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- mrgreen4242, on 10/12/2007, -0/+40Hey, answered my own questions... here's a slightly more informative article: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/news/66260/prius_hits_113mpg.html
Also, note that this a UK article, and the gallons are imperial, using the 40km/liter figure, it works out to ~94 mile/US gallon.
Still really impressive. Also still no mention of PHEV, so I'm going to assume no at this point. I wish they would make that an option, especially if they are going to have an improved electric only mode anyways. Oh, and 2008 is the goal for this model. Perfect timing for me to get a 2 year old off lease model. :) - Philoushka, on 10/12/2007, -8/+34250 MPG - wow, that's a lot of Smug !!
- m242, on 10/12/2007, -0/+24The Prius looks the way it does to reduce wind resistance; it has a coefficient of drag of 0.26. The Ford Mustang, for example, has a coefficient of drag of .33. That may not sound like a huge difference, but it is. The Prius cuts through the air far, far more efficiently than the Mustang.
- lateralus, on 10/12/2007, -4/+27"Some of your mpg nuts should just get a motorcycle...."
Yeah, here in So.Cal you'll be doing great, until Soccer Mom plows her Yukon through your skull when she drops her Starbucks latte. - mrgreen4242, on 10/12/2007, -1/+23Anyone have any other source for this? I'd be very interested to hear more about it, such as if it's true, when they'll be released, and if it's a PHEV (Plug-in Hybrid Electric Vehicle).
You can mod a Prius to get 100+ mpg now, as a PHEV, and I'm guessing this will be the case with this, if it's true. I'd love a PHEV mass market car, and would buy one for my next vehicle (admittedly that's about 4 or 5 years off, since I've only out 75k miles on my car in the last 5 years, and I am hoping to to put at least another 50 or 60k on it before I get a new one).
Being able to do, say, 45 on pure electric power AND charge it off of 110AC would be great for the couple months in summer when gas spikes a buck (or two) over the "normal" price the rest of the year. Just take a little slower route to work and run off of grid power most of the time until prices dip down again... forget to gas on the way to work Thursday morning only to find it jumped $0.50 a gallon during the day? No problem, hold out 'till Monday night on $0.10/kwh charging in the garage!
On another note, I wonder what the lifespan on the lithium batteries will be, compared to the NiMH used now (which are warrantied for 100k miles if I recall). - netbear, on 10/12/2007, -3/+16Different strokes for different folks. All the new gassy models look like the same old crap to me. But the hybrids look and feel more modern.
- rino, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12Hmmm, whodda thunk it? A car manufacturer responding to market needs and demands! Oh yeah, this is a Japanese company who has been innovating for the last 35 years while Detroit basically rested on its behind.
In the 70s they responded with smaller cars, in the 80s with better quality, reliability and manufacturing, in the 90s with price, features and safety, and now... - ianweir, on 10/12/2007, -1/+13You should keep in mind, even if you are moving the pollution elsewhere, it's probably a lot easier, cheaper, and more efficient to upgrade a few power plants to be more energy efficient and environmentally friendly than it is to do the same to hundreds of thousands of cars. It's much easier to do things efficiently on a larger scale. (e.g. It's cheaper (per tire) to manufacture 10 million tires than 10 tires, or even a million tires)
Alas, my typing speed has again caused my point to be made before I say anything. - jmichaelg, on 10/12/2007, -0/+11It depends. Power plants have major systems to clean their exhaust, at least here in California that is. A lot of times all that's coming out of the smoke stack is co2 and water vapor. If you charge the car during peak demand, i.e., at work, then you're shifting the pollution to dirtier plants that are run only when there's a spike in electricity demand. Those plants aren't as clean. OTOH, if you charge at night when demand is low, you're helping level out the power curve for the main plant which means it runs closer to its optimal efficiency. It also depends on your power source. As others have pointed out, if your electricity is hydro or nuclear then you're not generating any pollution at all.
- brandonking, on 10/12/2007, -3/+14Twisterx is an idiot. The Prius looks a little different (I like it more than the same friggin boring old every mom and pop's sedan), but that's it. The Camry, 400h, Highlander, Escape, Civic, and Accord look the same. Now STFU. Your information is 5 years out of date. You know they'll add the same engine ot the other Toyota hybrids...
- drizek, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12Car engines are only 10-15% efficient. Powerplants are 30-40% efficient, so you are basically doubling(or even tripling) the efficiency.
- fantasticFlan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10Hydrogen was only heavily promoted because it's a future tech that won't affect oil consumption in the short term. (feel free to mod down)
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+13We couldn't grow enough to make ethanol viable for any good percentage of the population.
- roeboedog, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12I love this idea, where does my power on my grid come from? Am I not pushing the polution off to some other site. I love the idea of plugging it in, now if their was a way I get my boss to pay for the power so I could plug in at work.
- falcon1, on 10/12/2007, -6/+15Wow - that comment isn't getting old around here at all.
- MrDo, on 10/12/2007, -23/+32And smug levels are high as ever
- geminitojanus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+9"For hwy driving super efficient diesels win no problem."
I still wish I Volvo or VW would jump behind TurboDiesel/Electric vehicles. I'd love to own a VW Golf that burned diesel and charged a battery (and for that matter, could plug into a wall or use inductive recharging when I'm parked somewhere equipped for it).
I don't know why they're not making them yet; Trains have been diesel-eletric for years and years now, and it seems to make the most sense overall.. - bab7880, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9With a 1988 Chevy S-10 that's lucky to get 15 MPG --- this looks absolutely delicious
- LaughingMan11, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8There are still major obstacles to hydrogen. They are
(1) production. Hydrogen is not like petrol in that petrol we basically take out of the ground and put it through a relatively energy friendly refining process. Hydrogen needs to be generated, and much energy needs to be put in to extract hydrogen. Until we can find a way to generate lots of hydrogen cheaply, it's going to be an energy medium instead of an energy source.
(2) engine technology. Two technologies exist for hydrogen use in cars. One is the hydrogen combustion engine, which will resemble our current ICEs, but instead of gasoline that is burned, hydrogen will be burned. It's a much cleaner burn because hydrogen + oxygen is just water, but the problem is range. Hydrogen combustion engines may not have that much of a range at first with a full tank of hydrogen (100 miles perhaps). The second technology is fuel cell electric vehicles. The hydrogen is used in a fuel cell to generate electricity which is used in an EV... this is a nice idea, providing silent electric vehicle operation. The problem is cost. FCEVs still cost millions to produce and have radically different components, in contrast to hydrogen combustion, which has mostly the same as current ICEs. Price and range are obstacles.
(3) storage. We still haven't a good and safe technology to store a decent amount of hydrogen that will give us enough range (say 400-500 miles) in a vehicle.
Hydrogen, if it is to become our future, is many years off as we try to solve the above problems. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9BFD. There's a guy out in California that has modded hybrid cars which get up to 250+ MPG. He's had one in his garage since LAST YEAR! Why the hell can't Toyota do THIS?!?!?!
http://www.treehugger.com/files/2005/08/wip_modified_hy.php - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10Hot damn, maybe I need me one of these. Gas prices piss me off.
- jerwood, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9"Americans want bigger, faster... it's hard to motivate a country like that to drive teeny cars that are slow as dirt just because they get good gas mileage."
False. Just wait for $4+ gallon gas. Peak oil is a bitch. - geekdreams, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8I thought the same thing about the Prius originally, but now I kind of like it. Anyway, there are more hybrid cars available now that look "normal", and lots more on the way in the next few years:
http://www.hybridcars.com/compacts-sedans.html - brandonking, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11You drive a Mustang, and you're bragging. And if I said, "*stuffy laugh* Don't look at me! I only drive a Rolls Royce!" would I be acting smugly? You bet ya. Your statement is an internal contradiction. It's like saying, "I'm so great! I'm so much better than you! You know why? Because I don't brag!"
- Drizzit, on 10/12/2007, -3/+10Just the other day a prius went past me... I was going 80.. they're not that slow.
- kacymartin, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8because they have to have a 100,000 mile warranty on the battery. and they were afraid that the battery only option would cause people to abuse the battery and cause them to wear out too early. thus its disabled.
- brandonking, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11You're a dumbass. Hybrids outperform their non-hybrid counterparts in accelleration and power. You'll look mighty stupid when you get smoked by a Prius when the light turns green. The best part is that it will probably be a block ahead of you before the gas engine even kicks on!
- Alex3917, on 10/12/2007, -0/+71. NiMH battery replaced by LiON
2. Aluminum engine instead of steel
3. Tube frame isntead of solid frame
4. Carbon fiber body instead of metal
5. More efficient use of electric engine
I have talked to people who know about this stuff, and the consenus is the next prius will borrow a lot from race car technology, while keeping the same look and feel. - saon, on 10/12/2007, -9/+15I don't know why this is getting thumbs down'd. This is one of the main reasons people don't buy these hybrid cars; they look like crap. When you're driving around in a new sports car, it has a very distinct and appealing look. When you're driving around in a new hybrid, it has a very distinct and unappealing look. I'm a firm believer in form following function, but, these things look like crap. Hybrids can look sexy too, there's absolutely no reason for them to not.
- Brian48216, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9why should the look matter that much when you're getting fuel economy better then any other car, helping the environment, and reducing dependence on foreign oil?
Sounds like someone has penis size issues. - XTrek, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8Prius hwy mileage is around 40mpg if you milk it. The Prius is best for stop and go city driving. For hwy driving super efficient diesels win no problem.
- firehydra2k, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Heh, nice development...but what happened to hydrogen?
- saroth, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Many utility companies allow you to buy energy from non-polluting sources. If you do this, they won't run another power line to your house, they'll just make sure that they produce as much energy from non-polluting sources as you use, so there is no net pollution. Additionally, the power produced by the power company is cleaner than that which your car produces, because your car cannot contain the massive emissions reducing equipment that a power plant is often required to have. Furthermore, the plant is more efficient than your car because it produces a lot of power at once, and none of it is wasted on idling.
- foohookups311, on 10/12/2007, -4/+10hahahahaa i loved that episode of south park. but all joking aside, i am very interested in these hybrids now. I am not so much into them for the environmental concerns (all though a nice bonus) but more for my own personal financial reasons.
- Wagnel, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9Doubt this is true, but if so, I'll be trading up soon. I'm driving a 2005 Prius and averaging about 52mpg
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+12mustang ...hahaha that has become the ultimate teenage girl car, congrats semen err seumas
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+894 miles per gallon = 39.96 kilometers per litre
113 miles per gallon = 48.0 kilometers per litre
(bloody amazing) - dykesat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6"Li-Ion batteries are currently reprocessed through pyrolysis (heat treatment) with the primary recovery the metal content."
http://www.wasteonline.org.uk/resources/InformationSheets/Batteries.htm - kacymartin, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8current hybrids can do 85-90 mph already, whats the big deal?
all the money you save on paying less for gas you'll lose to speeding tickets - mccoma, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6well geminitojanus, BMW says it has a diesel hybrid coming soon
- netbear, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5No, Mustangs are the ultimate mid life crisis cars. All the grey hairs drive em here.
- blahblah, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7Seriously. If the only non-sweatshop-labor clothing I could get were ugly, I would still wear it.
- aveyuen, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6@mrgreen: I think a plug-in vehicle would have to be the only feasible way for the jump in fuel economy. If it is, then sign me up! also, with regards to Li-ion batteries, if they are properly maintained then it should in theory last longer than NiMH. Ni-based battery technology is subject to the memory effect, where deposits build up on the electrodes and sometimes cause the complete failure of the battery. Li-ion batteries lose capacity as well over time, but as long as you're not draining too much current they're usually alright. In the Li-ion battery pack that we used for our solar car, the stat sheet said ~80% capacity after about 400 cycles... All that being said though, there has to be some sophisticated control circuitry for Li based tech. Too much current, too high temperature, overcharging, and undervoltage can all cause fire. I've seen some nasty lithium battery fires in other solar cars, but thankfully no one was hurt.
- sarusa, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5When you care about efficiency this much, the streamlining becomes pretty important - which gives you the smoooooth slightly stubby front and the large flat back (you don't want it coming to a point in the back, just a little taper from the widest part). And you don't want the sides near the back have any breaks in them which is why they covered the wheel wells - I'm not sure why they stopped doing it, but perhaps it was because people thought it was too ugly, and of course it makes it a bitch to change your tires. The Insight still has the covered wheels, and of course the best mileage.
- tifosiv122, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7Yup, my Ex had a Prius...on the highway it was just like every other car...only get one of these if you live in a major city.
- FarcePest, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6My dad got a Prius in the last year. It drives pretty much like a normal car, except that it stalls at every stop sign (that's a feature, not a bug). By the sound of it, it doesn't have a conventional starter, because when it does restart automatically, you barely hear it. And it gets an honest 50 MPG in mixed driving. It regenerates a lot of power in city driving. If it's cold (hasn't run in a few hours) it takes about 10 minutes for the engine and drivetrain and lubricants to warm up before the gas mileage really starts to increase. And yeah, it has a built-in display to show you if it's pulling power from batteries or recharging them, and what your gas mileage and regenerative breaking have done in a 5 minute histogram. I think the range is 500 mi or more. It does have weird dashboard shifter (for park, reverse, drive, and engine braking), and you don't so much start it as you do boot it up...
- kacymartin, on 10/12/2007, -3/+8cept for the fact that you dont plug it in. it uses regenerative breaking to charge the batteries
- kacymartin, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Not all hybrid vehicles look like *****. Actually a minority of them do (the Insight and Prius). The chevrolet pickup, lexus hybrids, toyota corola (and their next pickup), toyota minivan, ford escape (and most likely more that i'm missing) all retain their original styling.
- LaughingMan11, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5The Prius doesn't have a conventional starter at all. Instead of the relatively small starter engine that is used for ignition in a regular car, hybrids like the Prius use one of the large electric motors to spin the engine up to 800RPM instead of the 100RPM in a conventional vehicle. It then times the spark very carefully to get the smoothest start. It can start the engine from not spinning when the car is moving 40 MPH.
- Wagnel, on 10/12/2007, -4/+8Get one, you wont regret it
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