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64 Comments
- gamebittk, on 10/11/2007, -4/+41It will only have mass-appeal it the monthly price is reduced -- not just the actual unit.
- douggmc, on 10/11/2007, -1/+24You apparently have never used a TiVo.
- neuros, on 10/11/2007, -2/+10Too bad Bittorrent + RSS + more storage every once in a while is cheaper than HD cable service + DVR... not to mention I get to watch whatever I want, from whatever channel I want.
Come on cable companies (and telco's, I'm speaking to you)... Realize that what people want is a la carte and on demand, not just some pricey service which makes it seem like that's what you're giving us... - bloodytemplar, on 10/11/2007, -0/+7What kept me from picking up a Series3 was that it adheres to the CableCard v1.0 standard, which is incompatible with switched digital video. Of course, there's no CableCard v2.0 standard yet, so they did what they could with what they had.
In the end, I switched to Dish Network and their HD-DVR. I'm very happy with it, especially after their last firmware release. - jtown, on 10/11/2007, -0/+7xrisnothing,
Capacity. Reliability. Performance. Features.
That pretty much sums up my reasons in order of importance.
The cable company's DVR had a 120 gig drive which translated to roughly 14-15 hours of HD material. Tops. Despite having firewire, eSATA, and USB2 ports, there was no way to increase the capacity. So 2 football games and a movie would fill the DVR, knocking out everything else. As if the pitiful capacity wasn't bad enough, I noticed that it had a tendency to delete shows long before it needed the space for a new recording.
While the S3 only ships with a 250 gig drive, that's double the capacity of the cable company's box. Additionally, the 250 gig drive could be replaced with a 750 gig drive with minimal effort and, now that eSATA can be activated and 1tb drives are available, it's possible to have up to 2000 gigabytes of storage.
As for reliability, the cable company's DVR regularly lost all its program data and wouldn't record anything until it was fixed. Sometimes a restart did it. Sometimes it required a "hit" from the cable company. Either way, it was a useless rock without that data and it happened about once a month.
On the performance side, the cable company's DVR was a joke. I'd hit "List" and wait as long as 10 seconds for the unit to respond. Slogging through the menus was agony. And playback could be sketchy. If it was recording two HD programs and playing back a third (a difficult scenario to set up considering the limited storage capacity), it would drop frames from time to time. Didn't happen a lot but enough to be noticed.
And the cable company's DVR was pretty short on features. No suggestions, no folders, etc.
That's why people buy Series 3 Tivos. - sockpuppets, on 10/11/2007, -1/+8Rent.
- therippa, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5It's coming out just in time to compete with the Comcast DVR's running the Tivo interface...to rent or not to rent, that is the question.
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -1/+6Unfortunately a couple years too late. Even if we get a cable card that can access all the features, it's going to be hard to convince people to spend hundreds on any box when they can rent one from the cable company for less than just the TiVo service fee.
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -1/+6I've have a series 2 sitting right here. Works except a fan is going bad and makes a lot of noise.. Beats the cable company's DVR on the UI but not even close on features. The cable DVR records two channels at a time in digital with no issues with premium channels. The audio output is a 5.1 Dolby Digital over optical, assuming the original show was in that format.. If it breaks, I just tell them to bring over a new one.
- skoles, on 10/11/2007, -0/+5What ever happened to a DVR with VCR+ technology.
It was free, it worked w/out a hassle and it was free. I just want a plain old DVR that I tell when to record, just like a VCR did. ***** paying a monthly fee ***** just so it suggests other shows and automatically deletes flagged programs. - neuros, on 10/11/2007, -0/+4what?
- hppyfngy, on 10/11/2007, -1/+5Do you know how to use it? Doesn't sound like it...
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -1/+4I've had a series 1 for literally 8 years now, and I love it to pieces. Sadly, it doesn't do HD, which I have recently upgraded to. So, as someone who also pays for an HD DVR but has used TiVo, I can vouch for the fact that TiVo would wipe the floor with any DVR any cable company could do. They've just been at it long enough that they know what they're doing.
- LeeTXJD, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Merreborn may have already said it - but I will repeat it. When Tivo ended lifetime subscriptions, they lost in a market that will soon be dominated by $15/mo. cable boxes.
They need to approach it like Snapstream (beyondTV) and others and get rid of the subscription. I can only suppose that their attempts to create alternate revenue streams has not proved fruitful.
It is a shame ReplayTV in their new PC based venture has gone to subscriptions. - hppyfngy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3I've had Tivo since day one, now with a Series 2. Recently got the SA 8300 HDDVR with Comcast and I was absolutely amazed how piss poor it is in comparison. Two tuner recording? Big whoop. There's not that much on tv worth watching.
If you are happy with your cable co's DVR, you've never used Tivo. Searchability, Wishlists, etc., make it light years beyond the other boxes.
I sure hope the Series 3 Lite happens, and they offer lifetime memberships again... - merreborn, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3Back when they offered the lifetime service package, Tivo was a good deal. It's a real shame they axed that. You could get a DVR with a lifetime of guide data and upgrades for $350 total (including the $250 lifetime fee). My dad picked up a series one 6-7 years ago and got the lifetime package right away. It's payed off big time. Still using the same box nearly a decade later, although he's added a 300 gig drive and a network card.
$250 / 7 years = $3 / month. - dorianh49, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3I concur. I purchased a ReplayTV unit that crapped out two months after the warranty, at which point I decided to rent an HD-DVR through the cable company. The first one (a MOXIE unit with an acceptable interface) crapped out after a month, and the other (generic Motorola) has had issues here and there since. At least if something goes wrong, I can get (and have been getting) a break on that month's cable bill, and either get the unit repaired or replaced for FREE. Sure, the interface may not be as nice as TiVo's, but I feel the headache and price are not worth buying one.
- iSlappy, on 10/11/2007, -0/+3I loved my DirecTV TiVo receiver. I recently upgraded to HD and got DirecTV's HD-DVR. Both my wife and I are greatly disappointed. TiVo was much more intuitive with great features that I had learned to appreciate. I agree with others regarding the monthly price and the box price comparison vs. monthly lease from satellite or cable providers. In a perfect world, TiVo would get back in business with all the providers and start manufacturing quality boxes again and drop their monthly fee.
- inactive, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2Error601 makes a good point. You can't argue with renting someone else's equipment if it works right. When it breaks, you call them, the cable guy shows up and they fix it or swap it out. Try doing that with a Tivo.
The biggest drawback so far has been the mediocre quality of cable company DVRs. Everything from the interface to the feature set has been crippled and clunky. I'm surprised Tivo didn't just license the tech years ago and let the cable companies worry about the hardware. - inactive, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2I realize that your post is mostly a vent, but consider commerce. Not to mention that there's no such thing as a DV-VCR. So Comcast can overcharge you for their DVR, TiVo can charge you monthly for theirs, or you can sacrifice DV for a VHS tape.
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -3/+5Cable companies have on-demand. It's only a matter of time before that's all there is. Downloading is for people with way too much free time.
- Juncti, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3I use SageTV.
No monthly fees, I can put as many tuners as I want in it (currently 4), storage is only limited by how much hard drive space I install (1TB presently), free guide information, and you can stream it to any tv you want, and stream it over the internet all included.
Not as cheap out the box as Tivo's and such because you need to setup a whole computer for it, but in the long run, the lack of monthly cost and the flexibility to do what you want with the recorded content far outweigh that for me. http://www.sagetv.com/
Plus they have a community constantly making new features and plugin's for it that continue to add more functionality. It rocks. - chedlin, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2The series 3 doesn't require a phone line... I have one and like it. I don't love it like previous my previous unites because my cable company has switched digital video and the remaining channel selection stinks. I dumped cable and use my Series 2 DirecTiVo for my SD recording, and use my Series 3 for over the air.
I have a lifetime sub I transferred off a 7 year old series 1. - Synchro, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2What is this VCR you speak of?
- EnderTheThird, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3It will only have mass-appeal it the monthly price is reduced -- not just the actual unit.
Exactly! I don't understand why people would pay $800 for a Tivo S3 and still shell out $15+/month for the service. Let's not forget that Tivo is selling viewing/usage statistics they collect from customers. That would usually be fine -- I don't care as long as it's anonymous and not linked directly to me. But they're doing that AND charging for the service and that's just ridiculous if you ask me. I don't know how people can pay such a high a premium on both the hardware AND service like that.
I've never had a Tivo, but I know people say that the service and interface are superior to cable-provider DVRs. I'm just not sure that makes it worth that much money. Personally, I'd rather give up a few premium HD channels that I paid $10/month for but never watched, along with VoD and PPV, and spend $300 to transform an old computer for use as a PVR (MythTV in my case, but there are others). I have FULL control over all of my recordings, automatic commercial detection and skipping, and much more storage. The setup isn't as consumer friendly, but there's also just a small one-time hardware cost and no monthly cost after that, let alone the increased functionality and compared to any other DVR I know of.
Tive was great when it came out, but right now they have no mass appeal with such a monstrous pricetag. With so many other options out there for a DVR, especially ones from the cable-provider that are only $10-15/month, I just don't think there are going to be that many people willing to pay for Tivo service for much longer. - merreborn, on 10/11/2007, -1/+3The original comcast DVRs were absolute crap. For a long time, Tivo was a lot better than anything else on the market. That's less true now.
- aaronw, on 10/11/2007, -0/+2SDV is a pretty sticky thing to think about. I would be interested to see if they will release a version of the Series 3 that does not do cablecard - only OTA HD and analog cable. That's what I have now on my Series 3 and it works great. Practically speaking, if you don't get premium channels (I never did) and aren't into sports HD (I watch my local teams on OTA HD) then there's not really *that* much HD content out there besides NASA and Discovery HD. But, in order to get those I'd need to upgrade to the next tier of programming. It's also *unlikely* but by no means assured that the channels to go to SDV first will be the less frequently watched channels, as those are the ones that they would save the most bandwidth on. If you're sending CNN or Comedy Central to 65% of your houses, then it doesn't make sense, but for C-SPAN that goes to 4%, that's a good plan. I took the S3 plunge so that I could get lifetime service on it as well, and it is working great for me. Anyone want my old Series 1 with about 6 months left on its 'free' subscription?
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I have 15 HD channels right now, and they keep adding more. HD content is growing quickly.
- EnderTheThird, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1You may be right. If it weren't so expensive and I didn't already have a DVR solution in place, I might be tempted. I just don't have that kind of money to throw around (and I resent having to pay money to rent a CableCARD so I can pay extra for premium channels/services, which isn't Tivo's fault I know).
If you have the money for it, I'm sure a Tivo is a great way to watch TV on your own terms. And maybe once you get a Tivo, it is a lot more difficult to go back to any other kind of DVR. But with such a large price tag, I think Tivo will have trouble getting people to use one in the first place so they CAN fall in love with it and never go back to a cable/satellite provider's DVR. - piratearggghhh, on 10/11/2007, -4/+5Let's see, I can rent an HD DVR from my cable provider for an extra $11/month and if the equipment craps out or there's an upgrade, I get a new one or spend a few hundred bucks and stilll pay around $15/month with contracts for Tivo (with a nicer interface). Sounds like a no brainer. Sorry Tivo, no thanks.
- Error601, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2My understanding is they had licensing negotiations in the works but were dead set on the TiVo logo remaining on the unit and the UI. They pretty much shot themselves in the foot.
- jdehnert, on 10/11/2007, -2/+3I have a Tivo 3 and I love it. I was able to transfer a lifetime membership over from a Series 1 box that I had so its set for life. I'd buy another if I could get the lifetime deal again, but I'm not interested in paying that much for a box AND monthly fees.
- therippa, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2...and you can't record HD (unless it's OTA)
- merreborn, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1http://www.engadget.com/2006/03/26/tivo-to-release-180-hour-dual-tuner-series-2-box/
Most are single-tuner though. - skelly6, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Damn you, Tivo, for totally spoiling me!!!!
I recently switched to Comcast's HD DVR after having a Tivo with a built-in dvd burner for the last few years (which I LOVED). I wanted to upgrade to having HD, but didn't want to spend the $600 on the Series 3...
What a different experience. There is absolutely no comparison between the two. My old Series2 Tivo is vastly superior to the Comcast HD DVR. So much easier to use in every way. It's driving me nuts, and watching TV has suddenly become a really annoying experience, and I can't stop comparing everything I do in the Comcast unit to my old Tivo, and feeling really disappointed.
I'll hold out for the Comcast Tivo in the fall. Hopefully it'll be a decent compromise at least. $600 is sounding like less and less money - I miss Tivo too much. - zeppo, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Older tivos can only record 1 channel at a time...
same as other old generic DVRs
most new DVRs including tivo can record 2 or more at a time - pixelbender, on 10/11/2007, -7/+8Wasn't the series 3 like $800? You can buy 32" LCDs and 42" plasma and LCDs (refurb) for less than that! No one is buying a component more than the TV.
- mjpatey, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Tivos only record one channel at a time?! I've always wanted one. But my Comcast DVR can record 2 channels at once (of any type), while you watch a prerecorded show. I would think of that as the minimal starting point. Is this limitation true of all Tivos?
- Senseless, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1By the way, for you Comcast customers waiting to get the Tivo interface on their boxes, a quote from the transcript of the conference call..
"Second, we have made significant progress on work related to the Comcast product. The trials are progressing well and will include limited subscriber deployment between now and the early summer. We're also excited to update you on the date and location for the commercial launch. Comcast's plan, and I'm now quoting Comcast directly, the Comcast TiVo trials will continue into early summer with a commercial launch plan for August. The commercial launch will be in parts of our New England division, including Metro Boston, Southeast Massachusetts and New Hampshire."
Go New England!! - Thundercat1971, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Both the S2DT and S3 tivos also have 2 tuners
- LeeSoong, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Ya,
It's call the AppleTV - 160 GB version.
$399. - stalky14, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Check out one of the Panasonic or Pioneer DVD recorders with hard drive. That's pretty much what you're talking about right there, plus the ability to dub off the hard drive to DVD-R.
- CaptainRotundo, on 10/11/2007, -1/+2@EnderTheThird - You say that BECAUSE you've never had a TiVo, I have DirecTV so I pay $5 for both my tivos but I have considered switching to cable, and would gladly pay the tivo fee, it actually is worth it. - What I want is a tivo with CableCard that isn't $800, I dont care about HD.
- bdee1, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I got a tivo back when they first came out and used it with my time warner cable and it was great. then i upgraded to directv and got the direcTivo with the dual tuners and life was good. then last year i got an HDTV and upgraded to the HD DirecTivo and while it had its flaws it still had that sweet tivo interface.
I also have a windows vista media center PC in my living room which i use for watching DVD movies and i use it as my third OTA tuner for HD content.
this all works fairly well but i know that directv is trying to get rid of their tivo units and upgrade users to their new DVR's and i have not heard good things about those. i woudl just stay with my HD DirecTivo but they say that when DTV releases its next batch of HD channels you will have to use their new DVR because it supports a different level of compression or something like that.
so the trick will be - when the time comes, what will my next tivo unit be? i like the features of the standalone units but it seems crazy to spend the money for the unit and then spend $15/month. and i would love to exclusively use media center because it supports multiple tuners and all that but if i went that route i would have to switch to cable and get my HD locals OTA. and i don't think i would be able to get any locals over the cable at that point.
it is definitely a really murky time with DVR's in general. I woudl really love to see someone come out with a DVR with a nice interface like tivo or windows media center that can easily support HD from OTA, Cable, Sattellite or dish, and be able to record at least 2 shows at once. and not be more than $10/month. but unfortunately i don't see that happening any time soon. - elenadragon, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1When the HD Tivos first came out, they had an offer to transfer your pre-existing lifetime subscription to your new HD Tivo for free... and the old Tivo would still work for a year. My husband and I took the deal, and now have an HD Tivo with a lifetime subscription. The subscription on our old one hasn't run out yet either.
- Senseless, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1Apple and Microsoft understand what Tivo does not - it's of utmost importance to get boxes IN THE HOUSES and then to work on expanding content. I used to be a Tivo customer, then dropped it in favor of a DirecTivo, then dropped my DirecTivo when D* started putting out their own interface (which is really horrible) and have since moved over to a Comcast DVR. I also dislike the Comcast unit, but 100% agree with those who pointed out I only pay a monthly rental fee.
Tivo has never learned the lesson that it needed to a) subsidize units to get them into millions of households, and b) make them universally compatible with cable TV and Satellite. S3 does not work with Sat, so they killed a huge potential customer base, and Cablecard does not work with On Demand and Pay per View with Comcast - which Comcast's own DVR does.
I think if they want to stay in the hardware biz, then they start offering the units for $50 (reg) and $100 (HD), with little or no monthly fee. Then subsidize with on screen ads and selling demographic data. They could even sell paid content via the box just like MS does with XBL. MY GOD - MS even beat Tivo to an innovation - what does that say about Tivo?!? Hell, Tivo could have been the next Neilson box if they had played their cards right.... - Thundercat1971, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1I have a Tivo S3, and I could not be happier, and for me it is worth every penny spent.
I think the main problem people have with buying a tivo is that they have never had one. Many people think that the Comcast DVR is as good as it gets. They have never known anything better.
I briefly had the comcast DVR when we upgraded to HD. I had it for less than a month. It was so frustrating to use that it was a chore to watch tv. The menus are confusing, the drive capacity is a joke, and the lock ups, OH the lockups! That box crapped out at least twice a week, just using it normally. And after a reboot it takes about 6 hours, 6 HOURS to repopulate with data! What is that crap?
After that, I had no problems spending the money on the new (at the time) S3 tivo. The menus are so simple a first time user has no problems doing everything quickly. My tivo was recently upgraded with an ESATA drive so now I have 131 HD hours of recording capability. No problems saving the Planet Earth series and the last season of The Office for as long as I want. In the 8 or so months I've had it I only had one lockup. And after a reboot the tivo only takes minutes to be back up and running 100%.
You can also play music on the tivo from your computer, and the same with displaying pictures. There are included games. You can schedule programs from any web browser anywhere so you don't have to be home to record a show you just heard about. Wishlists are great. We use them to record Flyers hockey games and action movies that are in HD.
None of the capabilities I mentioned you can do with the Comcast DVR.
Comcast DVR users: THERE IS SOMETHING BETTER OUT THERE!!!! - PueSi, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1What the hell does that even mean?
- Anth, on 10/11/2007, -0/+1You know you can plug in your S2 to the internet right? Get a cheap $30 USB to ethernet adapter.
Also there are new S2 DT boxes with dual tuners. - sachman, on 10/11/2007, -0/+0Perhaps they need to exploit the differentials a little more. Provide newer services via the internet while maintaining the existing DVR features.
http://tinyurl.com/3xfbx5 -
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