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49 Comments
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+13The front kinda looks like a cool bullet train. Nice find.
- rjnerd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+11They have been building hybrid minivans for 5 years, yet they still don't import them. Sigh... I could use the hauling space, but want an engine that stops when I do. Like the styling, reminds me of the original "moon cruiser" toyotas, but its clear that the "conventional" style of the current US minivan is preferred here. I owned the cargo edition of the original. Not the greatest in the snow (we learned to buy a years supply of cat litter in october, and not unload it until spring) but it would carry a stack of 4x8 sheets of plywood inside the body, still get mid 20's mpg, and was shorter overall than the Subaru sedan it replaced.
Hybrids would be a great fit for urban taxi service, with the frequent short stops. Unfortunately I doubt we will see many that soon. Most US taxi companies buy cheap used fleet vehicles, then run them into the ground. (tip off - the "certified calibration" tag on the spedo - signifies an ex police cruiser, they go cheap because they have a lot of miles on the clock, despite only 2 years of age)
This is an ingrained habit, despite the poor fit between an ex highway patrol car and urban taxi service. If your typical use is on a city street with 15mph average speed, or a clogged highway out to the airport at 40, you don't need a large V8, and a rear axle ratio optimized for acceleration. Around here (Boston) the cabbies tried to get a fuel surcharge, and were horrified when the taxi commission suggested choosing vehicles that have better fuel economy instead.
In interests of full disclosure, my maternal grandfather was an independent Boston cabbie for more than 40 years. He bought his cabs new, and always got a 6 cylinder engine. - Tiabin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9The car can also be purchase pre-tweezed, I'm sure.
- ghettoiam, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11Oh wait, I get it, Japan actually tries to conserve resources.
- kanemano, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11high smug emissions?
- Gargot, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6I'm sure that many taxi fleets would be interested in those..
- Tiabin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Also kind of reminds me of the cars in "irobot" for some reason.
- D3koy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Looks bad ass... I wouldn't be caught dead driving a Minivan but its nice to see technology is branching out from the compact cars. I think it is the way to go!
- FuzzyCat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3
Herring can't - kevin.gc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Already done.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3lots of taxis in toronto use propane as a fuel
- raitchison, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3If they sold a hybrid minivan here it would almost certianly be our next car (wer'e looking to replace the Mazda MPV we currently have in a few months)
- sp00nz, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3It's a persons opinion on the looks of the car. If they don't like it so be it.
- triumph, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Toyota will have a version of the Sienna with their hybrid synergy drive for it's US market, expected in 2007.
http://www.hybridcars.com/toyota-sienna-minivan-hybrid.html - rjnerd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2What country has highly taxed cabs? The US doesn't impose any significant specific taxation on cabs. They pay ordinary income taxes on their profits, and some property taxes on their vehicle, which they get to depreciate... In the US, the taxes on motor fuel cover less than half the cost of road construction and maintence, so their use of the roads is actually subsidized. In some cities the "medallion" (city permit) is expensive, but the government doesn't see any of that money when they change hands (capital gains excepted). Its just that they aren't issuing significant numbers (if any at all) of new ones, and the existing holders are charging what they can to give up one they hold. (In NYC, the number hasn't really changed since the 1930's, as a result, it costs 6 figures to get hold of a medallion, none of this paid to the city)
Since the taxi business is a mostly cash business, there is a lot of room to fudge things. As mentioned, my grandfather was a cabbie. (long enough ago, that his medallion cost him $2, from city hall) He joked that he kept 3 sets of books. The set he showed the IRS, the set he showed my grandmother, and the real set. - Kendalf, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4It's sad how Toyota keeps bring out new technology while domestic auto manufactures continue to claim that the technology is too expensive to implement. Another reason why Asia is the great super power. Yes, I do mean the continent of Asia.
- glucoseboy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Yes, my next car. I am interested in replacing our well-used Honda Odyssey. (Yes, multiple kids, with lots of cousins)
Will they bring it over? (yes?) - HP844182, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Depends on what you're looking for, you don't buy a sports car to save gas.
- ChileanGoD, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2What's next?... the hybrid assault tank?
- mancat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Because the catalyst efficiency is diminished when not at full operating temperature. When you have an engine that is routinely shutting off during operation, sometimes for very long periods, the catalytic convertors are not doing the best job that they can do.
- ZenPirate, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Now I'm not poor, but I am seeing *way* too much of the phrase "starting at 31k" for autos these days. How can working people justify spending that kind of money on transportation?
- rjnerd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2No; All mass market hybrids are direct hybrids. The engine does not run continuously, and there is a mechanical connection between the IC engine and the rest of the drivetrain. Its simply a more efficient connection. A generator that can handle the full output of an IC engine will be heavy. Add to that the problems with charge rate of batteries (you can only recharge at 10% of the discharge rate), and the system described (small engine running steadily) would have less system efficiency than a non-hybrid (aka conventional) system.
All hybrids stop the engine when the vehicle isn't moving. Some (but not all) are able to move the vehicle for some time on batteries alone. This mode of operation is a real boon in typical urban stop and go traffic. It can be 10 minutes of blissfully silent operation before the engine kicks in.
This is true of toyota, and those that license (ford for example) their motor coupling system. The other commonly used system (honda) has the electric motor integral with the engine flywheel. This acts more like an electric turbo - adding boost when the engine is under heavy load. The car can't move without the IC engine turning.
One of the limits on how long it keeps the engine off, is the catalyst. They have to "light off" before they do much to reduce emissions. At least one car maker has experimented with a system that extracts some hydrogen from the gasoline, stores it, and injects it into the exhaust manifold at start-up to speed up the converter start-up. (one thing that the gen 3 prius does to speed warmup of the block, is when you shut the car off, it pumps the coolant out of the radiator and block, and into a vacuum insulated storage bottle, that will hold temp for several days. It pumps it back when you turn it back on)
One thing that I would be interested in would be to integrate a stirling engine into the converter. The IC engine can only harness about 40% of the energy in the fuel. The rest is dumped into the radiator, and out the exhaust. Stirling engines work on temperature difference. While the record for smallest difference is about 0.5 degree C, I would limit myself to the 500C difference between the catalyst and the outside air. Recover some of the waste heat, spin another generator, and charge the battery pack with it. Unfortunately the power:volume/weight ratio of a stirling is nothing to write home about. Efficiency is great, but it would be a challenge to find a place to put it. - rif42, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2All cars in iRobot film was from Audi. Some real with extra plastic padding, some complete custom made.
- Murdats, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"Depends on what you're looking for, you don't buy a sports car to save gas."
I think thats the current problem with america, the more fuel your car uses the more impressive it is
the oil industry has really done a good job over there - donsmith, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1yes. my buddy had one in Japan... just a new design. Still, I think they'd sell here if Toyota was so kind as to import them.
- rcomegys, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Keep in mind that Japanese minivans are about the size of a small station wagon by US standards. I never see big cars in Japan.
- carve, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Just what I'm looking for. Roomy, efficient, AWD. I'd buy one.
- boredzo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Inaccurate headline (both here and on the article).
From the article:
"Toyota first introduced the Estima hybrid minivan in 2001. At the time it, was the first hybrid minivan and the first mass-produced vehicle to use an electric four-wheel-drive system."
So it's not a *new* hybrid at all. It's been that way for five years now. They just redesigned it.
Reported. - yaosio, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Is the MPG real driving or driving at a low speed on those wheel things so it's always perfectly straight and level?
- infra172, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Sardine can.
- chiapet, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Put a 10' lift on that thing and slap some supper-digger 44`s thin you got something
- bmobile, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Yeah, i've always wondered why they refuse to import certain cars. Example being the clean diesel cars in Europe. Umm hello, it's not "illegal" to sell clean diesel over here ppl. lol.
- rjnerd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Actually it is illegal (in MA and CA) to sell new diesel passenger cars. They don't meet the emissions standards, given the crap sold as diesel in this country.
- bmobile, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1cauz it doesn't kill you?
- rjnerd, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1They want people to know its a hybrid. They are proud of Its high tech drivetrain, they want it to look the part. Oh yea, not all hybrids have distinctive bodywork. The civic, camry and ford escape hybrids share bodywork with the conventional versions of the same car. You have to look for the little badge on the trunk lid to tell them apart. (and the original (for the us) Prius was essentially a 4 door version of the Echo)
- saroth, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Just in case you wanted to know what those wheel things are called, they're called Chassis Dynamometers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamometer .
- gpd209, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0A 2001 USA Today article on the Estima: http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2001-06-15-toyota-minivan.htm
- peritonlogon, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@Mancat
I can't tell you about this one, but most hybrids operate using a small engine that runs continuously with about the same output, driving the vehicle and a generator then have an electric motor that kicks in when more horse power is needed. - SageofLightning, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I think it looks really neat, of course if I bought one it would end up with a black paint job and a custom side-to-side strobing leds(think knight rider) or purple and the custom plate snd wave.
- SageofLightning, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Its about as 'new' as the latest model civic or what have you.
- rayishu, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Why do all hybrid vieclues look like something out of a cool Si-Fi Movie? i like it but i dont think its something the mass public might like
- HP844182, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0Wrong spot
- HP844182, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0No, some people just want a good looking, good performing car. There is more to a buying decision than just saving gas.
- RegisteredUser, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0It would be nice to see more hybrid wagons.
- Eliminator, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1The taxi industry is among the mostly highly taxed. Me thinks a fuel surcharge would be fair.
- lolwtfhaha, on 10/12/2007, -4/+1"It is not mentioned if this feature also helps the catalytic converter heat up faster..."
Maybe it's not mentioned because that is an idiotic idea-- the best way to heat up a catalytic converter is to run exhaust through it. Maybe if they run the exhaust through it TWICE!
Sorry, my tummy hurts and I'm grumpy. - Celeron, on 10/12/2007, -7/+4Personally, I find the "unibrow" headlight in the middle ugly.
- santiago1, on 10/12/2007, -5/+2 I'm not anti-environmental, but for some reason, I find that website disturbing.... can't quite pinpoint why, though....
- dirtyfratboy, on 10/12/2007, -7/+3Unibrow?
People personify the front of cars and then judge whether or not to buy them based on "looks"?
Wow.
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