What is Digg?174 Comments
- reedreeder, on 10/12/2007, -3/+60The problem with HD movies is that a huge chunk of the general public thinks that DVD quality is fine. So it will be really hard to tell which format will come out on top, as most people just don't care.
- datagod, on 10/12/2007, -7/+61At this stage of the game, isn't it quite obvious that the physical format should have no bearing on the movies we watch?
HD-DVD, BlueRay, HardDisk, Satellite transmission, etc.....
Who cares about the medium? I just want hi-def content. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -14/+50I boycotted sony when I found out that they were installing spyware with their music. ***** em!
- xXShadowstormXx, on 10/12/2007, -6/+33"HD-DVD has a more positive “buzz” than Sony’s Blu-Ray, because of the string of failed formats."
Well obviously.
Sony's got this addiction. It's called proprietary formats. They really need to get rid of this mentality. - ninjasquirrel, on 10/12/2007, -12/+36I think that the operative word in the original post was "care", not "notice". I can see the difference between SD and HD, but I really can't be bothered with the extra cost in both equipment and media to get it set up.
Not to mention that I'd really, really like Sony to lose. - RichPowers, on 10/12/2007, -5/+27HD DVD has more buzz because it's intuitive: HD + DVD = high definition DVD movie.
Blu-Ray, unless you read about it, gets a what the *****? response. - joaob, on 10/12/2007, -4/+24HD-DVD is naturally going to appeal to the average customer simply because of the DVD in HD-DVD.
"what the ***** is blu-ray?" - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -6/+21HD DVD isn't proprietary?
- Dominatus, on 10/12/2007, -0/+15Can people PLEASE stop referring to blu-ray as proprietary as if HD-DVD wasn't. HD-DVD is just, in every single essence and spirit of the word...proprietary.
- Shorties, on 10/12/2007, -3/+17I didn't really care about the rootkits when I heard about them, but I sure as hell was ready to boycott Sony when they ***** did it to me. And to come to think of it, I don't think I have purchased a Sony product since then, and I don't really plan to.
- xerodeth, on 10/12/2007, -4/+18Thats when all this anti-Sony mentality started! Hope they fail!
- superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -14/+27They did, that's exactly why Blu-Ray is a large consortium.
Unlike Betamax, which Sony tried to control utterly, and had shorter video length - we not have Blu-Ray, which is run by a large group of companies including Apple, Dell, Disney, and other studios/electronics makers.
To add to that, also unlike Betamax, Blu-Ray offers more storage and thus more content per-disc. Both formats support exactly the same codecs so Blu-Ray offers you the ability to simply store more video using the same compression.
HD-DVD is the betamax of this round, as it's Microsoft's attempt to get people to pay them more for every player sold (they already earn some money from Blu-Ray because it includes one of the Microsoft codecs, but HD-DVD gains them more because it also includes a Microsoft menuing language the makers have to pay royalties on). - Muyoso, on 10/12/2007, -3/+15Just imagine a Sony laptop with a Blu-ray drive. You would have the wonder of the Sony battery with the grandness of rootkits invading your system.
- Microdot, on 10/12/2007, -0/+12but that would mean that sony didnt suck as bad. you are not allowed to think like that on digg. didnt you get the memo?
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -4/+15lame, one sided article
average joe who bought this brand new TV for football games hasn't researched the history of sony - SIDSI, on 10/12/2007, -0/+10I watch movies on a piece of vribrating string and a projector, like on that one episode of Mr Wizard.
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -2/+12TheDarkcyde:
That's not a fair comparison.
What if two new Operating Systems come out, one is called HD Windows and the other one is called blu-ray. Which do you think they'll be more comfortable with and purchase?
The DVD portion of HD-DVD is already burned into people's conscious HD-DVD seems like a natural extension to that, while blue-ray seems like something totally new, yet it's still a dsic, which isn't new enough to get people excited -- to overcome the name difference.
That's my 2 cents, anyhow. - WiseWeasel, on 10/12/2007, -3/+13Agreed. I boycotted Sony with the rootkit fiasco, and I will not buy another Sony product until they get new management that actually answers to their customers, and not to their media division. Their customer-hostile attitude has pushed me to look elsewhere for all my electronics hardware. Funny thing is, other manufacturers make better, more useful products, for better value, so it's been a win-win for me.
- superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -11/+21Which sense is that? It can't be the sense of smell, because your argument stinks.
Blu-Ray is directed by a great big group of companies, including Sony and Apple and Dell and Disney and other studios and electronics makers.
HD-DVD is primarily run by Universal and Microsoft.
It's funny how people seem upset that Microsoft is giving money to Universal for every Zune sold, but have no problem handing over net gen media to the two of them.
Both support the same codecs, and the same protection system (AACS) so neither one is better than the other in all the ways that "proprietary" matters. - Four20, on 10/12/2007, -2/+11see that's my beef
i love watching movies and tv too. . .but i DONT have the money to put 3000 into just a tv set
and i've looked at the smaller ones. i they're like 500 for a tv that cost me 175 normally(the 32 inch ones)
i was recently let go and now am making a LOT less than i was. 500 is like a whole months salary right now, unlike before when it could get 2 of those tvs with one 15 day pay check. - kingfoot, on 10/12/2007, -6/+15is it impossible for people to sit back, and chill for a bit and see what is really going to happen instead of posting ***** articles and causing nothing but headaches for many people?
- Microdot, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9"I despise Sony for the way they are always trying to invent a new technology to force feed to uneducated consumers"
HIIIIIIILARIOUS!!!! hahahahahaha
damn mercedes for making that new cls and trying to force feed me a new car.
damn toshiba for creating a new proprietary format in hd-dvd and trying to force feed it to me.
its called progression. maybe you should go back to an abacus. - theflavor, on 10/12/2007, -1/+9@Shorties
Actually the original Betamax was only able to hold 1 hour of video, thus hindering it from making it into the retail video market
This time HD-DVD has the size constraint. - DeadPenguin, on 10/12/2007, -2/+10I guess you can make up anything and have it hit the front page as long as it follows the formula-
Sony Suxx
Bush Suxx
Macs rule
Try Linux
My First time with Ubuntu....
Agree- most of the general public doesn't care.
Who outside of the early adopters are going to spend $500 - $1000+ dollars on an HD player when they are perfectly happy with DVD? - zetsurin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+8Exactly. Also in other news, have you heard that the Wii has already 'won' the next gen console wars? Yes, I read it on Digg so it must be true.
Heck, the internet population got Snakes On A Plane right. No, wait. - inactive, on 10/12/2007, -5/+13Sometimes, sometimes I think Digg is just a bad rumor mill. I know that Digg isn't reputable news in the least, but all the "BlueRay officially dead" threads are probably a little too soon no? oh well, if it helps sell a few more HD players it's worth it right!
- superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -6/+14Even on price HD-DVD has future problems - Blu-Ray just looks expensive now because it's just ramping up. But what Sony including Blu-Ray in every PS3 and making games come on Blu-Ray discs does, is lowers costs much faster. After all disc manufacturing factories don't care if they are making discs to be used in games. movies, or blank media - volume is volume. So in not too long a timespan, Blu-Ray players and media (including blank media) should be pretty cheap.
HD-DVD does not have any one maker that's running the same kind of volume Sony is with Blu-Ray, so they cannot reduce costs as quickly. At some point the price curves will cross, and Blu-Ray will be the cheaper format.
Just consider an example of that, say with disc costs - right now you have what - 120 movie titles in HD-DVD? And let's say 200k HD-DVD players, though I think that's optimistic.
Well then, you have around 110 Blu-Ray movies. But, you also have something like fifteen games out now, each of which (including the inexcusably poor Gundam title) is going to be pressed on discs, eventually by the millions (well, perhaps not Gundam). And of course new games (and movies) will be coming out on Blu-Ray discs every week - just from the game volume alone going forward, Blu-Ray will have twice as many new discs being pressed each week and the game discs should be manufactured in greater numbers as there will be a lot more PS3's than HD-DVD players for the foreseeable future. Do you see how this is a wave of cost efficiency that is difficult to overcome? When even a title like Gundam is making Blu-Ray cheaper just by existing, that is a powerful economic engine indeed.
if Microsoft had included an HD-DVD player in every 360, I would agree HD-DVD would win because it has a cheaper starting point and both would reduce costs of players and media at about the same rate. But again because of the economics of the whole situation, Blu-Ray has a real edge until Microsoft decides to more fully commit to the format (and that would include not only an HD-DVD player in the 360, but also games on HD-DVD). - willywalloo, on 10/12/2007, -0/+7Well blu-ray players are around 600 $ (samsung blu-ray, amazon.com), while HD-DVD players are about 100 $ cheaper (excluding the X-Box 360 + HD-DVD = 399 + 250, but you get other features).
So really, nothing there to push it in one direction or another. The biggest thing for me is the idea that Blu-Ray and HD-DVD have a large memory size gap. The B-ray is rated at 50GB, while the HD-DVD is at 25-30GB. If Americans will continue to choose only what they need now and not for the future, the obvious choice is the HD-DVD. Who needs an extra 25GB? (not dumbasses, that's who- meaning: that smart people will choose the larger format)
So we go into politics/economics; because rest assured everything must end up there somehow. With economics, it's what the consumers want. What they want is more marketing. It doesn't even really matter how shiny that product is. (Though the iPod is pretty shiny- many products that are marketed heavily aren't glorious, but just work > aka VHS vs. Beta - Beta was clearly the better form boasting a more compact cassette, with more lines of resolution; a Sony Product--maybe there's more to be said here.) As for which groups of people will want what, the smart ones may think that they will be able to back up all of their hard drive onto Blu-ray, where as on HD-DVD you'll only get that half the time. I'm speaking generally and looking towards the future.
Microsoft has it's hands in both formats via it's VC-1 codec, but only officially supports HD-DVD. Why is this? Why can't these expensive 500 $ players support both formats? Is there this much ignorance? I don't think so, and my bet is that some genious/idiot will finally realize that making redundant HD-DVD/Blu-ray discs of the same movie is frivolous and thick headed. Politics around the internet say that both formats are open and are supported by different companies. I'm going to have to say that if companies were smart, they'd stick with Blu-ray.
Commercially speaking and right now when someone says HD-DVD vs. Blu-ray all I hear is : HD-DVD (only 25-30GB: for a half-assed solution) vs. Blu-ray( 50GB! : ya, now that's worth upgrading beyond DVD-r's and DVD's for.) What's a 30 GB hard disk now a days? They are crap. With Blu-ray's potential for going from 50 GB to 100 GB in (in quad-layer) you could store all the extras of a movie and trailors all at the same high-def resolution as the movie is. Today's formatted 7.9 GB DVD's usually poorly encode this stuff to save space. It's pretty rediculous how much space HD content takes up. Let's not go with the crappy solution this time; let's go with Blu-ray for obvious reasons. - CamperBob, on 10/12/2007, -1/+8@superkendall: That's not a valid way to look at it. I don't sell defective products with my father's name on the front panel; if I did, I'd expect a significant ancestral ass-kicking. Sony did exactly that when they included malware on music CDs sold under the Sony label.
When a company puts its logo on a product, it is doing so with the intent of capitalizing on the public reputation, or goodwill, associated with that logo. Since the chairman of Sony failed to address the company's breach of business ethics adequately (committing seppuku with a broken CD would have been a good start, IMHO), I think it's reasonable for consumers to bear a grudge against the company as a whole.
That's why the laptop I bought last week was a Dell D420 instead of the Vaio I actually wanted. I have no reason to expect a square deal from Sony, and neither do you. - spdorsey, on 10/12/2007, -5/+12Say what you want - I know the transition is taking longer, that's why I estimate 10 years from NOW (not 10 years fro 1995, or whenever the "transition" was supposed to start). I think that the timeline is ***** also.
I know that there are a lot of people who are not nearly as interested in high-quality content as I am, but I think that they will all enjoy HD when it becomes more mainstream, and they will all be happy that HD has replaced SD. It's just better, that's all there is to it.
Don't get me wrong, I'd be thrilled if my TV didn't set me back $3000. I really would. But I love movies and TV a lot. When I started watching HD programming, I was so blown away that I decided I would never turn back. Also, I'm typingthis on my Mac Mini which is plugged into my HDTV at 1920x1080. It looks INCREDIBLE. I owuld have never considered surfing the web in my living room - but now it's a viable option because of this new killer TV.
I'm tellin ya, the market is headed in a good direction.
I'm no fan of Sony either, even though I do have a few of their electronics in my home.
I also think that the current quality of DVDs being :fine" is not a "problem" with HD. - SkubaEL, on 10/12/2007, -0/+6People...people... just becuse one sprinter bursts out in front at the start of the race you claim victory? When regular consumers start caring, they are going to the store and see shelf space occupied by Samsung, Sony, Philips, Sharp, LG, Lite-on, and Mitsubishi Blu-ray players, and a couple of Toshiba players....hmmmm....which one are they going to think is more dominant? Choice is the victor. People will pick up an HDTV and then buy a corresponding hi-def player. When all the hardware companies are putting out blu-ray players in force, hd-dvd will drown in the competition. b-b-ut Sony suxx?!? yeah im sure that's whats running through consumers minds. please...
- bbear, on 10/12/2007, -1/+7I bought a 40" HD set and I can tell the difference between HD and DVD movies. The problem is I don't care about the difference enough to buy any HD movies. If they cost the same thing as DVDs I might reconsider but I still won't be repurchasing any of the movies I already own on DVD. DVD quality still looks better than the movie cinema to me. On the other hand gaming in HD seems like a big improvement over SD especially in games where there is a lot of text to read.
- superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6But what if your reasons for wanting it to die are based on inaccurate assumptions and data? Would you be happy killing Sony, to aid in the dominance of Microsoft and Universal as kings of HD media? We all know how they have felt about the consumer and fair use to this point. Meanwhile Sony gets a tremendous about of hatred, even after they do things like include Linux support for the PS3 out of the box!
- keithwired, on 10/12/2007, -1/+6I don't quite recall where exactly I read it (I'm looking for it), but as of right now more movie producers are on-board with blu-ray. I think it was like 3/4 of the hollywood movie producers are adopting Blu-ray as opposed to HD-DVD. It also is going to be influenced by what format the porno industry uses. As it stands the larger porno production companies are favoring blu-ray because of its increased capacity as well as a lot of game producers such as EA game and Vivendi Universal
http://labnol.blogspot.com/2006/05/erotic-film-producers-to-decide-next.html
I hate stupid articles like the one we are commenting on claiming that one side ALREADY won a few months into their relase. The war hasn't even started yet, you can't declare a winner yet, we need to give this a year or two. So stop posting retarded articles claiming one side won already, its like the 3rd one in a few days. Enough is enough - superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -4/+9For people that think no-one cares about HD - open your eyes to the large number of people buying HD sets. I have talked to a lot of people at work who have HD sets, who are by no means videophiles - they aren't usign color adjustment discs or anything, or even using anything but the onboard sound in the larger sets! But they don't care, they LOVE the picture.
This is of course headed by sports fans because you get a really tremendous amount of detail that normal TV does not give you.
Normal people do notice, and like, the extra detail that HD video brings. - xeno439, on 10/12/2007, -2/+7I don't see how because all the new movies coming out for home viewing are followed by "on DVD and Blu-Ray this December" or something to that affect. Talladega Nights is one example.
- MaverickCC, on 10/12/2007, -4/+9If that's all you got ...just digg it down. I'm not trying to be comment police, but no need to be redundant. It just clutters the board.
- drjekelmrhyde, on 10/12/2007, -0/+5maybe they can plug the xbox360's hd-dvd player up to thier ps3
- inactive, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7The problem as I see it with bluray, is that even though the polycarbonate is supposed to be much tougher than what regular DVDs use, the data is something like 0.5mm or less from the surface of the disk, so the tiniest little scratch may have severe consequences on a disk's playability.HD-DVD on the other hand has a much larger amount of protection, the same as SD DVDs, and you've seen how utterly scratched to fuch current DVDs can be and yet still play perfectly.
Its no coincidence Disney are backing bluray. A HUGE amount of their sales come from kiddie movies, and the larger number of damaged and unplayable buray disks out there the better for them because the snotty nosed little brats who damaged the disks in the first place will pester mom and dad relentlessly till they go out and buy a replacement copy of frigging Nemo or whatever the latest crappy pixar happen to be. - bbear, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4@superkendall
I remember reading that one of the advantages of HD-DVD was that the production line was very similar to DVD and used a lot of the same equipment. If a manufacturer wanted to switch their production lines from DVD to HD-DVD it would be easy and affordable to do. If this is true then there are a huge amount of production lines for DVD discs that could be converted to HD-DVD if demand was there. This would negate any cost advantages that Blue Ray gets from being the format of PS3 games. - bigtrouble77, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7The sad thig is, up until about a year ago I was hoping blu-ray would win the battle. It's better technology and much larger capacity. Unfortunately, due to the events Sony has been involved in this past year, there isn't a chance in hell i'd support one of their proprietary formats.
- Dainjah, on 10/12/2007, -3/+7I see just as many if not more for HD-DVD format. Honestly Talledaga Nights is the only movie I can recall being advertised that is coming out for Blu-Ray.
Wait I lied... Little Man is on Blu-Ray too. - spdorsey, on 10/12/2007, -1/+5Four20:
I respectfully disagree. The data capacity on Blu-Ray is much larger (one reason I like it as an archival format), but I doubt that there will be very many games out there that will take up 200GB on a Blu-Ray disc.
http://www.engadget.com/2005/09/19/blu-ray-vs-hd-dvd-state-of-the-s-union-s-division/
The cost of multi-layered But-Ray discs will be higher (prohibiting them in game development circles who are notoriously cheap), and also - who really needs a 700-hour video game? I get tired of them after 100 hours or so if they are really good games, and most finnish before then (halo?)
The blu-ray capacity is higher, but I don't see that impacting game development on the scale that you are implying. HD DVD and Blu-Ray will both be good for gaming because of higher capacity, but I think the comment ends there. - zetsurin, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4It's marketing. There is, however, more to marketing than just a name. This war hasn't even started and both the HD-DVD and Blu-ray camps know this. Be prepared for massive marketing campaigns for both formats in the coming months. Honestly, virtually nobody owns either format.
Don't forget though, the public can learn new terms such as 'MP3' quite easily when it is marketed to them. Blu-ray can be learnt just as easily as DVD once was. - dannylewis, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Whichever format the porn industry backs will win, naturally.
- zetsurin, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6"I despise Sony for the way they are always trying to invent a new technology to force feed to uneducated consumers."
Since when has Sony:
a) Created an operating system called Windows.
b) Locked in all OEM's with predatory pricing and contractual arrangements so that you can't make any other choice for a PC other than the product listed in a).
c) Seek out any competition to take it away from the market by leveraging their new monopoly (that's bad for you by the way).
No, that would be the other company backing the other format. - spdorsey, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6Yeah, that sucks. I was in the same boat last year when my brother bought a 50" 1080p set. I was SO jealous!
But I see the 720p sets coming down a LOT this year. Like some will be WAY under $1000, possibly as cheap as $500. I'd consider a $300 20" LCD for the bedroom, or a dorm room if it was 720p. The video games look incredible on them.
As these cheaper alternatives trickle down (don't confuse some crappy off-brand $800 1024x768 stretched 16x9 40-inch LCD as an alternative - those really are crap), but as these cheaper alternatives trickle down, we'll see a lot of them in people's homes. Not everyone needs 60" TV - many will be happy with a 36" LCD at 720p in their living rooms. Most programming is 720p anyway (cable, satlelite, and some DVDs). - Johannesrexx, on 10/12/2007, -0/+4Yawn,
This must be another Microsoft funded study, ya?
FFS everybody please bury Blu-Ray vs HD-DVD stories. It will not be settled on digg anyway. - Velocity211, on 10/12/2007, -2/+6and i was really hoping for blu-ray to win the format wars, mainly because it can hold so much more than hd-dvd
- superkendall, on 10/12/2007, -3/+6Betamax lost primarily because it had very few companies backing it, and less storage than VHS.
Look at the situation today - Blu-Ray has more studios and electronics makers backing it, and also offers more storage than HD-DVD. There are going to be more Blu-Ray players just like there more VHS players.
You're right to bring up Betamax, but the format you'd naturally assume is the new Betamax has been reversed. -
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