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110 Comments
- sockpuppets, on 10/12/2007, -3/+151Finally I can google this "Paris Hilton" and see what everyone is talking about.
- whiledo, on 03/25/2009, -6/+150Google: Now with 50% Less Evil
- ejdmoo, on 10/12/2007, -4/+132Close. 18 months, not 12. From the blog:
"When we implement this policy change in the coming months, we will continue to keep server log data...but will make this data much more anonymous...after 18-24 months."
2 years is a long time to hold on to logs... - tom6a, on 10/12/2007, -8/+78"Our engineers are already busy working out the technical details, and we hope to implement this new data policy over the coming months (and within a year's time). "
I'm a little suprised that it will take Google a year to work out the technical details on how to do this. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+57too late Google, i think the FBI is knocking on my door right now
- Sakumi, on 10/12/2007, -21/+61Thanks, Google :)
- Nerys, on 10/12/2007, -3/+40NO what he means is RETAINING them AFTER I DELETE THEM. When I delete a message it should be UTTERLY gone. Period.
- Pile, on 10/12/2007, -3/+39Rule #1 of the digital domain: NEVER assume information will EVER disappear
- Lixie, on 10/12/2007, -2/+28@Cacoe
It's not about having something to hide, it's about privacy. It's why I have curtains in my house, and tinted windows on my car. - tom6a, on 10/12/2007, -2/+21"Our engineers are already busy working out the technical details, and we hope to implement this new data policy over the coming months (and within a year's time). "
I'm a little suprised that it will take Google a year to figure out the technical details. They seem much quicker with other projects.
What does Google store? Currently, Google stores an individual's IP address, data and time of the query, the requested URL, browser and operating system, and the user's cookie.
See: http://www.omninerd.com/2006/01/25/news/489?highlight=c4171#c4171
Under the changes, Google now plans to change part of the IP address and the cookie information in their massive database. - Lixie, on 10/12/2007, -6/+23While this is a step in the right direction, I'll still be using proxies until it's anonymous from the start (not 2 years later).
- nogami, on 10/12/2007, -1/+15It's nice that they're up-front about their data retention and such, but 2 years is still far too long to keep logs before making them anonymous.
It should be more like 1-2 weeks at the most... Or just keep them anonymous from the start. - JonForTheWin, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15It doesn't really matter. at&t along with the NSA still WIRETAP THE WHOLE ***** INTERNET
If you don't know what I'm talking about just Google Mark Klein it was a big ***** deal on Digg just a few months ago! - Phlag, on 10/12/2007, -7/+19@Lixie
I'm all for privacy, but going out of your way to use proxies for your every-day Google searches is a sign of outrageous narcissism, paranoia, or both. - JoeCabot, on 10/12/2007, -4/+15Is Google also going to stop retaining GMail emails?
- KibibyteBrain, on 10/12/2007, -6/+14Kudos to Google on this one. 99% of Google users would still use it if they put "We will send detailed reports of your habits to the government regularly" in their privacy policy. Very few people understand or care about privacy. Google is one of the few companies that listens to a minority of their customers. Lets just hope they keep it up...
- lnxaddct, on 10/12/2007, -3/+1130trip,
no... thanks for doing something that no other corporation does. - Flanker, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7I want to digg this!!!! But I don't want to support the idea that 4 exclamation marks at the end of your digg submission title is a good thing!!!! What should I do????
- dengzhi, on 10/12/2007, -6/+13thanks
- FDDIcent, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8Nice, this will definetely be a good thing.....for....google.....???
- sunchild, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Some period of retention is required by law enforcement in Europe. I think this lines up with the 18-24 month timeframe, but I'm no expert.
- Lixie, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8It's two years. But the Bush administrations wants them to be held onto permanently.
- flimbabulous, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8You know that every article that you've ever dugg can be seen by any other user right?
- BlakeEM, on 10/12/2007, -2/+8Couldn't they just encrypt the ip information, this way no one knows until it's matched up when the user is seen again? I don't see why it would take so long, but then again it is a very large database and many systems depend on it.
- minorthreat, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Im sure if they really wanted to know what ip searched what and when.... it would be possible
- paxmaniac, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6While you're at it, why don't you try to persuade Microsoft (or Apple or *nix) to actually delete files from the computer when you execute the delete command....
- Lixie, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Since the FBI has already abused NSLs, I see no reason to doubt the FBI will just begin "legally requiring" Google to retain log data for longer (a.k.a. permantly) on hundreds-of-thousands of innocent Americans.
I see this as a security risk to the person. People identified Yahoo users by their search logs alone when the logs were leaked previously. They could easily do such with someone's google search log as well. It's an identity thief's wet dream. - brundlefly76, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6I'm sure the technical challenge is not in the implementation but the deployment.
- gsiliceo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5I can understand their position.
Its hard for them "not to be evil" because they can't know what actually is evil, we, the users know that, they change their policies when people ask it.
And don't try to come with the common sense argument, moral values are decided by society, a corporation can't do that, nor should. There is evil, but new technologies bring new questions about good and bad.
Google is doing fine - grumpyrain, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6For those digging me down, you must have missed the tounge in cheek reference.
http://www.digg.com/tech_news/Gmail_Disaster_Reports_Of_Mass_Email_Deletions - chrono13, on 10/12/2007, -6/+11"Google Wins. I love Google."
"But it was all right, everything was all right, the struggle was finished. He had won the victory over himself. He loved Big Brother." - aquadoctorbob, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5Just go to File, Export... then under "Files of type", select "State Secret File (*.ssf)". Hit Save and wait a few minutes.
- inadvertence, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5I don't understand why people are applauding Google over this. From the FAQ:
"What does it mean to anonymize the logs?
We will change some of the bits in the IP address in the logs as well as change the cookie information. We're still developing the precise technical methods and approach to this, but we believe these changes will be a significant addition to protecting user privacy."
How can Google possibly call this "anonymizing the logs"? Basically what they're saying is that they will map IP addresses to unique IDs. As the AOL search log leak showed, the IP address doesn't matter. What matters is how the searches are connected to one another. Just ask Mrs. Thelma Arnold:
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/08/09/technology/09aol.html?ex=1312776000&en=f6f61949c6da4d38&ei=5090
Over the course of months you're more than likely than not to make searches that will uniquely identify you. For example, you search for restaurants in your town, the games you play, the news you read. Taken individually, these searches don't lead directly to you. Taken together, however, these searches can identify you a lot more precisely than your IP address.
So my advice is this: don't search for "how to kill someone" if you don't want to end up in a pound-me-in-the-ass prison when your wife dies in a weird accident ten years from now.
I'm disappointed with Google here. - wonboodoo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4You do realize you are in the "tech" section right troll? Are you unable to ignore posts you are not interested in?
- wonboodoo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5On the China thing, I guess you're reluctant to use every single major search-engine in existence then?
- binaryspiral, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5internet anonymity =! reality
No matter who's tubes you use... - GliTCH82, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Google called, man. They said it's cool, they won't tell anyone else about your beastiality fetish
- ob7ect, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3at first, after reading this I thought, "Gee, Google is swell". But then I realized that this is a way for them to wrap up practical & technical limitations in a nice, PR bow.
Google is in the advertising business (99% of revenues are derived from) and IS NOT interested in accumulating your life story. The fact is, what ever may have been of interest to you 5-10 years ago (expressed in searches and visits) isn't likely of interest to you now and thus less monitizable, so why should Google bother storing your searches and site visits -- remember, Google knows every page you've been to that runs either Analytics or Ad-Words -- for a period longer than which they can benefit from? Not only is it likely to be of little value, but it storing it has a cost (storage, maintenance, performance, etc).
I love Google, but this is kinda low. - imjustabill, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3If they don't know your ip address, they don't know where to send the data. If you sent a letter to someone you didn't know and didn't give them a return address, how would you expect them to send you something back? And if that person decided to keep your letter instead of throwing it away, would you be upset about that? I don't think so.
If you don't want someone to have information, don't send it to them. Simple as that. - alternateheaven, on 10/12/2007, -5/+8And how would anybody verify that they are indeed making good on this? We have no idea and have to take it on faith; not something easily done in this paranoid day and age.
- pagemap, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3@ahill
Sorry, it doesn't work that way. Trackmenot isn't doing anything for you but waste bandwidth. More here: http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2006/08/trackmenot_1.html - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+5"NO what he means is RETAINING them AFTER I DELETE THEM. When I delete a message it should be UTTERLY gone. Period."
Almost no database works like this. You never destroy data on the back end. You just mark a "1" in the "deleted" column for that table entry. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Now I can look up fist size anal beads in peace....
- Protonz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Well then what do you suggest? There is an advantage to google to mine this type of data, and I am all for that.
The problem is the big brother fascist government looking to use that data to target you and take away your rights. If Google leaks your search results revealing your ID you can try to sue them, good luck suing the government. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -12/+14That would defeat the purpose of an email client.
- Whoblah, on 10/12/2007, -2/+4I think by "retaining GMail emails", JoeCabot means "retaining deleted GMail emails". I'm not sure exactly how long they keep them, but it was mentioned a couple months ago on digg if I remember correctly.
Edit: Eh, nerys beat me to it - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5Now all my searches for protection against raptors won't show up!
( http://www.xkcd.com/c155.html ) - datagod, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2It is scary what people are searching for.
http://readthetruth.com/searchesthisweek.htm
Just scroll through there and see what people are looking for when they decide to visit the world's busiest guestbook. - quick5pnt0cobra, on 10/12/2007, -3/+5This is lame. It's not like their logs are going to be completely anonymous. They're all going to anonymize them AFTER 18-24 MONTHS! Woopty friggin doo.
- lostboy, on 10/12/2007, -4/+6@lixie,
Are the tinted windows on your car so you can strangle hookers in privacy? Sorry I couldn't help it. However, while I realize it possibly isn't a big issue I like to be able to see what drivers are doing, if I can hardly/can't see them because of tinted windows I get no early indication of what a car is about to do. Privacy is great and I wholeheartedly support it, in *certain* places. I like to be able to see the jerk using his mobile phone while driving, rather than a tinted shadow. -
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