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- the_snitch, on 11/14/2007, -13/+413While he's got that time machine, how about avoiding BetaMax vs VHS, MemoryStick vs. SD, Atrac3 vs. mp3, MicroMV vs. MiniDV, SACD vs. DVD Audio, Minidisc, UMD, naming FireWire "iLink", rootkits, and all the other Sony blunders. Isn't it obvious Sony never learns?
- scabbers, on 11/14/2007, -9/+200Change title to: Sony upset that consumers failed to become their bitches.
- jeromeerome, on 11/14/2007, -6/+132Thats a great point. When was the last time Sony created an industry standard?
- MikeCerm, on 11/13/2007, -10/+75It's not like Sony's the only company who ever invented physical media formats that didn't catch on. Think MiniDisc was a disaster? You haven't even heard of Panasonic's competing format, DCC (digital compact cassette). Memory Stick didn't flop much harder than xD. Laserdisc could be considered a failure, but was nothing compared to the failure of RCA's SelectaVision. Iomega's Zip and Jaz drives failed at replacing the common floppy. The Imation's LS-120 SuperDisk format failed to compete with Zip. Magneto-Optical storage in general was killed by CD-R.
As much as Sony's tried and failed, they've also succeeded a few times. Plenty of other companies have been far less successful than Sony. Also, while it's fun to beat up on the PS3, but the Playstation and Playstation 2 have pretty much owned the market for the last 10+ years. Just trying to add a little perspective here. - xcheats, on 11/12/2007, -5/+65I would say that was more Philips wasn't it?
- FlashBIOS, on 11/12/2007, -1/+43That consumers lost because Beta won is a myth that needs to die. While is it true Betamax had good quality, it implemented the quality and the expense of recording time. One hour was all the format supported for a very long time. Would you have liked to manage and swap multiple tapes just to watch a movie? I sure wouldn't. Additionally, the media and players were much more expensive. VHS allowed people to watch an entire movie at an affordable price, with suitable quality, and had the backing of the studios.
So where did the consumers lose? - aegis9975, on 11/12/2007, -7/+47For what it was worth, both sides tried to make a single format when they started. However, Toshiba insisted on keeping the DVD 6C royalty fees in place, which is the reason all the other manufactures left DVD consortium in the first place since there was a disproportionate amount of money going to one company (Toshiba). Remember Blu-ray really isn't a Sony-format, its a large group of companies like Phillips, *****, Samsung, etc that share royalty fees. Talks were continuing until winter of 06, but neither side could come to terms.
For MS, the importance of the format war is primarily due to the inclusion of a requirement for a full Java runtime for BD-J. Which is why they said that Vista will not support Blu-ray in the future, if BD catches on, and every PC is equipped with a BD drive like DVD drives are today, then it will also mean that every PC will by consequence also have a functioning Java runtime. - solid12345, on 11/12/2007, -3/+43Nice to see Sony showing some weakness for once instead of gloating.
- DarkDx, on 11/12/2007, -2/+40http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/images/son ...
- Trocisp, on 11/12/2007, -3/+39They didn't pull that one off alone.
- footbag01, on 11/12/2007, -6/+41Crap... If Bluray loses, I won't have anything to use the PS3 for. Wait let me check the manual... I think I remember that they said it could play games too.
- inactive, on 11/12/2007, -8/+42Probably since the floppy disk
- sekhui, on 11/12/2007, -13/+42i love how a story that basically says no one is winning the format wars is spun into a huge sony bashing orgy.
- nurall, on 11/12/2007, -1/+30everything is now made in china and will break.
- bnolsen, on 11/12/2007, -10/+38Just as Sony *thought* they had the price of the PS3 under control toshiba drops a $100 HD-DVD on the US market.
Sony is for real trying to bankrupt itself this time, not just from one angle but from 2. The fault is all Sony's but I can't wonder if they're getting some *help* this time from some other huge corporation with huge cash reserves. - HappyScrappy, on 11/13/2007, -7/+35ATRAC was released many years before MP3 was in use, you can't blame Sony for creating an audio format to fill a need. Yeah, they should have switched to MP3 quicker when it became a file format (as opposed to being used on media like ATRAC was initially).
MicroMV vs MiniDV was not a competition. Sony was a big proponent of MiniDV for years before creating MicroMV because there was a need for a smaller tape to make smaller camcorders. They then at this point kept supporting MiniDV for their mainline, and used MicroMV only fo the super small camcorders.
Sony created SACD before DVD audio came about. I do agree both formats have mismanaged their business here, the biggest mistake may have been thinking that there was a demand for a higher-def audio format in the first place.
MiniDisc was a success in Japan and Europe. Not just with Sony either, there were multiple companies who made money selling MiniDisc players for almost 10 years in Europe and Japan. Only the release of the iPod finally closed out the days of MiniDisc.
UMD is an internal format to Sony, it was never offered to 3rd parties. This is similar to the cartridge format of the DS. It is also incompatible with everything else and proprietary to Nintendo. You might as well complain DS doesn't read SD cards as soon as complain PSP uses a media format no one else uses.
By renaming FireWire "iLink" you mean renaming IEEE1394 "i.Link", right? Like it or not, FireWire already had multiple names before Sony adopted it. - rebrad, on 11/12/2007, -1/+28Give them enough DRM and they will hang themselves. Sony, in their effort to protect their formats have been their own worst enemies. I used to buy Sony but those days have ended.
- wintersland, on 11/12/2007, -0/+27They didn't pull off Blu-ray alone either: Dont forget Phillips, Samsung, Pioneer, TDK, LG etc. etc.
SACD was also developed by the same people who developed the CD in the first place, Phillips and Sony. - solid12345, on 11/12/2007, -6/+33Well lets be fair to Sony, they had BetaMax out first and VHS was a JVC invention so it was not really Sony v.s "the standard".
- alexforcefive, on 11/12/2007, -1/+27I don't know why you're being dugg down. We ALL ***** saw it coming, and all the companies involved were warned time and again about starting another format war. They did it anyway, and now we're all suffering the consequences. Well I'm not, because I still have a DVD player :)
- schoate09, on 11/12/2007, -0/+25VHS was open to others, Beta was only offered by Sony. You didn't need a JVC VHS player.
- betterth, on 11/12/2007, -1/+26Right. Good thing all the inventors, scientists and philosophers who made modern life a reality didn't heed that ***** quote.
- inactive, on 11/12/2007, -6/+30"Merits","merits"; who cares about the merits when Sony's screwing you in the ass for it?
- powerhouse, on 11/12/2007, -8/+31Normally I would too, but there are a couple of companies so anti-consumer I cannot support them. Sony is on that list.
- MtheoryX, on 11/12/2007, -0/+21Gotta love when someone pwns themself.
- schoate09, on 11/12/2007, -2/+20DVD was created by Toshiba. CDs were jointly created by Sony and Phillips, and Phillips was really the spearhead of the CD, well with creating the REDBOOK standard format that's used today.
- nurall, on 11/12/2007, -12/+30for the longest time i was planning to buy a ps3 for the blu-ray player. then walmarts 98$ hd player happend.
now i hope HD wins. - inactive, on 11/12/2007, -6/+24Remember Sony's comments a while back saying that the main aim of the PS3 was to push their blu-ray format?
I kind of feel wary buying a PS3 now, thinking that it's just being used to prop up their failing format. - inactive, on 11/13/2007, -15/+33I'd rather stand by what format is technically better, regardless of brand.
- Zippo, on 11/12/2007, -2/+19The problem with UMD is that they had movies made for it, thinking people would want to pay the same price as a DVD for a low-quality movie that only plays on a PSP.
- seneyr, on 11/12/2007, -10/+27Haha. Who didn't see this one coming?
- Flamekebab, on 11/12/2007, -1/+18UMD movies.
I never did quite grasp why they named the format "universal" seeing as only the PSP can play the damn things. - Fallout911, on 11/12/2007, -8/+25I just bought the 360 HD drive and got heroes S1 for free along with another 5 free movies.
I hope HDdvd wins - MikeCerm, on 11/12/2007, -3/+19SPDIF
- carpespasm, on 11/12/2007, -2/+18and only sony uses them because they're so concerned with all the money they could make if everyone paid them licensing fees to use the format that they don't see that no one is going to buy into something they can't control.
- m00nstone, on 11/12/2007, -1/+16The whole thing is lame. I would have bought a player by now if it wasn't for this war. DVD is fine with me until we have a winner.
- IndigoMoss, on 11/12/2007, -1/+16Just because other companies have installed rootkits on machines, doesn't make Sony any less responsible for doing it. That's like saying, "Yeah Charles Manson was a murderer, but it's not like he's the only one who's killed someone before." Obviously rootkits aren't murder, but the analogy still stands.
- betterth, on 11/13/2007, -4/+19And PS3 seriously kicks the 360's ass on the specs. And a Lamborghini seriously kicks a Mustangs ass on the specs. (Except for price/benefit ratio on all three). Sure the specs are marginally better (at a level unnoticeable to the vast majority of customers, and on the vast majority of setups), but is that marginal better-ness worth the 30% or more hike in price?
As for "seriously", you're a retard. They both run 1080p, they both run DTS and Dolby. The only real tech advantage that Blu-Ray lists is capacity, and maybe a codec? Oh noes, let's all pay $200 more so we can store marginally more information (even though movies fit fine on less) and run it at the same resolution using the same audio codecs. I'm sure we'll all feel the difference. - syphern, on 11/12/2007, -7/+21Sony creates great formats with alot of potential and some of the time these formats are a bit better than competition. The problem is that only Sony uses them! So only a minority of people get to use them hence they fail!
- tendonut, on 11/11/2007, -1/+14Just not on the price. This is why Sony lost pretty much every format war they fought. Sony's technology may technically be superior, but they want to charge and arm and a leg for it and make it proprietary (UMD and MemoryStick come to mind first). I'm sure Betamax would have won the format war if they were able to undercut the VHS team in price or at least match it. Quality sells so many units, but it will always come down to what is cheaper for the end user.
- hove, on 11/12/2007, -1/+14Anyone else see a time machine format war on the horizon?
- evereddie, on 11/12/2007, -1/+14The professional Beta used in Broadcast is NOTHING LIKE the home Beta. You cannot compare these. The only thing is has in common is the type of tape shell. Check your specs. Professional Beta is a completely different standard and only gets 1 hour on the size tape that home gets 5 hours.
- staticneuron, on 11/13/2007, -3/+16Blu ray is more expensive because.... get this.... it is actually manufactured differently. They use the same laser but blu ray has more pits and a different stamping process. That allows it to have more space per layer and a higher overall bitrate. The technology cost money. The formats are similar but not the same. They try and try to push drm but in the end who cares? Especially about drm on an HD format? The backup complaint gets worn here.
- betterth, on 11/12/2007, -2/+14Despite huge losses from Playstation Sony actually drove a decent profit last quarter, as their consumer electronics division has seriously stepped up from the slump it was in. Don't think it's going anywhere anytime soon...
- tendonut, on 11/12/2007, -2/+14It was also a temporary one-day sale, and was used to liquidate all the HD-A2s to make room for the new A3's. (around $200). Regardless, the best HD-DVD player still costs less than the low-end Blu-Ray player....As I said above, quality will get you so far. If you can deliver a format that is NEARLY identical to superior competitor, yet charge have as much for the player, you win. History is just repeating itself.
- mydickhertz, on 11/12/2007, -2/+14solid12345: It'd be more relevant if there weren't a million other examples of Sony not playing well with others (and oh, let us not forget root kits).
- samanathon, on 11/12/2007, -13/+24Not to mention that Beta is still being used in the pro television market. The format is way more superior to VHS ever was, it was the consumers who lost on that one....
- LeRenard, on 11/12/2007, -1/+12People can't put a download on the shelf and admire/brag about their collection.
- Viral, on 11/12/2007, -2/+13Sony, Philips, Toshiba, and others merged competing formats to create the DVD, and subsequently the DVD Forum, of which Sony is still a member yet ignored when the rest agreed that HD-DVD should be the official replacement to the DVD and went on to release Blu-Ray. Toshiba even extended their hand early on and offered to merge HD formats which Sony ultimately snuffed. So now after being total dicks about the whole thing, Stringer finally releases it was a mistake.
Amongst all of the good they have done, Sony does a lot of idiotic *****. It's almost hard NOT to hate them... - Flamekebab, on 11/13/2007, -5/+16"The Blu-RAY clearly kicks HD-DVD's ass on the specs."
What are you smoking?
I've just looked through the chart and the only real difference I can see is the amount of data that can be stored on the discs which is fairly irrelevant for consumers who just want to watch films. -
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