What is Digg?107 Comments
- theNazz, on 06/24/2008, -7/+33Good lucking finding a place to live in NYC on $96,451 a year...
- wjackson, on 06/24/2008, -1/+21But the cost of living in Houston is pennies compared to NYC.
- sockpuppets, on 06/24/2008, -2/+20If anyone in the NY puppet community has space in their sock drawer for me and my laptop let me know.
- lostarchitect, on 06/24/2008, -0/+17NYC's not cheap, I live here. But $96k is waaaaaayyyyy more than enough to get yourself a decent place, even in Manhattan. I don't know anyone here my age (30) who makes that much, and they all have apartments, some of them quite nice.
- krahzee, on 06/24/2008, -1/+16In Manhattan, no. In one of the boroughs you can easily find a place assuming you don´t mind a subway ride to work.
- frostbyt, on 06/24/2008, -1/+14Less IT people = Higher demand. The market will keep pushing our IT salaries above and beyond the average worker.
High demand = More money.
*Cha Ching* - Temo1, on 06/24/2008, -0/+111K a month gets you a decent just-out-of-college type place in Manhattan. Trust me, I've looked.
- villainousT, on 06/24/2008, -2/+12Why the heck would you leave NYC for Houston of all the god awful places?
I'm actually just about to move from NYC back to Austin. Gotta head back to school :( - Rahodeb, on 06/24/2008, -1/+11You get what you pay for...
- leerayIG88, on 06/24/2008, -0/+10I wonder... is Sex and the City the real thing? Will a IT guy like me ever get laid? i really hope so.
- chewitt, on 06/24/2008, -0/+9Wow, and New York City sells more beer than Munich, Germany - NYC must be the beer capital!
Unless it's per capita, these statistics are useless. - inactive, on 06/24/2008, -0/+8Not if you watch Sex and the City.
- blackinthmiddle, on 06/24/2008, -0/+8I live in NYC and while I make more than what this article says is the average, I'm surprised the average is that high. Good to see. I do feel MUCH better than I did in '01 when I was hopping like mad from one consulting gig to another, just trying to find consistent work. During that stretch of time, I seriously considered switching professions and wondered why I got a degree in mechanical engineering in the first place.
Although tech degrees allow you to get jobs in many different professions, I'm not sure if I would steer anyone in that field. If companies decide to ship my job overseas again, I'll be once again competing against people who make a tenth of what I make, which I obviously can't do. Unfortunately, however, there are very few jobs that can't be outsourced nowadays. Nurses, Teachers, Electricians, Plumbers, Firefighters, Policemen, Construction Workers...I miss anything. I was reading an article that mentioned that some insurance companies were even considering outsourcing certain type of medical procedures, so doctors may not be immune. - inactive, on 06/24/2008, -1/+9*****. I've lived in Manhattan for most of my life (and Brooklyn before that). Yes, rent in Manhattan is *generally* horrible, I'd say the average one bedroom is hanging around just over 3,000 a month--but it still varies. I have friends in Hell's Kitchen paying 2400 for a two bedroom, and friends in Gramercy Park paying 5K for a one bedroom. It depends on what you're willing to put up with, but 96K is fine to live on here---it's far more than enough.
Don't believe the hype, and also, DON'T MOVE TO NYC. WE'RE FULL AND I CAN'T TAKE ONE MORE YUPPY ***** DECIDING TO BREED ALL OVER MY NEIGHBORHOOD.
Thanks in advance. :) - blackinthmiddle, on 06/24/2008, -0/+8I'm not sure how much that's happening today, but I saw it about ten years ago when I was consulting for a reinsurance company in westchester. Two of the hardest workers on my team were working for a consulting firm based in Chicago. They were from India and using H1 visas. I remember one day they asked me for a ride back to their hotel. I agreed, but asked, "Where's your ride?" They informed me that they didn't have a ride. I was shocked. "Wait a minute! Your boss sent you to another state. How does he want you to get to and from work every day?" They told me that their boss gave them no per diem and they were supposed to pay for everything with their salary! They also told me they were only making $35K a year!!! I felt bad for them, but I had my own responsibilities.
- WomensUnderwear, on 06/24/2008, -0/+7Statistically, NYC has more rainfall than Seattle
- Commodore69, on 06/24/2008, -3/+9Look, this article is nothing but another IT industry scam. They never mention who the AeA is and wisely so. The AeA is a lobbying group for IT companies. They go about crying and whining that they don't have enough workers to fill positions so they have to go abroad. This is a pile of *****. What they really want are more H1B visas so they can drive IT salaries down. I work for a fortune 500 and can tell you that the vast majority of these H1Bs are either on par or INFERIOR to American workers. The only reason these companies want them so bad is so they can pay them lower wages. They try to pass this partisan BS off as news. Nice try. You're all a bunch of ***** holsters.
- inactive, on 06/24/2008, -1/+7Yes.
- inactive, on 06/24/2008, -1/+7Stupid me moved from NYC to one of the lowest paying places in the US (Houston, TX).
- Suzilla, on 06/24/2008, -3/+9The dirty little secret about why NYC tech salaries are lower is the higher percentage of immigrant (H1B visa) workers, who earn, on average 65% of what their US citizen counterparts earn in the same job. When you account for this, it puts Silicon Valley and NYC in roughly the same ballpark. Some (most? all?) companies in NYC actually have these "discount" rates codified in their HR hiring practices documentation. Moreover, these workers generally must remain with the company that has hired/sponsored them until and unless they are granted a green card. This can take years and some companies are less than "helpful" when it comes to helping to expedite that process.
- MosX, on 06/24/2008, -0/+6Manhattan really isn't that expensive if you know where to look.
- ontain, on 06/24/2008, -0/+5Average? I thought we all knew that salary statistics are supposed to use median since a CIO salary drastically increase the average enough to make it a meaningless statistic. also I'd bet that there are more CIO's in NYC than most other cities.
- Ch33t0, on 06/24/2008, -1/+6I know NYC very well. I have spent a good amount of time up there due to my job as an IT related employee. I declined moving to NYC from Houston because at least here I can own my home with a pool, have no state tax, own a car, park it free and not have to worry about the freaking tourist and hipsters that clog the damn streets when im in a rush to work or grabbing a pint. Not to mention how much my savings account grows living in H-Town. Yeah there are better places to live but Houston has taken care of me and I love it for that. If you moved here and are coming out behind your doing it wrong. The cake is NOT a lie. :)
- Alenzia, on 06/24/2008, -0/+5Yeah, I've heard about people getting surgeries in other countries to pay less... wouldn't be surprised if insurance companies endorsed it more.
- seandaly, on 06/25/2008, -0/+5Every time I work with our enterprise customers in NY, there is a trend.
60% of their help desk / sysadmin staff is of Latino decent, but not on a visa.
50% of their System Engineers and Administrators are either from China or India, on H1B or are cheating the system by running it through Canada.
75% of their programming staff are on H1B's. (see above)
90% of IT management are plain old white guys.
So, it seems to me that if you're an IT manager, and you can get 3 qualified H1B or immigrant experts for the cost of 2 (or less), you're either potentially increasing output or saving money, securing your future.
I'll tell you this... If I get another ***** call from another damned India-based, / US company where Sangram Valishwaly is looking for a Senior Unix Engineer that also with experience in SAN storage, Windows 2008, MS Exchange, jaguar hunting and expert Suis Chef for $22 per hour if I'm willing to relocate to King of Prussia, PA or Detroit, I'm going to lose my ***** mind! These shops succeed by undercutting the other IT placement firms by 10 - 20% on average rates in the big cities ($75 per hour vs. competition's $90), and then just take the blitzkrieg approach and if they can't place on of the thousands of their HlB brethren, they use their practically free Indian Call Centre to call 200,000 potential applicants for each position, saving additional money by using state law contractor loopholes that negate them from having to pay into unemployment insurance, health insurance or any other benefit programs. The northeast is loaded with these *****-holes.
I wouldn't mind so much if they were just providing cheaper local IT labor by cutting overhead, but when you're undercutting the local companies by exploiting your cheap offshore resources, using cheap H1B contractors and exploiting the local unemployed talent (when all that comes across unemployed for 5 months - Joe IT worker's desk is calls from these shops), they're literally cheapening the entire IT landscape.
I'm glad I've been lucky enough to work for the exact opposite for the past 3 1/2 years.
Or, maybe I just don't know what I'm talking about. - mandarin, on 06/24/2008, -0/+4Heh, if only 100k average was true....
- MuskokasFinest, on 06/24/2008, -1/+5Population of Silicon Valley : 3 000 000 and 225 300 tech-jobs = 13 people for every tech job
Population of NYC : 8 000 000 and 316 500 tech-jobs = 25 people for every tech job
Even if you factor in that a lot of people in silicon valley are in the industry, I'd still place my luck on the valley. - LinkGCN4, on 06/24/2008, -1/+5Crawford, TX has a booming IT sector.
- mdude85, on 06/25/2008, -0/+4"finance, despite the economy, is always and only where the real money is."
Yeah, tell that to the guys over at BearStearns!!
finance, like law, is where you go in order to work really hard and make a comfortable salary of 200k/year so that you can buy a modest co-op on the UES and eat out 3 nights a week. But no payout working for Goldman Sachs or Citi is big enough to enable you to retire at 35 like selling your San Jose tech start-up to Google - inactive, on 06/24/2008, -0/+4What? Do you honestly believe that every one of those 25 people WANT a tech job? No. In NYC, the most sought after work is in finance, because despite the economy, that's always and only where the real money is.
- frostbyt, on 06/24/2008, -0/+4Too bad people hate calling India. I have formed in house side business fixing computers on site. We are like geek (Joke squad) squad but we know what we are doing.
- Temo1, on 06/24/2008, -1/+5I wouldn't trade NYC for the world, I love it here... but no income tax in Texas takes some of the bite out of the deal.
- sodade, on 06/24/2008, -0/+3Too bad most high tech firms have invested heavily in Indian resources.
- Zzone, on 06/25/2008, -0/+3The Bronx ain't Manhattan, guy.
- phoomp, on 06/24/2008, -1/+4Broom closets
- Ryan166, on 06/24/2008, -2/+5India = More IT people
More IT people = Less demand
Less demand = Less money
*Mom, can I move in for bit while I find another job?* - seandaly, on 06/25/2008, -0/+3Houston's biggest problem is that it is at present, unfortunately situated in Texas.
I vote we give Texas (we'll keep Austin) and the rest of the fundy states their own country. Most of them never wanted to be part of the union anyway. - blackinthmiddle, on 06/24/2008, -0/+3The article I read mentioned India. It said that the success rate for most bypass heart operations is just as good there as it is in the US for a tenth of the price.
- tnoy, on 06/24/2008, -1/+4Those places are referred to as "crack dens."
- inactive, on 06/25/2008, -1/+4You and your hubris are welcome in my great city. Be careful of Chicago; you stand a good chance of making people cry with that kind of attitude.
- lostarchitect, on 06/24/2008, -0/+3Very few people in NYC actually make that much. NYC is expensive, but many, many people get by on $30,000 and manage to do just fine.
- ssfwestlife, on 06/24/2008, -0/+3Really!? And I've been thinking of moving to Houston.
- frisk415, on 06/25/2008, -0/+3Dude. New York-->Houston. wtf?
- inactive, on 06/24/2008, -0/+3They aren't lower, they're higher. Welcome to the city where unix sysadmins start at 80k if they have a clue at all.
- slayerab, on 06/24/2008, -2/+5The Bronx?
- MuskokasFinest, on 06/24/2008, -0/+3you mean 2 people per job?
quick! change while you still have a chance! - rockchops, on 06/24/2008, -1/+4The obituaries
- digjam, on 06/24/2008, -0/+3Well the truth is a little distorted in both the case above. I agree with blackinthmiddle, that was the case 10yrs ago, but things have changed a lot nowadays. The situation right now is that the same consultants make more, believe it or not.
Reg what suzilla said, I agree H1B workers stay with the company that sponsored them, but thats not a necessity. IF you apply for a GC then you have to stay with the company till it gets approved, not if they sponsor your H1B. And reg what you say that most of these immigrants make less than avg american makes, I seriously dont understand the problem. Trust me, I am on H1, and I can tell you, this is a false notion created by ppl who want you to believe that. Thats definitely not the case. - solid12345, on 06/25/2008, -0/+2Stupid you? My best friend left his $14/hr job with just a high school degree from Oklahoma to move to NYC with his girlfriend so she can apply for an internship at MTV and get her "dream job" (which I can tell you judging by her grades she will never get it)
a month later, he says he hates it, the people in NYC are rude, and he cannot find a decent paying job without a degree.
Yeah we may not have all the glitz and glamour in the midwest and do have church fundies but if you want to make a nice life here without an education you have that opportunity. - lostarchitect, on 06/25/2008, -0/+2I had 3 roommates when I first moved here (4 years ago), but we shared a 2000 sq ft loft in Brooklyn, each had our own room, and paid $800/month each. Not to mention the amazing view of the Manhattan and Brooklyn bridges. I made $38,000 at the time. You just have to LOOK. Jeeze. I can't believe I'm defending New York. I hate it here.
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