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Fatah, Hamas sign reconciliation deal

ynetnews.com — Fatah had said it would agree to direct reconciliation talks with Hamas only if the Islamist group first agreed to relinquish its hold on Gaza, home to 1.5 million Palestinians. Factions reconvene in last ditch effort to hammer out compromise over future of Gaza and the West Bank.

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  • Iconoclast25, on 03/23/2008, -17/+25Well, both groups have more in common than not: palestinian, terrorists and selfish about power. Seems like a marriage made in Hell to me.
    • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -21/+12Give Peace a chance, you chickenhawk Likudnik.
      • neko6, on 03/23/2008, -8/+18Fatah+Hamas combine forces against Israel =/= peace. Just a bigger war.
        Hopefully, Fatah will pull Hamas into peace talks, instead of Hamas pulling Fatah into violence. I wonder how many more people will die before Hamas finally changes the call for eternal war in their charter.
        • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -14/+6Geesh there are so many wrong implications in there. Democratically-elected Hamas has had so many offers of truce and peace, like the lull right now for instance, in front of Israel, you look silly saying they are pulling anything, even themselves, to war.
          Now, are they essentially a US CIA-funded front like the PA which took over the West Bank and is universally despised by all Palestinians? No.

          You may not like what Hamas has in their charter, but people rarely like their enemies. It's certainly not a reason to refuse to negotiate with them. Israel has the same sort of thing. Israel calls them terrorists, an entire elected government mind you, and they have laws and directives to destroy and kill all terrorists, so it's the same.
          • Iconoclast25, on 03/23/2008, -6/+13Advocating and seeking to achieve the destruction of a nation state =/= interception and execution of criminals. That dog don't hunt, neo; you don't even get points for playing the card.
          • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -13/+5Hamas is not "criminals," it's an entire government and infrastructure, and you know it. Hamas wants to destroy the Israeli government, Israel wants to kill every last member of Hamas, a government.

            You just don't get away with calling them criminals. They're not. They think the Israeli government & military are criminals. They're not, somewhat. Accept it now, or you'll be forced to accept it later, Likud boy.
          • yonoz, on 03/23/2008, -3/+11So, you don't consider terrorists who attack innocent civilians with rockets and suicide bombings as criminals.
            BTW, Hamas want to destroy all of Israel, not just the government, while "Israel" does not want to kill every last member of Hamas.
        • neko6, on 03/23/2008, -5/+13"o many offers of truce and peace" - no peace offers, only temporary truce offers while dismissing the agreements signed by past Palestinian governments. If Bush said today that all pacts signed by previous US administrations with other countries, for instance the Geneva accords, are void - you would be outraged. If Israel would say today that the Oslo accords signed by Israel in 1995 are void and Israel is retaking West Bank and Gaza, you would be outraged. But when the Palestinian government revokes previous agreements (mostly the clause that allows the Jews to live) - you don't seem to care.

          "people rarely like their enemies" - when people turn enemies into friends, they declare changes. When the US and Japan signed a peace treaty, they acknowledged eachothers' right to live in their countries. Israel agreed to let the Palestinians live in their country - when Hamas agrees to let the Israelis live in their country, we could start having true dialog.

          "Israel calls them terrorists" - because they utilize murder of civilians as a political tool, which means they ARE terrorists. "an entire elected government mind you" - the Nazis were an entire elected government, does that protect them from accusations of war crimes?
          "and they have laws and directives to destroy and kill all terrorists" - the terrorists want to kill civilians, hence killing the terrorists = saving civilian lives.

          Bottom line is that Hamas can single handedly end the violence any moment, while Israel cannot. Therefore, its Hamas' move everyone is waiting for. But in Arab politics, a real truce is akin to surrendering, and Hamas can't be seen as surrendering, or they will be replaced by the terrorists more eager to fight.
          • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -12/+4Do NOT compare the illegitimate, CIA-backed PA as a "past government." Those agreements were not made by Hamas, and were not agreed to by the Palestinians. They were never valid in the first place, especially now that we know the US funded the PA. Palestinians think they are thugs and hate them! So no, the three preconditions Olmert wants for talks with Hamas are non-starters. You all should stop bringing that up. It's a wish-list the Palestinians do not wish for. And by the way, Bush did pull out of the Nuclear Nonproliferation Treaty. Israel didn't say anything.

            Hamas has offered to change their charter in the past, most notably in 2006, as part of a peace deal. Haven't you seen that? I'm surprised you haven't. Regardless, they have definitely offered to recognize the state of israel many times. If you want them to change their charter, which only came about after years of armed struggle against Israel, you'll have to negotiate.

            Your definition of terrorism isn't correct at all. Killing civilians by itself? When is killing civilians NOT for a political goal? Your country calls it terrorism, I call it guerilla warfare. Don't even get me started on the apartheid situation you have 1.5 million Gazans suffering in, which by the 1948 Conventions on Genocide IS genocide. Ugh do not even get me started.

            You have a very biased view, and a racist view, but that's understandable. So do they. Now sit down and negotiate!
          • neko6, on 03/24/2008, -0/+3"Those agreements were not made by Hamas, and were not agreed to by the Palestinians." - The Geneva convention was never authorized by the Republican party, thus Bush can revoke them and torture anyone he wants. Makes any sense?

            "They were never valid in the first place, especially now that we know the US funded the PA. " - Several Arab nations fund Hamas, Iran and Syria supply them with specialized anti-civilians weaponry and training to use it. Why is that more valid than Fatah funded by the US? Also, why is the Palestinian government being funded a bad thing?

            "the three preconditions Olmert wants for talks with Hamas are non-starters. You all should stop bringing that up. It's a wish-list the Palestinians do not wish for." - If you think its OK for Hamas to restart negotiations and forget anything signed in the past, Israel is allowed to also waver anything the Labor party signed in the past. For instance, they can reclaim the West Bank and Gaza under military occupation, meaning the Palestinian government is void. I have a suspicion that wouldn't fly with you. You can't have the cake and leave it whole.
            P.S: Can you name one thing in the treaties signed by the PA that is so bad for the Palestinians?

            "Hamas has offered to change their charter in the past, most notably in 2006, as part of a peace deal. Haven't you seen that?" - never heard of it, source?

            "Don't even get me started on the apartheid situation you have 1.5 million Gazans suffering in," - exactly the same apartheid Iraqis have - they can't vote in the US elections, and they can't enter the US without special permits. And you know what, Israelis also can't vote in the US elections or enter the US without special permits. Amazing.

            "Your country calls it terrorism, I call it guerilla warfare." - so its OK if Israel decides to kill as many Palestinians as possible? Again, you can't have one sided moral - if its OK to kill civilians for political reasons, Israel would be allowed to kill every last Palestinian for the political cause of gaining land. CHOOSE damn it - is it right or is it wrong to kill civilians for political causes?

            "You have a very biased view, and a racist view" - not biased, just realistic. Whats racist in my comment btw?
        • caferrell, on 03/23/2008, -11/+4Hamas has not called for eternal war. They have called for Israel to return to its legal boundaries. Lets tell the truth, shall we?
          • yonoz, on 03/23/2008, -4/+12Yes, let us tell the truth - for Hamas those legal boundaries are non-existent - they wish Israel ceased to exist.
          • Stevanoski, on 03/23/2008, -3/+7Like most of the Left these posters have bought the rewrittien history that now the aggressor are the victims and visa versa. Neo and cafe will never change their minds.
          • wpi97, on 03/24/2008, -1/+6No, not an eternal war. Just until all the Jews are dead. http://www.mideastweb.org/hamas.htm
          • caferrell, on 03/24/2008, -5/+2Just until all the jews are dead.

            Pal, over ten times more Palestinians are killed by Israelis than vice versa. You know that and you know that I know that, quit the lies.
          • neko6, on 03/24/2008, -1/+4"over ten times more Palestinians are killed by Israelis than vice versa" - In WW2, more German Christians died than German Jews - does that mean the Jews are the aggressors in the war who decided to exterminate the poor defenseless Germans?

            If the Palestinians had the means, all the Jews would have been dead long ago - in 1834, in 1929, in 1948, in 1967, in 1973, in 1982... In any of the previous attempted genocides. Just because they don't have the means doesn't mean they don't have the will.
      • Iconoclast25, on 03/23/2008, -7/+16Try telling that to the terrorists, neo - they are the ones insistent on the destruction of Israel, the ones who continued launching attacks on Israel after agreeing to stop in exchange for the Israelis handing over Gaza to the palestinians, they are the ones who take the billions in humanitarian aid and use it to buy weapons. In short, they are the ones who need to change. Israel is like a wolverine - leave it alone and it will leave you alone; attack it and find your belly laid open and throat ripped out. Your heroes aren't too smart, however - they keep kicking the wolverine to see if maybe they can do so with impunity and keep getting chewed up. The Israelis REALLY ought to do a more thorough job of chewing and then MAYBE the survivors would be able to grasp the flaws of their strategy.
        • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -13/+4Are you sure the majority of Israelis would go along with your wolverine simile? By the way, the first wild wolverine in forever has been seen recently. Good news.

          Hamas and PA are meeting for no other reason than to be able to negotiate with Israel better. You should be glad! If PA was back in the picture, Olmert would have no more need to hesitate. That is, if you really want peace. Do you want peace, Likud boy?
          • Iconoclast25, on 03/23/2008, -3/+13You must have missed the news where Fatah (the PA group) took "credit" for the attack which killed the eight kids studying in the Jewish library, eh? I have no idea if the majority of Israelis would agree with my simile or my view. Those are my own and while yes, I would dearly like to see peace in that part of the world, I doubt mightily it can be had as long as the 7th Century savages are allowed to influence world affairs. And spare me the infantile ad homs, mac; I don't need them to recognize the sterile infertility of your banal comments.
          • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -12/+3No, Fatah didn't claim it, Hamas did. No way, where did you hear that?

            "7th Century savages" Do you understand how racist, dehumanizing, and anti-Arab that is? Shouldn't you start trying to reform your tongue a bit since you're about to have new friends once the peace negotiations conclude?

            sterile infertility = redundant, but I get your meaning. Also, why would you think I want my comments to be anything other than banal?
          • Iconoclast25, on 03/23/2008, -3/+11"Also, why would you think I want my comments to be anything other than banal?"

            You're right, why would anyone like you want to be taken seriously? Trust me, I will not make that mistake again. I also note you did not quarrel with my characterization of your behavior as infantile. [Set Ignore ON]
          • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -10/+2I guess you won't admit your racism, but thanks for letting me know how young you are. Get your homework done!
        • neko6, on 03/23/2008, -3/+15Neo, you seem to be far away from understanding the Israeli civilian viewpoint. The average Israeli has seen thousands of Palestinian terrorist attacks attempting to murder him, several wars with the DECLARED goal of his people's genocide, and an entire world indifferent to his suffering, but sympathetic to his enemy's suffering. He also saw the Palestinian groups betray their allies as well as Israel numerous times.

          It would take a very big step from the Palestinian side to cause the average Israeli to trust that they are honestly reaching out for a true peace. The Israeli civilian knows the Palestinians' historic untrustworthiness - but is willing to put it aside if they declare a change of policy.

          They have yet never done so.
      • Jeff82, on 03/23/2008, -2/+14Lessee... 84% of the "palestinians" (actually just plain ole' arabs) supported the latest seminary school shooting... yeah they're all about "peace"!

        Get a grip.
  • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -24/+11neko6, you submiited something from liberal ynetnews, are you feeling allright?

    Then again, the article keeps repeating the same lie over and over, about how Hamas "took over" Gaza. We all know that's not true, that Hamas was elected by all the Palestinians in an internationally monitored election to be the government. The PA, backed by the CIA and American $, led a coup, which Hamas put down in Gaza. All the Palestinians know it, they hate the PA and think they're lying thugs, so why keep repeating the same lies? It really doesn't make any sense.

    All that said, I very much hope the PA and Hamas can achieve unity in a way that benefits the will of the Palestinians. I imagine the PA will have to cut all ties with the CIA. Let's all hope and pray for a good resolution of these talks. I had no idea they were going on until neko6's helpful article!
    • neko6, on 03/23/2008, -5/+19"neko6, you submiited something from liberal ynetnews, are you feeling allright?" - Unlike you anti-Israeli activist who would support any anti-Israeli story true or false, I care only for truth.

      P.S: I'm a liberal, in case your blind hatred towards anything Israeli made you miss it.

      I don't understand much about internal Palestinian politics and what really went on there (I do remember Hamas MURDERED Fatah officials in the coup) but the way I see it as a liberal, Hamas is not a valid party for election. Just like Israel blocked Kahana Hai (rightfully) from participating in the Israeli elections because they called for murder of Arabs, the PA should have blocked Hamas from participating in the Palestinian elections, as they call for murder of Jews.

      "All that said, I very much hope the PA and Hamas can achieve unity in a way that benefits the will of the Palestinians." - I don't believe this moment has arrived, but I actually agree with you about something.
      • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -14/+5I'm more pro-Israel than you are, and my views are more in line with the majority of Israelis, which yours are not.

        I'm glad we agree. Let's hope for something unexpectedly good, but if not something incrementally positive.
        • neko6, on 03/23/2008, -5/+13"my views are more in line with the majority of Israelis, which yours are not." - what view do you think that majority of Israelis share with you, that I do not?
          • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -11/+6Desire for immediate face-to-face negotiations with Hamas, for one. Non-Likudnik and non-Shas everything, for two. You just said you are liberal, but my recollection of some bitter arguments I've had with you have lead me to think otherwise. Plus you keep company with some extremely far-right crazies and never bat an eyelash.
          • neko6, on 03/23/2008, -3/+13"Desire for immediate face-to-face negotiations with Hamas, for one." - I actually support negotiations with Hamas without the terms Israel demands. Were I in charge, I would start talking immediately - but I don't resent the Israeli government decision to demand recognition of previous agreements first, as it is a valid demand with a solid basis. Its not like Israel demanded half of Gaza for starting talks - just that Gaza agree in general not to kill Israelis.

            "but my recollection of some bitter arguments I've had with you have lead me to think otherwise" - I don't think we ever had arguments, you usually just foam at the mouth, curse and toss various claims about my and other people's views that we never expressed, while I keep on focusing on the subject until I get bored with your non-responsiveness.

            "Plus you keep company with some extremely far-right crazies and never bat an eyelash." - I digg comments I agree with and bury those I do not. Notice I sometimes correct my own supporters when they are at the wrong. But ofcourse, how could you notice any of this when you're so deeply buried in your paranoia.
          • wpi97, on 03/24/2008, -0/+3"just that Gaza agree in general not to kill Israelis."
            Oh, I am sorry, that's going too far. We can't have that, no!
      • victorypup, on 03/24/2008, -0/+2One way to look at Fatah and Hammas would be to compare them to the Demacrooks and the Republicrooks. Just two branches out of the same tree. Both have exactly the same agenda as their objective. The only thing that may be different is the rhetoric they spew for gullible consumption.
    • zolthar, on 03/23/2008, -7/+15I am amazed how you forget those Fatah personnel who were slaughtered by Hamas when they took over the Palestinian Police facilities in Gaza strip.
      You spit on their graves and forget them.
      You are willing to look aside when the lives of those that you support are being wasted when it serves your goals.
      A true freedom fighter.
      • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -14/+6Sigh.

        Again Z, Hamas was putting down a coup attempt by the PA. People get killed when they are committing treason with guns. I'm sure the PA fought back with guns, or they would have raised their hands high and surrendered. They chose not to surrender, so Hamas had no choice. They were and are the elected government.

        Now stop talking about it like they "took over." They didn't. They "took back over" or "put down."
        • zolthar, on 03/23/2008, -4/+10The PA did not fight back.
          After the first, religiously fueled, murderous wave of killings, a complete shock to the PA personnel, the PA guys just gave up the facilities.
          Hamas had no casulties, PA personnel's bodies were piling.
          • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -10/+5The PA did not fight back? Who the hell told you that, moron? Even if they didn't, Hamas was putting down a COUP! It's called giving your soldiers kill instructions. Countless examples to choose from throughout history.

            Oh, if it's body count ratios, then how about the 100:1 ratio Israel has with Palestinians. Does that imply Israel is just as in the wrong as you think Hamas was in putting down a coup?
      • Kizilbash, on 03/23/2008, -7/+4And you forget who started this civil strife: it was Fatah trying to take over Gaza, supported by the US and Israel.
    • BassMastr, on 03/23/2008, -5/+14Hamas won with like 30% of the vote...hardly the choice of the people...
      • neocognitism, on 03/23/2008, -10/+5Same thing in Israel or any multi-party coalition-based system.
        • BassMastr, on 03/23/2008, -4/+13I guess the difference is in most other mulit party systems is the winners don't start killing the losers.
          • yellowcakewalk, on 03/23/2008, -9/+2Most countries don't have a brutal occupation that "allows" them to hold elections from time to time, and then punishes them if they vote "incorrectly".
          • BassMastr, on 03/24/2008, -1/+9What's funny is the US, Israel, and the EU provide the Palistinians with food...while the Arab world provides them with explosives, weapons and military support to wage a constant unwinnable war. There is plenty of blame for both sides and people who think one side is one hundred percent right or wrong are the problem. At some point both sides are going to have to let by gones be by gones and make painful concessions. That or live in a constant state of war which neither side can win.
          • hadees, on 03/24/2008, -1/+8Don't forget the Arab world also makes laws which prevent Palestinian from becoming citizens of Arab states. They also severely restrict what jobs Palestinians can have.
          • BassMastr, on 03/24/2008, -0/+1Ironically, you should go read up on how Mexicans treat both legal and illegal immigrants...talk about hypocrites...I digress... The way the U.S. treats immigrants is the exception not the rule.
        • Kizilbash, on 03/23/2008, -5/+2It was the losers that started killing the winners. It was the winners that won the military confrontation too, doesn't mean they started it.
      • victorypup, on 03/24/2008, -1/+1The USA has been giving Palestinian terrorist arms and ammo in addition to the food, compliments of Judas George and company.
  • Jeff82, on 03/23/2008, -3/+18They both realize they are weaker apart. If one were stronger than they wouldn't be interested in coming together with the other one. Anything that keeps them weaker is better for Israel. And anyone who thinks peace is obtainable with the arabs, short of the return of the anti-christ, is foolish.
  • BassMastr, on 03/23/2008, -5/+25I wonder when the Palestinians are going to wake up and realize that they are nothing but pawns for the rest of the Arab world.
  • leubstop, on 03/23/2008, -3/+14Hamas is not stupid. Gaza is in the gutter... the World has pledged billions to Fatah, future contracts like cell phone companies are being drawn up and will make many fatah people quite wealthy... all while hamas gets is small charity from Iran. The corrupt seek corruption. Hamas will join in with fatah.. get access to the billions of the worlds money, get access to the weapons the world has supplied fatah. then when they cant get anything else... they will begin the coup in the west bank... armed, funded and corrupt as ever..
    • victorypup, on 03/24/2008, -0/+5There is very little distinction between Fatah and Hammas. It's all a charade designed to deceive the stupid.
      • neko6, on 03/24/2008, -0/+5Not really - they are different fractions of corruption, each wants the whole cake.
  • diggB, on 03/24/2008, -4/+1The enemy of my enemy is my friend.
  • Turambar, on 03/24/2008, -7/+10wow, the zionist digg brigade is out in full force tonight.
  • Alfonzo, on 03/24/2008, -4/+3Hopefully the rest of the world will let a legitimate Palestinian state start to form. I know they aren't groups the US is comfortable with, but the stronger and more unified their government becomes, the sooner real peace treaties can be discussed.
  • rapincandy, on 03/24/2008, -1/+4i can haz land?
  • victorypup, on 03/24/2008, -1/+4LOLOLOL, Fatah, Hammas, kissing and making up? They are just reading script written by Jimmy Carter and Judas George. The great religion of murder and mayhem takes yet another strategic leap. (well, now, Judas George calls it, Great Religion of Peace). Get ready for the next chapter in this fantasy play, it's final act.
  • neko6, on 03/24/2008, -0/+5Anyone has an idea why the submission disappeared from the most popular upcoming section of World News?
    Weird... It should have been #1 there right now by the number of diggs.

    P.S: Was it too soon?
    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-3522964, ...
  • americangoy, on 03/24/2008, -3/+1What is this thread, the Israeli KKK meeting?

    Sheesh - I haven't seen so much racism since my trip to the boonies, FLA a decade ago.
    • tekirkedicik, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1shut up americangay read the article
  • PatNolan, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2Let them make all nice nice and gather in one place -- then we can use fewer bombs to kill us some terrorists.
  • tekirkedicik, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1their understanding of is what normal people call assrape of millions so leave them be their ***** two of the biggest enemy of the whole humankind one
    white haired moron and another bunch of towel headed morons keep them killing them is the only solution they dont deserve to breathe
  •  

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