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Canadian ISPs furious about Bell Canada's traffic throttling

arstechnica.com — Canadian DSL resellers learned the hard way this week that Bell Canada now runs traffic-shaping hardware even on the lines it resells.

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  • MAGZine, on 04/22/2008, -2/+194Bell throttling its RESELLERS traffic? This is getting way far out of bounds. If more studios keep putting television shows on BT (like Canada's Next Great Prime Minister), I'm sure the industry will fix itself; and, if it doesn't, some serious action will need to be taken. Rogers, Shaw and Bell are collectively being cheap and shutting out sharing.

    Common' guys, share the sharing. :)
    • blinki, on 03/26/2008, -0/+55I've just sent emails to my local MP, minister of heritage and their secretary of state and the competition bureau of canada.
      I'll be sending paper copies of each by mail this evening. Let's speak up and be heard people!!!!!!
      • smacksaw, on 03/26/2008, -3/+10You can contact your MP, but unless that MP is a Conservative, nothing is going to be heard...no legislation is going to be tabled on this. And guess what? The Conservatives are the last people to punish Bell.

        No, the only chance you have is contacting your MLA or municipal leaders and trying to get them to do something. Then, Ottawa will try to intervene when the ISP complains and it will be up for open debate. The Liberals and NDP aren't going to be able to table anything on this. The biggest shame is that both parties are fundamentally opposed to provincial rights over federal oversight - even if your province could enact network neutrality, I don't think those two parties would be overly prone to cede their power to the provinces like that.

        No matter what, everyone is screwed unless they start suing in court. And good luck with that.
        • Waiting2awake, on 03/26/2008, -0/+10Lets do it anyway eh? It may work, but you are probably right it might not. But even if it doesn't they will know why we start showing up AT their local offices won't they?

          And if that doesn't work? What does that really tell us?
          • smacksaw, on 03/26/2008, -0/+11When you vote Liberal or NDP in the next election, you can contact the Conservative in your riding and tell them why they lost your vote. I'd make net neutrality a no-compromise issue. I bet you the Greens would support it.
          • Timbertron3000, on 03/27/2008, -2/+2@smacksaw -
            although I have strong feelings about net neutrality, I can't say that I'm willing to base my entire vote on that one premise. I like having an economy, thus the NDP aren't a sustainable choice and the Liberals have totally screwed over the maritimes recently...
    • DeFex, on 03/26/2008, -8/+10Yeah its ok to throttle normal peoples traffic but a business!! thats unthinkable.
      • lengau, on 03/26/2008, -0/+21It's not okay to throttle anyone's traffic. However, these resellers are probably paying by the byte (more likely per GB, but that's irrelevant), so this could well violate their contracts.
        Additionally, wouldn't this be anticompetitive?
      • NeilM, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5Are you insane? Throttling is BAD. Never WILL be good. You might be trying to look at throttling from a business perspective, but stop and think for a moment. Businesses freaking hate us. They want our money and they will gladly give us less for our money. Wake up.
        • cwgannon, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2Hmm. Maybe you should try reading the parent comment a bit more closely. Say it out loud if need be.
    • Ganpachi, on 03/26/2008, -1/+86Yeah, that is what I love about public owned broadcasting.

      CBC puts all shows on BT
      CBC is part of the government
      Bell throttles BT traffic
      therefore, Bell is actively fighting against government distribution of public resources.

      I can't imagine this would fly if it was with any other resource like roads or water.
      • smacksaw, on 03/26/2008, -4/+1I dunno...if Bell had underground or above-ground transmission lines and the gov't wanted to put a road there, I think Bell would make sure their interests were protected. You can't dig up phone lines like that.
    • themastersb, on 03/26/2008, -1/+5Good thing I just got Bell a couple days ago. /sarcasm
    • yabos, on 03/26/2008, -0/+21Heavy users are leaving bell for their competitors who offer reasonable bandwidth caps and no throttleing so bell can't compete. Instead they just make the resellers as ***** as they are.
      • offspring06, on 03/27/2008, -0/+3Which is anti-competitive behavior and highly illegal.
    • AndreiOttawa, on 03/26/2008, -0/+9For a few months a couple years back I was "fortunate" to work for Bell Sympatico tech support. "Unlimited" bandwidth was the main selling point for their top plans as other ISPs (Rogers, in particular) have a cap with extra charges if you exceed it. Now it's becoming clear why Bell can easily afford it while competition can't.

      By the way, article mentions that Rogers throttles torrent traffic. I've been using Rogers for a couple of years and had problems at the beginning. Once I switched to uTorrent (was using Azureus initially) and started changing ports on a regular basis, problem went away. I'm getting good speeds now (up-to 700KB/s).
      • Waiting2awake, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2Same here, although not as high speed.
    • JettaMan, on 03/26/2008, -17/+2Funny, with all this whining I don't experience anything except incredibly faster internet speed every year. These complaints are way overblown.
    • jugger74, on 04/12/2008, -0/+1There is only one way to stop this and that is the pocket book. As of Monday I will be contacting Bell and letting them know I am canceling my satellite, phone and cell phone contracts with them specifically because of this throttling BS.. Furthermore I will be doing my damnedest to convince all friends and family to do the same. They will back down.
    • tysonsmith, on 04/14/2008, -0/+0Also anyone who is against traffic shaping can digg this story and fill out this form to help CAIP and support network neutrality http://digg.com/tech_news/Upset_about_bandwidth_th ...
  • TritonX, on 03/26/2008, -3/+87Hopefully we have the CRTC that is supposed to protect the citizens from media corporation abuses....., ah *****, we are screwed.
    • Wardvark, on 03/26/2008, -0/+17The CRTC decided not to regulate the internet in the late 90s. There is no protection from this, but call your MPs anyway. And ditch Bell and Rogers and tell them why you are leaving. It is too bad in Canada we really have no competition.

      I switched from Bell to Teksavvy at the beginning of the year, the service is about the same only cheaper and the bandwidth cap is more than three times the amount bell offers.
      • BoneheadFarker, on 03/26/2008, -1/+14Bell owns the DSL network, Rogers owns the cable network. You will never get away from Bell or Rogers. I'm on Execulink, which leases the DSL lines off Bell, and I've noticed lately that I'm getting throttled. Until the CBC starts getting majorly involved, you will be at the mercy of Bell and Rogers...
        • Speed, on 03/26/2008, -1/+4If you're in the West you've got Telus for DSL and Shaw for cable. unfortunately, they're both just as bad.
        • ianknauer, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2telus doesn't throttle me, though their current speeds suck
        • twistymcgee, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1I'm on Eastlink in the East which has no ties to either company that I'm aware of. I have never had a problem with Eastlink and have always had great download speeds.
          • BoneheadFarker, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1Rogers has recently invaded New Brunswick. Give it time...Rogers will buy out Eastlink's business...
      • Verdanic, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5That's exactly what I want to do, but both of my parents rely heavily on their @sympatico.ca email addresses - completely ***** useless email services anyways, but it's very hard do ditch an email address entirely smoothly. I've been considering attempting to make a huge deal about the ***** of their service and support and the ***** absolute ***** they try to sell us to work out a deal whereby we can switch ISPs and pay a small monthly fee to keep the sympatico email addresses my parents use for a few additional months.

        ... I don't think it'll happen.
      • PolarBearCa, on 03/26/2008, -0/+4Problem is Wardvark, is that our switch to TekSavvy (I did the same last year) because of unsatisfactory service from Bell is now being undermined by Bell. So our additional bandwidth and reasonable service is now going to be compromised by Bell's anti-competitive actions.
    • JettaMan, on 03/26/2008, -0/+12The CRTC should be abolished. It does nothing except slow down progress and limit consumer choice.
      • Spudster, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1In this case it would be nice to have an active CRTC intervene and ensure that this throttling is put to an end. Let's not throw out the baby with the bathwater!
    • scamper22, on 03/26/2008, -0/+4think about it.
      Ontario Teacher's Pension owns Bell Canada...you think the government is going to do anything against their interests?
      • Waiting2awake, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1You may be right - but maybe we the people should start doing this "divide and rule" for a bit. Besides, if this starts to happen it is always easier to fix it before it becomes an accepted norm.
    • oogee, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1http://www.canadianisp.com/
  • demne, on 03/26/2008, -1/+62Time to fight back. Its not just torrents, Skype will/is affected by this. Somewhat anticompetitive from a telco.
    • Speed, on 03/26/2008, -1/+6Even worse if you're on Shaw. You have to pay an extra $10/month to guarantee that you'll have the bandwidth for VOIP.
      • Thepirateking, on 03/26/2008, -1/+2That didn't work here in Winnipeg. I worked for a month to Get Primus VOIP to work with shaw. Didn't do a damned thing. Shaw just tells you they don't support that, and Primus tells you it's shaws fault. Shaw shapes their traffic and now I can't get more then 100kbps on ANY torrent. I'd Switch ISPs if I could find one that would just give me my bandwidth to do with as I please.
        • mpdid, on 03/26/2008, -1/+1MTS?
          Zero problems for anything over here.
          • iruel, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1i hate MTS more than any other company. i have gone through so much ***** with them.
        • iruel, on 03/26/2008, -1/+1I use Wiband. i live just outside of Winnipeg. I don't have the greatest speeds ( 1Mb/s up 1Mb/s down, i believe they have faster packages too) but i have had no problems. i use bittorrent quite extensively. It may be a little more expensive than MTS but i wouldn't switch even if i was able. MTS has decreed that DSL will never be available in my town anyway.
      • j1ggy, on 03/27/2008, -1/+1Not true. VOIP works without it. The $10/month fee prioritizes your VOIP packets to improve quality. Only makes sense to have to pay for the extra feature, if you don't want it don't use it.
        • Speed, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Tell that to the people I know who've tried VOIP on Shaw.
    • julienbh, on 03/26/2008, -1/+11Bell y donnent un service pourri, y chargent plus cher qu'ailleurs pis y disent toujours que c'est pas leur faute.
      BOYCOTT !
      That was for all the Quebecers (including me) that are tired of them and switched to another company. Thanks.
    • tjkisst, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1COMPLAIN TO EVERYONE, including the CCTS, your MPs, a news journalist:
      http://www.ccts-cprst.ca/ots/cf/ExistingComplaintF ...
  • ryth, on 03/26/2008, -1/+72Too bad that the CRTC has washed their hands of even accepting complaints re: ISPs. See here: http://www.crtc.gc.ca/RapidsCCM/warning.asp?page=i ...

    Apparently the market is now "competitive" so they don't have to monitor it, even though 3 companies control the entire real estate that was built with Canadian taxpayer's money when they were running state-sanctioned monopolies. As demne says -- this is seriously anti-competitive when Bell is a telco and they are throttling Skype. Not to mention that one of the selling points of a lot of these smaller ISPs is that they don't throttle, by Bell imposing their throttling on the re-sellers they are essentially undermining their "competitions" service.
    • SilverRocket, on 03/26/2008, -0/+7http://www.ccts-cprst.ca/ots/cf/ExistingComplaintF ... Complain there!
    • smacksaw, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5Not only that, but mobile phones went to ***** after Rogers bought Fido. It amazes me how uncompetitive phone service is up here. I use my Verizon up here more than my Rogers service. Telus gives a better deal to Verizon's roaming customers than they do their own! Why? Because Americans wouldn't put up with the ***** that goes on up here.

      It's happening/going to happen in every segment and sector unless Canadians do something about it.
      • Waiting2awake, on 03/26/2008, -0/+4Exactly. Write letters, emails and phone calls. Letters to newspapers editorials explaining the dangers to both freedom and capitalism(One of the few times I think the majority of people will stand behind if for no other reason than to get what they want as well).
        • smacksaw, on 03/26/2008, -0/+3LOL...not many people you can write to...your MPs are not going to challenge these large companies that employ so many Canadians, while writing letters to magazines, newspapers or calling TV stations won't work since a lot of them are owned by Rogers!
    • j1ggy, on 03/27/2008, -0/+3As far as I'm concerned, your internet connection is a telecommunications line and should abide by the same rules. Not being regulated by the government is understandable but by that same token the gov't should make sure that private enterprise is not regulating it themselves. Traffic throttling to me is censorship.
  • 10001110101, on 03/26/2008, -3/+90IMO, Bell is one of the worst companies in Canada. NOTHING is there fault: ***** satellite service? You've got unshielded cables! Internet keeps crashing? It's a problem with YOUR router! (even if you're not running one.) Want to cancel that calling feature on your land line? Customer service will conveniently forget about you asking them to cancel it until you call back a few more times...
    Needless to say, I've only done business with Bell when it's absolutely necessary (ie: when I first moved to Sault Ste. Marie, digital home phone was not available)
    • nekochan, on 03/26/2008, -0/+27"it's your router" is just what tech support guys tell you when they wish they weren't at work.
    • radarbeam, on 03/26/2008, -0/+14Too true mate. It took me over 1 hour to just cancel my caller ID with Bell last year. What a nightmare.
    • ethamajin, on 03/26/2008, -0/+15so so true, Bell will not take responsability for anything and their customer service is awful. The only way to get anything at all out of them is to send an email with some hefty language.
    • DeFex, on 03/26/2008, -0/+16dont worry they will sign you up for a free trial of their lame gaming service without asking, then start charging you $20 a month.
    • BinaryFragger, on 03/26/2008, -0/+17Typical responses from Bell support if your DSL stops working:

      * your computer has a virus
      * your router is faulty
      * your phone line cable is too long

      They'll say anything to put the blame on your equipment instead of looking into the problem on their end.
      When my DSL was connecting at 1.5Mbps instead of 3.0Mbps, I had to call several times before they finally checked out my profile (turns out my profile was incorrectly setup). I kept getting "1.5 is still pretty fast" or "how do you know you're not getting our advertised speed" as replies.
      • Verdanic, on 03/26/2008, -0/+9Bell does not have support. They offer a support manual, and as a bonus, will have somebody on the other side of the planet read it to you in a manner that forces you to ask them to repeat every sentence three times.

        Bell does not have support, that's all there is to it. I have never in my life encountered a worse ***** system.
    • IEatHamburgers, on 03/26/2008, -0/+4Could be worse - at least in Sault Ste. Marie you have the option of taking your laptop across the border and torrenting at the library there. A good idea if you don't mind the 90-minute wait at customs and the NSA snooping in on your web surfing...
      • sweet4545, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1Try TrueCrypt. This will keep the NSA at bay. I don't have a solution for the 90 minutes at customs though.
        • TritonX, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1Won't that ***** them more than anything?
      • 10001110101, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2I use Shaw.
    • Speed, on 03/26/2008, -1/+7Try Shaw. I call because my internet was going about as fast as dialup. He tells me to do a speed test at speakeasy.net, I end up with less than a Mbps as a result and to him that was acceptable. I realize I'll never get 5Mbps, but when the result comes back as 300Kbps, there's something wrong. His only response: you must have a bad setting with your router.
      • 10001110101, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1I do.. However, before my wife and I started living together, she was a Bell subscriber.
    • bbhh, on 03/26/2008, -0/+9I've actually dealt with all the major telecom companies just as a consumer and here are my rankings based on pure annoyance from their customer service. starting with the worst: telus, bell, rogers, shaw. there is a huge gap between the annoyance of bell and rogers, shaw is almost fine- they SEEM like they actually want you to get good service.
    • BobsYourUncle, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5Years ago, I was told the reason my internet was disconnecting was because I had a virus. Except my internet cable was plugged into my PS2. Switched providers, magically the internet started working again, in both my PC and PS2.
    • j1ggy, on 03/27/2008, -0/+2As someone who works in that industry, I can tell you that a lot of the time it IS unshielded cables. And the most prone part to lack shielding is the connector.
  • Scipio, on 03/26/2008, -3/+127I HATE Bell.....Can I say it again? I HATE Bell
    • macbookpromat, on 03/26/2008, -0/+13They are telco Nazis, what's not to hate.
    • spect3r, on 03/26/2008, -0/+15I hate the BELL Beavers EVEN MORE!! !RAAAAAAAAAWRRR
      • revnoah, on 03/26/2008, -0/+6They sent me a personalized greeting card. Proof that Norm MacDonald cares about me.
      • encrypter, on 03/26/2008, -0/+8Gordon is the most annoying piece of ***** on the airwaves.
      • one1plus1one, on 03/26/2008, -2/+1I like the Bell Beavers, but I hate Bell.
        Free the Beavers.
    • bbhh, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2me too, i had a bell cell plan, and it ended after 3 years, they offered me an AMAZING retention plan to keep me from switching, but i said no, just because I hate them. my hate for bell is currently costing me at least $20 a month. (i hate telus more)
    • Prodigyman, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1I hate Bell more then Rogers and I hate Rogers alot, at least their 18 mbps connection in my area is not bad but whats the point when I can't reach over 500 kb/sec on torrents...
      • antifreeze11, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2whats the point of their 18 mbps connection with their pathetic 90GB caps.
    • rosco01, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1I hate their beaver mascots, too.
  • corlito, on 03/26/2008, -1/+48This needs to be corrected, and now is the time we need to unite. If we cannot win this little battle, which is actually huge, it will truly mean how meaningless we as consumers are in this brand new information age. This age belongs to us. We provide the content that goes on the lines, through uploading or mere interaction such as bloging. We ARE the internet. As such, we set the rules, and WE control the content. If it wasn't for our content, these pipes/internet would mean nothing. Do not punish us or assimilate us into your world of dollars and bottom lines while at the same time profiting from the fruits of our interaction. If everyone is collaborating on this internet, as many of us are, then maybe Bell should pay us so that other people can download our content (weather it is music i created, or a blog someone wrote, or the art my cousins created or wrote) and they (Bell) can make a commission as middle man transport (which they already do).

    I am setting the tone here, the next thing we need to do before we even think about making another comment is links to pages and outlets of Canadian government to send the emails. We need this information on the next post. You reading this, get started, lets fix this NOW literally.
    • blinki, on 03/26/2008, -0/+19Seriously, this is incredibly important for our CULTURE as a whole, nobody seems to be understanding the gravity of the situation. They're trying to stop the shift in media from their control to open control and they want their piece of the pie.
    • spix44, on 03/26/2008, -0/+15I'm in Toronto and use BT for large business data transfers. If this is the future direction for Canada's so-called "tech-city", I would not be surprised to see jobs go the same way the manufacturing sector in this province has... For some this is bigger than downloading pre'd movies at the highest speed possible. We are dependent on unfettered access to the bandwidth we paid for and are actually counting on further growth in the bandwidth capacity in the future. Bottom line is, if you cant get that here, businesses will go somewhere they can.
      • HonoredMule, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5I have no idea why someone would have dugg you down for saying that. I can only assume it was someone who somehow maintains the bizarre illusion that the entire internet is merely a "toy." It is part of the infrastructure of our society, and our growth is in part bound by the growth of our communication pathways. What's more, WE are controlled by the parties that control those communication pathways. That's not something business can depend on, and they are going to go where they have the freedom and empowerment to...you know...OPERATE.
  • martinherrera, on 03/26/2008, -6/+26they should stage a bandwidth revolt and organize a day where every user on their network tries to download tons of files all at the same time. Watch that network grind to a halt
    • DarthDiabetes, on 03/26/2008, -3/+28Oh yes. That won't justify their case for bandwidth throttling at all.
      That's like burning down a building to protest new arson laws.
      • Speed, on 03/26/2008, -1/+6This is Canada. We protested gun control legislation by picketing Parliament while carrying unlicensed firearms. Do you not see a pattern?
        • DarthDiabetes, on 03/26/2008, -0/+7Good god. That's why I left Ottawa. I didn't want to see what they'd do on the lawn of parliament to protest gay marriage.
    • nickert0n, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2hahaha nice
    • Verdanic, on 03/26/2008, -0/+6Personally, I just take advantage of the apparent 'unlimited' bandwidth I have and download full speed (500kb/s) during un-throttled hours (if I run out of stuff to download, I find stuff I don't really want or a friend wants - high definition movies are great) and then do the max I can during throttled hours 6pm to ~1am. Last month I had nearly a terrabyte of bandwidth used. Not the right way to protest, I realize, but it makes me feel a little bit happy inside to know that they're attempting to limit what I download (even with unlimited bandwidth) and I'm shoving it right back up their asses.
    • jessegrondin, on 03/26/2008, -1/+0We already do. Its called bittorrent.
  • Chaoticfist, on 03/26/2008, -3/+12I like it. Anyone want to seriously set a date? I am thinking maybe next Saterday 2 pm (top hours) Bring the network to grinding crash. Of course we would need someone like torrent freak to spread the plan of attack to other people.
    • DeFex, on 03/26/2008, -1/+2no ive got a scrim right then, don't you dare :)
      • jcani, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1damn right! Slowing down networks to prove a point isn't right, or just, to other users who doesn't share your views. Be it a scrim or an important VoIP session with a business client.
  • MikeonTV, on 03/26/2008, -12/+5As someone who uses Bell and has fabulous ratios on many private trackers I must appose this!
    • smacksaw, on 03/26/2008, -1/+11I ogree.
    • RSterkenburg, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1Proof? Honestly, I don't believe it.
    • Trichomonas, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2I have fabulous ratios on private sites where I've upped more than 1Tb BUT...if you even get on late at night and you notice your speeds will be capped at 30-60kb/s down and will stay that way even when you unplug your router. If you call them and tell them they increase it for a few days and then it happens again. During the day it's fine but evenings and late at night it can change.
      • Verdanic, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2For me it's an exact cap of 30 down between exactly 6pm and approximately 1am. I can get past that to about 100 down if I switch ports or have a lucky night, though.
        • igob8a, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1EXACTLY how it is for me as well.
          During the day it's capped at 30, but after 1am it goes up to full 2mb/s or so. I'm still ***** with their crappy service.
  • TritonX, on 03/26/2008, -5/+14Internet access should be nationalized and offered free of charge to everyone. It has now became an essential part of our lifes and future communications will rely entirely on it. I know the government rarely does thing the right way, but I see no other way for the future of our network, because sooner or later BCE and co. will try to charge us and control every bits that goes through the pipes.
    • captainchris, on 03/26/2008, -2/+8all communications (including mobile phone service escpecially) should be nationalized and made public in canada. but only if we have laws protecting privacy and all those nice things. some day, some day.
    • Speed, on 03/26/2008, -2/+5I agree. Our population just doesn't justify having it privatized since we're too small to have true competition, or to encourage getting network speeds faster than 5Mbps.
      As long as the government couldn't regulate it, I'd be happy.
      • j1ggy, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1It's not that we're so small, it's that we're spread out.
    • smacksaw, on 03/26/2008, -1/+5Fascinating. Now, let me tell you that would work in the real world.

      Actually, forget it. If it's not obvious why that's a recipe for disaster, I have a secret network hub in an AT&T building I'd like to sell you internet access at.
    • scamper22, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1YES,
      then IT workers can be on the government's payroll just like teachers and nurses and doctors.
      • TritonX, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1I know this is scary. But what else, we could have it maintained by volunteers, but the unions would get in our ways...
    • punkmonkey, on 03/26/2008, -2/+1Damn straight it should be nationalized, we pay so much in goddamn taxes you would think we would get more in return.
    • canuck10101, on 03/27/2008, -3/+0Yes of course, because socialized/nationalized systems work wonderfully. (sarcasm) Canada's health care and education system are gleaming examples of this. These concepts look good on paper but fail miserably in practice.
  • ShinRaTDR, on 03/26/2008, -2/+5I have Bell, and one day torrents just stopped downloading. Then a couple days later I saw a similar article on digg taking about how Bell was starting traffic shaping. So I started using Usenet. Beautiful. Always full speed, massive library of stuff, and since i stopped using torrents, I can get the occasional one going at full speed if needed, for stuff that isn't on usenet. Just a suggestion for anyone in this same situation.
    • hotdamn, on 03/26/2008, -1/+3While I agree with the basic premise of your comment (I had to switch to Rapidshare based sites for my leeching needs), I don't think that's the way.

      I want to be able to torrent again, and I want it nowwwwww!

      (on Rogers, Ottawa)
      • ShinRaTDR, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1I now prefer usenet over torrents&rapidshare combined, which is what I was doing before. Faster and way more reliable, and If you have OS X you can use Unison, and its all the better. Torrents were never that good, and after the loss of Demonoid, the torrent music scene didn't really recover.
        • SurlyDuff, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1torrent music scene=demonoid? I hope you mean oink, and I think waffles and what do a fine job.
        • ShinRaTDR, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1Oink got credit for what it did, provide high quality rips of music that wouldn't otherwise be heard. Demonoid had more good collections and material that I was looking for and was only semi-private. I am not and was not a member of oink, what or waffles, so while they might be doing a great job, hell if i know. Demonoid hosted all the good public music torrents.
    • sinkhead, on 03/26/2008, -1/+2I, too switched to Usenet. Never once looked back.
    • Tribe303, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5Usenet FTW!
      Unfortunately Rogers is implementing caps of 60gb/mo now... I can download 60-70GB a day off Usenet. I remember back in the day when Rogers had good news servers [pre Giganews]. It was when they killed their Usenet that i switched to torrents, which is what is now clogging their network. Just think Rogers boneheads.. I used to not have to leave my city [NNTP traffic-wise] so my packets never even touched the public internet and thus, costing you money. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot! Rogers=morons.

      As for Bell, they ripped me off, charged me $200 for a $50 phone i failed to return when moving [my friend, the new tenant was supposed to return it]. I offered to go to their Bell store and buy a new $50 phone [same exact model] and return that but no, they still wanted $200 [in 1993 coin]. I called them out on it, told them I'd never use any Bell service ever again and they laughed in my face "yeah right buddy"... well i haven't and 15 years later they can still go ***** themselves. Bell sux so bad, ***** technical service, ***** customer service and massive corporate arrogance to boot!

      Yeah, Rogers also has ***** customer service but I've never had an issue with any technical aspects of their services [iNet, Cell and basic cable]

      Its a damn shame that consumers in Canada are forced to decide WHAT SUCKS LESS when choosing an ISP, not who is better.

      Hell, ***** them all, i'm switching to Electronicbox.net out of Montreal which has service in Ottawa [and Toronto i think] and only leases ~11% of their bandwidth from Bell Nexia [400 out of 3500 MBits]. Static IP, no caps, servers allowed [even encouraged!] and they list their bandwidth providers on their site. The downside is their support is 9-5ish and 95% French
      • ShinRaTDR, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1I cut my plan back a bit (from 10mb optimax to 7.5mb w/ unlimited download) and used the extra money to sign up for giganews.
  • SilverRocket, on 03/26/2008, -0/+17Bell has just starting throttling PSP/Playstation net traffic as well. Thanks Bell!!
    • BobsYourUncle, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2I can't find anything specific to PS/PS. Link?
  • purplehaze420, on 03/26/2008, -2/+7And thats why I use Cogeco... Best ISP in Ontario IMO.... Other than maybe Mountain Cable in Hamilton they get some pretty high speeds. Cogeco does filter BT traffic... but that is why I use uTorrent, and it runs just fine. See regular 1200KBps dl speeds from well-known sites (not bt)
    • RSterkenburg, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1Anyone can get 1200 kb/s from a good non-BitTorrent server, even Bell customers. Tt's BitTorrent that people are worried about though.
    • Omano, on 03/26/2008, -1/+1Yeah Cogeco is an amazing provider for the most part. I just wish they gave (would let you buy) more bandwidth monthly
    • Kinjiru, on 03/28/2008, -0/+1Ahh.. but Cogeco's bandwidth allotment is beyond a ***** joke... so i chucked the morons months ago till they get a clue.

      Doesn't matter how fast they are if it's crippled by such a pathetic limit on bandwidth.

      Much the same as paying for a Ferrari etc.. and only being allowed to drive one city block per month.
  • freezerburn666, on 03/26/2008, -0/+37bell and rogers both throttling p2p traffic now... and it seems theres no escaping it. both companies can suck my d*ck
  • SilverRocket, on 03/26/2008, -0/+20Though the CRTC does not handle Internet complaints, the CCTS does:
    http://www.ccts-cprst.ca/ots/cf/ExistingComplaintF ...
    • teh_techie, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1I was going to point this out too... I remember wanting to complain about Vonage once (not internet, I know...) , and was eventually directed to CCTS to file the complaint.
    • teh_techie, on 03/26/2008, -0/+3To add to this, this is the list of companies that are members of CCTS:
      Current members of the CCTS in alphabetical order are:

      * Bell Aliant Regional Communications LP
      * Bell Canada
      * Cogeco Cable Canada Inc.
      * Eastlink
      * MTS Allstream Inc.
      * Rogers Communications Inc.
      * Saskatchewan Telecommunications
      * Telus Communications Company
      * Videotron Ltd.
      * Virgin Mobile Canada
      * Vonage Canada Corporation
  • goodkidyo, on 03/26/2008, -0/+9A few years back i cancelled my cellphone with them.. Just recently cancelled home phone as well. Honestly..
    For such a giant in their field, Hell Canada doesn't seem to want to do much for their clients. It always felt as though all of their customer service was to avoid issues not create a friendly communicative environment. You call.. you put in your phone number, wait about 10 minutes then someone asks for your phone number again.. They apply additions to packages without asking. Obviously they need to make money but it's just ridiculous.. endless crap.
    When i say this.. I say it to the few suits who set the pace in the company, not it's employees who work hard and know that they work for a ***** bunch of clunts: You suck
  • Helspawn, on 03/26/2008, -4/+2I use Usenet as well. Specifically Giganews. They have 200 day retention on binary files. They have everything !
    • mdaize, on 03/26/2008, -1/+1I just got Giganews tooooo
      15gigs yesterday ... weeeeeeeeeee
    • justice7, on 03/26/2008, -3/+1Giganews @ 30 bucks a month ... ya okay
      Do you not understand the POINT to piracy?
    • Tribe303, on 03/26/2008, -1/+1Usenet.net rocks. $13/mo, 100 days retention, no caps and i get 7Mbit/s on my downloads from them [my ISP max, i think they go to 10Mbs]. There has been the odd month i download over 1Terabyte of bandwidth! Thanks to NZB indexing sites making Usenet easier for newbs, i think the NNTP providers will see an upsurge in business with ISPs hatin the torrents. Newsbin and Binsearch.info make for a killer combo, but u better invest in some big HDs cuz those ***** fill up fast!
  • SilverBlade2k, on 03/26/2008, -0/+42Throttle the speeds? the ISP's should then "Throttle" their payments to Bell..
  • gothicknight, on 03/26/2008, -18/+10Blame Canada!!!
  • CrazedLeper, on 03/26/2008, -1/+13Bell Canada: "Terror. Now shut up--unless you're a terrorist..."
  • Chebsi, on 03/26/2008, -0/+10Yeah, Bell seems to be throttling torrents at certain times of day... It's really annoying. They also have horrible service, it takes multiple calls to cancel a feature. I've called/chatted with service dozens of times about that $10 security suite crap with logs of previous calls... at least now they're paying it all back. They also never informed me at all about a new bandwidth limit when I signed up for unlimited bandwidth years ago and ended up with a huge bill one month.

    PLUS their website is a horrible mess and very difficult to navigate through to the important stuff.
  • swean, on 03/26/2008, -0/+16Bell Canada sucks balls. I have had THE ***** service by them.
  • Giorgioman, on 03/26/2008, -1/+15I know this is not constructive but: I really hate bell and I'm switching as soon as I move. Stupid ***** company - their customer service is the most frustrating thing ever!
    • mizike, on 03/26/2008, -1/+4what are you going to switch to? All the cable companies throttle -- some of them even have the balls to throttle ALL encrypted traffic; the only companies that didn't were DSL resellers, who have now had their service throttled by Bell.
  • mizike, on 03/26/2008, -1/+46teksavvy customer here (they're awesome btw, $30 / month, no contract, no download limits)....I was just about to call them and ask them what's been up with their generally amazing service....now it turns out that I don't have to as Bell has still found a way to ***** me even though i'm no longer their customer....thanks Bell!!!, I was beginning to forget how much I hate you...
    • motionblur, on 03/26/2008, -0/+8TekSavvy customer here too. Rocky and his team have been amazing. Here's his latest statement:

      "Ok... Here's the deal...

      They're now openly acknowledging that they are rolling out a full throttling process. They plan to have things fully throttled by April 7th. All BT and P2P traffic will be affected.

      They claim they are allowed to do so according to their Terms and Services under the Fair Usage Policy in the tariffed contracts... We'll be looking into this shortly.

      The meeting was with Sales and Product Management. They will be preparing a formal letter before end of week.

      In the meantime, we (many other ISPs) are going to prepare as well... I guess the high road is the path taken in this case.

      Spread the word one and all as this topic needs to reach every level possible... There's now officially an issue and action must be taken by all if we're to rectify things.

      Rocky"
  • demanche, on 03/26/2008, -2/+4I've also setup a facebook group as we have had in the past to help get some media attention, join up at the group if you can it is called 'Stop Bell From Throttling DSL Resellers'
  • pcamp, on 03/26/2008, -1/+7I'm getting usenet anyways but thats bull *****. I'm going to download GB's worth of ***** needlessly now to spite them.
    For the past few months I've had nothing but issues with Bell...This is how they treat a family of customers with 4 cell phones, a Lan line and high speed DSL, by limiting our service...this is bull *****
    • screwthename, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Calm down. I know a few who downloaded "GB's worth of ***** needlessly" for a few months in revenge. Bell simply downgraded them from Unlimited to 60G/month because they were deemed "abusers".
  • jlhoben, on 03/26/2008, -1/+22Another blow to the free internet. Thanks corporate pigs.
    • FXPooky, on 03/26/2008, -1/+4Four legs good, TWO LEGS BETTER, eh?
  • ivansusanin, on 03/26/2008, -10/+1dupe
  • steevo, on 03/26/2008, -8/+1My understanding of the reason for the throttling was capacity and that they only do throttling during peak hours but overnight its basically wide open.

    Also i appear to be in the minority here and have always had great service from Bell.
    • Topher06, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5Yes, your in the minority because I guess you love big comanies charging you 2 - 3 times more for 1/2 the services. Being ignorant of the quality and respect other companies offer compared to Bell is no reason to assume Bell offers great services.
      • steevo, on 03/26/2008, -3/+2Ya well i don't think having consistently fast internet at speeds that i pay for makes me ignorant, maybe you've had a different experience, but all i was saying that i've never had any issues with Bell
  • vancanucksfan, on 03/26/2008, -0/+21bell is such a piece of ***** company. they offered unlimited EVDO for aircards for $75 a month. A month or two after people started using their service, bell started cancelling their accounts for excessive usage,which was a little over a GIG of data. The best part, the customer had to spend over $300 for the aircard and now it is a useless doorstop. I mean, 1gig these days is nothing. Maybe if it was 1998 1 gig would be fine, BUT its ***** 2008.
  • FXPooky, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5So does this mean Videotron is the only ISP left that doesn't throttle traffic in Quebec? Dear god.
    • Alexcarrier, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1Never had any trouble with Videotron. They're no saints, but still way better than Bell.
  • TritonX, on 03/26/2008, -0/+6If you want more frustration from their customer service, tell them you run Mac or Linux and they will almost likely hang up on you.
  • Topher06, on 03/26/2008, -0/+14This ***** me off because I specifically subscribed to a 3rd party ISP to get around Roger's and Bell's bandwidth throttling, which they not only perform on P2P services but I found on lot of other content and services. They are just trying to reduce usage so they can get away with not putting money into infrastructure to improve the quality of service while demand for faster broadband increases.
    The communications companies in Canada seriously need to be bitch slapped, but the impotent CRTC which is supposed to govern Canadian communications and protect consumers of these services is pretty much just living in the pockets of big business. If Rogers or Bell say jump, the CRTC asks how high! The Tier 1 communications companies in Canada are raping consumers by charging excessively for lower quality services (compared to other countries) and they are bullying smaller 3rd party companies that were supposedly allowed to compete with the Tier 1 companies into forcing them to charge the same amount of money and provide the same lousy quality of service. I am sure if Canadian ISP's go to the CRTC with complaints about Bell, they CRTC will just turn a deaf ear while stuffing their pockets with money from Bell.
    • RexxxMaster, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5This should be all under the government untell we have a solid footing on the whole network... Come on Canada We made the a train that went across Canada with just a hammer. Now the its the 21 century and we are getting owned by POS company's and OUR own government lets them. Quebec almost left us... our country is been ripped apart bit by bit. The way is see the internet is like now is that we just have the train station in the city's. where the hell is the tracks between them. What happen to the day when Canada was the cool kid on the block with his trains... the people are still cool and all, but the country and what is going on is not.... the sad thing is that people see it and it still keeps going...
      /rant
  • RexxxMaster, on 03/26/2008, -3/+7Bell is the most evil company in the world...
    • LOCK3D, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2Halliburton, Dyncorp and Blackwater are just a few companies that I can instantly think of that make Bell look like a charitable organization. There are many, many worse companies.
    • AROZ, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1As much as I'd like to Digg that up, because they're very bad, especially their cell phone division, I can think of worse companies. They're among the worst in Canada though.
  • justice7, on 03/26/2008, -3/+13I hate the cell companies in canada even more

    Bell, Rogers and Telus .. are all garbage money hungry bottom feeding douche bag companies. They nickel and dime everyone to death and make you call in to correct false charges on a monthly basis.

    Virgin Mobile is FAR superior to those three, but its still a cellphone company with hands in your pocket HANDS IN YOUR POCKET.
    • aidave, on 03/26/2008, -0/+6Yep. My favorite is when they invent new charges and features for your phone, and start charging you without your permission. Then you phone to complain but no one has the "authorization" to refund your money.

      Gotta keep those millionaire suits able to afford those huge mansions tho, so its allll worth it.
    • SniperSlap, on 03/26/2008, -0/+6Canada is being ransacked by a growing anonymous base of greedy capitalists.
    • mizike, on 03/26/2008, -1/+8totally agree....here in canada we get ***** all around when it comes to Internet, cellphone and cable television....after living in asia (south korea specifically) for a year, I was shocked at how cheap and efficient their internet and cell phone services are; when people immigrate from asia to canada they must think they're entering the stone age.....it's appalling that we let 3 huge telecoms dictate the level of service we're entitled to, but until the CRTC stops letting Bell, Telus and Rogers buy up every damm competitor I'm afraid that's what we're stuck with....

      btw I agree about the false charges from Bell, the assholes.....currently I have a Bell landline and have specifically requested that they never add ANY service to the phone beyond local calling (no call display for $7 a month, no voicemail, I even have a long distance block and just use jajah.com for my long distance calls); and a pay as you go cell phone from virgin mobile.....my telephone related expenses are easily half of what they used to be when I was cell only due to the numerous questionable charges that would creep onto my cell bills, pushing them $20-40 above my plan price every month.......when I eventually kicked the contract cell phone my last bill mysteriously ended up being 3x the price of any bill I had received from them previously, dirty *****.....btw, this is on top of the ETF I agreed to pay to get out of the contract....

      /end rant.....
      • BinaryFragger, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5Cellphone service is ridiculously expensive in Canada. The ads seem like a good deal until you read the fine print: 911 access fee, system access fee, tower maintenance fee, and so on

        That $30/month cellphone ends up costing you $50/month.
        • SniperSlap, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1And heaven help you if there are any billing errors, etc.

          Basically no price plays out to what they advertise it to be. Cell phone companies in Canada get away with complete dishonesty and duplicity.

          But good luck convincing anyone of that when their image is so heavily based off of it. Peoples' insecurity is a very lucrative market (Apple).
  • emoci, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5For some of us this means there is no other option out there...

    See fair enough, if Bell wants to ensure they can run their network light that's fine...but the resellers they are now throttling lease the copper not bandwith from Bell, they provide their own servers and routing via Peer1, Cogent etc.

    So the only reason to throttle is to keep from losing Sympatico customers to third parties which up to a week ago or so, had better pricing, higher CAPs and no throttling.

    For more news on what is being tried to put a stop to this see http://www.freeourbandwidth.com
    • SniperSlap, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1Good information, thank you! Canadians should be interested in the link you provided.
  • happyhappyhappy, on 03/26/2008, -0/+4Bell has done more than this in the past. They completely crushed the Ottawa based ISP called iStop and forced them out of the retail ISP business.
    • Guspaz, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1That was because iStop's business model involved racking up huge debt with Bell and only making the minimum payments. This isn't exactly news, it's fairly well known that they did this.
  • jswaby, on 03/26/2008, -0/+7Bell often calls us to take us away from Rogers with cheaper intro rates. Every time they call and I pick up the phone, I tell them to go ***** themselves.
  • pigletj, on 03/26/2008, -0/+7Now that I live in Manitoba all of my services are through Shaw (internet, phone and HD satellite service through their Starchoice subsidiary). Shaw cable internet is awesome. Phone service is mediocre. HD satellite is awesome.

    Bell has:
    -Billed me for cancelled DSL for an extra 6 months which then took another 4 months of calling to finally get credited for
    -Sent a collections agency after me 4 years after I cancelled a cellular phone with them because they "forgot" to cancel it

    It sounds ridiculous, but in both cases I got "lucky" and the CSRs who actually took my calls put notes in the file about what they were doing so I was able to get everything resolved eventually. But what recourse would I have had if they just decided that I hadn't ever called them to cancel that DSL or that cell phone? I don't think Bell is evil, just massively incompetent.
    • SniperSlap, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2I swear by Shaw.

      MTS on the other hand is awful, they offer some of the worst and lowest bandwidth infrastructure I have ever seen from a communications company. They love to overcharge for *****.
  • PhantomSoul, on 03/26/2008, -2/+2This is really ironic, because south of the border, this beast manifests itself by the name of Comcast, who is notorious for throttling, if not altogether blocking, torrent streams and other p2p protocols, citing that such traffic uses up very large amounts of bandwidth and provides very little in terms of returns on the ISP's bandwidth/hardware investment. Let's not forget that a free and completely neutral internet will only be as good as any organization is willing to invest in it for a fixed amount of money, regardless of whether it is by free enterprise, franchise, or by the government itself. There's more people with broadband now then ever before, and we all can't get through at the same time...
  • sb66, on 03/26/2008, -1/+7***** YOU BELL CANADA, especially the ***** bastards who made this decision. I want some names and addresses, there's a lot of gay porn and viagra spam that's looking for a home.
    • kevptim, on 03/27/2008, -0/+1I have a full spam folder that says you had beef with me in the past. I demand restitution!
  • robfis, on 03/26/2008, -0/+13http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/3598/belladqq0. ...

    the ironing is delicious.
    • univerio, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2Ironing indeed. Hey while you're at it, mind ironing my shirt for me? Thanks.
  • P5ycHo, on 03/26/2008, -2/+1sew & get y'r money back

  • l31101, on 03/26/2008, -0/+5I'm using Shaw. They offer the best customer service I've ever experienced. They are friendly, helpful, and on time(if repair/installation is needed). That been said, they also throttle p2p traffic, from what i read. What i do is just enable encryption on my utorrent.
  • microchp, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2Nobody should be complaining here. This is awesome! Businesses feeling the pain of traffic shaping is exactly what is needed. You see, if it impacts the bottom line, it will cease to exist rather quickly. Some might be silly enough to upsell a "service" for ISP's to be "whitelisted" but then their legal departments will go after them. Corp vs. Corp. == win!
  • antitomato, on 03/26/2008, -0/+6hey Google!! Please save us!
  • Emachine, on 03/26/2008, -0/+10Isn't it pretty ***** obvious that bandwidth usage is only increasing with time?
    ISPs should be upgrading their networks to meet the new demands, not throttling traffic.
    • BinaryFragger, on 03/26/2008, -0/+1Apparently, new Bell Sympatico customers are capped at 30GB per month, which is ridiculous. Rogers is almost as bad, allowing between 25GB and 95GB per month, depending on which plan you pay for.

      They really need to increase these limits, considering it's easy to go through 1+GB of bandwidth just watching YouTube videos for a few hours.
    • overkillingness, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2You're right, but upgrading networks costs $$$.... They would rather take the cheap route
  • SniperSlap, on 03/26/2008, -3/+5Canada is becoming so ***** corrupt.

    What is with all the greed in our country these days? Did all the 40somethings with their shriveled dicks just roll into power with the agenda of fleecing this country for all it's worth?

    Jesus ***** christ, get some god damn socialist values people, it won't killya!
    • Soothsayer1, on 03/31/2008, -0/+0Socialism is bad, mmkay?
      And anyway, Bell sucks, as does your 15yr old know-nothing attitude. Go back to suckling your ma's tit in the basement.
  • orgazmo, on 03/26/2008, -0/+2I had to switch from BellCanada to ColbaNet because of this (Montreal), but then again, it's the same price and ~14Mbps ADSL2+ (24 advertised) compared to Bell's 5... Blessing in disguised, probably wouldn't have switched otherwise. And Colba does not throttle or caps anything and is, so far, reliable.
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