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- daven1986, on 12/17/2007, -15/+56as much as i like google, office 2007 > *
office is and always has been a very solid set of tools, all google has over them is the ability to work with them online. - cubytes, on 12/17/2007, -11/+51I have my money on Google........
- inactive, on 12/17/2007, -2/+26They'll be "waiting." Good strategy.
- rebotfc, on 12/17/2007, -3/+20However surely here lies the problem: to defend their monopoly they will continue to enforce a closed propriety document format. This ties businesses to Microsofts upgrade cycles and ultimately reduces innovation in product.
- FoxFaction, on 12/17/2007, -4/+18So basically Microsoft thinks its Jason Bourne.
- meruru, on 12/17/2007, -5/+13OK, wait a minute, you are upset at Microsoft for acquiring companies to make itself better...how is this different from what google does? Also Google acquiring Microsoft would create the biggest, most powerful corporation ever known in the tech world, I for one am not looking forward to that.
- rayraym0fucka, on 12/17/2007, -0/+8This is probably one of the corniest threads I ever read.
- parkamark, on 12/17/2007, -11/+18I am picking up a vibe recently that Microsoft is clutching at straws some what. Having now bought over www.multimap.com, a company I worked for several months ago last year, it seems they like doing nothing more than being the Borg of the Internet and assimilating every good company that will make them even bigger and better than they already are, simply because they lack the capacity to do it themselves, unlike Google. Their acquisition of MultiMap is no exception to this - it is a direct business move to compete with Google Maps. I just hate seeing good companies go down the pan this way - I mean, out goes anything running Linux and in goes everything running .NET. What a load of bollox. Most of all, I feel sorry for all the man hours of Linux skills that have gone on within MM, only for it now to be trashed and re-developed from scratch anyway by The Borg.
I don't think I'll be truly happy until I see the day that Google acquire Microsoft. Then I really won't have to worry anymore about getting royally pissed off! - inactive, on 12/17/2007, -6/+12Corporations are like politicians. They say the same dumb ***** without there being any truth to it.
Little do they realize, to "remain a leader", you have to be one to begin with.
Delusions of Grandeur.
The reality is, Microsoft is a leech in today's world. - JQP123, on 12/17/2007, -1/+7"... all google has over them is the ability to work with them online."
Well, that and the fact that they're almost *free* (as in beer); you just have to trade away your pirvacy. Which is why most businesses will shy away from the Google approach. - banmaster, on 12/17/2007, -4/+10NEWSFLASH - Its NOT just MS that buys companies it feels would make their own product line up better.
For example, remember Keyhole? You know, the company that Google bought out so they could offer a mapping service... - MWeather, on 12/17/2007, -2/+7That's microsoft's business plan
1. Leverage OS Monopoly into dominant market position in related field.
2. Wait. - Borgcube, on 12/17/2007, -2/+7Real constructive argument...
- jrbrewin, on 12/17/2007, -0/+4hrm, i'm not sure i agree regarding document standards. At least, not for larger business / organisations. For the most part open office tools, or applications that can open and edit microsoft office documents have been around for a long time, since before i started working in IT (which is 10 years) - and as time goes on their functionality and interoperability will only help matters. Microsoft Office found itself in a dominating position primarily because it is simply the best tool out there at what it does. With one caveat, if you buy in to microsoft.
- it has one of the best mail / PIM clients and servers out there
- it has some of the best support out there (offering support for products released 5+ years ago)
- it ties in with many other Microsoft and thirdparty tools (e.g., sharepoint, groove, everything works with ms tools)
and finally, user familiarity always counts for a hell of a lot for organisations. Never underestimate user training costs, or loss of productivity through unfamiliarity.
We may see some errosion of microsoft's share through google, but i don't think so much with open office. Google is attempting something new, whereas ultimately, OO is not. It is replicating office 6 (at best), but without a good email client, the 'ecosystem', the support tools, the deployment tools, the community (office.microsoft.com), the suite scripting, the functionality, and the experience. the OO supporters out there are finally going to get / already have their holy grail - the xml-ised office documents, and still their market share isn't increasing. So there really has to be more to it than that. - jrbrewin, on 12/17/2007, -1/+5indeed, and at the risk of hijacking the comments on this digg, the original outlook web access was one of, if not the first real implementation of AJAX as we know it today, yet the guys over at office / exchange development very rarely get the props they deserve. read more @ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outlook_Web_Access
- rotten777, on 12/17/2007, -0/+4The problem with Google relying on the 90-10 idea is that Internet access in all areas will have to be rock solid and everywhere. I don't want to have to be online to work on a document. I don't want to lose my work or have to stop working when my ISP decides they want to reboot a DSLAM or Redback. I don't want to be stuck unable to compute when my router dies.
I will stick to my current setup which is already free (ubuntu+openoffice) and is way faster than any online office setup could potentially be. - IbbyIbby, on 12/17/2007, -0/+3 Wow . Let's step back from our Google loving for one moment. Of course there's the obligatory thanks to the company for providing a fresh new view of the internet and multiple technologies on it. Google search is the best thing to happen to search ever. Period. I love their services. For example Scholar , is great for me , a University student. However , do not count out Microsoft. They bring consistency. And as much as you can argue otherwise , their success is unparalleled.
To view Microsoft as some stale unmoving and as a non evolving monopolistic beast , is inaccurate to an extent. Of course there's many negative things about the company (i.e business practises (EEE) and conservatism ; see "Iron Law") . However , when you get that large and have that many shareholders it is bound to happen. Simple business and economics. Check out the Iron Law of Oligarchy. Google hasn't fallen to the trap yet , but time is the best and only true compass. And back to Microsoft , lets ignore expansion of all live services. Let's ignore vast improvements in the Zune (Let's not joke , will the Ipod ever die?) . Let's ignore Xbox and namely Xbox Live. MSFT and GOOGLE , both are companies showing promise. I doubt anyone will ever touch the O/S monopoly. I use Vista , and (shock and awe) don't hate it. But I use Firefox , and and Google is my homepage. Picking sides is frivolous , and competition is the only thing keeping technology cutting edge. Call me a Microsoft lover , but the fact of the matter is they have made personal computing move forward for everyone. Whether or not , it was completely their own creation or responsible for all innovation is irrelevant. Having a giant has made organization of file formats , O/S distribution , and consistency easy. Since APPL and GOOG have had some success, you're ready to count it out? Get serious. I'm not saying it will never fall ,but that it is less likely to collapse or simply fade away. It's beaten large competitors in the past, by innovation , or by acquiring. Although that may not sound as "cool" as Google or Facebook , the most effecient machine , and in general has allowed the Internet and modern personal computing to this era. Not alone, but as a springboard.
Word. Go, ahead digg me down. - known, on 12/17/2007, -0/+3Employment (Microsoft) versus Entrepreneurship (Google)
- MerryMortician, on 12/17/2007, -1/+4they need to pay-per-view this showdown. Im waiting for a google OS.
- beset, on 12/17/2007, -4/+7Microsoft already has live maps, a far better product than Multimap and at least on par with google maps.
They bought multimap for the users, not for the technology. - JQP123, on 12/17/2007, -1/+4The articles is titled "Google vs. Microsoft". When he talks about MS defending their monopoly, it seems rather clear to me that he is addressing the threat from Google.
- srujanlive, on 12/17/2007, -0/+3I hate nytimes asking me to login or get an account
- oldgal, on 12/17/2007, -0/+3They don't need to do an OS - they integrate everything via the browser.
- crispee, on 12/17/2007, -0/+3Yep. Firefox is their operating system. They have a lot of engineers working on it. Firefox 3 will have "offline browsing" that is mostly driven by Google to enable running their apps when not connected to the internet.
- JQP123, on 12/17/2007, -1/+4"Google apps are much more intuitive and much more favorably priced - free is a good thing"
Not quite "free" --- unless of course your privacy has no value. - MWeather, on 12/17/2007, -2/+5Are you sure you replied to the right comment? He never mentioned Google at all.
- jrbrewin, on 12/17/2007, -0/+3if only it was an 'edge'. Look at my post above about office live.
secondly, you have to argue if taking away 90% of the functionality, and then making tools that barely work with documents that have been created outside of your tools, really is an edge? - Kindjal, on 12/17/2007, -0/+2I think you are missing the point here. Do you think big companies do use the public Google to index their Internal Websites? They use the Google Appliance, a hardware that contains Google in a Box, perfectly secure, no spying or privacy issues.
Guess what Google will sell big companies to replace Office? Yeah, you guessed right, a nicely integrated Hardware Solution for the internal and external sites that will be multiple times cheaper and easier to administrate than the bloated crappy Office Suite. - roberto_deneero, on 12/17/2007, -1/+3LOL Shhhh, don't tell them what's about to happen!
- JQP123, on 12/17/2007, -0/+2"I think big companies don't like that"
I think most individuals don't like that. Google Mail/Docs is a quantum leap beyond anything previously on the web in terms of privacy issues. Take browser cookies for example, compared to Google Docs they're relatively benign. Google don't need no stupid browser cookies when they have full access to your documents and email with the potential to yield every piece of private info that defines you --- address, phone number, maritial status, occupation, salary, sexual preference, etc.. - antdude, on 12/17/2007, -0/+2http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/16/technology/16goo ... for a non-login version. :)
- Kindjal, on 12/17/2007, -1/+3Office Live is not even in the same Ballpark as Google Apps. With the Google you can work on your spreadsheets even if you have nothing but a browser installed from ANYWHERE and with ANY OS not only from a Windows PC with Office.
I think you have no idea what Office live is. It is nothing but a few generated standardized web pages that import and export to the Office products. To make any use of it you need Office. Part from that it's a normal web page account with a domain, a bunch of e-mail accounts and some HD space.
Another sad attempt by Microsoft to push their crappy platform and software monopoly. - LincolnA, on 12/17/2007, -0/+2Wow that's a great point.
- oldgal, on 12/17/2007, -0/+2Corporate does not like to change, and often does not select the most productive products - e.g. COBOL had to be one of the worst languages out there, but that didn't stop corporate from hanging on to it until the bitter end and beyond - it will be out there in corporate for years to come.
- victorguttmann, on 12/17/2007, -0/+2"we’ll certainly be waiting for them.” *Cue West Side Story music*
- martalli, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1In many ways, you are spot on. I am not a fanboy for either side (too old for being a fanboy now). Many of Microsoft's bad plays lately have been a product of little or no competition. Now facing competition form many sides, they may innovate and produce good products. If they don't, they will be supplanted by others with better innovations. The 80's were full of this sort of innovation. Office products rose and fell over just one release at times. Now Windows and Microsoft Office have dominance on the desktop, but open source products are strong competitors on the server and increasingly on the desktop.
I primarily use linux, but the high quality of linux and its improving usability on the desktop is probably driven in part by competition with Windows and OSX. If Apple and Microsoft went out of business suddenly, I bet KDE and gnome development would slow. The long stretch after XP was probably in part due to Apple's near death experience causing Microsoft to instead consolidate its market, instead of offering too much variety.
Competition leads to innovation. Innovation is good for us. That's great all around. - JQP123, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1"My Point is that MS fans can't point to Google's privacy policy without also looking at Microsoft's"
Lots of individuals and organizations have a problem with giving a marketing company full access to their private email and documents; regardless of whether the marketeer is Google or Microsoft or someone else.
I know that using Gmail and GDocs does this, just read their privacy policy. Show me some evidence that using MS Word or Excel on my local computer does the same and you'll have a valid point. - rmd34, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1"MS's response to Google Docs. The difference, MS only has a patent, Google has a working product."
Now, you know that's not true. My Point is that MS fans can't point to Google's privacy policy without also looking at Microsoft's - which is working quite well throughout all their sites, their partner sites, etc... Let's not forget, also... that it was Google that fought the government when they wanted search data while Microsoft and Yahoo (and others) simply gave it all up without a fight.
btw... The Patent is for a system to be integrated into their Operating System. I'd say this raises the stakes quite a bit (you should have read the article). - Pherdnut, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1Good arguments on both sides but it's hard to argue with "free" and "not so hopelessly bloated that it takes twice as long to open Word now as it did on Win95." Microsoft's coding and software development practices are just awful but not as bad as their business practices.
- WhatKindaBat, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1Does the quote not sound like a quote that could have been in 300?
- TeacherOfHeroes, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1Don't they allow you to lease/buy in-house google servers to run google apps yourself?
- jrbrewin, on 12/18/2007, -0/+1owa1 = not so good
owa 2007 = f'in impressive, if only they could package that technology up with an online collaborative implementation which included other office tools, and give it away.
oh yeah, that'd be office live. :D - jrbrewin, on 12/18/2007, -0/+1google only offer search on their appliances at the moment, or that's the impression numerous searches for appliances brings up. And lets be fair, that's not what we're talking about here.
- parkamark, on 12/19/2007, -0/+1*yawn*
1) I'm not a fanboy of Google, and never will be (see 2 below).
2) Google is already evil, but I would still like to see them acquire Microsoft anyway, cause then it gets rid of the lesser of the two, once and for all, but this does create a new “problem” (see 3 below).
3) Yes, the acquisition "would create the biggest, most powerful corporation ever known in the tech world" but this merge is probably inevitable, whether you or I like it or not - because, as you're already aware, this acquisitional trend is the way "business" seems to work these days and, in any industry, especially the tech world, only the fittest survive (Darwin principle).
4) As soon as (3) happens, kiss good buy to any freedom you have because you’ll have a company – no, corporation – err, super power – no, actually, I think I’ll use the phrase “world dominating hyper power” that knows every single thing about you, from what you search for online, to how big the bogies in your nose are. “Information” is “power” and “power” comes from having lots of “money” (acquiring companies and improving yourself, as a company). And all three of these things lead to “control”.
5) From the moment (4) happens, you, I and everyone else are pretty much f**ked. It never is governments controlling the planet, even though most people like to think it is – it is really top dog corporations like Google - and the day (4) happens, I think I’ll throw a party in my bedroom and take lots of drugs in attempt to kill myself – because, to be honest, as soon as you’re under “control”, you might as well be dead.
Have a great Christmas! - CalipsoII, on 12/17/2007, -2/+3The Google fanboys in this thread make me laugh. Truth of the matter is, all those Microsoft ads with the "employees are your most valuable asset" are bang-on. The average user has been brought up on Office. It's on every Ghost disk. P, most comfortable in, and most experienced with. Ask 100 employees in an established business which tool they'd prefer to do their work in.
Kudos to Google for innovating and offering up a great product, but all it takes is an article like this to really demonstrate which commentors have actual experience in a business IT/HR department versus those who rally blindly behind their favorite company. - daven1986, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1seriously openoffice is *****. anyone who says it is better is seriously deluded. fair enough MS have made mistakes with windows in the past but they did office well and it is worth every penny.
- crimsonnblue, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1Yea, well what about people with laptops who travel where there is no internet.... Like on a plane. What if I need to work on a spreadsheet on a flight... Google apps wont be a valid solution for this.
- rmd34, on 12/17/2007, -0/+1Microsoft patents the mother of all adware systems:
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20070717-micr ...
http://privacy.microsoft.com/en-us/fullnotice.aspx
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ec, etc, etc... - manageMyRights, on 12/17/2007, -1/+2Old news. Microsoft used this argument in their anti-monopoly case years ago. MS claimed to be worried that the OS would become as irrelevant as the type of RAM you have. It didn't happen then and won't happen now for the same reasons.
The OS with local apps. will dominate for a long time . -
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