".
If you're going to pay a mortgage every month for the rest of your life, and never actually OWN THE HOME... then how is that different from renting? In that instance, all you're doing is RENTING FROM THE BANK!
If you "own" a home and your washing machine breaks down, and you don't fix it, you go without a washing machine. If you RENT a home or apartment, and the washing machine breaks down, and the landlord doesn't fix it... you can MOVE!
It seems to me that breaking a lease, because the landlord isn't holding up their bargain, is FAR EASIER than breaking a mortgage contract, because you can't afford the payment. Please tell me where I'm wrong. And keep in mind that I've moved four times in the past five years... and it HASN'T damaged my credit rating. - shredswithpiks, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4Yes - you won't lose your living space but (since owning a condo means you own the airspace, paint to paint, and have only a vested interest in the actual building) the property owner can go under. There's almost always another company that will rush in to buy it, but lots of similar bad things can happen with condos. Also, you can't walk away from the mortgage the same way you can walk away from a lease.
*family member owns a condo who's property owner is currently going through bankruptcy stuff - brettg102, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4Landlord-Tenant law is a part of every state constitution in the union. There is law to protect the tenant, they are just choosing not to pursue the application of those laws.
I would suggest to these tenants that they pay all of their rent to the courts in an escrow account which will be used to pay the creditors of the landlord, water stays on. Landlord doesn't get money until the issues are resolved. - jsffive, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4The upside to this is that, those foreclosed apartments will create a glut, which will FORCE the rent fees down.
At least those renters won't be saddled with a HOUSE PAYMENT that they can't make. - tgjerusalem, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4A lease is a contract - the landlord is theoretically obligated to abide by it too. If I sign a year long lease, they are responsible for that property until that lease is up. That includes paying any utilities that the contact specifies are included in my rent, and basic upkeep of the property.
Not to mention that if landlords disappear suddenly, this leaves on wondering where the hell the security deposit went. I count on getting my security deposit back when I move out of an apartment, because I'm probably going to be using it to cover the security deposit at the new place. If the landlord disappears with it, that's theft. - tgjerusalem, on 03/16/2009, -0/+4Yea. Because home loans are just flowing like water right now, and everyone has piles of cash around.
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