What is Digg?41 Comments
- Gryph1, on 10/12/2007, -0/+18Maybe because... the more countries that end up doing this the less a chance we have at being able to have a free internet.
- blackkbot, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11Alcoholism, I'll drink to that!
- Erowid, on 10/12/2007, -4/+12@Condottieri: http://www.google.com/search?q=define%3A+sarcasm
- Matt2k, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7Too many here mistake a pirate for a rebel or a freedom fighter of some bizarre sort. It's a disservice to people who have given their lives to the pursuit of _real_ freedoms. Downloading the latest Spiderman off BitTorrent is hardly in the same league, as, say, a war protest or players in the US civil rights movement. None of any of this has to do with freedom of speech, it has to do with being cheap or lazy and justifying yourself. It's been said that any choice a person makes immediately becomes the correct choice because the thought originated from themselves. Everything else after the fact is justification. That's a gloomy view on man's ability for self reflection, but largely true.
Maintaining the equitable balance of copyright through fair use doesn't mean you take the polar opposite stance and fancy yourself the champion of the world's freedoms. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+9why are you drinking on a munnday morning? its a little too early in the week for shenanigans
- ryannerd, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5It will be interesting to see if the ISPs fight the court order. The torrent savvy will just use randomized ports and encryption. Legislating internet content will never work in Bulgaria or any other country. There are always ways around censorship.
- Matt2k, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4> I'm not talking about fair use. I'm talking about the purpose of copyright - "To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts". It no longer fulfills this purpose, since a work cannot be utilized as a base for new works for a ridiculous amount of time (and heading off to infinity).
I agree the durations are a probably a bit absurd, I said it's not a perfect system, but can you explain what "works utilized as a base for new works" you referring to specifically. And how does that affect you? That sounds like it would only only affect other copyright holders, not 'end-users' out to acquire copyrighted works. And in many cases you can build off copyrighted works, parody being the most notable exception, citation, reviews, etc. - Matt2k, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3There's a reason why torrent sites being used solely to distribute Linux ISOs aren't being shut down. Or the reason why YouTube isn't shut down. Because largely, their purpose isn't illicit. It's like the difference between a hunting store, and a hunting store that sells explosives and refers people to the local militia while people outside distribute plans to assemble a bomb. Or the difference between a halfway house and a crack house. It's all about the intent behind it.
- RaynerApe, on 10/12/2007, -11/+14Uneffectively, I must say. The owner of the tracker has been set free yesterday, the case fully dropped as unsubstantial after making a media show (police hitting journalists and restricting the tracker owner to speak to them, investigation boss arriving at the court in sports wear like he's just left home), filtering is still in effect but most ISPs but most personally provide workabouts (filtering is DNS only, not IP-based) others have personal interests in filtering torrents (major ISPs are preparing to launch legal movie distribution channel, and they want to filter free sharing), HTTP proxies multiply like rabid bunnies and work in most cases. The tracker has seen about 10% drop of traffic during the last few days, so much for filtering.
- astrotrain, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5"accused of putting links"
Sounds like a Monty Python sketch... so now you will get not only in trouble for providing the data, but now
if you point or provide any links to it. Don't let the RIAA get wind of this. - Kelmon, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5As unpopular as this may be, why are we advocating BitTorrent sites filled with copyrighted materials? Are we advocating that warez is "a good thing"? I'd like to see the end of DRM and the embrace of Fair Use as much as the next person but I really don't see how we can justify what is nothing more than theft. I suspect that the RIAA/MPAA would still have required DRM to be applied to media even if P2P networks hadn't appeared to distribute ripped media but I can't help thinking that it's this sort of activity that holds back DRM-free media now and gives the authorities the justification for DRM that they want.
Stop supporting this sort of activity. Free speech is one thing but theft is something entirely different. - Matt2k, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4> In fact, I'd be much more likely to send cash to a bittorrent tracker site than I would be to buy a cd or dvd. Copyright has been twisted so far from its original purpose that I feel zero guilt at flagrantly violating it.
I disagree, copyright is the framework that gives such noble causes as the GNU or Creative Commons license their foothold and validity. As a software author, I can use copyright to distribute my hard work without worrying that someone will rip me off. Copyright has issues, but it's mostly OK in my book.
You could instead argue that DRM is asinine and counter productive, or that the DMCA has absurd reverse engineering clauses, or that the RIAA/MPAA are overzealous in their legal pursuits. But copyright in general? - madcat87, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Well at least in Bulgaria people are not being arrested and jailed for downloading Pirated Content......yet.
- Alpione, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3"All of the music videos and song mashups I do for fun and my own creative gratification are illegal to distribute to the public"
You know, you could always make your OWN music instead of ripping off others' work. Just a thought. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4with a per capita income of $10,400 poor is the proper adjective
- volkos, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Not jailed yet. Arrested some of the users were and some more wil lbe I suppose.
- DeskFlyer, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3I work 10pm-6am. You figure it out. ;)
- straxus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Firstly, all art is derivative. Even 'new' music. I have a desire to express something by shaping parts of our *existing* culture into something new and different. I like to take certain established elements that people already have an association with, and use that association. You can turn and twist and mold peoples emotions and perceptions about things entirely unrelated to original source by using that association. Advertisers do it all the time, but they do it poorly and always for a single purpose; to make you spend money. There's lots of ways to reach people. Making new original music is only one, and it's not one I'm particularly interested in. Also, how have I 'ripped off' anyone? Who has suffered a loss for what I've done?
Your comment indicates that you see mashups as requiring less talent than making 'new' music. That's simply not true. The reality is that most mashups you run across are bad, in the same way that most music out there is bad. While a filter exists in the form of the music industry for bad music, there is no such filter for bad mashups. Much like indie music, you have to wade through alot of crap to find anything remotely good. It requires an entirely different skill set and talent than making music, but no less of it. Sure, anyone can create a mashup. Anyone can also pickup a guitar and pick at the strings. The end result is still crap unless you learn how to use the tools you have to evoke the emotional response you want.
The difference is that while it is 100% legal for me to pick up a guitar and create a derivative song and distribute it, the same doesn't hold true if I want to participate in mashup art. Copyright law doesn't anticipate changes in technology that changes how we participate with art and culture. That's why we have historically changed it and made allowances. If we hadn't changed copyright law, radio stations would have to negotiate rights for each song they intended to play. It would never have taken off as a way of distributing music. If we hadn't changed the law, cable providers couldn't carry local TV stations. I'm not saying that I should be able to make money off of other's work without compensating them. But I do believe that I should be able to pay a reasonable set fee to each rights holder to use their work. Without a compulsory license scheme (as already exists in many other areas) mashup artists have to negotiate fees with the rights holders directly, who either flatly refuse, or price us right out of the market. - Azurensis, on 10/12/2007, -3/+4>As unpopular as this may be, why are we advocating BitTorrent sites filled with copyrighted materials? Are we advocating that warez is "a good thing"?
Umm, yes!
In fact, I'd be much more likely to send cash to a bittorrent tracker site than I would be to buy a cd or dvd. Copyright has been twisted so far from its original purpose that I feel zero guilt at flagrantly violating it. - volkos, on 10/12/2007, -1/+2Such as it is using the torrent tehnology is not a crime. I personally used two of those sites to seed Linux distro's and other open source software. Why don't we close the weapon/hunting/outdoor stores because of the high rate of death caused by their merchandise. Actually each and every time something like this happens here it is with some political reasoning behind it. Looking good in the eyes of the greater.
- Matt2k, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1> but now if you point or provide any links to it.
Knowing complicity in a crime is a crime itself. We aren't exactly sailing uncharted legal waters here. The DMCA for example, spawn of Hades that it is, at least makes concessions for parties like ISPs that can't moderate every piece of content on their systems, but it wouldn't apply to someone whos raison d'etre was the trafficking of pirated materials. - volkos, on 10/12/2007, -0/+0It is not the same. Yes I can seed Linux distro's in linux of Open source software trackers only but only the people who are interested in it will go there. It is the basic of advertisement. Why are there commercials in the prime time shows on non commercial-only channels. Because you can see them and you might get interested. Further more it is not OSS that can be distrubuted. Open Culture and Art too. And pray tell me where can I seed a music album that is CC registered? On a Linux distro tracker?
- Yaginor, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2There are some interesting patterns there, if you watch out for them.
I.e. administrators of both Arenabg and Linkos(former hosts of another tracker) have been arrested on the grounds(both proven false) of hosting pedophilic pornography(an easy to fabricate accusation of a crime heinous enough to earn the arrests public support)
Seizure of property is present in both cases, much like in the infamous action against Ma3x net-clubs(on the grounds of violating copyright laws, disproven). - Travelsonic, on 10/12/2007, -1/+1Being used illegally != being illegal, nor should it EVER work this way.
- dAbReAkA, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2the list of the greatest 301 countries-pirates is due soon.. that's why the government is simulating activity like they did last spring in order to show off for the EU..
the only difference is they closed 3 of the biggest trackers in bulgaria this spring and several smaller ones closed themselves because of fear.. :)
let the fight for net neutrality begin! - straxus, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2"...works utilized as a base for new works you referring to specifically. And how does that affect you?"
All of the music videos and song mashups I do for fun and my own creative gratification are illegal to distribute to the public, without negotiating huge license fees with the rights holders. There should be a compulsory license for this sort of thing, as exists in radio. The digital age has enabled consumers of media to easily become producers of media, and copyright law hasn't caught up to that reality. Until and unless it does, it remains oppressive. And as with any other oppressive law or rule that is unnecessary to freedom, I ignore it. - Azurensis, on 10/12/2007, -2/+2I'm not talking about fair use. I'm talking about the purpose of copyright - "To promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts". It no longer fulfills this purpose, since a work cannot be utilized as a base for new works for a ridiculous amount of time (and heading off to infinity).
As they screw us, so can we screw them. - apple2gs, on 10/12/2007, -3/+2poor Bulgarians
- kolobcreek, on 10/12/2007, -2/+1Lets see Hackers vs Politics. Anybody remember what the Politics' track record is.
Oh thats right. The best they will ever be able to do is to arrest a few unfortunate individuals.
Site is going to be back up in a week kids. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1Only in bulgaria.
+digg - KuntaKinte, on 10/12/2007, -10/+8and we thought we had it bad in the U.S.
- digitalarcanum, on 10/12/2007, -3/+0it's been said to much but where there's a will there's a way.
"you can't stop the signal" - skyhighrockets, on 10/12/2007, -6/+3Man, why did I read that as "Government Blocks Terrorist Site, Citizens Protest"
o_O - Fordi, on 10/12/2007, -6/+2@bigtittyslut:
+10 points for using the word 'shenanigans' - Gutterpunk, on 10/12/2007, -8/+3Why does every thread out of late have those "why did I that as"? Is it the new "First Post"?
Or Digg users don't know how to read? - DeltaWolf, on 10/12/2007, -11/+4Bulgaria and the RIAA would get along great. Mby we should move them all there...
- DeskFlyer, on 10/12/2007, -12/+5All I can say about this is that I'm on beer 5 at 0748CT and I'll be completely obliterated and passed out before your lunch break.
I know that doesn't have anything to do with this article, but it's just about as asinine, so just thought I'd share. - riplikethat, on 10/12/2007, -9/+1"May 2006 saw the admin of one of Bulgaria ’s largest BitTorrent trackers arrested by the police.."
After I read that, I double checked to make sure my browser isn't showing any cached pages fromt he past. Then checked my data/time settings on PC. 2007 they say. OK.
Oh and I haven't read the article because like many others, I don't give a ***** (yeah I know you are reaching for that red button). - mrwiggles123, on 10/12/2007, -13/+3last i recall, the US is to scared to block any sites
- dboy3587, on 10/12/2007, -19/+3and why do we care what bulgaria is doing
- Condottieri, on 10/12/2007, -20/+4Last I remember, the US never blocked any torrent sites, so no, we don't have it bad in the US.
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