digg

Join DiggAbout

Discover the best of the web!
Learn more about Digg by taking the tour.

» Is Microsoft about to release a Windows 'kill' switch?

blogs.zdnet.com — A ZDNet.com Blog, posted by Ed Bott. Ed speculates that a specific unanswered question may reveal a September date to disable Windows if WGA has not been applied to computers running Windows.

Bury
show profanity settings
expand all
  • derlin, on 10/12/2007, -16/+93In the words of Dave Chapelle, "microsoft is effin up!".
    • Nezzari, on 10/12/2007, -172/+38They have every right to do so. As a programmer, I laugh at you.
    • info, on 10/12/2007, -17/+157I say bring it on!

      This will just send more everyday people over to Mac and Open Source.
    • KingAdrock, on 10/12/2007, -12/+24Large Corporate Software companies in general is effin up... shhh they comin!
    • inturnaround, on 10/12/2007, -3/+73Nezzari, just because you have the right to do something doesn't mean it's right to do something or that you should do something.

      Such a kill switch will invariably break some legitimate users' computers, too.
    • OddWeaselBoy, on 10/12/2007, -3/+52The more they tighten their grasp, the more we'll slip through their fingers. Do your best, MS, I look forward to laughing in your faces. :)
    • r00tus3r, on 10/12/2007, -8/+64Go ahead, we dare you, Linux users (particularly ubuntu) would quadruple over night. They haven't got the minerals!
    • robbh66, on 10/12/2007, -3/+82@ Nezarri

      I agree, they may have a right to- but I also have a right not to be F'ed over by them.

      I have a Toshiba laptop. It has a XP Pro key on the bottom of the laptop. I have tried time and time again to re-install windows on it- every time it refuses the key. I call MS, they tell me to call Toshiba. I call Toshiba, they tell me the key is valid and I cant have another.

      Obviously I already paid for XP pro on that computer. I'm not paying again.
    • jrizzo, on 10/12/2007, -3/+47Hackers > Microsoft...

      They can try as they may, but the hackers will always find a way around it. And chances are, it will be "legitimate use" of software that you own. When will people like Microsoft and the RIAA realize that they canNOT beat the Internet nerds at their own game? Start giving us legitimate reasons to play by your rules instead of threats.
    • neoknight, on 10/12/2007, -9/+56suddenly those MAC Switch campaigns started playing in my head.
    • rasterbator, on 10/12/2007, -9/+38Dateline: Los Angeles
      October 2006
      Reports of computers exploding and killing people are happening all over the city and the country. It really is a kill switch! (video of Steve Ballmer dancing and playing the violin around Redmond, WA as buildings are burning around him)
    • wstrucke, on 10/12/2007, -9/+9@robbh66

      the key on the bottom of your computer is probably for a normal copy of XP Pro you would get from the store or on your Toshiba restore disk, if they provided one. I suspect you're trying to install a corporate edition XP Pro which will not accept a non-corporate key. If not, boo on Toshiba and Microsoft... but in my experience that's probably the problem.
    • rewritable, on 10/12/2007, -9/+63If Microsoft does this i will build a faster pc, switch to linux, and use an emulator t run BF2, GTA, and AOE II. This will be the last ***** straw. I run an unlegit copy of windows xp pro because the retarded quick restore CD's wouldn't let me re-install windows xp pro on a custom built pc I upgraded to and there is NO way in hell I am gonna shell out another $200 for somthing I ALREADY HAVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. Then M$ changes their EULA so that you arent allowed move a OEM install to a new pc even if the old pc doesn't even have windows installed on it anymore. Open source here I come.
    • vertinox, on 10/12/2007, -18/+31I'd complain, but I rather enjoy my OS X ;)
    • crimpshrine, on 10/12/2007, -9/+36I hate the comparison everyone makes on how breaking copyright is like stealing a car, stealing from your mother, etc...

      It's NOT, I wish people would make proper comparisons. If a car dealership had the means to "clone" cars on premise for 1/1000th of the original cost with no harmful byproducts produced then yes you can use the comparison that copying a program is like stealing a car from an automobile dealer.

    • CharlesDarwin, on 10/12/2007, -3/+18Vista isn't behind schedule, so they can get some of those developers to work on this...
    • PCDirect, on 10/12/2007, -11/+13@derlin

      In the words of Dave "does MS have to smack a bitch"

      I think that MS is in line to kill pirated copies, but the issue has been stated many times that how they determine whether or not you own a license is the issue. If you do not own a license and want to use XP, buy a copy. If you do not mind trying to hack around it, don't buy one and be prepared to spend time keeping your XP running. The time you spend keeping your pirated copy running could cost more than the actual license itself. Only you can determine that for yourself. I myself need my PC to run when I need it and could not afford downtime. Buying a license only made sense. If you do not have the means to buy a license and have all the time in the world to keep hacking it to keep it running, go for it. Some people out there will hack it for their own personal vendetta against MS. I understand that too.

      Everyone just needs to realize that what works for you may or may not work for others.
    • ivko, on 10/12/2007, -7/+37**Exactly this** is why open source software is the future!

      you don't have to worry about evil people trying to control your life
    • zatrix, on 10/12/2007, -25/+4nobody has heard of disabling automatic updates?
    • Hatefull, on 10/12/2007, -12/+6to info
      how exaclty will this just send more everyday people over to Mac and Open Source?
      everyday people, such as myself, who use their pc for work, gaming and internet, don't care if ms wants to install wga, go ahead I don't give a *****. As long as it doesn't interfere with what I'm doing, I don't care. Don't get me wrong, I grew up using a mac, and would love to go back, and plan to, but it won't be because of ms, it'll be because my money situation is better.
    • elstevo, on 10/12/2007, -12/+6why is this a problem? honestly, anyone in the situation where they need to worry about having windows disabled (i.e. it's pirated) will be smart enough to apply the first hack that's posted to digg... and for everyone else, (i.e. grandma) they will never know the difference because their software is all legitimate.
    • r3zonance, on 10/12/2007, -5/+11"Then M$ changes their EULA so that you arent allowed move a OEM install to a new pc even if the old pc doesn't even have windows installed on it anymore."

      No, that has ALWAYS been the way OEM licenses work.
    • r3zonance, on 10/12/2007, -3/+14I hate MS as much as the next person, but at least my £99 will get me a FULL RETAIL version of Mac OSX, not some *****, restricted OEM crap.
    • OBKenobi, on 10/12/2007, -4/+16Has anyone asked what else MS might have hidden away in Windows?

      This is a perfect example of why an operating system should be open-source. True, MS has released XP's source code *in limited form* to some governments to prove there were no backdoors or killswitches like the one now rumored to exist, but was that source code really complete? And could you really find a hidden function in *MILLIONS OF LINES OF CODE*? MS itself has trouble documenting it all.

      Simply put, I do not trust Microsoft or their products one bit. No pun intended. This is a serious subject, I'm surprised that government agencies and businesses blindly put so much trust in a private, self-serving corporation. Microsoft is not some charity! They're out to make a profit, and they've shown numerous times in the past that they're willing to do so illegally and/or unfairly.
    • ajwillys, on 10/12/2007, -4/+12This is retarded for one simple reason. At one time, EVERY PC ON EARTH had a legal, working copy of Windows on it.

      Ok, not every pc on earth, but darn near it. Pretty much if you don't have a Mac, you paid for Windows at some point for that PC.
    • l1wulf, on 10/12/2007, -9/+3@obkenobi

      Haha, this is the kind of twisted logic that makes me fall out of my chair laughing.

      "This is a perfect example of why an operating system should be open-source. True, MS has released XP's source code *in limited form* to some governments to prove there were no backdoors or killswitches like the one now rumored to exist, but was that source code really complete? And could you really find a hidden function in *MILLIONS OF LINES OF CODE*? MS itself has trouble documenting it all."

      So you're saying that the OS should be open source specifically becuase of the possibility of a kill switch then go on to complain that it is next to impossible to find this hidden function in "*MILLIONS OF LINES OF CODE*". Somehow, being OSS makes it easier? Oh wait, the government people aren't as good as Joe Programmer OSS enthusiast in finding these things? I'm confuzuled.

      People that jump on band wagons for the sake of being "in" make me laugh. OSS is great, I love it (and use it, just wish I had more time/skills to contribute more), but arguments about why MS sucks from lackeys invariably fall on flawed logic.
    • jzimmerman, on 10/12/2007, -11/+5@robbh66

      I have been able to obtain activation authorization off of every computer I have had to call in.

      I work on a lot of computers for both businesses and home users. I often install windows clean using an OEM disc and the key stuck on the side or bottom of the computer. Never once have they denied the activation.

      Yes it was a pain in the ass to have to activate over the phone. No it did not kill me, I usually don't have to do this often on the same computer. If you are having to continually clean install windows on the same machine, you are doing something wrong.
    • dapookenator, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6What if someone "hacks" this and writes code that can use the "kill switch" for their own purposes? Is this possible?
    • xst4t1kx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"Linux users (particularly ubuntu) would quadruple over night."
      Agreed. If this happened I'd go from windows running a virtual machine linux to linux running a virtual machine windows. Unfortunately I have some application dependencies, otherwise I'd ditch windows entirely.
    • cartwheels, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Sounds like Fall 2006 is the time I buy that MacBook I've been eyeing.

      And if this holds true, XP sure as hell isn't going on it.
    • richardiscool, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Nezzazi, being able to make scrolling text in VB does not make you a programmer.
    • xst4t1kx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Also: If they do this I don't forsee people flocking to Vista, what will happen is people will pick up a cheap copy of XP home.
    • vixiecron, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@ajwillys

      Sorry broseph, but my PC never had any flavor of windows on it. Not at any time whatsoever. It's rather difficult for this to happen when you buy all of the parts separately and assemble them yourself. The first OS this thing saw was a Gentoo livecd.
    • vixiecron, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0@ajwillys:

      I should learn to read your entire message. Just ignore my babbling...
    • ph30nix, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@ r3zonance >
      I bought an OEM xp media center 2005 last year for my system...after i built up my dual core system this summer i installed MCE and it wouldnt activate (naturally)
      I called up and politely explained that i upgraded my system (using some of the old hardware (hdd/dvd-rw) and that it was my oem copy;
      Woman on the phone told me that she had a new cd key she could give me but next time i'd need to buy a new copy (which will be vista anyway) and activated the new cd key for me :)

      Then the 40gb hdd used for windows that i dropped once before died on me and i had to reinstall/reactivate windows. This time it said that the os had already been activated and yadda yadda call;
      called last night, told the guy the situation and that it was only installed on this system (which it is) and he gave me the code.

      Call and be polite/appreciative; nothings black and white.
  • phpirate, on 10/12/2007, -4/+40That actually sounds extremely possible. With vista right around the corner, they have no reason not to... it only means more money for them.
    • StatusQuoRules, on 10/12/2007, -2/+43Yep, right around the corner - its like a year away at least
    • rasterbator, on 10/12/2007, -0/+50that is a really WIDE corner.
    • skyshock21, on 10/12/2007, -4/+24Good thing I just switched to Ubuntu Linux on my home desktop. I've used many many different distros of Linux previously, but this one by far takes the cake. I'm really liking it. MS can blow me.
    • NICU, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11This sucks, they'll force you to buy a copy of XP in September and then a new copy of Vista in the spring or summer or fall or by 2010 when its released.

      If they go through with this I'm switching to Ubuntu.
    • OBKenobi, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6How will forcing pirates to pirate Vista instead of XP make them more $$$?

      I suppose they could be after the early-adopters to increase marketshare.

      Here's something interesting about Vista: it's going to miss the holiday season. That means MS will miss all those OEM preloads. That means they need to get alot of early adopters to spur development. Vista doesn't have any killer apps/features.

      So who knows? Maybe.
    • cannucklehead, on 10/12/2007, -1/+0One would think the type of person who pirated the OS either (A) is technically inclined enough to pick up a Linux distribution, but just hasn't been bothered to do so yet, or (B) knows someone or got someone to install it for them, also making it likely they could just get someone to load a Linux OS.

      It would be very interesting to see how many broke down and bought the MS OS versus the final push to Linux. I think in the increase in the number of people introduced to the Linux community would end up hurting Microsoft, although they would see a spike in revenue in the short term.
    • kettlechips, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Plenty of people are unknowingly running pirated windows they got on a cheap PC.
  • furtwan1, on 10/12/2007, -67/+35While I doubt they would do this, I think it's possible.

    if you have a hacked key, I dont feel sorry for you at all.

    Several of my friends had hacked keys and they ended up buying a copy of xp home because WGA told them windows was going to stop working if they dont fix the problem.

    Its kinda sad that people hate on MS for doing this when it's the same people stealing the software. Quit bitching, get a job and quit breaking the law and then crying about it!
    • MikeSD34, on 10/12/2007, -12/+67"Quit bitching, get a job and quit breaking the law and then crying about it!"

      I believe this falls under copyright infringement, not theft, which makes it a civil issue, not a criminal one.
    • Kamino, on 10/12/2007, -13/+30Amen son. Or download Linux. Then just don't complain when you can't play the game your uncle gave you. Or when you can't run the powerpoint presentation your collegue mailed you.
    • Odweaver, on 10/12/2007, -8/+24Ah, so your saying only people that have a pirated copy should worry about this?
      What if something in thier system screws up and disables purchased copies?
    • hackwrench, on 10/12/2007, -23/+9You offering your job? Or are you going to hire all comers?
    • Scruffydan, on 10/12/2007, -4/+33MS has to realize that users running a pirated version of Windows is better for them than users running Linux or OSX.

      Current users if pirated windows are more likely to buy windows than users of Linux or OSX.
    • dclowd9901, on 10/12/2007, -8/+25What about people who bought the software, and lost the keys, or lost the install discs? Should they have to buy it twice, just because Microsoft is using a dated distrobution system?

      I do have a stolen copy of Windows, but I lost my original, and I'll be damned if *I* pay twice for it. I'm not even worried. There'll be a hack out, probably before the switch even goes into effect. Look how easy it is to bypass WGA online: http://www.funponsel.com/blog/archives/2005/08/06/how-to-bypass-windows-genuine-advantage-check-on-windows-xp/
    • dclowd9901, on 10/12/2007, -22/+9accidental double post.
    • dogred, on 10/12/2007, -39/+6@dclowd9901
      So it is okay to steal, so long as you've purchased a copy before?

      does that work for CDs? You are only purchasing the license to listen to the tracks on the disk..as well as the media.

      does that work for automobiles from the dealership, if you've lost your keys? "I've already bought one...but I was too irresponsible and lost my keys. I'll take the red one please. No I don't need keys for it...I've got a screwdriver."
    • merreborn, on 10/12/2007, -3/+39From the article:
      "I purchased a SEALED OEM copy of XP Professional. WGA said the license key was already used. I called MS and they said I should uninstall and buy another copy. I told them I wasn’t made of money and hung-up."

      This guy's paid full price for a legit windows license, and microsoft won't do anything to assure that he can actually use it. I'm pretty sure in this case, it'd actually be completely morally and legally acceptable for this guy to use a pirated copy of windows: _he owns a license to use the software_!

      WGA would prevent him from using something he's legally paid for.
    • Aninhumer, on 10/12/2007, -2/+19I noticed that WINE passed WGA, I don't know how, but it's ironic I could never get WGA to work on XP
    • merreborn, on 10/12/2007, -2/+35"So it is okay to steal, so long as you've purchased a copy before?"
      Using software you have a license to use is in no way theft. You've confused licensing something and purchasing it -- they're totally different concepts.

      "does that work for automobiles from the dealership"
      Completely invalid analogy. You buy a car. You license windows. Apples and oranges.
    • skyshock21, on 10/12/2007, -4/+10@ Kamino

      I have a PS2 and Open Office. No worries here whatsoever. MS is *****' up! :P
    • geocar, on 10/12/2007, -3/+15@furtwan1

      ``does that work for CDs? You are only purchasing the license to listen to the tracks on the disk..as well as the media.''

      That's a load of *****. You're purchasing a copy of the song. You can listen to it in your car, in your living room, in your ipod, or anywhere you like. You can even make a copy of it for your own use.

      ``does that work for automobiles from the dealership, if you've lost your keys?''

      The question isn't that- it's if you _did_ lose your keys, the dealership, the locksmiths, and the MVA all got together and said you have to buy a new car. That's a load of crap, and isn't even what you did, it's this guy got a car delivered, and the keys supplied just don't work.

      You mean to tell me that experience would encourage you to just buy another car?
    • dclowd9901, on 10/12/2007, -1/+12"It’s not Microsoft
      ’s fault that you lost your copy of Windows. It’s your fault. Yes you should have to buy it again if you want to continue using it.

      Thats like saying, I bought a car, my car was stolen, Its Honda's fault, they owe me a new one."

      Okay, I get it now. There's a reason your analogies suck: Because you can't think of a good one that supports your side. As was already said, purchasing a software license is nothing like purchasing a car. By owning a license, you own the right to have however many copies of that software you need. Even though I stole Windows, I own the right to use it, one copy, because that's what I paid for, and that's what Microsoft sold me.

      When I bought my Honda a year ago, I did not purchase the right to have a Honda, I purchased the car itself. Again, as was said before, it's Apples and Oranges.
    • DarkSorrow, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4brownelltyler, if your car got stolen and never to be found later, then your insurance will pay for a new car.

      dont tell me.... you dont have a insurance? that must explain why you blaming on Honda
    • Burner, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7@ all the retards who keep bringing up the stupid automobile analogy. You can't duplicate cars like you can disks! It wouldn't cost MS anything to replace these people's keys or supply them with the correct copy of windows so that it is compatible with their current key. AHHH!
    • erissiva, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Look, you have to realize that there are many people out there that have random crap happen to them that isn't their fault.
      I had something happen to me that is similar to what happened to dclowd9901. Except crappier.

      I recieved a 'new' eMachines computer with WinXP. Everything is dandy. Until I need to restore the OS because of a stupid third-party defragger (yeah...I know...). So I crack open my yet-to-be-opened OS disc only to find a large machine-tooled-looking scratch down the side. This of course renders the disc inoperable.
      MS and eMachines both refuse to take responsibility or help me fix the problem.

      So, I'm stuck here with a downloaded copy and some clever tools from a Russian website. No way I'm paying $100 for a new OEM disc.
      And don't tell me to switch to Linux - the only ones that work on my computer are DSL and other mini-releases. Whenever a new one tries to boot it gets to where it configures the shell and then I get a black screen that doesn't go away. Tried with Ubuntu, Kubuntu, Knoppix, Slax, Slackware, Fedora Core, Gentoo, and Xubuntu.
    • OBKenobi, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6[quote]Current users if pirated windows are more likely to buy windows than users of Linux or OSX.[/quote]

      I've got legit OEM keys. I and many others I know overwrite their OEM copies with the corp version to avoid all the activation-reactivation-MS masturbation ***** that users have to put up with to run this giant piece of crap of an operating system.

      There is one reason and one reason only that I run Windows: it has the apps and games that I need and MS software is what is used in most businesses and organizations. People want Word docs, etc. Luckily at least this is slowly changing and it's coming down basically to games and Photoshop. Yes, I know OS X, but I don't want to buy Apple hardware-yet.

      Keep screwing your customers MS, and soon you won't have any!

      MS, do you realize how much the world and the industry hates you? You're not the "benevolent tech pioneers" or "idealistic nerds" you make yourself out to be. You're a greedy corporation that strong-armed it's way to success without providing any genuine benefit to anyone.

      Maybe Gates is now distributing some of his ill-gotten gains to clean up his image because so many have realized what he really is, but that still does nothing to change what MS itselfhas done--and still doing today!
    • Cl1mh4224rd, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2dclowd9901 wrote: "Look how easy it is to bypass WGA online: http://www.funponsel.com/blog/archives/2005/08/06/how-to-bypass-windows-genuine-advantage-check-on-windows-xp/ "

      Umm... "Update: for new visitors, above trick is no longer work. Please read through the comment below and try suggested bypass steps from others."
  • awoodhouse, on 10/12/2007, -5/+26I'm sure Apple wouldn't moan
    • patrickweber, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9Nope, they just stick Kext's in the /System/Library/Extensions folder that say "Dont Steal Mac OS X"

      http://www.osx86project.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=89&Itemid=2
    • salmog, on 10/12/2007, -34/+12Your smoking crack if you think someone who steals the OS in the first place with go open souce, they had the option of using open source, but they CHOOSE to use (a stolen) copy windows. That should tell you something. Linux is not main stream, no average Windows user will 'switch' to it. Your dreaming or delusional if you think this will make someone switch to open source.
    • awoodhouse, on 10/12/2007, -2/+17A hidden text message versus switching the OS off. Not exactly the same thing is it?
    • lnxaddct, on 10/12/2007, -5/+9salmog,
      They didn't choose anything. The average person either doesn't know an alternative exists, or they're locked into one of Mcirosoft's illegal monopolistic practices, so they are forced to continue to use it.
    • OddWeaselBoy, on 10/12/2007, -16/+16Actually, salmog, I beg to differ. I run a pirated copy of XP for when I absolutely must get my video game fix and I'm about to be in the process of installing my new Dapper CD in about 20 minutes. You see, I think alot of people, MS especially, get the wrong idea about how pirated copies are used. If I actually used it for anything that I felt licensed the > $100 price tag, I'd fork over the money. I paid for Photoshop, I don't feel like paying to run it. Nothing MS has written directly benefits me. Instead, their strong arming of smaller software companies has actually caused much undo stress over the years. Honestly, I don't know a single person who owns a legit copy. It's sad, but it's true. We're all pirates and we do prefer Open Source. Most of us, myself included, have made monetary donations to projects we support. Some of us even code for them. The long and short of it is we don't want to use Windows, but sometimes we have to. It is our belief that if it is a necessity rather than a desire, then there is no warrant in paying for it. I'll GLADLY go all open source as soon as some companies release their software for open source or some open source projects catch up. The day that happens, I promise you that I will smile as I format my Windows drive and mail MS my pirated copy with a nicely written thank you note.
    • r00tus3r, on 10/12/2007, -2/+18Could salmog be more wrong?
      People will always choose the easiest option. When it is no longer easy to pirate windows, the ones that can afford it will buy a legal copy, and the ones that can't will switch to open source. You're a complete idiot if you think this won't result in more linux users.
    • uncleLeo, on 10/12/2007, -14/+4@ OddWeaselBoy - you are a complete idiot. you have absolutely no idea how an operating system works, even at the most primitive levels. i suggest you drop the ignorance and self rightousness and learn the fundamentals of computing before opening your mouth.
    • Wilson, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5"Could salmog be more wrong?
      People will always choose the easiest option. When it is no longer easy to pirate windows, the ones that can afford it will buy a legal copy, and the ones that can't will switch to open source. You're a complete idiot if you think this won't result in more linux users."
      And some of those that will buy another legal copy will get stuck with an invalid key they can't exchange or refund, be told by Microsoft to ***** off, be told by the retailer to ***** off, and have to buy another copy. What a quality system.
    • hackwrench, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2"People will always choose the easiest option"

      That must be why always on anesthetic drugs are selling like gangbusters, and gyms are a figment of the imagination.
    • patrickweber, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2@awoodhouse: I was referring to the text of the comment (hence the name 'reply'). He said apple wouldn't moan about people stealing their OS. I was implying that they tell you in other ways rather than making a big press statement and releasing software (see my previous comment).
  • jav1231, on 10/12/2007, -29/+30This is awesome news! The more stupid ***** M$ does, the more folks will abandon their OS.
    • awhiteflame, on 10/12/2007, -18/+35Please, drop the unbearable "Micro$oft" and "M$". I don't like the company either, but you're going to get alot more respect explaining your reasons for disliking the company rather than saying "Micro$oft SUCKS!!!" or "Wind0ze suxxorz".
    • homeobocks, on 10/12/2007, -17/+12Your credibility is weakened by the use of "M$" to mean "Microsoft."

      I'm no fan of MS, but writing "M$" is just stupid. Yes, they want to make money. That's what business is.
    • badbox, on 10/12/2007, -22/+12Don't worry, your credibility is fine.

      People like to nitpick the $ crap, but your point is the same nonetheless.
    • soopafly, on 10/12/2007, -13/+9There's a reason why people use the "$" in M$.

      I do it all the time...it feels great! But than again, I don't use M$.
  • ahhell, on 10/12/2007, -11/+11As if Microsoft would do this, they COULD do it but they WON'T.
    • jwoelich, on 10/12/2007, -6/+23If you trust Microsoft, you are a fool. Give me one valid reason why they *wouldn't* do this?
    • awhiteflame, on 10/12/2007, -5/+14> If you trust Microsoft, you are a fool. Give me one valid reason why they *wouldn't* do this?
      A backlash. Enormous bad PR.

      But it's not like Microsoft hasn't hit the "stupid button" (http://blogs.zdnet.com/Bott/?p=76, I love that title) before.
    • Pie_Man, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5The reason that they can't just wipe the slate clean with the people who don't have legit keys is because of the class action lawsuits that would ensue.

      There are many people who do, in fact, have a legit copy of XP and all of the supporting information, but are not seen as legit by MS. They may have reinstalled, migrated to a faster machine, or have had their key stolen.

      If they jilt these people...wrongly....I will be 100% willing to bet that there will be a pile of bloodthirsty lawyers willing to start several class action lawsuits that will have teeth, and a very high likelyhood of success.
  • dapete, on 10/12/2007, -5/+35pfft...Windows already comes with THOUSANDS of kill switches. What's one more?
  • WolvenSpectre, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5I think you are looking at this fr5om the wrong end. do a little Google research into Intel AMT DRM that is built into their Pentium D and later chips and the LAN and 'hacking ' utilites that can take advantage of it.
  • chicken101, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7Holy *****, from the comments it seemed like the new WGA really messes up systems. Has anyone here have the same problem?? (I use linux, but I really am curious)
    • csa0307, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4I've heard that its caused problem for some but I haven't noticed anything on my multiple machines running XP.
    • lbeaty1981, on 10/12/2007, -0/+16I haven't had any problems with it actually killing a machine, but it has popped up and told me several copies of Windows that I manage are not genuine. I work for a university with a Microsoft site-license agreement (installed the OS myself more often than not), so I know I have a "genuine" copy. If they start shutting down systems that don't appear genuine to it, it could cause a major headache to a lot of people.
    • BarriedaleNick, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5I run large amounts of XP machines and WGA hasn't caused any problems....

      ...yet
    • aragami, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2i carelessly installed wga to see if my second pc would pass it and it wiped out my graphics card drivers, now nothing comes up when i boot up :(,


      luckily im getting rid of that crap thing soon anyway :)
    • startrek, on 10/12/2007, -2/+0I've only had two problems with WGA. But I've had XP for 3 years, which means I could have more. (If someone knows how to get NDISWrapper working I'll format my Windows harddrive and put a linux flavor on it.) The first problem was when I downloaded a faulty update from Microsoft Update, WGA then corrupted the boot loader; I used the repair tool on the install disc, but my wireless was screwed. So I reinstalled XP, but Microsoft rolled out an update for WGA, which said that my version was not a legal copy. So I had to fork out enough money for a new version rather than fight with Microsofts people.
  • sokz, on 10/12/2007, -5/+19Well, considering the last copy of Windows I purchased legally was 95, I may have to pick up XP. Or replace this aging laptop with a new Macbook. I've been looking for an excuse to switch to Mac (and I am not a gamer, so it's all good).
  • RHollister, on 10/12/2007, -5/+5How is it 'required'? Wouldnt it require a download of another update to implement the 'kill switch'? I dont understand, if someone has an illegal copy, why would they download any update to install a kill switch?
    • chrono13, on 10/12/2007, -0/+16Windows + No security patches = killed anyway.

      You are damned if you do, damned if you don't.
    • badbox, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5They won't, which is why this would never work.

      MS would get such a bad rap from this, it's not even funny.

      They can't afford to go through with this from all the bad press they've received over the years - their software is known as the most buggy and exploitable, and if they pissed off a bunch of people by shutting down their windows, it'd be even worse for them.
    • TiMMY8765, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2I assume it will be like the WGA warning box that came out earlier this year. just make sure to set automatic updates to manual and uncheck that update when the time comes.
    • TiberiusDRAIG, on 10/12/2007, -3/+3This is exactly what I was thinking. I updated a couple of months ago for the first time in the 3 years (?) I've had this system and promptly turned off auto update afterwards. I didn't have any virus' before nor have I had any since. All this BS about hackers taking over your system - if you don't do anything stupid, you wont become a target. No, I don't own a valid copy of XP. I'm not about to justify myself for it here, but suffice to say I'm 16 and have just left school. I sure as hell can't afford XP.

      But yeah, unless there is a built in kill-switch and has been since the dawn of XP, there isn't any way MS will be able to enforce this if people don't update, assuming it's even true. I for one, don't think that it is true. Microsoft know that they will lose a large percentage of users to open source if they do this - if they don't clamp down on the pirates then it just means more PCs running Windows, helping them keep their firm grip on the market. That has always been their stance, why would they suddenly change it now?
    • spikespeigel42, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4@Timmy

      A young kid that doesnt have tons of money, and probably cant pay for wow as a result. I say you should run Linux, its free and you can do more stuff, and it still does all the .doc and whatnot that windows does
  • skifreak107, on 10/12/2007, -4/+19Like there won't be a fix for this in less then 24 hours.
    • trees420, on 10/12/2007, -9/+0exactly
    • texpundit, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10Yeah... but after they kill your copy of Windows... how do you get online to download the patch/crack? ;)
    • feedmecereal, on 10/12/2007, -5/+6@texpundit
      Just go to the library, school, friend's computer, etc.
    • camiller, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5"Yeah... but after they kill your copy of Windows... how do you get online to download the patch/crack? ;)"

      From my daughters Win 98 machine. Actually I have a legit WinXP install but I just might have to look at Linux a little closer. Last time I considered it there wasn't a mature replacement for Quicken but I think that might have improved since then.
    • leszek, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9you could use a knoppix live cd. that would be ironic :)
    • leszek, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5@camiller
      you can have a look at gnucash to replace quicken
      http://www.gnucash.org/features.phtml
    • slamm6, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Get digiWIZ miniPE. It has Firefox and Opera built in.
  • krisper, on 10/12/2007, -35/+11Sorry, no sympathy for people too cheap to buy a legit OS.
    • badbox, on 10/12/2007, -17/+12Take the morality squad elsewhere.

      Don't be pissed off you spend over $100 for an OS while most of us didn't :)

      Besides, this won't ever happen. If it did, there will be a crack.
    • Fladrif, on 10/12/2007, -5/+14But you have sympathy for a company that has done everything in its power to stomp the little guy and take our options away?
      I'd switch to Linux in a heart beat if it supported all the games I play.
    • 81v3d07g0d, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7agreed, and who said anything about being cheap. Do you have an extra $200 laying around? I know I don't, but that's not really the point is it. I bet you half of the assholes that say that don't feel sorry about this happening are either already mac users (Biased) or Linux user (Biased) you sure are high and mighty when it serves your preexisting agenda. I don't have anything against macs or Linux but don't misrepresent yourself.
  • jesuspchrist, on 10/12/2007, -6/+2While I have a legit copy of XP Pro, however I use Media center edition. When Vista comes out, I'm going to get it, but I use Media Center simply to try it. If it ever comes down to it, ill just reinstall my XPPro
  • vandread, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4They should delay from september to when they release vista for public use. As it is all the people who lose access will be forced to either buy Windows XP and will be unlikely to turn around and buy vista a couple months later, or wait till vista and just go to that.
  • barrettg, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5This will just make priates Hack Vista (If its ever released) serials quicker, in order to have a working system.
  • roodscreen, on 10/12/2007, -1/+22Wow, treating all of your customers like criminals because some people steal. What a great business model. Wait, it's working so well for the RIAA, they have people just pleased to be associated with them.

    I have worked for companies that took the attitude that they will do such and such 'because they can'. These companies inevitably go down the toilet.

    I am hoping that Windows does this - it will be what makes me bite the bullet and move to Linux.
  • romeyinfc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+17Even though I agree that people running pirate versions of Windows deserve what they get - I still believe this is a Croc. I have legitimate copies of Windows on all of my machines, but I refuse to download WGA because of the privacy concerns. It was revealed a few weeks back that WGA makes DAILY calls backs to the Mothership, something they didn't disclose when WGA started out. While I respect Microsoft's attempts to secure their intellectual property, I don't trust them to do it for me. I hate this "guilty until proven innocent" strategy.
  • badbox, on 10/12/2007, -8/+01. You have to install the patch that gives the OS this instruction. If it can be installed, it can be removed. An OS just doesn't magically decide to do something unless allowed.

    2. Where will be a patch for it, just like every other useless method they've done trying to prevent piracy of their OS.

    Programmers are MS are stupid, they really are. The sooner they realize that it all boils down to a yes/no switch, the faster they can stop blowing money and pissing people off :)
    • lombarke, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9remember the WMF exploit where code could be executed remotely without the user's input / knowing about it? and it turned out that it was coded purposely into windows from someone at microsoft? perhaps this was its purpose.
  • awoodhouse, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10Here's why WGA is bad. OK so I'm a mac user and I have a valid copy of XP (a work one licensed with a VLK) licensed under bootcamp on my imac. I want to use it under parallels on my macbook and get rid of bootcamp on the imac. As I understand it I cannot do this as it won't activate a second time despite the usage being perfectly within the licensing agreement.
    • ThinkFr33ly, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Just call Microsoft and tell them exactly that. They will give you a new key to use.

      I've done this many times for a wide variety of Microsoft products. They never hassle you, they just give you the new key.
    • althe3rduww, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Its really the double edged sword of the new intel macs. On one hand we can now run windows for those moments we need to. But now we have to start being concerned with all the crap microsoft pulls. Before the intel macs I probably would have just laughed at my pc only friends and stopped caring.

      Its not suprising that microsoft is screwing up again, they are a bit over due for another screw up. I think it has bee a few weeks since the last one. I can't wait to see a wide spread use of whatever new WGA crack that is developed. I am not rooting for the people who never paid for windows mind you, just trying to fight for the people who did buy windows and are still going to get screwed. (I am looking at you RAID users).
  • bart5986, on 10/12/2007, -10/+2This is stupid. Yes my windows xp isn't valid. But i'm not going to go and buy windows XP. I've been waiting for vista to come out...

    Before XP I had 2000 but got forced to update for compatibility etc.

    If I brought XP now, I'd end up having to buy/pirate vista because I want to play things like halo 2 and all the other stuff that will force me to get it.
    • ThinkFr33ly, on 10/12/2007, -13/+6You should check your post before submitting it. You have a pretty big error.

      Instead of "This is stupid", you should have "I am stupid."

      Be more careful next time.
    • heinousjay, on 10/12/2007, -9/+5You were forced to use Windows? Me too! Did Bill hold the gun to your head? He did for me! Neener neener neener, I'm the cooler weiner.
    • aliengoods, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8@heinousjay

      "You were forced to use Windows? Me too! Did Bill hold the gun to your head? He did for me! Neener neener neener, I'm the cooler weiner."

      First, your childish banter aside, many people ARE forced to use windows. There were many software packages I had to use for college (BS Electrical Engineering) that were only available on windows only. As an example, for spice software, there was a limited but free student version for windows of the software we used, or I had to cough up ~$10k for the unix version. As a student, this is not an option, and neither was spending nights in the department computer lab until 5am.

      Now you may ask why I didn't purchase windows. I did, in the form of having it preinstalled by a whitebox retailer. And it worked fine(except for BSOD), but eventually I needed to move to Win2K for other software. I was lucky because my internship gave me one of their licensed copies for home use, but if they hadn't I would have had no problems grabbing a pirated copy. When my daily staple was ramen noodles, I really didn't have $200 for a copy of windows.

      So I do empathize with those that NEED to use windows but cannot afford it. They are not a majority, but that does not mean they should be ignored or their arguments should be discarded.
  • pbaehr, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11With everyone claiming that Microsoft is pushing more users to seek alternatives I'd like to note that all the hype about DRM in Vista made me decide to install Ubuntu. I still have to use Windows for work since I need to be able to run Adobe's Creative Suite but as far as my computers at home go I'll never look back. Thanks, Microsoft, for inspiring me to be a little more open minded.
    • GRTWHT, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10Sounds like you and I are in the same boat. I had also decided to look into Linux much more seriously due to all the rumors flying about Vista, then the newest Ubuntu came out and well, let's just say that I'm still dual-booting, but not for very much longer.

      Go ahead Microsoft, continue to alienate your customers and you will eventually realize they are not your customers any more.
    • horsman, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Same situation here. I'm dual booting now just do I can use Photoshop/Dreamweaver/Flash and put mp3s on my rio player. Everything else is now done through Ubuntu, that with XGL and Compiz looks ***** awesome and runs like a dream.
  • WarpFox, on 10/12/2007, -3/+430 days is more than enough time to crack. How long did it take to come up with a workaround for service pack 2?
    • 81v3d07g0d, on 10/12/2007, -5/+3its so easy to bash the thing that everybody uses, because the more people use it the more problems become apparent. macs are like a small fraction of the computers out there, that's whey there aren't tons of viruses for them not because mac users are special. Linux is any even smaller portion or people and granted with the GUI you can do most of the stuff you can do with any windows PC, but then again if you don't know the Linux command line stuff you might as well not even bother. Microsoft hasn't done anything that any other large corporation has done, if your going to bash them at least break it down on issues that matter not just because you're regurgitating the line "they're an evil corporation"
  • Microdot, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7i for one, hope they do this. i really do. the more people get pissed off with windows, the more people that will actually move to another platform. http://www.linuxiso.org, or if you want the familiarity of all your old favorite programs, http://www.apple.com

    the world would be a much better place without windows (or even microsoft) at all.
  • lombarke, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9it's not just people who have illegal copies of XP pro that are going to have a problem with this. see the article, there are several responses from people who went ahead and did the WGA update, and it screwed them over. so even if you have a legit copy of xp pro, there are obviously still problems with WGA. to make a patch that ***** your system mandatory is irresponsible.
  • AZTriGuy, on 10/12/2007, -4/+4Ok, confession time. I had a non-genuine copy of XP on one of my three home computers, and went ahead and purchased a valid key when WGA started complaining on my last processor/mobo upgrade. Now, it didn't say that Windows was going to stop working, it only said that I couldn't get automatic updates. I had genuine versions on two store-bought 'puters, but I'd never had a genuine license for my home-built one, time I got on the bandwagon.

    I think that Microsoft has every right to disable systems that are not "valid", but from the read it sounds like there are some other issues with WGA that they need to get worked out before they enact that. You have stories of people getting shrink-wrapped copies of XP that fail validation, people's systems starting to BSOD on installation of the WGA patch, devices and drivers failing, no way can they hold the customer responsible for faulty WGA. Once that's all worked out, then yeah, they should do some kind of kill-switch. Now, that being said, hackers will come up with a way to circumvent the WGA before that kill-switch is enabled, so realistically, nothing to worry about, right? +1 digg for fear-mongering :)
  • MrChonks, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4@info: I couldn't agree more, save but broaden the scope to Linux, as well. Expecially with the advent of being able to port windows application on OSX and Linux now, it will make it easier to switch.
  • deadbaby, on 10/12/2007, -1/+14Hey Microsoft, sound familiar?

    Governor Tarkin: You don't know how hard I found it, signing the order to terminate your life.
    Princess Leia: I'm surprised that you had the courage to take the responsibility yourself.
    Governor Tarkin: Princess Leia, before your execution, you will join me at a ceremony that will make this battle station operational. No star system will dare oppose the Emperor now.
    Princess Leia: The more you tighten your grip, Tarkin, the more star systems will slip through your fingers.
    • dhasenan, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2"We've shut down his augmentations and activated the killswitch."
      "Activated--what?"
      "He's gone, JC. He's a terrorist now."
  • treycranson, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3I've been waiting for them to do this for years and couldn't figure out why they hadn't done it. 2 years ago I started my transition over to Ubuntu. Now I primarily use Ubuntu and Mac.
    • krono6, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0I love Ubuntu, though the lack of support my modem has for Linux proves a bit of a pain, so the best alternative is to run it as a Virtual Machine. You can order their CDs for free from the site, so it's a nice thought.
      Switching to Linux isn't exactly the best option to make, especially if you're familiar with a Windows enviroment. Sure, not a whole load of problems, but can you seriously imagine someone who would replace every other letter with an emoticon on msn (for example) to feel comfortable using that? Windows has been made to be as easy to use as possible.. Well, is what Microsoft says, anyway.
      And, you've been waiting for this for years? Waiting for what, a poorly created peice of software that's been causing so many problems? Right.
  • badbox, on 10/12/2007, -7/+0"If they throw the switch and kill all those systems - imagine how happy people will be about sticking with such a company."

    Why would people be happy at them over that? I could care less if MS profits or not, even if I purchased software (unless, of course, I was bitter, which is my problem not theirs)

    Just another case of people being concerned with matters that have nothing to do with them.
  • frobozzcompany, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6As usual, DRM just punishes legal users and creates uncertainty for everyone.

    Windows is already a house of cards, do they also have to put a stick of dynamite under it?
  • bigboom, on 10/12/2007, -11/+2well people stop complainin if ya got a genuine code ya don't hafta worry. however if you stole your code or hacked it because your to damn cheap to buy it i cant feet sorry for ya.
    and for all of you surprised by this move all i can say is: what the did ya expect it corporate America cutthroat, as Stalin himself. all the more reason to switch to Linux and mac. though i wonder about those of us that don't have a computer on a network with a stolen of false code that aren't on a network or connected to the Internet in any way form or fashion.
  • Zyzzyva100, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6Well, I hate to be a dick, and chime in about how you should use Linux if you don't like it, so I won't. I will say that my fiancee and I saw this coming, and have become a Linux only household (to each their own). However, one of my jobs at my university is IT support for my department (running exclusively windows). I really hope this doesn't turn into a complete fiasco, or else I am going to have some very uphappy people in the fall.
    • ricosalomar, on 10/12/2007, -8/+1"to each their own"
      Ha, that phrase declares ITSELF to be stupid.
    • TiberiusDRAIG, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1@ ricosalomar

      retard
  • chubbly0, on 10/12/2007, -4/+7I can't believe some of you guys are buying this crock of *****. Seriously, I am going to submit an article about Microsoft's plan to build a death ray to kill all the puppies in the world and you would all go nuts, gobbling it up like the sheep some of you are. This guy is making a complete shot in the dark guess based off of a 2nd hand conversation with a random support drone, and the fact that a cookie cutter response didn't deny this would happen. Pro Tip for all you wannabe lawyers: Not denying something does NOT imply guilt. This guy has no credible sources and no concrete facts. He is 100% BS, and it honestly makes me worry for humanity when you guys take what some attention whoring journalist says at face value. Think for yourselves people.
    • awoodhouse, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10Doesn't change the fact that WGA is wrong for many many reasons
    • chubbly0, on 10/12/2007, -4/+4This isn't an article about whether or not WGA is appropriate. Like you, I don't agree with WGA the way that it is implemented. However, I also don't agree with fear mongering "journalists" either.
    • CBTF, on 10/12/2007, -8/+5WHAT?! M$ IS GOING TO KILL PUPPIES?! ZOMG LINUX FTW1!1
  • stealthrocket, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Without starting a fanboy flame war, can I get opinions as to why you would choose to run a Windows PC over a Mac? I listen to lots of Podcasts, read articles deal with friends that talk about viruses, spyware, adware and all the ***** you have to put up with from Microsoft. And I keep asking, why do people put up with it? I really really want to get some feedback on this because I'm baffled at this point. What are you doing on Windows (other than gaming) that you can't do on a Mac?
    • awoodhouse, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5as I think more and more people are discovering (me included - I saw the light about 3 months ago and I'm a happier person now) :)
    • CBTF, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Well..

      Most of these problems affect those who aren't as computer literate as others, or rarely take the time to learn about their systems. Adware can be prevented by simply not downloading software that contains it. Simple google searches will tell you what's safe and what's not. Spyware is the same. A spyware scan, such as ad aware or spybot will clean up anything that manages to make its way onto your system (usually just a few bad cookies, which means nothing.)

      If not behind a router, a software firewall is wise. When properly set up, it keeps the baddies out. Same goes for antivirus. There are plently of free ones that offer real time protection (avast!, avg, antivir, etc..)

      To summarize it, a windows pc can be just as secure as a mac or linux system. I can honestly say that during my time using XP i've gotten one virus (and this was my fault- it was quickly taken care of too.) Spyware and adware have never made their way onto here and no blue screens of death since 2003 (on my old comp, which is still running but used as a makeshift server.)

      So- the proper prevention and updating software make it so you don't even deal with the stuff.
    • ricosalomar, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8What can you do on a windows machine that you can't do on a Mac?
      Install antivirus, antispyware, clean up viruses, clean up spyware, all that cool stuff.
    • stealthrocket, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2CBTF, thanks for the comments. Everything you said is totally true and those are the same comments I keep hearing. My problem with it is, like you said, you have to configure all of that stuff. While it might be easy to do the thing is, you have to run a virus scan, you have to run a spyware scan, you have to be behind a properly configured firewall. There are just a lot of things you have to do in order to make Windows safe. So this is where I keep coming back to the same question. Why do all this? I guess I'm just trying to get to an aha! moment of understanding why so many people continue to use Windows.
    • heinousjay, on 10/12/2007, -4/+3Because Windows does what we want. You make it sound like it's a heavy burden. It's five minutes.

      Macs have their own stupidities. So does every other OS. Windows happens to be alright for what it does, and it's ubiquitous, so it's good enough. It's hard to fight inertia. Especially when you're a condescending prick about it.
    • saska, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3I've run every one of the Big Three OSes as my home desktop at one point or another. For a long time I survived just fine with Lynx and a bash prompt. Today, I use XP and Vista, with a little dabbling in Ubuntu on the side to keep from getting rusty.

      Simply put, I couldn't easily get the kind of *free* software I wanted for the things I wanted to do anywhere except in Windows. For example, I edit video and I want to store it in the a widely readable format (AVI). VLC Player to play it is cross-platform, but Avisynth and VirtualDub to produce it are not.

      Sure, I could buy a MacBook and Adobe Premiere to do the same things I do now for free on a PC running XP. I'd spend about 40% more on comparable hardware and a boatload on software, and I'd be off and running.

      My time is worth too much for me to noodle around looking for hobbyist solutions for how to do my hobbies. I can earn the money I spent on a license for XP SP2 in the time it takes to find and learn the right tool for the job under Linux. I'm not stupid, I'm not technically illiterate, and I've been hit by one virus in 17 years of owning a Windows PC. I just have better things to do.
    • althe3rduww, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3@CBTF

      You make some good points and one very specific one that needs to be highlighted. That is that windows is ok for people that take the time to learn their system and are very cautious when running anything. The problem is thats not going to fly for the majority of windows users. Many users don't have the capacity or the time to really learn the os and its potential risks. As a windows user myself I know how specific this point needs to be. I have had systems with very little in the ways of security software but have kept the systems very clean because I know exactly what I am doing.

      Their is also the issue of a users comfort level. I use windows, mac and linux quite often so I am quite comfortable on any platform. But people who have never used anything else than windows will also tell you windows is the only os for them. They will also believe many of the myths out there such as "their is no software for the mac" or "my files aren't compatible". But the truth is they just don't know and were told the myths by someone else who doesn't know any better. Try not to get aggrivated at users who think this way, they just haven't developed their pallette for os's yet. Who knows that user may eventually grow to like linux. I always suggest users to try out different platforms for a substantial amount of time to really find out what they like the best. I ended up liking OS X the best even though I still have to use windows on a daily basis.

      In short, for the users that "know what they are doing", windows will continue to be their os just because they have become comfortable with it and know how to handle every obstacle thrown at them. But those users who are not windows experts, have kids, use their computers for multiple complex tasks, or are new to the platform are the ones hurt the most by all of the obstacles. And the later make up the majority of windows users. The digg crowd will always be a tough crowd to gauge the stability or usability of a piece of software or os simply because the majority of the digg crowd is very tech savy. However, as tech savy individual who has to deal with the general public and their computer problems on a daily basis, I find it crucial to point out the details of a systems usability.
    • wtf00, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11. i ain't no fanboy 2. only dumbass get bloat with viruses,adware,spyware 3. I know how to handle winblow 3. most the issue with windows is bad drivers or program bad coding 4. windows has bad coding 5. macos doesn't own 97% of the market so they are off the hook from being ass rape with virus,etc.. 5. I use windows until an OS kick directx ass until than I will wait. i do Iuse linux(ubuntu) for other stuff.
    • CBTF, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2"What can you do on a windows machine that you can't do on a Mac?
      Install antivirus, antispyware, clean up viruses, clean up spyware, all that cool stuff."

      Hmm.. how much time have you spent on a windows machine? I know that personally, I spend 5 minutes running my spyware scanner every few days. I rarely scan for virii as I have real time scanning that alerts me of a virus before it sets up shop...

      "Why do all this? I guess I'm just trying to get to an aha! moment of understanding why so many people continue to use Windows."

      Well, for starters a PC is much cheaper. You can buy more powerful hardware for less of a price. This being said, you can also upgrade your computer when the parts become obsolete. This isn't the case with Macs and they tend to be much more expensive. I enjoy being able to have almost any device being compatible with my computer.

      Personally, Windows is my OS because I love to play games online with others, leaving Mac out of the question.

      While it's true that the standard user isn't able to install proper protection/browse safely, I believe that advances are being made. Firefox is picking up support and endless articles on ad-aware and others are becoming popular.
    • spuggy, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'm actually typing this out on a Macbook Pro that I'm "effectively" trading soon to go back to a PC.

      Love the system, but as a developer, it's just too difficult to stick with OS X when I'm constantly using Microsoft Project, One Note, Outlook, Excel, and Visual Studio.

      Now, I could have gotten around this by VPN'ing into my work, but since we're using a Nortel VPN that requires a non-free client for OS X (not to mention the fact that there's still no release of the client that works on an Intel Mac), I'm out of luck in that regard.

      Yes, I did the whole Boot Camp & Parallels thing, but this of course again requires me to spend extra money for the software licenses. Parallels was nice, but I found its use impractical with 1GB of RAM. Bootcamp worked well, but the lack of an actual good trackpad driver drove me nuts (no ignore accidental input, no scrolling, no tap to click, etc), has effectively driven me nuts enough to stop doing that as well.

      All that aside, there is still a *serious* dearth in real-world productivity applications for OS X. Despite hours of looking, I couldn't find a good alternative to Excel for example. (Yes, I know of OO.org, but it's not a Native Aqua App, and still horrendously slow IMHO). Office for OS X, not being a Universal Binary, is also tremendously slow. Factor in the lack of anything resembling a good personal finance program, and that was enough for me. Quicken for OSX is just awful, GNU Cash is too complicated, and Budget, while a nice new way of looking at things, lacks the higher end features for tracking investments and the other features I've come to expect from Money & Quicken on Windows.

      Also, say what you want about Windows Media Player, but it works out of the box, and they don't have the egregious practice of not only making you pay for all the features, but also requiring you do so for *every* dot upgrade as does Quick Time.

      I would say though, that aside from my professional requirements, that using a Mac is *almost* there for the casual user (and in a lot more ways, significantly better). But until someone can come out with the productivity apps that are just as good as the Windows equivalent, Apple will never gain a significant chunk of market share. Most people just want stuff to work--I know this is the whole credo of OS X, but that ignores a pretty significant chunk of real world functionality that has come to expected of computers.
  • mecc, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5
    Linux + WINE/CrossOver Office is looking better all the time.
  • masgaster, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2I wish there was a way to edit the registration key from an invalid one to a valid one without reinstalling Windows. What a pain.
    • chubbly0, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3google.com is your savior. did you even look?
  • uownedge, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3Well...it would be a huge mistake on Microsoft's part. If they don't realize that, they deserve what they'll get. Although, I find this hard to believe, as it would be difficult to enforce participation in WGA without secretly adding WGA software via another update (which is illegal -- see: malware), unless it's already a part of windows.

    Apple is poised to strike, and this would be a prime opportunity (see: Apple cuts prices! etc ect -- it could happen), and several Linux distributions are pushing ever closer to having a deliverable Desktop *nix based solution. Again, it could happen.

    Only time will tell...
  • thespace, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2I wonder what the economic impact is going to be like
  • badogg, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5I don't know about the rest of y'all, but I feel like MS owes me something for all of the OSes that I purchased over the years and still had to deal with the same crap/problems that I was dealing with from the previous version. For example, I purchased 95/98/ME/NT/2000/XP Home, only to continually have to deal with the same crap. Now, don't get me wrong, I think they did some pretty cool things on some of those versions (Mainly 2000) but for the most part I felt ripped off that I spent all that money for the other versions. So I am not sure I would feel bad at this point if I had spent the energy to download/use a pirated version. But since I bought them all I guess I fell right into their marketing traps.
  • leftovers, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1uh its called a firewall if mothership cannot contact me it can't disable me. 99% of the patches arent required for safe stable running of XP anyways if you use safe computer practices.

    Plus I want to see them force this on corporate customers and POOF! workaround or suddenly everyone starts running corp keys that don't require wga.
  • pcheaven2k, on 10/12/2007, -12/+5For all you morons that made the statement (or a similar one) "if they do this it would just make me bite the bullet and move to linux" SHUT THE FRACK UP. If you ever intended to move to linux you would have done it along FRACKING time ago, like when MS introduced WGA and Product Activation to begin with.

    For all those that think MS killing illegal copies of windows will make people switch to linux, YOUR FRACKING IDIOTS. If the people using PIRATED WINDOWS had the since to use LINUX they wouldn't be using PIRATED WINDOWS in the first FRACKING place. They will just wait for a crack or buy a legal copy. Very few of them will make the switch.

    As far as having to download an update for the switch to be installed, NOT. It has been there in RETAIL versions of XP since it first hit the store shelves. Notice I said RETAIL. Corporate versions (the ones without the Product Activation) didn't get the kill switch until SP2 and WGA.

    And lastly, the crack is already out. Its been out for months. All ya have to do is download the "Windows Product Activation Removal Tool" and the "WGA Removal Tool" and uninstall the Product Activation and uninstall WGA to disable the switch completely. Of course then you won't be able to do Updates and any yoyo script kiddie can hack you, but hey that's the price you pay for using ILLEGAL SOFTWARE.

    And for the record, I AM NOT A MS FANBOY. I use MS and Linux but prefer Windows just because it is easier to use, easier to configure, easier to repair and I am too FRACKING LAZY to learn Linux as good as I know WINDOWS.
    • Dorv, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2First... Love the use of the word Frack (Though, I prefer the less popular 'Frak' spelling).

      Second, dude, chill the frak out. Just because you became aware of Linux and its ease of use faster than others, doesn't make you holier than thou. I'm dual booting Unbuntu now on my laptop (Which had iits legal version of XP Pro, too). While I'm finding it a more secure, "cheaper" option, there isn't he wide range of games that make up a good bit of my computer time these days.

      I, for what its worth, just installed a less than legal copy of Medai Center on this desktop just to see if I liked it. I don't really like the media center program over Wnamp and simple WMP for video, so I think on my next desktop refresh, my legal copy of Pro from Dell will go back on it.

      Granted, I would assume that about half of the people here with an issue with this are ones that would be affected because their key's are less than legal, but problems with the WGA implementation on LEGAL copies, and problems with Legal Keys not being validated make it wrong (IMHO) for Microsoft to roll this out, should it be their plan.
    • DuneAdx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Lay off the Battlestar Galactica bro.
  • DarkPrince11, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4They would defintely do this. Its all like Microsoft. They dont care who it is thats using it or if you bought XP before. All they care about is that you have a pirated copy now and they want their money. I bought a Dell Dimension 2400 in like 2001. Came with XP Pro. In 2005, I had to reinstall XP. But I hated the Dell restore CD because it installed all this other crap. So I downloaded a copy of XP SP3 (the XP with like the Vista customization and no user end needed for installation copy..u can find it on torrents) and installed it. I have a legal XP key on the side of my computer..but its not like it matters. Microsoft doesnt give a *****. But then again the hackers and crackers dont give a ***** either. I am sure that there will be a way around it. An even simpler way, just dont download the update or w.e

    And for the dude that said read the EULA, what person in their right mind reads the EULA? Why do you think that installation software doesnt require a certain amount of time before the I Agree button shows up? Because they know that no one reads it. Reason being no one understands it. Its some hoo-haa about legal rights and w.e

    And not everyone will switch to Linux you know. Sure Ubuntu is great, but a majority of Microsoft customers are computer novices. Very few people will be able to make the switch to Ubuntu. For example, many people think the big E means going to the internet. Where's the big E in Ubuntu or Mac? Or where is that little start button that lets me see everything? Microsoft is like Sony..they're just riding along their user base knowing that they will stick with them.
    • chubbly0, on 10/12/2007, -6/+0SHUT UP ABOUT THE EULA!!

      OMG M$ is so evil because they included a EULA. I bet they will make it thorough so that I could never read it cause it would take me like 15 mins and I just dont have that kind of time to spare. I bet Apple doesn't include EULA's and i bet they give out their software for free and i bet they only sue people who dont use MACS because they want to make those people's lives better and i bet that linux can cure cancer and end wars and it will do it for free because it loves us all and it especially doesnt have EULA's cause those are evil and Microsofty.

      Honestly though, what software DOESN'T include a EULA?
  • CBTF, on 10/12/2007, -9/+4It's not MS's fault that anyone chooses to pirate their stuff. They can enforce it if they want.

    Rag on Microsoft all you want, but the solution is simple..

    DON'T PIRATE ***** AND THEN COMPLAIN ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS.

    :).
    • awoodhouse, on 10/12/2007, -1/+11the problem is WGA is a PITA for genuine users!
    • tnvwboy, on 10/12/2007, -8/+1PITA how? I have to click an extra button before I can download certain items from the Microsoft site? Windows/Microsoft update works just like it did before WGA too. Can you please explain the pain?
  • LegendX, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Well I guess with this news I might as well give linux a try at geting my games to work >.>
  • ThinkFr33ly, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5I have to say, a lot of that "feedback" regarding the problems people have had with WGA seem like complete crap.

    WGA validates your license key. Simple as that. How the hell could it possibly break a RAID array, or cause bluescreens?

    As far as people having their license rejected, that's certainly possible. But the responses they claim to have had from Microsoft sound like more crap. I've called Microsoft many times over the years when I've had issues with WPA and every single time they've just given me a new activation key. They barely even ask why.

    Yes, that's just my personal experience, but I've that call perhaps a dozen times and it's been the exact same each time.
    • awoodhouse, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4The problem is, surely, that if you upgrade or change components (MS have a list of what hardware gets registered/activated against) you have to go through the whole activation/WGA process again. Now this is painful. OK it can be done but why should I need to call microsoft if I change my computer?
    • Lardquake, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3"WGA validates your license key. Simple as that. How the hell could it possibly break a RAID array, or cause bluescreens?"

      Err... remember it's a Microsoft product we're talking about here.
  • CubiX, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Yehay! Less piracy, less Windows, more Linux!
  • Willow01, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Well according to Microsoft, my legit copy of Windows XP is pirated, since I purchased it unopened from Fry's Electronics...after calling Microsoft they tell me the key is already in use and I need to buy another one....personally I'm not made out of money, so I am still using this key with a few tweaks around everything, so I don't have to get myself a pirated key.
  • robin1989, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2i got fooled into installing WGA a few days ago and i had a genuine version of xp home but i had put a shell on it so WGA said i had a illegal copy of windows - it restored all my menus and start bar to the basic grey windows 200 version and said i had to sort it right away in effect holding me to ransom - the only way i managed to fix it was to reinstall windows again - it was so frustrating
  • awoodhouse, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Re: illegal practices, I refer everyone to the following story I submitted earlier today:
    http://digg.com/software/EC_polishing_big_stick_for_Microsoft
  • Fetching more discussions...
    Show 51 - 100 of 138 discussions
  •  

    Login or register to add a comment

    Create a new account or login to join in the conversation on Digg. You'll also be able to Digg stories to help promote things you like.


© Digg Inc. 2008 — Content posted by Digg users is dedicated to the public domain.
DIGG, DIGG IT, DUGG, DIGG THIS, Digg graphics, logos, designs, page headers, button icons, scripts, and other service names are the trademarks of Digg Inc.