What is Digg?86 Comments
- foxingworth, on 07/02/2008, -1/+58I try this every semester and come up empty handed. Last semester I managed to find one of the books in PDF form, but it was two editions old and the problems had been re-arranged. (Pumping out new editions of textbooks every year should be illegal.)
But still, there's always the old fashioned method of using the cameraphone in the bookstore. Five minutes in between classes once a week saved me a few hundred dollars. - nephari, on 07/02/2008, -0/+49Penn State will never have a problem with this because they order custom editions of textbooks (including the nefarious "course pack") and make us buy interactive software textbooks that require a key -- then they top it all off by never using the material more than twice in a semester... oh, and sometimes they'll do you a favor and buy back your unused books at the end of the course for 1/4 of the original price.
- Kosher1947, on 07/02/2008, -2/+36Well crap. I am usually all against sharing of copyrighted files. Seriously I buy all my music and software and stuff legitimately. BUT...textbooks are a huge racket to rip students off big time. I have seen new editions that may only change the font size so the page numbers are different; and change a few problems here and there.
Why? Well because used textbooks don't make publishers money. They get around this by releasing bogus "new" editions every freaking year. Schools are in on it too, because at one college I went to they put a cap on the number of books they would buy back from students; a cap that was ridiculously low. For example the introductory college algebra class had a buy back cap of 50 books. That means only the first 50 students could sell back a book that costs over $200 dollars, but there were over 500 hundred students who owned that damn book. IN A CLASS EVERYONE HAD TO TAKE!
It just pisses me off to no end. The only good thing for me is that my current college rents its textbooks out to the students. Needless to say that they don't seem to change textbooks every time a new edition comes out....I wonder why.
So, yeah torrent the hell out of textbooks. It is all an insane rip off to start with. The only problem is more and more textbooks are coming with interactive content tied to the company website. Increasing this interactive content is becoming required for class. - carpespasm, on 07/02/2008, -0/+32and then proceed to milk at least 3/4 of the sticker price back out of some other student.
- sfacets, on 07/02/2008, -2/+33You want us to not copy/distribute your textbooks? Lessen the prices. A student cannot afford $500 in book expenses.
- EvilCan, on 07/02/2008, -6/+33I'm afraid to digg this story cause I don't want this site to get too much attention.
- las3rjock, on 07/02/2008, -1/+21College libraries, on the other hand, generally do have the required textbooks in their collection.
- Lazydriver, on 07/02/2008, -3/+22***** you.
Seriously, college is incredibly expensive and it's just, not right at all, for it to be forced (try to find a job WITHOUT a college degree) on people. - t0rp, on 07/02/2008, -1/+18omg you are who my dad wishes me to be.
- mattlohkamp, on 07/02/2008, -1/+18Try my strategy - don't but the textbooks until you fail a quiz because you didn't study. Seriously. That way you're not left holding a $200 monster on the first day of class when your teacher asks how many people already bought the book, then says, "the rest of you, don't worry about it, we're not going to use it that much."
- inactive, on 07/02/2008, -1/+18Ever heard of a photo copier and a library?
- chrisvc86, on 07/02/2008, -1/+17Too bad I didn't know about this site before, I usually searched for textbook pdfs on mainstream torrent sites and don't really get too lucky. Sucks that Pearson is pissed, because they publish alot of engineering books.
I wouldn't even mind paying for digital textbooks if someone actually gets off their ass and starts a good distribution system with reasonable prices, the current alternatives only have basic texts and none of the advanced engineering books I usually need. - cvrefugee, on 07/02/2008, -0/+12I've spent more than enough time is necessary in school and finally graduated this past June (History!). One thing I've learned is that I cannot stand staring at my computer screen to read textbooks. When teachers posted PDFs online I printed them out to read. For some reason I cannot get comfortable enough in my computer chair to read long bodies of text. Maybe if I had a Kindle or some other type of eBook device I would be okay, but to me old-fashioned print is much more natural and easier on my eyes.
My point is this, while saving money is great, nothing can replace traditional print for me when it comes to textbooks. I usually bought used books or found them on Half.com for "half"-price. Then you can sell them next semester or quarter for like 90% of what you paid. Also, never buy the book until you're certain it will be used in class. If you really need it, buy it online and go to the library to read it in the meanwhile. Most teachers put a few copies on reserve. - Kosher1947, on 07/02/2008, -2/+13What the hell are you even trying to say? I rent my textbooks, and I bought them before that. Understand?
You don't have to buy music. Last time I checked you didn't have to buy a Will Smith CD for class, and I don't see Will Smith issuing a "new" edition of his CD every school year and the college forcing you to go out and buy it.
THERE IS A MASSIVE DIFFERENCE HERE, and it is amusing that you can't get that. - Pulledteeth, on 07/02/2008, -0/+11Textbooks are the easist money maker on the planet.
It's even better than buying oil, because you get a quicker turn around. I used to feel for the publishing companies, because there was no better alternative than pumping out tree killing books, and I felt their distrubution costs where around equal to the sticker price.
But in the digital age there is NO excuse (other than the bottom line) to not release a e-book. I mean hell, most books are printed using a digital copy anyway, so it's not like it's going to be THAT much more work to create a pdf and sell it for half the price of the damn printed text book. - synaesthesia, on 07/02/2008, -2/+12Imagine this: A piratebay-esque site where users scan the textbooks they bought and seed them for everybody else to share. By mandating an upload/download ratio (like empornium), the site can ensure that users are sharing at least something. It would be a self-sustaining network of students supporting other students with torrents of the latest 'editions', breaking the obscene racket and forcing publishers to understand that the raping will have to come to an end. Of course, this will probably result in publishers making 'digiTextbooks' dripping with DRM or the Textbook Association of America uploading fake textbook torrents rather than (heaven forbid) evolving with the times, but it'd still be a worthwhile endeavor.
edit: Wow, did I really just describe the site in the article verbatim? - HonoredMule, on 07/02/2008, -0/+10A few hundred shots from a digital camera or hand-held scanner cost nothing but time and negligible energy consumption. The photocopiers are less convenient, often in use, and insanely expensive even for black and white copies (often costing more per page copied than buying the complete work).
Buy a portable scanner, spend a few minutes per day or week in the campus library scanning the pages/chapters you'll need for your upcoming work, and keep everything you scan. You'll save hundreds on deified, "copyrighted" material that is usually based purely on knowledge that is hundreds of years old and often predates copyright itself, while working when and where you choose and not tying up access to the specific books/versions of books for which fellow students are also facing an artificial, institutionalized need.
The next logical step is to coordinate with fellow students to mutually benefit from scanning efforts instead of duplicating work, and the next step after that is the same evolution of information access and peer/public-empowerment that the internet is bringing to every other industry or market founded on the control and restriction of information...still using the work students already had to do to service their own needs.
Knowing how college students feel about established norms, their high level of participation in and belief in a read-write web, and that they've been raised in a society where actually obeying IP law has become impossible anyway--maybe the textbook revisionists should consider finding another field of work. Between local peer-empowerment, devaluation of textbook use itself, used textbook recycling (and revolts every time a university moves to version n+1) and projects like wikibooks, their business model is being attacked on all fronts.
I for one won't miss it when it dies. - somedigguy, on 07/02/2008, -0/+9They sure do. That's why I kept any book that was remotely worth keeping.
The Text Book System is a real gimmick. I don't mind people making a living, but I was spending over $500 a semester for undergrad Engineering text books. The fundamentals don't change, they just milk the universities to death. - lamiaconfitor, on 07/02/2008, -1/+10Technology. Bitch. That is what. You would have done the same.
- DaDrake, on 07/02/2008, -0/+9Got to disagree. People mostly disagree with the RIAA because of draconian enforcement and harassment without due process. Very few people actually encourage the infringement of other people's right by openly encouraging individuals to distribute a publisher material without permission. If you don't like the product, you have the right not to buy it.... you don't have the right to just take it because you please.
A better step would be two fold. First, open your own NGO book publishing press or work with an existing one; you would be surprise at the number of NGO presses that exist and provide text books for around 12-18 USD. Secondly, work with teachers and students to FORCE universities to accept NGO presses. University will ALWAYS give preference of a textbook if it was written from a phd at that university. Secndly, too many universities made contracts with publishers so they can spend their limited fund elsewhere (you build me a 2 million dollar book store... we sell your books).
The BEST idea for this has been proposed (but not past) in Vermont where state schools (or any federally/state funded school) would be forbidden to make "press contracts". Therefore, the educator will choose what publisher to go to, and teachers generally care about their students. - Kosher1947, on 07/02/2008, -0/+9To clarify. I am annoyed at the racket that develops around textbooks. I can justify in my mind buying an expensive book, and even one that I will only use for a single semester. What I can't get past is certain schools (larger ones) constantly using new editions that force students to have to pay full price.
There is no excuse for a math book to need a new edition every year. Do the basics of Algebra change that often? I just think certain colleges take advantage. For example my college rents textbooks, and because they eat the cost...we don't update our texts everytime the company decides to change the illustration on page 45.
So no I am not about stealing, but this is happening because of a larger issue. If schools would actually stick with a textbook for awhile then this wouldn't happen. I personally don't like being forced to spend the money on a new edition that the only change was the font size. Seriously, I have a lifetime wellness book and a Biology book that I compared to the "new" edition and the only change was the damn cover and the freaking font size. That is complete *****. - Ducttape21, on 07/02/2008, -2/+11Because they realize they're being cheated and are finding ways to cut through the crap maybe?
- hd95, on 07/02/2008, -0/+9i once paid $80 for a text book the professor said was required. The book was very small, highly specialized, no resale value and the a-hole didn't pull anything from the book for the entire semester.
- deadowl, on 07/02/2008, -0/+9Textbook Torrents doesn't offer torrents of the textbooks I need, at all. Google actually gives me better results. Having the professor put a copy on reserve at the library is key though.
- nonks, on 07/02/2008, -2/+9greedy bastards the lot of them...what's mine is yours and whats yours is mine...whether you like it or not
- Karai, on 07/02/2008, -0/+7tl;dr - ***** text book companies and their attempts to get very rick off of students who can barely afford to eat, let alone spend hundreds (if not thousands) on text books EVERY SEMESTER!
What really pisses me off is a lot of companies who offer digital text books in PDF charge the exact same price as their paper text book. You would think they would at least cut the cost of publishing for you to give you more incentive to buy. I wouldn't mind spending $40 on a PDF instead of $80 on a hard cover text book. But since the digital is also $80, ***** that, if I can find my text books this September, I'm downloading every single one of them.
And as the original comment suggested, pumping out a new revision of the same ***** book every year should be illegal. They expect people to pay for their books yet they charge the same price for every revision and there is no way to "upgrade" a text book. At least with a PDF you could set up a system to allow users to get free updates and revisions or something, but having to buy brand new text books every generation instead of selling your old books to new students is really annoying and just a huge rip off to everyone. ***** that, they aren't going to get my money unless I have absolutely no other option. - DavidThaGnome, on 07/02/2008, -0/+7Ah yes, exactly what this country needs. A bunch of copyright thugs masquerading as the law, hell bent on robbing citizens, students, all at educations expense. I'm sorry but is the RIAA affiliated with Al Qaeda? If not I think we found the real terrorists.
- dupeduperson, on 07/02/2008, -1/+7I am a college professor, and I think this whole book thing is getting out of hand. The publishers keep raising prices to compensate for used book sales. This makes people buy more used books. The cycle continues. Really, they need to find a new model that works for everyone. Maybe they could find a win-win-win situation.
PS - I still want to write a textbook, but maybe it will just be free and online, but would any other prof use it? (probably not) - reed311, on 07/02/2008, -0/+5Just because you can't afford something, doesn't mean you are entitled to steal it. We've all been through college and had to pay thousands in textbooks. It's a rite of passage.
And to the person who said it is "forced" upon people. No one is forced to go to college, therefore no one is forced to buy textbooks. If you want a decent job, that's just the price you have to pay for. You'll learn pretty quickly, if you haven't already, that everything in life comes at a price. - drgirlfriend, on 07/02/2008, -0/+5My douche school tried this ***** too; then one day I happened upon a not-so-easily-accessible part of Pearson's website that lists all of their custom packages and the actual ISBNs for the contents. Bought book on amazon, then paid small subscription fee for the interactive website stuff....hundreds of dollars saved.
- NCg8r, on 07/02/2008, -1/+6Was it written by said Professor? Probably...
- fmasterdragon, on 07/02/2008, -0/+4I'll let all of you folks in on a little secret that saved me and my classmates hundreds this semester, India.
International editions of most math/engineering texts are available on eBay for about $30 or so. They are usually softcover and in black and white, but for courses you'll only be taking once it's a God-send. - lamiaconfitor, on 07/02/2008, -0/+43 years later then I expected.
- Slothapotamus, on 07/02/2008, -1/+5University texbooks are stupidly overpriced and the authors/publishers insist on writing new editions every year to cash in on the new crop of students. If you want to make a small fortune, write a University textbook and add a new paragraph every year for the next edition so the old edition is redundant. I would have to spent £250-£300 on books (each costing between £35-£50) every year at Uni and it sucked. If torrenting textbooks had been available when I was a student I probably would have done it and saved my paltry grant on other needs, like beer.
- prgmctan, on 07/02/2008, -0/+4Maybe you should spend more money on dictionaries. Look up verbatim first.
- PopcornDave, on 07/02/2008, -0/+4So why not just sell them at half price to the incoming students? Screw the school and the bookstore at the same time.
- inactive, on 07/02/2008, -2/+6Thank you, RIAA & Friends, another fine resource to add to my collection. Digg this everyone, so more people will know about the site.
- lamiaconfitor, on 07/02/2008, -0/+3*busts through brick wall...*
- DangerMouse9, on 07/02/2008, -3/+6You don't want arstechnica to get too much attention?
- winmywii, on 07/02/2008, -1/+4"THERE IS A MASSIVE DIFFERENCE HERE, and it is amusing that you can't get that."
This is digg, are you really surprised? I agree with you 100% though. The school I went to had custom edition of every book. - ZachSka87, on 07/02/2008, -0/+3I agree. Expensive textbooks ARE frustrating.
- jawmaster, on 07/02/2008, -0/+3In engineering classes usually, you don't get that luxury, because by then you're too far behind if you find out you failed the first quiz. But I totally agree with this as far as liberal arts classes go. In fact, I took a course on Ancient Egypt, and everyone who studied from the textbook messed up horribly on the tests (which were only on the teacher's lectures).
EDIT: This strategy also doesn't work if you have teachers who are anal retentive about giving out problems from the textbook in their homework.
2nd EDIT: And believe it or not, there are also teachers who give quizzes on the very first day. *holds fist up in fury* Dr. KHANNNNNNNN!!!! - hapax, on 07/02/2008, -0/+3How about someone comes up with some kind of diff package? Would contain:
- What was added
- What was removed
- Something to calculate new page numbers and chapters (so this would most likely be software)
This could be on some Wiki site so people could cooperatively fill it out for lots of different textbooks. - RoshanK, on 07/03/2008, -0/+3thats where craigslist and facebook marketplace come in handy. it would be a win win situation for you and the buyer.
- Twee, on 07/02/2008, -0/+2I try to buy my books used off of eBay's half.com, and when I'm done with it I re-sell it on half.com and make back almost the entire amount I spent on the book in the first place.
- mozert, on 07/02/2008, -1/+3Oh Yeah!
- e2superman, on 07/02/2008, -0/+2I agree. When I was in Singapore NUS (National University of Singapore) sold the same books I bought in the US for 1/4 the cost. They were soft paper cover but identical otherwise. With EBay I am not suprised you can buy them online from overseas for cheap :). Good call.
- hakluytbean, on 07/02/2008, -0/+2http://www.binsearch.info/browse.php?bg=alt.binari ...
- Uzael, on 07/02/2008, -0/+2Textbooks are getting more and more expensive and it's one of those things that students always struggle with. In Canada (at least at my university), we had to not only buy textbooks - we also had to buy course packs. I think someone else mentioned this here. The course packs are just spiral bound photocopies of articles and often cost close to $100 each. That, combined with the fact that the Profs tell us we need to have the newest edition of the texts, make it hard to think about buying used textbooks from last year.
- Kraken2003, on 07/02/2008, -0/+2What is even worse is that the "interactive content" you spoke of is usually restricted to a single student. So even if you BUY the textbook used, you still have to shell out up to 50% of the cost of the new book to be able to do the quizzes/homework worth 20%+ of your grade. In addition, some classes don't even use the book, they just say do problems 1-6 on page 156. If the professor would write out the problems you wouldn't need the book, but since they don't, you have to buy not only the book, but the newest edition because problems 1-6 are what used to be problems 1,5,8,12,14,16. Exact same problems, but different order.
But don't think official electronic media is an answer! The DRM infested crap they try to pawn off on you is even worse than buying the textbook new! Sure it may cost half as much, but there is no resale value, the book stops working after 6 months (seriously), and the book is locked to a single windows install. No, you can't send the PDF to your PDA or laptop for on the go viewing, and you can't even use the book if you have to reinstall Windows.
Textbook companies can die. They are way worse than the RIAA/MPAA because you can abstain from entertainment, but you can't avoid textbooks; not if you want to pass the class. -
Show 51 - 86 of 86 discussions
The Digg Toolbar for Firefox lets you Digg, submit content, and keep track of Digg even when you're not on the Digg site. Download the official 
© Digg Inc. 2009
— Content created and posted by Digg users is