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Comcast, BitTorrent To Work Together On Network Traffic
online.wsj.com — Comcast is in talks with BitTorrent on ways to run the file-sharing company's technology more smoothly on its broadband network. The companies are in talks to collaborate on ways to run BitTorrent's technology more smoothly on Comcast's network, and allow Comcast to transport video files more effectively over its own network in the future.
mdfrancois- 734 diggs
- digg it
- cucina, on 03/27/2008, -1/+71Nothing is going to change. This is just some good PR.
- Angels, on 03/27/2008, -4/+16While I agree nothing will change that much. It's still a step forward. It's interesting that major newspapers are covering this issue. More awareness of it is critical.
- Andy.D, on 03/27/2008, -2/+5Send Comcast a message. This doesn't cut it.
Comcast-BitTorrent pact not a substitute for net neutrality
http://digg.com/tech_news/Comcast_BitTorrent_pact_ ... - kipmartin, on 03/27/2008, -0/+3ok. i was going to order Comcast today. Im using a laptop with a verizon data network card and it sucks bad. my only other choices are Dish or Comcast. does this mean i cant use bittorrent with Comcast? please dont force me to use the evil satellites!!
i apologize for asking the question here. really, i do.- CompIsMyRx, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4Bittorrent over Dish will suck pretty bad. You're better off using Comcast for internet in general.
- prophetpimp, on 03/27/2008, -2/+1Just shell out a bit of money for a rapid share account and be done with it
- SeaBass22, on 03/27/2008, -0/+2srsly?
- andreusboy, on 03/28/2008, -0/+1ya liek, rly?
- Genma, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1"Comcast will slow traffic for those users who consume the most bandwidth, said Comcast's Mr. Warner. Comcast hopes to be able to switch to a new policy based on this model as soon as the end of the year, he added. The company's push to add additional data capacity to its network also will play a role, he said. Comcast will start with lab tests to determine if the model is feasible."
translation: "We're going to keep doing what we do as long as you try to use your service."
all the pr bs and traffic shaping in the world isn't going to change a thing until their capacity catches up to the bandwidth they've sold.
- DaLukeMan, on 03/27/2008, -17/+3Someone owns bittorrent ? isnt it just a thing
- masterc, on 03/27/2008, -0/+14http://www.bittorrent.com/
- Neoanarchist, on 03/27/2008, -0/+9Bram Cohen is the owner/creator of the protocol. He started a company based on the protocol after it became a massive hit and now attempts to use the protocol for legitimate decentralization needs such as large software/media distribution. bittorrent.com is now a legal movie and game downloads site as far as I know.
PS Please correct me if I am wrong, it's been a while since I've read much about this.
- RadiatedAnt, on 03/27/2008, -5/+64***** comcast!
- Postalwrker27, on 03/27/2008, -3/+7How original.
- prophetpimp, on 03/27/2008, -0/+3***** the RIAA and MPAA.
How is that for originality?
- prophetpimp, on 03/27/2008, -0/+3***** the RIAA and MPAA.
- Stemnin, on 03/27/2008, -1/+2They've been doing that since you signed up for it!
- Postalwrker27, on 03/27/2008, -3/+7How original.
- saxreturns, on 03/27/2008, -3/+10Do my eyes deceive me? I remain skeptical, but I suppose only time will tell if Comcast are serious or just trying to save their reputation in the face of mass complaints.
- KMartSheriff, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Yeah I'm confused too. Does this mean Comcast could care less who is torrenting files (legal or otherwise), and really only concerned with their bandwidth?
- spatulacity, on 03/27/2008, -0/+0Pretty much.
Comcast only cares about what you do online in a few situations I've seen.
1. If you're pirating, and they get DMCA complaints from rightsholders.
2. If you're using enough bandwidth to affect your neighbors. If you keep your connection maxed out on downloads and uploads constantly, but your neighbors aren't complaining of slow speeds, there won't be an issue. Once you become something that drives tech support calls, the throttle/cap hammer comes down.
3. If you use enough bandwidth that you cost the company more in what they pay to the backbone providers for it than what they make from you on a regular basis. One wouldn't often see this, but if you are doing that, I can see why they would cap/throttle you or even drop you as a customer.
- spatulacity, on 03/27/2008, -0/+0Pretty much.
- KMartSheriff, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Yeah I'm confused too. Does this mean Comcast could care less who is torrenting files (legal or otherwise), and really only concerned with their bandwidth?
- ShamaN357, on 03/27/2008, -5/+12I hope this ends up being Comcastic!!!
- modingo, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1The name Comcast with any combination of superlative is an abomination. As one of their many throttled customers, it makes me sick just to hear that word.
- RobotLeAwesome, on 03/27/2008, -4/+12Keep your friends close, your enemies closer.
- RealmDown, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4But encapsulate them equally.
- abszint, on 03/27/2008, -3/+44i smell *****
- RealmDown, on 03/27/2008, -1/+9Yeah well, it's an election year.
- Oysterville, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4Passing this through the reality filter of time will quite probably show that Comcast is working with BT to find out an easier way to identify BT traffic so they can throttle it no matter what port it comes through. Maybe the lawyers over at Comcast told the folks at BT that they'd sue them to oblivion if they didn't help out. I have no proof of this, but it sounds much more likely than Comcast working to improve BT traffic.
- ryanmct, on 03/27/2008, -1/+23Wait... Is this the same Comcast that's been throttling my BitTorrent traffic since 2006?
- B1663r, on 03/27/2008, -6/+3Are you sure you have your firewall set up right? Because my bittorrent hasn't been affected at all...
- bradleyland, on 03/27/2008, -1/+3What the hell does his firewall have to do with the admitted policy of throttling by companies like Comcast?
- justjeninsf, on 03/27/2008, -3/+1they've admitted the policy but it doesn't seem to affect 100% of comcast users. no one I know who is a comcast user has had their traffic throttled.
- B1663r, on 03/27/2008, -6/+3Are you sure you have your firewall set up right? Because my bittorrent hasn't been affected at all...
- kipmartin, on 03/27/2008, -1/+3thats a heck of a first paragraph! are you saying the companies are in talks to collaborate on ways to run BitTorrent's technology more smoothly on Comcast's network? it's not clear in your lead-in.
btw, Comcast is evil.- diggrim, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1smoothly does not mean top speed...probably just a smoother throttle :(
- Marglar, on 03/27/2008, -0/+6As much as I despise any form of network shaping, Comcast is the ONLY available provider for a lot of people (including me :( ) that is worth a damn. Maybe if they had some competition they wouldn't be able to pull crap like this
My options are 756kbps DSL or 6mb comcast, so you can imagine what I pick. One can only hope that this article is more then a positive PR stunt... especially since they are offering 15mb service very soon- nekochan, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1the options here are even more dire. 756kbps DSL vs a company that likes to pretend it's comcast, but without the connection speed.
- Akraz, on 03/27/2008, -1/+12There is a redundancy in the article description. There is a redundancy in the article description.
- nekochan, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4department of redundancy department!
- kipmartin, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1i mentioned that earlier. did i mention that i mentioned that earlier?
- Laiden, on 03/27/2008, -0/+2The hard to comprehend redundent description is tough to read.
- Holocaust, on 03/27/2008, -7/+4Pirates Win?
- digitallysick, on 03/27/2008, -1/+2Probably cheaper for comcast to upgrade its network, and work with bittorrent than to be fined by the FCC. I'm sure that was the next step , they fought it and lost, so now they can only compromise. A Mixture of bad press and loss of customers over this, could be a wake up call for comcast.
- MattB123, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4Wired article on the same subject: http://feeds.wired.com/~r/wired/index/~3/259061275 ...
- Jeffler, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Bell better be next.
- Lukesed, on 03/27/2008, -0/+39Hey, hey! I got an idea on how to make bittorrent faster on your network. How about you STOP BLOCKING IT!
- B1663r, on 03/27/2008, -8/+3How about you check your firewall settings?
- Kucher, on 03/27/2008, -0/+6What?
- br0ck, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1I wonder if some intelligent caching software could go even farther than not blocking it. They could do it very simply by just storing blocks of data in the data center and when inside and outside bittorrent clients request that block of data by MD5 hash ID, the data center could just send them that block of data. It would basically be like a caching proxy for web content, but intended for bittorrent content. I think they'd escape prosecution for any bad content through safe harbor provisions.
- br0ck, on 03/27/2008, -0/+3Wow, I should have done a search first. It looks like my idea is actually pretty old. In fact SandVine, the very company that's doing the torrent blocking for Comcast has a product that does Torrent caching. http://www.sandvine.com/products/p2p_element.asp
- diggrim, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1they're not trying to make it run "faster" just smoother...whatever that means (probably stop resetting sessions)
- thejynxed, on 03/27/2008, -0/+0They can do that easily enough already if they bothered to properly configure their Sandvine devices. Those devices are already capable of doing such. They are also capable of geo-ip location and a number of other tricks to connect traffic to the nearest node on the network during a bit torrent session. Why Comcast doesn't take full advantage of this, instead of randomly blocking or resetting, I don't know. I know they don't mind incoming network traffic from outside of the Comcast network that they get paid to take in, but they hate paying for the traffic that leaves their network (as most ISPs generally do). That's one of the reasons they are using Sandvine to begin with - to focus bit torrent traffic to first exhaust all seed and peer sources on their own network before going outside of the network at a reduced rate of speed.
Hopefully this really is good news for Comcast users in general, and may bring about an end to the total throttling/blocking some are seeing.
That being said, I'd still swap to FiOS in an instant if it were available in my area.
- thejynxed, on 03/27/2008, -0/+0They can do that easily enough already if they bothered to properly configure their Sandvine devices. Those devices are already capable of doing such. They are also capable of geo-ip location and a number of other tricks to connect traffic to the nearest node on the network during a bit torrent session. Why Comcast doesn't take full advantage of this, instead of randomly blocking or resetting, I don't know. I know they don't mind incoming network traffic from outside of the Comcast network that they get paid to take in, but they hate paying for the traffic that leaves their network (as most ISPs generally do). That's one of the reasons they are using Sandvine to begin with - to focus bit torrent traffic to first exhaust all seed and peer sources on their own network before going outside of the network at a reduced rate of speed.
- B1663r, on 03/27/2008, -8/+3How about you check your firewall settings?
- aoki4, on 03/27/2008, -7/+0stealing from the rich to give to the poor is still stealing
- theaceoffire, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4We are not stealing from the rich, we are using what we bought.
If I buy internet speed, and I want to download X, Y, or Z at the rate you told me you were giving me, then it better damn well do it.- spatulacity, on 03/27/2008, -0/+0Yeah...and if you want a constant speed of 8Mb/768k 24/7/365 for $53 a month, it's not gonna happen. You buy consumer/entertainment grade internet access, that's what you get. Shared bandwidth on a node, and if you're affecting your neighbors, you're gonna get throttled.
Do you want constant, maxed-out speed capabilities? Get a dedicated fiber line. And pay for it.- theaceoffire, on 03/28/2008, -0/+1They don't OFFER a fiber line in my area.
- theaceoffire, on 03/28/2008, -0/+1They don't OFFER a fiber line in my area.
- spatulacity, on 03/27/2008, -0/+0Yeah...and if you want a constant speed of 8Mb/768k 24/7/365 for $53 a month, it's not gonna happen. You buy consumer/entertainment grade internet access, that's what you get. Shared bandwidth on a node, and if you're affecting your neighbors, you're gonna get throttled.
- theaceoffire, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4We are not stealing from the rich, we are using what we bought.
- Twinked, on 03/27/2008, -1/+3"Come into my web" said the little black spider.
- positron, on 03/27/2008, -0/+2I believe you mean: "Come into my parlor," said the spider to the fly.
- Postalwrker27, on 03/27/2008, -6/+1Comcast does....good?
- elosorusso, on 03/27/2008, -0/+3So they'll "stop" throttling much like they pretended they weren't doing it in the first place?
- SealandRes1, on 03/27/2008, -0/+28Maybe this is their attempt to control the future development of the protocol?
Comcast: So for bit-torrent 2.0, we want you to add more information in the packet header, revealing the filename, size, and originating URL...
BitTorrent: But our users will be more 'exposed'....
Comcast pushes 2 briefcases full of greens...
BitTorrent: Done!- BoneheadFarker, on 03/27/2008, -0/+2Don't worry...something even more difficult to track then Bittorrent is now will pop up to take the place of Bittorrent 2.0. Just like after Napster, there was Kazaa, eDonkey/eMule, Limewire, Bittorrent, etc...
- Angostura, on 03/27/2008, -1/+33"It's a trap".
- nekochan, on 03/27/2008, -1/+6inb4 the ascii Ackbar spam.
- DivisibleByZero, on 03/27/2008, -0/+11Wouldn't working with BitTorrent to make torrent traffic more efficient actually end up violating net neutrality principles we've all been beating a drum about? Say some BT competitor comes along with their own protocol. They could argue that comcast was unfairly favoring BitTorrent; and while Comcast can do something like this for the case of 1 company like BT, having to support hundreds or thousands of protocols would be unfeasible in terms of resources.
- displaced1, on 03/27/2008, -1/+1Anyone else feel like the title of the story said more in 8 words than the entire article? Everything else was just fluff.
- megaton, on 03/27/2008, -0/+3Except there is no mention in the title about the fact that Comcast wants to shift the throttling from a single protocol to ALL of a subscriber's bandwidth.
- EdwrdDiggrhands, on 03/27/2008, -0/+0This does not sound like the Comcast I know, damn. As soon as I read Comcast and BitTorrent I assumed that the latter was simply throttling all related traffic on its network.
- comp8, on 03/27/2008, -2/+0They just need to dump some of that silver "High Speed" jizz on it...
- Dizaster, on 03/27/2008, -2/+1You saved El Moola! *slap*
- maskedm564, on 03/27/2008, -0/+6"The companies are in talks to collaborate on ways to run BitTorrent's technology more smoothly on Comcast's broadband network"
It would run just fine if you didn't block it! Assholes! - megaton, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Why can't I just pay like $50 MORE and download however much I want?
I don't give a ***** about their bandwidth caps, and I'm willing to pay extra to not have to think about getting my service threatened just because I like to watch Netflix and Hulu instead of regular TV.- shredswithpiks, on 03/27/2008, -0/+5why can't you just pay your current rate and download however much you want since their service says "Unlimited" access?
- funkyloki, on 03/27/2008, -1/+1FTA: "and allow Comcast to transport video files more effectively over its own network in the future, said Tony Warner, Comcast's chief technology officer."
Maybe, just maybe, Comcast is waking up to the idea that BitTorrent is a fantastic (Comcastic?) way to distribute large files. And I am quite sure that this means BiTorrent will be paid for licensing of this tech. Also, Comcast alleges a bandwidth consumption problem when it comes to file sharing, hence the reason for "network shaping". So no matter what, even if Comcast allows BT files unencumbered flow through their network, they WILL be shaping someone's traffic. FTA: "Rather than slow traffic by certain types of applications -- such as file-sharing software or companies like BitTorrent -- Comcast will slow traffic for those users who consume the most bandwidth, said Comcast's Mr. Warner."
Watch out BT users of high quantity, you will still feel the pinch. - aolshove, on 03/27/2008, -2/+0Here's a solution: Dump Comcrap and choose any other option.
- kylere, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4Here's a clue, a large majority have NO OTHER OPTION.
Comcast bribes* local politicians into being granted exclusive licenses *Note: FU Comcast, You can call it "donating to local needs" but the truth is indirect bribery
- kylere, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4Here's a clue, a large majority have NO OTHER OPTION.
- Azriel7, on 03/27/2008, -0/+7Don't fall for the PR hype, this is just to get the FCC off their backs, but NOTHING will change except HOW they screw you. Call your representative and tell them to support net neutrality.
- NapoleonGold, on 03/27/2008, -1/+1I am in the same problem with stupid satellite internet now. Instead of bitorrent our system has been downgraded because of watching online shows. Don't punish the companies like bitorrent punish the user watching Google documentary's..
- TamerzIsMe, on 03/27/2008, -0/+6I have a good idea. How about Comcast stops selling bandwidth it doesn't have? If during "peak times" their network slows down, then they don't have enough bandwidth plain and simple. Stop blaming the customer for using bandwidth they advertise.
- coltraning, on 03/27/2008, -1/+1It's a trap!
- Phusion, on 03/27/2008, -1/+1Don't be so quick to call ***** on Comcast, they may of actually opened their eyes. It's possible that after coming under heavy fire from critics of their traffic shaping, they changed their policy. I agree, we may not see much of a change and it _could_ just be a PR move, but then again, it might not. There are plenty of legitimate uses for torrents, most of the Linux distro community has embraced it as their method of choice... will the media giant give in to the best protocol on the net?
- h3llscaper, on 03/27/2008, -1/+2Am I the only one that had their eyebrows raised a little when they saw this in the article:
"Rather than slow traffic by certain types of applications -- such as file-sharing software or companies like BitTorrent -- Comcast will slow traffic for those users who consume the most bandwidth, said Comcast's Mr. Warner."
How is that going to go over well with their current subscriber base? - artfuldodga, on 03/27/2008, -0/+4This should be all about the Protocol not BitTorrent Inc. the Company that sold out to Big Media, something strange is going on and I do not like the direction this may take.
- bradleyland, on 03/27/2008, -1/+1Is it just me or does that summary read a bit the Internet Service Providings sales script?
- MadN, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Simple, arrest everyone at Comcast who performed or authorized "man in the middle" hacking of network packets.
If I did that, I would go to the "Big House"; why not Comcast employees? - Cartmants, on 03/27/2008, -0/+7I Smell SHENANIGANS!
- FOXDIE4815, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1i've gotten emails from comcast warning me to stop using bit torrent or they will cancel my comcast services. now what comcast, now what?
- danc4498, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1I predict this is a response to the RIAA no longer paying Comcast to throttle traffic.
- Athe, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1That's funny, Comcast always shuts my internet off when I use BitTorrent to download anything. Legal or illegal.
- positron, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Working to better their support of BitTorrent (the company) not BitTorrent (the protocol)...
- moulin1, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Full article without subscription http://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/stories/2008/0 ...
- crownedgriffin, on 03/27/2008, -1/+1What's this? Giving your customers what they want instead of screwing them over? They did say "Comcast" right? It must be a typo.
- astrotrain, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1And a new service charge on your Comcrap bill.... $19.95 for BitTorrent Services and taxes.
Then will Comcast have a help desk for BitTorrent?
"Hello, Comcast... I am having trouble downloading this movie via BitTorrent, can you help?" - tolerant, on 03/27/2008, -0/+2BitTorrent Inc does not speak for the vast majority of bittorrent users or the many, many providers of bittorrent software. Nor do they in any way speak for other P2P software/protocols or any future P2P software/protocols.
*IF* they have a press release that says "We spoke to Comcast and advised them that the solution is to not interfere with any protocol." then, and only then are they the good guys.
Otherwise they are acting only in their own self-interest, not addressing the issue of the vast majority of Comcast P2P customers, and are doing us all a great disservice. Comcast will be quick to announce to the public, congress, the FCC, and everyone else that they have worked closely with BitTorrent Inc to reach a mutually satisfactory solution. Nothing will have changed and a lot of effort will be needed to explain BitTorrent Inc's insignificant role to policy makers. - aerwin, on 03/27/2008, -0/+2I'll believe it when I see it. I have high doubts.
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