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165 Comments
- Nekura20x6, on 10/19/2007, -5/+113I'm okay with this to a point. "The customer is always right" is not true if they are being a jerk. Here is a great article about that topic: http://www.violentacres.com/archives/59/two-phrases-that-destroyed-american-culture
Someday, I will own my own store and will be able to bounce customers who need an attitude adjustment. There is no reason to be rude or unreasonable. - ericodom, on 10/19/2007, -1/+52Yeah, but this isn't what he's getting at. I know because I pay Homestead $1,000.00 a year for hosting and I've been slapped by customer service on several occasions over petty issues that *should* be easy to resolve. Homestead support is notorious for not knowing what they're talking about, and this attitude of the customer is wrong has spilled over into my lap several times now.
In many cases, yes I can agree that ***** customer simply need to go. From personal experience I would say this is a completely different scenario. - superkendall, on 10/19/2007, -3/+54I totally agree. Have you not been behind those people in return lines that expect the sun and moon from the store?
Obviously a store should go a long way to keep a customer happy. But there has to be a point after which you say, happy employees are important as well and some customers are too high maintenance for little or no gain.
The thing is, such a policy in all stores would make things better for everyone because then the stores wouldn't have to jack up prices to compensate for people that basically take advantage of them at every opportunity.
This Homestead thing seems to perhaps be in a different category, but then again it would be interesting to hear the story from the point of view of Homestead workers. - KragTheDigger, on 10/19/2007, -1/+36Why is this linking to a blogger's thoughts on the Homestead.com CEO's post, instead of the original CEO's post (http://ceounplugged.homestead.com/2006/11/maybe_you_shoul.html ) ?
~K - dstew74, on 10/19/2007, -3/+36I worked as a branch manager for a national industrial distributor for several years. Some customers simply don't have any idea of how business really goes. People always asking for discounts, refusing to pay shipping, and then being late on paying their bills. Those customers who are a pain to deal with, and not profitable tend to fire themselves. Either by me pricing my products high purposely, or by slacking on my customer service in hopes they would go somewhere else.
I had an employee of a company that owed me 15 grand come into my store and demand a price on a specific product. He claimed he was quoted at another branch 300 dollars for a tool kit that was on sale for 330. Normally I wouldn't have argued and made the sale anyways, but his attitude and then his name dropping of his employer, who owed me real money, made me admantly refuse to change the price. He stormed out saying he was calling the company owner to tell him how I treated customers. Needless to say I never heard from the owner as he wouldn't return my phonecalls anyway about the money. I then instructed my employees to refuse any cash sale to anyone associated with that company.
It's okay for companies to get rid of customers, especially the ones who act like asshats. - hansonc, on 10/19/2007, -3/+32welcome to digg where people link to their crappy blogs in an effort to make adsense money
- banjk, on 10/19/2007, -0/+25Yes. Firing customers is essential - WHEN it's appropriate.
No one should take abuse. Upset? For good reason? Different story. - zdlatham, on 10/19/2007, -3/+27I think it is time for businesses to look out for employees. Just because you are purchasing something doesn't give you the right to treat another person poorly. The customer is always right mentality has led to a society where customers think they can be abusive and act in a manner that they would otherwise never tolerate.
Good for homestead. - inactive, on 10/19/2007, -1/+22At the credit card call center they taught us "The customer isn't always right, but it's how you tell them they are wrong". Some people are so stubborn and just think they're right when apparently they aren't (Hey, they trained me on the terms and service for 2 months -- you didn't even read it. Who do you think knows more?)
I agree that firing customers works, whole heartedly. I see nothing wrong with what he says. - silverbax, on 10/19/2007, -2/+18This is true, and I've learned it from some great managers and companies.
I'll give an example. I used to work for a company that had over 1000 retail stores. They had a policy that they would always take returns, no receipt needed. One of the executives told me that the amount of returns in one retail store was less than one-half of one percent of that store's sales.
BUT
People started figuring out they could return stolen merchandise, or old merchandise, or products not even from the store. And within a few years, the amount of a single store's returns went from 1/2 percent to 11 percent. And suddenly, the returns policy was gone.
If you think the customer is always right, work in retail for a couple of years. - inactive, on 10/19/2007, -3/+17Ah yes, the Eric Cartman business approach. Very effective indeed.
"The best part about my new theme park is that YOU CAN'T COME HERE!" - funkytaco, on 10/19/2007, -0/+14If you're really paying $1,000 a year in hosting, you ought to buy your own server, switch data centers, and get over homestead's treatment of you. Their loss. If you stay, it is your loss.
- swingchild, on 10/19/2007, -0/+10I used to work in a outdoor retail store. One day we had a particularly rude customer, my boss comes out from the back, walks up to the guy, points around the store and says "All this is mine, and none of it is for sale to you. Have a nice day." Without saying another word he went back into his office. The look on the guy's face was PRICELESS.
The customer is not always right. - brstilson, on 10/19/2007, -2/+12Anyone that's worked retail can definently sympathize with this CEO. People hear that "customer is always right" garbage and interpret that to mean businesses have to give them everything they want. If I were running a business, I would rather have 100 good customers than 1,000 bad ones. Realistically, though, most customers are good, and the few bad ones (who demand the "because I'm me" discount, etc.) are just not worth it. Who cares if they go elsewhere? They'll be taking someone else's money.
- Universe, on 10/19/2007, -1/+10No soup for you!
- inactive, on 10/19/2007, -1/+9"That’s when I learned that sometimes the best thing you can do is fire your customers. If they don’t get the value that you are adding, or don’t appreciate your service, or have unreasonable demands..."
What is wrong with saying that? I wholeheartedly agree with him and have "fired" unreasonable clients in the past.
Edit: Why doesn't this guy just move his Homestead accounts to a better company? He doesn't seem very bright. - stainboy, on 10/19/2007, -0/+7a number of years back i worked for a moderately-sized local internet provider. my desk was right next to tech support. these guys were in rough shape. they were stressed all the time and were constantly taking smoke breaks just to get away from the phones for a while, and went through a box of squeezy "stress balls" every week.
the day came when the boss announced that corporate internet was doing so well, that it wasn't worth the expense to keep supporting our worst home users. from then on, users who were abusive or excessively problematic were told their account would be closed immediately and they would be refunded whatever balance was left.
the significant shift in tension within the department was amazing. sure, they pissed off a handful of customers. but there was less turnover, tech support put in less overtime and you could see these guys were much, much happier. - brundlefly76, on 10/19/2007, -0/+7There is a very simple reason why you can never get good tech support (or a good Best Buy salesperson).
The reason is that anyone who is truly qualified to provide good tech support is automatically overqualified for the job.
For example, if you work at a unix web hosting company and are good enough to figure out user's difficult problems (not just the easy ones which are common or scripted for you to answer), then you could probably get an entry-level job as an IT support person. In fact, most of the real sticklers are passed up to the sysadmin-level.
Similarly, if you could answer most of the difficult questions about the computers at Best Buy (example: does this PC support hardware virtualization? What socket type does this computer use? What is the front side bus speed? again - just examples - being able to answer these three is not a comprehensive qualifier!) Then you could get a much better job wrenching hardware or again, maybe even entry level IT. - Pile, on 10/19/2007, -1/+8In any service-oriented business, the key to profit is to be able to either do more with your time, or charge more for your services. Unlike a manufacturing business where you can easily ramp up production to increase profit, service-businesses are limited. Ramping up capacity almost always results in a degradation of quality. The only alternative is to go for higher-quality customers that are lower maintenance and pay more for your services.
Along these lines, firing customers is part of the business model. You cannot stay profitable if you have customers that take a disproportionate amount of resources verses what they're paying. The large companies can afford to let these troublemakers slip between the cracks, but the small companies cannot. - kosibar, on 10/19/2007, -0/+7I have some customers who come to me upset right from the start looking for hosting or web design. In some cases I can't blame them - they've gotten ripped off elsewhere and now they don't know who they can trust.
Then when an email bounces because it had a huge attachment, they're on the phone yelling at me that I am destroying their business because I'm not allowing them to use their email.
Then when they decide to try editing their own site but they have no idea what PHP is and they overwrite index.php with an HTML file, suddenly everything is going flakey and they call yelling at me because there is something wrong with my server.
I can't keep customers like that because they demand a lot of time and a lot of extra work when they mess something up and they never intend to pay for it. They usually call so upset that you can't explain to them what has happened because they think that you are ripping them off just like "everybody else" so they won't trust anything you say anyway.
So it doesn't necessarily reflect the quality of customer service that a company offers. Sure, a customer may get upset, and they may say things that are disrespectful when they call, but you have to look at the overall quality of the customer. If they were unhappy with you the moment they first contacted you for service, and they're yelling at you every time something goes wrong regardless of whose fault it is, nobody is winning in that situation.
For the record, most of our customers are very happy with our customer service. We're a small company that provides very specialized services and we try to go the extra mile. Some customers just can't be pleased. - silverbax, on 10/19/2007, -4/+10Renters are customers. They are paying for a service.
- robdavy, on 10/19/2007, -6/+12http://www.duggmirror.com
- fac3less, on 10/19/2007, -2/+8Why is honesty seen as bad?
- dknighton, on 10/19/2007, -1/+7I hate bartering, especially when someone tries to do it in a modern, big-box store. "No sir, Best Buy will not trade you a top of the line computer and HDTV for 12 goats." ***** cheapskates.
- j0ew00ds, on 10/19/2007, -3/+8it irks me when people submit their own commentary on their own blog... please just link to the original blog, damn it!
- dknighton, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Working at Office Depot in the business machines department years ago, we had a similar problem. Certain business customers would need a laptop to be portable for a few days, but because of the cost (translated - their cheap-ass nature), they didn't want to actually buy the unit. So they would keep it for the alloted 30-day return period, then bring it back, usually with all sorts of physical damage, and with the OS in a highly used state. We actually passed around descriptions of certain people between area stores...there were about a half dozen customers who were notorious for this behavior, mostly 30-something ex-executives who were starting their own companies.
As a result, most places that sell laptops now have a 15-day return policy and charge a restocking fee. I was fortunate enough to still be at OD when they implemented their policy, and got to see a lot of "borrowers" get bit in the ass. It was actually a sick little joy of mine to let them know they weren't getting the full purchase price back. I loved the stunned reactions. - mbeckfl, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6Thanks for the link ... it's even worse when people link to their pass through blogs, which then get overloaded and don't work. Just post the source dammit :-)
- AKAImBatman, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6"And someone who doesn't pay for their services is entitled to what, exactly?"
To be treated with dignity and respect? If you have a business model that allows for freebies for the customers, that doesn't mean you can just stomp all over them. If you do, you may find that you have no customers left.
Case in point: Network television. - xtremesniper, on 10/19/2007, -1/+6Once again, read the comment above. Leeching? If they OFFER free hosting for me and don't ask for anything in return (what could they want? I even had a link to them on my main page!) then how am I doing anything that is against their terms of service? That's like saying that Google has the right to delete all your email messages and attachments on Gmail without notice just because you arn't paying for their service. Do you see my point now?
- terrix, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5They taught me in Marketing that while the customer is always right, keeping unprofitable customers or sacrificing service to other customers to provide for the one is a big mistake. They also taught that some companies have fired they're less profitable customers to focus on the ones that spend more money there, and became highly focused on the top 10% or those with money and raised their profit margins considerably since they didn't waste time on customers that are not going to spend as much money with the company.
- TheBeaver, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6I worked at a hosting company that didn't "fire" customers. We were eventually so overrun with high-maintenance customers that we had to overstaff our call center, which lead to high overhead, which lead to eventual bankruptcy. Ultimately, half the staff was laid off and we had to sell the customer base to another company.
- Bigfootsdick, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7The customer is always an *****.
- scootinger, on 10/19/2007, -1/+6This is a lot like how one of the executives of Best Buy talked about how they want to keep "angel customers" that make them lots of money (buy high-margin stuff, etc) but want to get rid of "demon customers" that cost them money and only buy stuff on sale.
- dknighton, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5I think the "customer is always right" mentality came about during a time when there were fewer ***** trying to take advantage of the system, or who got their masturbatory kicks by berating employees to the point of tears. In today's ADD, designer-drug society, I think it's perfectly acceptable to send the blow-hards packing. The true skill of customer service is knowing when a customer is legitimately in need of assistance, and when they're just out to bend "big business" over the proverbial barrel.
- orientis, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5This is not the first complaint I've heard about Homestead's support. I agree with the basic idea that the customer is not always right, but it sounds like this company has problems with their staff being arrogant. In this case, when people are already talking about your bad customer service, it's a really bad idea to then tell everyone on the net that you don't give a ***** about the customer's problems.
- AKAImBatman, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4"Business are in business to make MONEY not make customers happy."
Actually, businesses exist to make money off of a useful product or service. If they're not providing a service or product that makes the customer happy, then they're not going to make money. That's why customer service is so crucial to a company. It's the difference between millions of people paying $5.00 for a cup of coffee and competing with gas stations to sell coffee to tightwads.
What needs to be understood is that "firing" customers can be a good part of customer service. Not only do poor customers cost companies a great deal more money than they're worth, but they tend to disrupt business with other customers. So by firing the customers who fail to respond in kind to good customer service, you provide better service to those who do. - holydope, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7I love violent acres. She makes so many valid points. I particularly love her story about ***** You money.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4I wouldn't expect more from my customers than I was willing to provide myself. So many companies crap on their customers by outsourcing customer service to the low bidder. Operators who don't speak English, reading off a script, authority to do absolutely nothing. Customers have a right to be annoyed...and yes, I'm talking to you, Dell.
On the other hand if I go to the trouble of cultivating an environment of quality customer service, no one is going to treat my people poorly. Respect is a two way street. Some customers just aren't worth the money. - venicerocco, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5@ BunglesTwanger:
Yeah, the article is pretty much about you. "you might actually have to lift a finger and do some ACTUAL WORK" - irrision, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Sounds fair to me, ***** customers aren't worth keeping 95% of the time. It isn't fair to employees when a business insists they kiss ass with crummy customers day in and day out. True, occasionally they spend so much money with your business you sometimes have to bite the bullet, but there is definately a point at which a customer is no longer worth retaining.
- DreKor, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4I think we need to differentiate between clients and customers. There are levels of service associated with each of them, and they are not the same.
If you're in retail, you probably deal with customers. These are the everyday people who walk into your store, go to aisle 14, and buy a stapler. You do not make much money off any specific customer, your profit comes from quantity instead of quality. While you don't want a large percentage of your customer base to be offended, most people will be happy enough to stand in line and give you their money. The few who aren't and demand special treatment, are given reasonable accommodation or are shown the door. Here, reasonable accommodation means going through levels of acceptable deals as defined by a business plan laid out by the company and it's accountants. After all, the corporation really doesn't care that Joe Schmuck won't be shopping at Best Buy again (mostlly because he will anyway). Basically, these people suck and you can do whatever you want to them and they'll still buy your stuff.
A client is a different animal all together. Your clients are people who are coming to you for something that is either very expensive or something that they need a lot of. Each client represents an important asset. Some clients are more valuable than others and it is easy to measure one against the other. When the Homestead.com CEO discusses firing clients, it makes sense. There is an opportunity cost associated with each client and it is in your best interest to minimize these costs so as to maximize profit. He knows when he's dealing with a large account and when he's dealing with somebody who's business is crippled by having 50 spam forms a day.
Welcome to the big ocean, little fishes. - Hardcase, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4http://ceounplugged.homestead.com/2006/11/maybe_you_shoul.html
That's the original post from Justin Kitch. His quote is taken wildly out of context and doesn't really apply to Homestead customer service. In fact, what he advocates is right on the mark. - tizz66, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Firing customers IS a healthy business practice. It is common sense that you don't want customers who cost your more (money or trouble) than they are paying you.
Too often, customers don't realise this, thinking that a business is there to be their servant and to act on any of their wishes. - orangetiki, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I've turn down many a freelance job because of jerky / cheap customers. And at my main job I have seen my boss get burnt a lot because of frugal customers. If a customer doesn't have the courtesy to be polite, then I shoudln't have to give the courtesy of my work to him/her.
- Ehrgeiz, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4Was waiting for someone like BT to show up. Must be nice to be oblivious and live in BT's world where the very article is about them yet they don't get it.
- MyKungFu, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Seems to be an increasingly common practice. For example Cingular routinely cancels customer's contracts that are not profitable to them:
http://www.consumerist.com/consumer/cingular/cingulars-oneway-contract-201899.php
At least this guy is up front about it. - gorndog, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3> The server is temporarily unable
Maybe his web hosting firm fired him as a customer. - LetsGoHawks, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4They let it get to 11% before they stopped it? That's ridiculous.
- MingdaMirthless, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3The ONLY bad part about dumping your worst 5% of customers is that they're also the most vocal customers.
"Don't shop there! They refused to honor the warranty on my Beta Max player, and the customer service rep got mouthy with me after I threatened to burn the shop down! I'm telling everybody at church Sunday night!"
These people often make your life a living hell, regardless of whether you serve them or kick them out.
*waving at father-in-law* - vertinox, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3@"It is probably just a good business practice not to be so open about it."
It is probably good business to lie, cheat, and steal and then act like you are saint too or least pay someone to say so. -
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