What is Digg?152 Comments
- zforrester, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6Is this nationwide?! cause they tried this a few months ago in the Toronto area. They told me it must be a problem with my router or with iTunes (since itunes downloads were being affected as well.) i was assured that Rogers would never block any sort of traffic of anysort, in fact the rep I spoke wiht made me feel like an idiot, since, as he said "If your internet is on, it's on." Eventually I found out that, yes, they were indeed blocking the torrent traffic, and as public outcry increased, they removed the blockage. Well, I guess they put it back.
I'm calling them tomorow,asking for a manager, and if I can't get a straight answer, I'm cancelling my service and calling for a boycott. This is rediculous, and illegal. - JTMON, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5"zforrester: how is what they are doing is illegal? you read their TOS?"
Just because companies have a TOS and companies have EULA's, doesn't mean they are legal..or legally enforceable. People like you who think because it is written it is law are why the country is going to *****. Stand up for yourself. You are paying for a service, then later having that service be changed without notice and without change of the charges you incur. Verizon is paying for this type of ***** in NY as is. They overbill so much that the state of NY charges them interest on the refunds they have to do.
Their policy?: We can change the cost of internet service and you only get the new price if you happen to look at their website and ask for the new price. That would be the same as paying a cable bill for months at a set price, then they drop the price but only for people who notice and tell them.
It's not how things work, imagine paying $300/month for heating bill then they drop their rates to 250. You don't know it's been dropped because they don't notify you. They continue to charge the old amount gaining 50 extra bucks each month until you finally notice and say something. You think that's legal? Well how about if it's their company policy? Think it's legal then? That is your current logic you are running with dharm. I tell you this because I work for a lawyer and guess what, we are suing verizon for the overcharges. Plain and simple. There are whole companies that do nothing but go after Verizon overcharges. The Attorney General is all to aware of this. They even get fined every year for ***** customer service! Just because a company has a policy doesn't make it legal. - dharm, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6welcome to a year ago when this story was all over the net...
they are simply packetshaping traffic using ellacoya packetshaping servers...
why? because torrents make up for like 90% of traffic...
how to get by it? encryption in newer versions of utorrent and azureus
want to know about it? go browse a real discussion board mainly focused at these issues... http://dslreports.com - jugaaru, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Rogers sucks big time.
- pcronin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4this has been hapening for years.
"Rogers has a right to protect thier bandwidth and service quality..."
sure, but don't advertise yourself as a full ISP if you're not able/willing to provide FULL ACCESS.
As an ISP client, I want a public IP, and the bandwith I'm paying for, whatever that level is, and leave everything else alone. don't run forced proxies, don't tripple NAT me so I can't host games, don't asume I don't know how to have an antivirus on my windows machines. Offer all these as extra services for people that don't want to have the responsibility themselves.
What rogers is doing, is marketing ultra high speed(Laughable anyway, as in my previous address, I could only get 5Mbit, and my former room mate now has 10), this is not what they deliver. what they deliver is high speed web surfing. it should be marketed as such.
because of other factors, mostly the argumentitive tech support and the head in a hole billing, I'm never going to have any rogers service again. Even if this means dial up, at least the dial up is un throttled.
Rogers is wrong here, piracy aside, as long as I'm not breaking the EULA, (and thiers is shady anyway) I should be able to do whatever with the bandwidth that I pay for, and actually get *all* I pay for. - sishgupta, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5USE PORT 1720 to bypass Rogers's BT throttle.
Also use encryption as said above.
I noticed this BT throttling about 3 months ago.Thank god this has made the front page of digg.
PLEASE PLEASE EVERYONE COMPLAIN TO ROGERS. Maybe we can stop this. - newtbrick, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Rogers is indeed throttling bit torrent traffic, but not in all areas. In the GTA there is major throttling going on.
I have spent time with rogers on the phone, tech support knows nothing about it, cancellations department knows all about it, what does that tell you?
My BT downloads never go faster then 2 kb/s, while my usenet has no problem maxing out my connection at 700 kb/s.
Encryption does work, but your client and the peers client both must support it, and have it turned on. I am using utorrent 1.4.1 beta.
Btw Rogers has started to throttle ALL ports, so 1720 and 1725 dont work anymore. - zforrester, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4JTMON, thanks for coming to my defence
I'd like to add, that just because Sony got people to aggree to installing Rootkits in their EULAs, that doesn't make it legal in the slightest.
Maybe somewhere in the pages and pages of fine print, Rogers does reserve the right to insert anal probes into customers bums from time to time, at their discretion. That doesnt mean i'm gonna let them. - zforrester, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3"What's new? Most ISPs would have some form of throttling or another."
Is most ISP throtled as bad as Rogers does, most people wouldnt use bit torrent. - shubjero, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Rogers is too cheap to upgrade their infrastructure to handle the mass use of torrent's. It's a good thing we have great software engineers from such products as uTorrent, Azureus, Bitcomet that are including header encryption in their clients to help avoid these traffic shaping servers. ROGERS FTL!
- digiital, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Using port 1720 doesn't work anymore. Only way is encrypted torrent clients.
- RyeBrye, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Someone just needs to invent a Torrent traffic thing that will emulate HTTP send and receive requests over port 80... Sure, you will lose a bit in overhead for the protocol - but the ISPs wont kill port 80 traffic unless they want to piss EVERYONE off - not just the filesharers...
- jedijome, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3everyone should just switch en masse to bell.
bell isn't better but if everyone switches rogers will get the message loud and clear that this kind of crap won't fly.
the same thing happened to bell a few years ago when they tried to put in a 10Gb download limit. Sooo many people jumped ship over to smaller dsl providers and rogers that the caps didn't even last all of 3 months.
just switch to another provider, it doesn't even have to be permanent. - jonesin, on 10/12/2007, -1/+4It's *****-up man, folks who pay for broadband have a right to use it how they see fit!
- LNahid2000, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I cancelled my Rogers High Speed immediately when they introduced bandwidth caps. Using Bell now and it has been working great for almost a year. I was even more glad I cancelled Rogers when I heard about the traffic shaping. With Bell, torrents usually max out my speed, making surfing so slow that I have to cap my torrents manually.
- IguanaNed, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3See who else is being throttled AND add yourself
www.frappr.com/broadbandusersagainstbittorrentthrottle - Trepan, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3I've got the Extreme package too, and I'm cancelling because of this at the end of this month.
- Tantor, on 10/12/2007, -0/+3Port 1755 is apparently one of Rogers VoIP ports. That port has highest priority over other other traffic so if you make bittorrent use that port your traffic will also get highest priority. I'm not sure what the entire range is off the top of my head, but worth giving a try.
- t3hX, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2>I'd like to add, that just because Sony got people to aggree to installing Rootkits in their EULAs, that doesn't make it legal in the slightest.
The thing that made the Sony thing especially bad was that it installs even if you press decline, and don't accept the EULA. - geminitojanus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"Someone just needs to invent a Torrent traffic thing that will emulate HTTP send and receive requests over port 80... Sure, you will lose a bit in overhead for the protocol - but the ISPs wont kill port 80 traffic unless they want to piss EVERYONE off - not just the filesharers..."
That's what Kazaa did, and its traffic was still significantly different from typical HTTP traffic, enough so that it was still incredibly easy to traffic-shape. The *only* ways around this kind of traffic shaper would be to encrypt the packet, or to use a tunnel (or just keep inventing protocols and having them packet-shaped until you run out of ideas). It's sad that it'll be the ISPs pushing pirates to using encryption and not Hollywood. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"Another way to deal with Rogers is to get a copy of their "unlimited service" advertisements, and send a complaint to the Advertising Standards Canada complaint site:
http://www.adstandards.com/en/Standards/submission.asp
Make sure that you click the second radio button on submission of information so Rogers doesn't find out who you are and do something really nasty to your service.
You're welcome."
Thank you, I just reported them. - pcronin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2and to everyone saying:
"Cost of bandwith" or "Rogers can't provide 5Mbit to everyone all the time"
I say, they should not be offering something if they can't provide it.
City water offers xLeters/minute, do they punish people by throttling to 1/2 x l/m when they use too much, or when more people then they expect turn on the taps at the same time? no.
and why does Rogers have to pay $50/Mbit? They should be shoping around for a different back end provider, and "vote with thier dollars".
I'm glad you're using usenet, and hitting the good speeds. Let's all switch to usenet. Bet it won't take too long to be shot down to 200k/s....We'll call to complain, and get the same old song and dance, because gues what people... the front line agents in a callcenter get told NOTHING!
I know.. I've been there. We were told when SP2 came out that we weren't supporting it, even tho on the TOS, EULA, and the "supported hardware" site, it said "windows xp home or pro with all latest updates". and the reason why, is because most people at the "tech support" callcenters don't know how to make the microwave/vcr stop flashing 12, and are reading from scripts.
anyone with real knowladge either gets promoted or fired for knowing too much.
to the videotron customers:, check to see if you can be connected to at all, ftp/ssh/game server, and if not, complain that yohu can't host a game with your friends, and that's why you wanted the net. bet you find out that you're being double NATed.
My current provider is a WiMax ISP, and can only push 1Mbit service, but once I called and told them that I couldn't host games, I found it was because I was behind about 3 levels of NAT, and they had to punch a hole and give me a static IP.
Once this was done, I verified with them that I was wide open now, and they said I was, and asked about firewall, to which I replied OpenBSD.
Above all, be polite as possible when calling, it's not like the guy(or girl) you're talking to wants to hear you bitching...
"Pirates pay for bandwith"?
Um, don't you think the pirates *ARE* trying? Pirate or "good surfer drone", the rules get changed on both just as much, because they're all customers of the ISP. - jgam, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Not only were they initially blocking Bit Torrent, they were also traffic shaping other applications. My iTunes ceased functioning for over a month, all the while Rogers was claiming it wasn't their problem. I had a business client that was having consistent dropped connections to their ASP over Citrix at the same time. Again traffic shaping.
Here's a link to an article by Jack Kapica regarding this problem:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20051208.gtjkcolumndec8/BNStory/einsider,Technology/home
So, not only were they blocking Bit Torrent, Rogers did it so ineptly, it was blocking unrelated traffic. - JasonPrini, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Rogers is getting into VoIP and will (or do) also use their network for cable video. What do you think their going to throttle to fit it all in? A per-minute charged VoIP phone service, huge profit margin cable TV, or the flat rate web access....
Isn't convergence great? - mrhahn, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2Throttling or killing? They're two very different things.
- dipswitch, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2That torrent making up 90% of traffic is a Good Thing. It's very efficient. You can for instance:
- Download GNU/Linux
- Download Creative Commons or public domain content
- Share mirrors of websites (after they're gone, or to circumvent slash/digg effect)
http://www.ubuntu.com/download/
http://www.legaltorrents.com/
(and much, much more) - fraged, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3time to start using a BT client that suports encrypting
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2isp's have no business saying what users can and cannot do with their traffic as long as it's legit activties. they aren't their to police peoples downloads or read their email to make sure they aren't using naughty words.
- EyeNo, on 10/12/2007, -1/+3A Rogers user for years (I was on a waiting list for over a year before they brought the service to my area). Been a constant battle with them.
As an early adopter, I have the "extreme" plan. Fantastic on downloads but torrents suck the big one.
Also, now that they offer there own VOIP, my vonage service is getting worse by the day.
A few months ago, they cut off Usenet access and now this. I doubt that Bell is any better and that they won't place the same restrictions down the line if they haven't already. - RickySan65, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2"Magma, perhaps?"
forget magma, i had huge problems with their dsl, lot's of dropouts, downtime and what have you, not to mention the cancelation hell i had to go through when i switched to another isp - zforrester, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2dharm: Is it not illegal for them to a) deny what they're doing b)charge people for "high speed" access and then throttle portions of it? I dont know, I'm not a lawyer. but I don't like it. I don't like being lied to.
Also, does anyone know anything about the American telco's 200 billiondollars in subsidies to bring 45mbps connections to peoples homes, and how that affects their canadian counterparts? Is there a lawsuit yet, or not? - reets, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2The filtering has been going on for longer than 3 months, this is REALLY old news. There are plenty of ways around it also, I am on Rogers and my torrents run just fine.
Only thing is, more and more companies are starting to use torrent as a release method for legal content so this filtering may have to stop in the future or something else be done. - Guspaz, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2That port 1720 business doesn't work anymore. They filter for that now.
The only current solution (other than changing ISPs) is to use the encryption in uTorrent and Azureus, and of course that only works for peers using uTorrent and Azureus (luckily most of them).
Whoever claims that Rogers is paying $50 per megabit is fooling themselves. Large bandwidth comits don't cost anywhere near that in Toronto, and big ISPs like Rogers offload a LOT of their bandwidth at (free or dirt cheap) public peering points. For example, they don't pay for any traffic that goes through TORIX, which would be a lot considering the number of peers that are accepting (Even Google):
http://www.torix.net/peers.php
And as I mentioned, ISPs don't pay that much for bandwidth. One of Bell's largest network providers is Cogent (who are actually of quite good quality when you get down to it). Cogent publicly charges $30 US per megabit for ISPs, but word has it that you can get that down as low as $18 per megabit through private negotiation. Other major backbone providers are rumoured to provide similar pricing when you get down to it (in large comits).
So, $50 per megabit? A flat out lie for actual cost to ISPs. - rhester, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2So does anyone know of any good alternatives to Rogers? I live in London, Ontario
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -0/+2vote with your wallets people, leave any ***** who wants to take away a legitimate service...
- jbtc, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Been with Bell for 3 years and have no issues. Even tech support is top-notch.
All you need:
http://www.ihaterogers.ca/ - pcronin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Also, how about the fact that the EULA/TOS that I signed when signing up for the initial service, had no mention of 60gb/month, needing to retulate programs/traffic, or that rogers could change it at any time?
How about people that never actually SIGNED a contract with EULA/TOS? As far as they knew, what the installer guy told them was all they needed, "Here you go, internet, have fun" - kb9okb, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1See this one http://digg.com/technology/My_ISP_Just_Terminated_Me_Because_I_Complained_That_They_Are_Blocking_Ports
- movieking, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I am on Rogers, and I can't even play online poker anymore, since I time out so much . I hate Rogers, and the second that another company is available in my area, I am switching. Screw Rogers!
- Infekted, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Hoooray for dbxz!!!!.. not!
hahaha look at this guys intro... so just because we use both services we suck?
anyways, im on bell and im not having this problem. i get a pretty normal speed using uTorrent.
and they dont have any bandwith limit like rogers. only problem on bell is that its not available everywhere.
So for all the rogers subscriber. if you really want to get some download speed. you just need to switch to a different ISP providers. not only you get a descent speed, but you also skip all this throttling and bloking ***** that i never heard before nor experience. Because i have read thousand of stories about Rogers internet services. go to dlsreport.com and look for rogers thread... to see how bad rogers is. im glad i never had rogers. but most of my friends does and all they do is complain too... - Dragonis, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Bell does the sme thing, and switching to Cogeco Cable, doesn't help cause they do it too.
- bilangew, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1If you are looking for something else than Bell for ADSL, aei.ca is the place to go-- they block the smtp port, but who cares :)
You know whats worse? Videotron, which is equivalent to Rogers but in Quebec, blocks incoming http requests. That is: if you try to set up a personnal web server on your modemcable, videotron will throttle it, reguardless which port (80 or whatever) you use! - Zippo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Old old old news. You can get around the port problem, but Rogers caps upload here to
- sarnia, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1We've been sort of battling with Rogers this past month. They used to just cut off the connection for a few minutes, then it became a few hours. Now, it's become days. We've had the tech come by once, but he's scheduled to come tomorrow. Ironically, they've decided to start our connection up the night before the tech guy arrives. The same thing happened the last time he was here, when the guy's supervisor came. The supervisor sort of gave him hell for not being able to fix the problem, and then went, "Look, the light's on. Let's go."
Now, I'm guessing most tech support on call, and over the phone have absolutely no idea about bandwidth throttling, which is just a waste to spend money on these guys in the first place. If my ISP doesn't want me doing something, I'd rather them tell me, instead of just taking my connection away. It truly makes no sense to not tell the customer. - mpancha, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I’ve had rogers since Nov 05, the Extreme package. As the months progress, even loading up basic pages like google.com are taking longer and longer (as in 10 seconds for the, simple google.com search page). cnn.com is almost instantaneous. Video podcasts which back in november took about 5 minutes at the most to download, now take 15-30 minutes.
I’ve asked them about their throttling of my speeds, and according to their speed test I am getting the promised speeds between my home and their servers. But they blame slowness on the websites I go to. I don’t understand how google.com is slow for anyone…. when its not.
If I had a choice of another ISP I would switch, but unfortunately, I don’t.
as for this article, its a blog entry. What site did the author get his information from? No digg b/c there's no source. - Tkkt, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I just called them and got transfered to the office of the president, speaking to a person named Priscilla. I expressed my outrage at the service reduction over two years with the price increase (used to be $40/mo, now $55 a month. Pretty much I wasted 20 minutes of her time, since she would only tell me pre-packaged templates of info. I got very irate after being told that the traffic shaping was for everyone, and even though they monitor traffic there is no way they could ONLY apply traffic shaping to people use use alot of bittorrent bandwidth. Give me a break...
And then she had the gall to ask me why Rogers would want to slow down people's traffic. I WONDER!?!? Hmmm... To make money? She didn't know how to respond. - ehmjay, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I used to hate bell and love rogers...what was I thinking!?
- FRAGaLOT, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1Blame Canada....
- Kniggit, on 10/12/2007, -2/+3Another way to deal with Rogers is to get a copy of their "unlimited service" advertisements, and send a complaint to the Advertising Standards Canada complaint site:
http://www.adstandards.com/en/Standards/submission.asp
Make sure that you click the second radio button on submission of information so Rogers doesn't find out who you are and do something really nasty to your service.
You're welcome. - TugsMcgroin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+1I'm using rogers. I just started to download some Linux distro using Azureus, top speed was 30km down and 10 up. I then turned on encryption and switched the port to 1755, within a minute both numbers had doubled. In the time it took me to write that last sentance, the speed has doubled again.
Cheers -
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