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100 Comments
- TiKoZ, on 10/11/2007, -0/+59So intelligence is measured by how much URLs and math constants you can memorize? then calculators are making us dumber too, and 100 years ago they were much more intelligent than us right now, right? WRONG.. calculators (same goes for google) were made to save precious time memorizing stuff like the 0.45359237 ratio or the huge URLs, and concentrate about what really matters.. he (the author) misses the point.
- zoozo, on 10/11/2007, -2/+27You didn't understand the article, did you?
The correct link is: http://www.google.com/search?q=google+alternatives - arof, on 10/11/2007, -0/+25@tikoz
I completely agree. True intelligence is not what you remember but how you are able to use and interpret that information. The easier it is for us to get to any information we need, the better off we are. The skill of memorization is being replaced with the skill of using things like Google to get to the information we need.
That said, I have always been one to remember the things I find on Google at least well enough to find them again with Google (or Digg, or whatever other source I found them with). As long as you're able to do that much, you'll be okay. - The_Wallbanger, on 10/11/2007, -1/+23Google is a tool for information much like a calculator is a tool for math. It increases efficiency, but the user must still have an idea on what they'd like to accomplish.
- HayString, on 10/11/2007, -1/+22I'd actually say that google helps make me smarter. I always using it to look up the definition and correct spelling and also usage(grammar) of words. I may not be smarter per-se, but I can atleast sound smarter and appear smarter in my writing.
- kenvsryu, on 10/11/2007, -3/+24Memory is not a sign of intelligence.
- animalmuther76, on 07/30/2008, -6/+25i use google when i cant remember how to get to yahoo
- progidy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+12Einstein might disagree with this article:
"One of Einstein's colleagues asked him for his telephone number one day. Einstein reached for a telephone directory and looked it up. 'You don't remember your own number?' the man asked, startled.
'No,' Einstein answered. 'Why should I memorize something I can so easily get from a book?'"
From the last anecdote on the page:
http://oaks.nvg.org/sa5ra17.html
Then again, during a recent software developer interview, I asked the candidate what his greatest strength as a programmer was. He answered, "I can look things up really well if I don't know something". We didn't hire him. - evilTak, on 10/11/2007, -1/+12This article is moronic. By the same token, dictionaries, encyclopedias, newspapers, programming texts - ANY kind of reference "makes us dumber." I think that what the author (perhaps intentionally) fails to realize is that intelligence is not a factor of the number of pieces of information memorized, but rather the ability to DO something with information once obtained.
- 1021, on 10/11/2007, -0/+10memory != intelligence. Otherwise, computers would be the ones that created us. Not the other way around.
- merreborn, on 10/11/2007, -0/+9This "problem" is far older than google. Before google, we used these things called "Books".
Google and books augment our knowledge. Given access to google/books, people are actually *smarter* than they are without either, if you consider knowledge to include anything that's easily accessible to the person in question.
The most important thing you can possibly learn is *how to learn*, and how to find data when you need it. It's absurd to suggest that people should simply be repositories of all the knowledge they'll ever need -- what's important is that they be able to find the data they need quickly, and apply it. - ricksite, on 10/11/2007, -1/+8Google is definitely making me dumber. Before Google, I used to just memorize the whole internet.
- trghpy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5By the time I commit something to memory... It's out of date.
- GTPilot, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4our memory is very limited. why commit stuff to memory when you can commit resource points instead?
i'd disagree and say that google makes us smarter by freeing up our memory for more important personal information.
on top of that, think of how much we learn by searching google rather than accessing our memory. google is always working to access the latest information so the next time we search, we may get new information. - Topher06, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4I have read a number of articles like this. One in particular was the idea that we have lost basic math skills because of calculators, so therefore, ergo, society is dumber. People writing these articles are dead wrong and completely mislead.
New technology does not make society dumber, it simply changes the information people need to process and remember. While people these days probably can't multiple 1256 * 4298 in their heads anymore, the fact that calculators exist to do the job doesn't make society dumber. The fact is today generally society knows that the Earth is a sphere, not a plane and they use a calculator to multiple large numbers. In the past, if society as a whole could multiple in their heads, I generally call the entire society dumb if they thought the Earth was flat. People today know more about science, physics, math, etc even if they don't actively use this information or collect the information in passing. We know the earth revolves around the sun, that our bodies contain various types of cells and when we get sick we don't believe we have been possed by demons and call the exorcist (well, most people in society don't anymore).
So along comes Google which catalogs the worlds collective knowledge. Is society dumber for it because instead of remembering trivial bits of facts in their heads, they simply Google it. No.
Do you need to store countless amounts of trivial and even not-so trivial facts in your heads. No. The bottom line is that the human brain is designed very effectively to keep and preserve information required for daily activity, but has a tendency to let go of information we don't need or use. This doesn't make a person dumber, the brain is optimizing itself to make it more effective for the types of things we need to do on a daily basis.
Like, I can't remember specifically Calculus even though I obtained over 90% in the course in high school and in university. Guess what, I don't use Calculus on a daily basis (in fact, I haven't used Calculus since leaving school). Does that make me dumb? Again, no. If I DID require the need to use Calculus again, then I would Google and find a quick primer on basic Calculus skills. The amazing thing is that despite the fact I can't immediately recall how to do Calculus, it would only take a short amount of time to "re-learn" calculus. The brain has some Calculus information tucked away somewhere and with just a little bit of practice, will recall it. Then, if I needed to use Calculus on a daily basis, my skills in calculus would improve and become more efficient as my brain re-tasks itself to start integrating Calculus for more immediate recall.
Like anything in life, practice makes perfect. The brain will remember the information in needs to perform the tasks we ask it to do. Stop doing those tasks and the brain stops keeping the information prominently retrievable. Unless you play Jeporady every day, there is no need to store the information Google collects.
You see, the thing is that society hasn't forgotten how to multiple large numbers in their heads, they just have a more efficient way of obtaining the results. If you needed to multiply without the use of a calculator, and needed to do it repeatedly every day, not only will your brain remember how to multiply but it will become more efficient at it and you will be able to do it quicker as time goes on.
Its a great idea to exercise your brain however, doing things you generally don't do on a daily basis will help to enhance mental performance, learning new things, even after childhood, will allow the brain to become more effective even when doing daily tasks. But remembering countless amounts of useless facts doesn't make a person smarter, nor does it improve mental efficiency.
The simple fact is, its smarter to understand and know when to Google for retrieve information, and if the information is readily useful the brain will remember it. But like most Digg articles, if I had to memorize every one, I would be in an insane asylum. Its often a good thing the brain forgets. - Valence, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4Plato, the most important ancient philosopher and one of the most important minds in the entire history of the human species, was occasionally wrong about some things. He was wrong, for example, about writing. His argument, below, sounds, oh, a little familiar ...
"If men learn this, it will implant forgetfulness in their souls; they will cease to exercise memory because they rely on that which is written, calling things to remembrance no longer from within themselves, but by means of external marks. What you have discovered is a recipe not for memory, but for reminder. And it is no true wisdom that you offer your disciples, but only its semblance, for by telling them of many things without teaching them you will make them seem to know much, while for the most part they know nothing, and as men filled, not with wisdom, but with the conceit of wisdom, they will be a burden to their fellows."
Oh, I Googled this in order to find it ... - fugularity, on 10/11/2007, -2/+5this is a terrible article, google is making us more efficient, therefore allowing us to use our brain for other stuff instead of memorizing rote numbers and facts
- heavensblade23, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Tools don't make you dumber, they make you smarter in a different way.
- beatphats, on 10/11/2007, -3/+6Playing devil's advocate here,
how can you say that reference guides and other such things help save time? I guess looking things up doesn't take time at all.
Based on Einstein's quote from above, ask yourself, before cell phones, how many phone numbers can you remember by heart compared to now? I still can remember my friends' numbers from grade school (1990) and now I get confused between my home and cell numbers.
If you guys think that memorization and comprehension are not connected, then you guys are sadly mistaken. - arnar, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3^^ what they said. It pisses me off when people equate the ability to remember stuff to intelligence. The school system helps with that. Alot of my classmates in college got excellent grades and praise even though they were actually quite dense when you spoke to them. They were just hard-working and memorized the whole thing.
The maths test was even in two parts - one with problems from the material (exactly - same numbers even) and the other one with new problems. Why anyone would do better on one of them than the other is beyond be, yet many people got a 100% score on the first one but failed the second one. - 1021, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3"If you guys think that memorization and comprehension are not connected, then you guys are sadly mistaken."
Let me ask you this, how much more do you get paid if you can remember a long URL? Memorization of these things doesn't have anything to the comprehension of the content hidden in that URL.
EDIT: given a vast data source such as the net, search is the only way you will ever be able to find useful information in a timeful manner. The author of this story doesn't understand this thoroughly enough to appreciate it. - rclay, on 10/11/2007, -3/+6Many current college students seem unable to function when their Internet connection is down and a search engine is unavailable to retrieve answers to their questions. It is very sad to see bright people unable to do any thinking on their own.
- neuralzen, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Google is a form of external memory, which as long as we know how to reference efficiently, the lack of actually knowing something doesn't matter as much as the ability to retrieve something from this external memory is far more important. As long as the knowledge can be retained and accessed when needed, there is no problem in my mind. As technology improves and integrates our biology with technology (post-humanism) there will come a point when referencing google will be only an extra thought (I mean, we already have thought activated lightsabers ( http://www.arrogantics.com/2007/04/30/science-harnesses-the-force-so-awesome-i-almost-throw-up/#more-687 ). Besides, doctors often need to freshen up on procedures and areas of the body they rarely treat, and they do that with textbooks and journals. With googles, you can quickly search for information like this to "freshen" up on the topic you need info on.
- HomerS1, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Google makes us dumber in the same way that programming languages make bad software developers.
Not many developers today know how to code in x86 assembly. - psykiv, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2During a criminal justice exam last semester, I only remembered some of the numbers related to the question (it was related to crime statistics), but not the actual one related TO the question. The only way I would be able to solve it was long division (using a calculator would definitely raise a red flag). I did it, but with a great amount of difficulty. The prof even commented that I was the first person he's seen to use long division to solve that and give the answer.
- frant1c, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Maybe Plato wasn't wrong. Maybe he was just thinking that the written word will be as powerful as the Internet, so he was thinking a bit ahead of his time. Not a rare feat in his case.
Since I'm commenting, I have to say that I can't believe how many people are butchering this interesting discussion to the question "is Google cool or not". It's not about it at all. It's about technology changing the way people think. - NSMike, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2I would argue that this is a function of the person you're dealing with. I prefer to use Google to learn, not to be my information store. Just because I google something because it's easier to find out that way doesn't mean that I'm not learning from it. And conversions? I don't convert things very often. Regardless of whether or not Google was there to help me, I would still have to look up conversions. I keep things at the fore that I use all of the time. Things that I don't use tend to just slip back into the oblivion of the mind.
The only difference is instead of picking up an encyclopedia for a conversion table, I just google it. I would no more have remembered it from either source. When Google becomes so important to you that you have to use it to discover basic things you SHOULD know, you have an issue. - chijim70, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2This is the dumbest article I've seen on digg ironically enough. Seriously, do encyclopedia or dictionaries make us more dumb? What would be the purpose of recalling a long list of URLs versus their actual content? The ability to look up things means you are able to become more informed and thus *drum roll* SMARTER!
Buried as lame - seandfeeney, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2I disagree, without google I would be lost. I know way more than I ever would have if it wasn't for being able to find it on google in 2 min of searching for something. I learned more researching google than listening to any of my college professors.
"buried as inaccurate" - HomerS1, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Many college students were not capable of thinking on their own 20 years ago when I was in college. The available tools have changed since then, but the student has not.
- leer317, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Time to switch back to Altavista
- machismonstro, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Imagination is more important than knowledge.
Albert Einstein
US (German-born) physicist (1879 - 1955)
And yes, I forgot the quote verbatim and had to google it. - bradleyland, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Since when is rote memorizaiton the most accurate measure of intelligence?
- ronaldinho, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I don't quite agree with the article. Being able to do 1239847462 x 129874092346 in our heads does not make intelligence. Intelligence is about how we use and/or derive information most effectively. I don't think Google makes us dumb by not remembering. Conversely I think those people who don't use Google are dumb. Just think of how much time they save by using Google. We are still using our brain: we made the correct decision that Google saves us some much-needed time and provides us much efficiency.
Someone here said this before: Google does make our memorizing ability decrease, and that IS true. At the same time, being able to memorize everything in sight doesn't mean they are intelligent. That simply means they just have a good memory. Intelligent people are those who can put those stored information to good use. - Lennalf, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I agree with you. Google does not make people dumber. It is a very powerful tool, and like all tools one must adapt his or her methods in order to get the most return for the effort.
Rather than memorizing information that we may not use often, we simply learn how to most quickly yank that information out of the internet. That same ability allows us to quickly reach all-new information, and it allows us to check our sources to verify our memory. The recording accuracy of the human mind is far from that of a hard drive.
Human intelligence is largely defined by our ability to use sophisticated tools. To say that the same characteristic is dumbing us down is absurd. - yahoofrom, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Oh no, integral tables are making me dumb.
- yahoofrom, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1But altavista make us dumber too.
- someotherdude, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I totally agree with, wait, erm, that's embarassing, mind blank er what's this board with letters and, oh cool, words appear, neat I thi......
- evilTak, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1We used google to inform our comments.
- vhold, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1If you drive a car all the time, odds are you will personally be slower.
If you use a stove to cook, you will likely not be good at making fires.
If you use a cellphone all the time, you probably aren't as good as planning ahead and coordinating schedules as you otherwise would be.
Reliance on technology does have personal trade offs, everything technology does so that you don't have to, you will become worse at without that technology.
I'm not exactly sure what technology it is that makes people so closed minded to the possibility that some progress comes with a downside. - yahoofrom, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I google my password.
- ahawks, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2Good ***** point. Any time we choose to store information outside of our brain, does that make us "dumber"?
- ahawks, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1On the one hand, this article is dead on. I am a diabetic, and have to count the amount of carbs I eat each meal in order to properly dose the amount of insulin I take. For example, I know a bean burrito has 55g of carbs, which means if I eat it at lunch I take 2 units of insulin (1 unit per 30g).
However, there are countless things I eat every single day, but because that information is easily accessible on the Internet (hooray for calorieking.com), or a nutrition label, I never bother to memorize the amount of carbs in say, a bagel.
On the other hand, with the amount of information we flood our brains with these days, I think it would be impossible to process it all without some sort of aid. - inactive, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1It's because they're just not that bright. I have yet to meet a college student that has impressed me on any level, yet I have met many dropouts with extraordinary talents in music and literature. Not to say that they (impressive college grads) don't exist, but in my experience they are rare.
The education system in this country is in dire need of reform. Rather than critical thinking skills, people are being taught regurgitative memory tricks. Cram for that big test so you can pass your class...but a week later, what did you actually *learn*? Not much. Jumping through a series of hoops like this is not the way to educate people, it is a way to train rats to find cheese. - froman98, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I don't agree that Google is making us dumber, I think it's just allowing us to have access to a plethora of tools in one single location.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Is it just me, or has anyone else noticed how eloquent and well-written the comments are in this thread? How unusual for Digg.
- OpticalLiam, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2Seriously I can't remember the last time I typed a URL in by hand. Everytime I visit digg I type "digg" in the Google box on Firefox.
- MadMastaZ, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Google was made to make it easier to search for items that we can't find, and it's better to us google to find the URL instead of spending 20 minutes trying to remember what it was.
google is a helping website, it doesn't make us dumber. - ahawks, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1More and more people keep saying this. Am I the only person left who remembers how to do long division? I'm 26, so I've been away from "the basics" for a while now.
I guess I just understand decimal places and stuff... but geez. - Amoeba16, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Yes, we are less memorization-capable than we were generations ago. Roman students memorized entire epic poems, volumes of history, countries of geography.
Today we outsource that data because the dead hand of the memetic component of our civilization has evolved to carry, process and transmit that data for us.
Similarly, now that we make clothes we don't shiver so much. We may even be more sensitive to cold than we used to be.
The trend is not necessarily destructive, however. Would you rather be tough or protected from the elements? Would you rather be a human memorization machine or have all the information of civilization at your fingertips with the ability to fluidly perform hundreds of man-hours of processing on it in a nanosecond?
Nostalgia -- especially biological nostalgia -- is for geriatric cranks and technophobes. -
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