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246 Comments
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+78Google should pull the listings for all of these companies from their search engines and refuse to reinstate them without tiered listing payments that equal whatever payments they are making google pay.
- thenativeraver, on 10/12/2007, -6/+60The big corporations and the government are in kahoots, they look out for their own while screwing over you and me.
- MrUnderbridge, on 10/12/2007, -2/+55I think the point isn't extortion but rather retribution. The question is, who's bigger now - verizon or google? Assume verizon says "pay us or your bandiwdth 5UXX0Rz. Then let's assume Google responds with "OK, your customers will get nothing from google but a page that says "Verizon says you can't have Google, call Verizon's customer service at XXX-XXX-XXXX." The question is, who wins that one?
- Slugo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+44"WE" already pay for the bandwidth....getting paid from both ends and double dipping is sooooo greedy
- jasqwerty, on 10/12/2007, -1/+42Considering they're talking about tier-1 pipes, not your dinky home service end, yah, it ALREADY has global repercussions.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -17/+56ryog - don't be retarded. It's not just republicans. It's democracts, too. You think the left isn't in the pocket of big business and special interest? Are you seriously that naive? I hate discussions that involve people pointing out failures of just one party that are clearly failures of the ENTIRE party. All that does is serve to anger people and detract from that ACTUAL ISSUES. It's this petty infighting that keeps the status quoa.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -1/+34Yes, it can. The fees increase. Colo providers have to charge more. Small guys like me have to pay *them* more. Small guys liek me can't afford to run their free sites anymore and shut down. Nobody benefits.
Or are these guys ONLY going to pick specific websites to go after? The top 100 alexa ranked sites? Or just sites of companies that happen to compete with them? Hm..
Anyway, this is completely ***** and retarded. - kolobcreek, on 10/12/2007, -1/+30 Martin Kevin OCM (202) 418-1000 Kevin.Martin@fcc.gov
Maybe we should let him know how we feel. - Sabarok, on 10/12/2007, -2/+31An even better idea would be for Google to place a warning notice on their pages "Your ISP [Name goes here] is attempting to extort us by limiting your ability to access this website unless we pay them to stop. If you wish unfettered access to Google, we recomend [Competing ISP]"
- megabytehl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+28Gentlemen, start your engines:
http://www.fcc.gov/commissioners/martin/mail.html - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -7/+35The FCC needs to be disbanded.
- shaund, on 10/12/2007, -3/+29Kevin Martin Sucks.... Everybody Boo this man... BOOOOOOOOO
- lnxaddct, on 10/12/2007, -2/+27Geodanny,
The telcos are arguing that websites are nothing without them, as though the telcos, just by being there, add value to the web. In reality, the opposite is true. Websites give the telcos' lines value, without good websites, no one would pay to use the web. The only reason the web has been successful is because it has been neutral and the playing field had been the same for everyone. A tiered internet will ruin everything, and I can only hope that if the telcos start acting up that Google puts all the dark fiber to good use.
Regards,
Steve - http://krenzel.info - clownguyx, on 10/12/2007, -4/+27DSL struggled for such a long time, and now it seems to be doing pretty well and they're going to blow it. You can't change the internet, people will spend there money with a company not doing this. Cable should launch an advertising campaign to capitalize on this.
- lane.montgomery, on 10/12/2007, -0/+21Confirmed via zdnet in the last two paragraphs of the story:
http://news.zdnet.com/2100-1035_22-6052239.html - mrWoot, on 10/12/2007, -2/+22I wish the FCC could be like DIGG. They make a comment that people don't like, IE: this, and people would "bury" it. I wish the world would be as easy and a THUMBS UP or THUMBS DOWN.
My two cents. - geodanny, on 10/12/2007, -7/+27They shouldn't use their index as a tool for extortion. Otherwise they'd be just as bad as the telcos, and their search engine would lose credibility.
- samstr, on 10/12/2007, -7/+25There should be no bandwidth restrictions! Grrr
-------------------------------
http://www.wirah.com - TonySki, on 10/12/2007, -9/+272 simple words.
***** ***** - Saintlink, on 10/12/2007, -4/+22It doesn't matter if the Bush administration or the next Democratitc party stiff is in office. Both major parties have grown beyond control of the people and have wasted our future in pet projects and protecting their own. It is high time we started voting for 3rd parties.
- pgm_01, on 10/12/2007, -3/+18The pigs are definitely in charge.
The Wikipedia article just oozes with background information on Kevin Martin:
…He has also served on the Bush-Cheney election team in Florida and the transition team.
…Martin worked several years for Wiley, Rein, and Fielding, "Rated Top Telecommunications Lobbyists" according to an article on their website. The firm represents the Bells …
Chairman Martin is married to Catherine Jurgensmeyer Martin, who used to work for Vice President Dick Cheney as an advisor. She now works for President Bush on economic and other policies, as Deputy Assistant to the President and Deputy White House Communications Director for Policy and Planning. Kevin and Catherine reside in Washington, D.C.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Martin_%28FCC%29
At least he has better qualifications for the job then "Browny" did for FEMA. What is with the incestuous political scene in the White House? Everybody is a friend or friend of a friend or a friend of a lobbyist friend. Both political parties need to be tossed out on their well padded behinds. - jasoneisen, on 10/12/2007, -1/+15I don't think these companies understand what they are doing. If they start charging Google, then Google is going to have to find a way to increase their income to counter it. Since Google offers mostly free services, the only area where they can raise prices is their ad services, which would be costing AT&T and other telcos a lot more, since they are heavily into Google's ad program.
I know this applies to all websites, but it seems that they are targeting Google the most. - jasoneisen, on 10/12/2007, -10/+24Everyone shut your mouth. This IS party *****. I give you exibit A:
"Chairman Martin was nominated by President George W. Bush to a Republican seat on the Commission, and was sworn in on July 3, 2001. He was designated chairman by President Bush on March 18, 2005.
Before joining the FCC, Martin was a Special Assistant to the President for Economic Policy. He served on the Bush-Cheney Transition Team and was Deputy General Counsel for the Bush campaign."
http://www.fcc.gov/commissioners/martin/
Do your Google searches folks, before it starts costing $.10 a search. - Flyerman85, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15well the FCC isn't big bisiness, it is big brother
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+15Only big business can make a decision this bad. This is un-freakin-believable.
- Slopchop, on 10/12/2007, -3/+15Here is an idea for google, and the likes. Pull the plug on these companies that would try to fracture the greatest invention of the century, by not offering there services to them. These companies would then see a huge exodus of there clients for companies with some sense of sanity and respect for a free, single Internet. Sure it would hurt the consumers with this company in the short run, but in the long run I could see these select, greedy, companies, rethink there business strategies. Maybe they could think somewhat innovatively and improve there services to help drive there business and improve there bottom end.
- carpespasm, on 10/12/2007, -2/+13then do something about it, mail your senators, representatives, the fcc, anything. let your opinion be known.
that or move - TheCheeta, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10Instead of using their built-in email form, try emailing Mr. Martin directly via Kevin.Martin@fcc.gov
I'm sure he'd love to hear from you. Please be somewhat responsible in your emails to him. Actually... here is the whole list (note that Mr. Martin actually has a different email address here):
Chairman Kevin J. Martin: KJMWEB@fcc.gov
Commissioner Michael J. Copps: Michael.Copps@fcc.gov
Commissioner Jonathan S. Adelstein: Jonathan.Adelstein@fcc.gov
Commissioner Deborah Taylor Tate: dtaylortateweb@fcc.gov
To Obtain Information via E-mail
General information, inquiries & complaints: fccinfo@fcc.gov
Freedom of Information Act requests: FOIA@fcc.gov
Comments on FCC Internet services: webmaster@fcc.gov
Elections & political candidate matters: campaignlaw@fcc.gov - eclectro, on 10/12/2007, -4/+14Google needs to start laying their own pipes and buy up those that have dark fiber. It's as simple as that.
- megabytehl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10Problem is, if its FCC endorsed there won't be a company that won't do it. It really is legalizing extortion. Don't think AT&T/SBC/Verizon/Comcast won't buy up/drive out of business any companies that refuse to practice it. Not to mention that if you couple this with regional government supported monopolies we've got a pretty sizable ***** storm on our hands.
- Xopl, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10I just sent this... feel free to borrow the talking points. Contacting Mr. Martin is important.
Dear Mr. Martin,
American Telcos cannot be allowed to create a multi-tiered internet. Consumers already pay for their bandwidth, and content providers already pay for their bandwidth. Downgrading services and forcing them to pay a second time to have normal access is ridiculous.
The government allows the Telcos to provide the services they do, and to lay the lines that they lay, and to hold the relative monopolies that they hold under the assumption of public good and that they will be common carriers, completely ambivalent to what is being sent on the lines.
Moreover, the government creates tax and other incentives to benefit to Telcos to encourage the creation of modern fiber networks and other advancement. These benefits were given to the Telcos with promises of services which have yet to be delivered. Further lining the pockets of the Telcos by allowing this tiered internet is unacceptable.
Thank you. - geodanny, on 10/12/2007, -1/+10This is a wake up call. Perceived apathy amongst voters will only be received by this sort of government treatment. The FCC was originally intended to serve the people as a whole. It has now been crippled and filled with appointees who don't generally look out for the interests of all people. It is the same throughout our government. And unless we stand up and take it back ... more of the same.
The Telcos and their friends are starting to prime us for the day they start extorting money to allow you the user, access to the bandwidth you and these web sites already pay for. If I were Google, I'd prepare to sue. Yahoo!, too.
Everyone should write, call, and email your congressman, all FCC commissioners, state utility commission, and these telcos. A neutral net was one of the driving forces to create what it is today. Let's keep it that way. - rabiddogma, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11Libertarians believe that everything belongs in a market. And that if you own it you can do anything you want with your property. So if AT&T thinks they own the Internet then Libertarians should be okay with that and let them do whatever they want with it.
Moderate people--like the Democrats and Republicans that ran this country 50 or 60 years ago knew that there were certain parts of our infrastructure that should be owned by the public and maintained for everyone's benefit. Like roads and highways, like the power grid, like water systems and the air. Monopolies (allowing private entities to claim that they OWN these things) over any of these things would stifle innovation. The Internet should be the same way--it's critical infrastructure to everyone. No single business should control it. - szelij, on 10/12/2007, -5/+14The United States isn't the only country using the Internet. It is however unique that the government would not step in to protect neutrality and the rights of consumers. Even in the UK, Mr Blair's government would step in-even more so in socialist France and EU.
- planktonx, on 10/12/2007, -3/+12This is terrible, we are already paying access to the web via our ISP, now it looks like there will be extra charges on top (like cable TV, pay per view). The world wide web should always be free. Maybe if we build our own Internet so that we don't have to go through these greedy companies AT&T and other telcos). A lot of homes already have WiFi, what if we open it's access and use it as alternative to land line. We have open source, copy left, maybe now it's time for OPEN NET, none profit Internet that is not under the control of anyone.
- hometoast, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9You're almost right; we pay at one end, Google is paying their ISPs for their datacenters. What this proposes it to charge a THIRD time.
- jasqwerty, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10Or people will just use Yahoo or whatever else is available, because an overwhelmingly large part of a user-base of any product exists as a matter of convenience, not zealotry. I can go to my store and buy either Coke or Pepsi. If all of a sudden my closet grocery store stopped selling Pepsi, and the closest other one sold it for 20% more than what Coke costs, guess what?
- mofomojo, on 10/12/2007, -17/+25So.. uh..
Why don't you guys try to elect libertarian? It seems that their platform supports both ideologies, Conservative and Liberal.
Seriously, libertarian is the ultimate moderate party.
Furthermore, libertarian jurisdiction over the internet would be even more beneficial to what we would want, a one tiered internet, no more of this strangle hold on information by telcos, no more of the whole two-tiered ***** that screws over the rights of small guys.
Plus, there really aren't too many laws based around good IT, it's mostly rich telcos paying off senators and congressmen. The real only thing that we as citizens have is the EFF, which is incredibly small compared to the lobbying power of the telcos. - neozeed, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9Direct democracy? Surely you jest!
- Reddog_x2000, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8Google needs to brighten up all that dark fiber they bought. Time to create a parallel internet or at least a national ISP that automatically routes around the offending *****.
All search engines should also start de-listing those companies that try to pull this crap. The only time AT&T, for example, should be show up at all is when you search directly for them. Even then, you will only come up with a link to a page discussing why AT&T's behavior is so scummy. - 5blocksfree, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9Let them do it. I know I will immediately switch to a search portal that pays the extortion fees and doesn't suffer from bandwidth issues as a result.
Oh wait. No I won't. I'll continue to use whatever search engine I damn well please, even if it's a little slower. So, AT&T, Comcast, et al, go ahead...tier to your heart's content. It won't change MY behavior one bit, although it very well MIGHT encourage me to find an alternative means of access. - MrUnderbridge, on 10/12/2007, -14/+21Hey, who's calling for violent video games to be banned RIGHT NOW? Bush, right? Nope, that's Hilary and Lieberman. Who called for violent music to be banned? Reagan, right? Nope, Gore.
I'm not a Republican, but those blaming them for all our ills have no knowledge of either history or current events. - carpespasm, on 10/12/2007, -3/+10FCC Chief: "I don't see a problem with a fragmented and tiered internet"
- oxymoron69, on 10/12/2007, -16/+23booooooooooooooooo! glad im not an american.... although this could have global repercussions.
- Antimatter3009, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8This is a sensationalist headline/article. Look at this article and read what he actually said:
http://www.networkingpipeline.com/news/183701554
For instance, the last sentence says, "When asked how consumers could measure service performance levels, Martin said that public Web sites already exist that let users measure their connection speeds." He's talking about limiting how much bandwidth you have based on how much you pay, which the telcos already do and have always done. You pay more for more bandwidth. If you read the rest of that article you'll see that AT&T has backed off of a tiered internet, calling it "economic suicide" and Martin says that they will enforce net neutrality if necessary. All they said is that they don't believe that new laws are needed to enforce net neutrality as they already have that power. TFA is blown way out of proportion to get more hits. Calm down. - ryogahibiki, on 10/12/2007, -19/+26Seumas, I never said that the Democrats were perfect.
But which party has the majority in Congress right now? Who's in charge of the White house right now? It is under the current Republican rule where so many favors are given to big business to the detriment of the majority of hard working middle class Americans. Only the richest 1% of Americans are benefitting greatly under the current republican administration while the average wealth of the middle-class American has gone down during this same time.
As for special interest scandals, we are seeing connections to republicans over and over again and it sickens me.
About the now infamous Abramhoff scandal, FEC records prove that NO money went to Democratic coffers directly from Abramhoff, or his corporations.
And republican representative Randy "Duke" Cunningham was recently sent to jail for taking millions in bribes from defense contractors.
No, the Democrats are not perfect, but in terms of this topic, they are the far lesser evil compared to the average republican congressman.
The big problem with politics today is that modern-day politicians have to spend so much time raising money for their campaigns. Campaign reform is a crucial subject that needs to be addressed. Politicians should be given a flat amount of government funds in lieu of private campaign money. Then the politicans could actually spend time doing their true job. I truly believe that this would have a profound affect on every Americans' lives.
btw, I'm not a Democrat. I'm a moderate independent voter and a strong supporter of consumer advocacy. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+9I pay for my internet bandwidth.
google is already paying for there own bandwidth (as all sites do)
who is getting the free ride and losing money?
sounds like a shake down.
I wonder what att gave kevin martin? - rabiddogma, on 10/12/2007, -4/+11Yes there is a name for a corporate controlled government: Fascism.
- cobalt60, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Done & done - emailed both senators and my rep. Everyone should do the same! Only takes 5 minutes to write a relatively coherent email. Let your representatives know how you feel!
- jdavid, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7i am vacationing in TOKYO and it rocks, when crap like this happens it makes me want to interview over here in tokyo for some sort of job so i can live in a real country that supports technology.
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