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85 Comments
- zyklon, on 10/02/2008, -5/+38When DRM is in the way, The Pirate Bay saves the day.
- wukillabee, on 10/02/2008, -2/+261 word: Amazon
- l33tmike, on 10/02/2008, -1/+19Is this really news? Didn't we all agree this was the case as soon as DRM was introduced?
- fireashes, on 10/02/2008, -3/+19Because if i buy some song from itunes it wont play in my zune. It only plays in ipods. I am paying for a song but they require me to buy their player too. its like buy one song for 99c in addition to $200 ipod/zune.
- dvsbastard, on 10/02/2008, -1/+16Why?! DRM only affects, restricts and punishes those who are already willing to legally obtain their media...
Those with no intention on legally using / licensing the media will simply bypass the DRM. - arjie, on 10/02/2008, -1/+16The thing is that ways to crack the DRM always exist, so it only hurts the people who actually go legal. Which also reminds me of those anti-piracy videos they play before your DVD begins. What's the bloody point? The people who don't buy the DVD don't get that. Why do they get a better experience?
***** that. - keozen, on 10/02/2008, -5/+20***** DRM
- inactive, on 10/02/2008, -0/+14i feel bad for the non-tech savvy people who bought music from walmart and yahoo. they're screwed now that these two services have abandoned them with locked music.
owning music > renting it (DRM)
down with DRM! - Azerael, on 10/02/2008, -1/+15You're missing the point: DRM does nothing to further that goal, it only pisses of those of us who would like to purchase a game without having it install spyware on our computers that turns our purchase into a rental.
- matx, on 10/02/2008, -2/+13A mp3 file is different to a CD. A CD is a physical medium and requires physical piece of hardware to use it. A mp3 file is not constrained to physical mediums and so it should technically work on any computer or device that supports the mp3 encoding. Apple is just wrapping the mp3 file in drm which makes it incapable for devices to use it.
What I mean, if it is software than it should work on every device you put it on.
It is like when a website designer builds a site but adds code to say that it is not compatible with your web browser. By disabling that code that is stopping you viewing the web page you would see that the website works fine. - MrJ777, on 10/02/2008, -4/+14Why DRM should die? One word: SPORE.
- savocado, on 10/02/2008, -0/+7DRM is evil.
- Jimbeeer, on 10/02/2008, -0/+7I was one of the people that bought Spore, then sent it back sealed and unopened when i learned about the ridiculous DRM protection surrounding it.
That's the point, i WANTED to support the developers of this game. i WANTED to give them my money but i didn't want to jump through EA's hoops.
DRM will always be cracked. In this industry, if you can put on protection, you can take it off. The hackers know this, and you and i know it.
So you have 2 choices, buy the game and have pathetic restrictions imposed on you, or download it for free and have no restrictions.
I bought a few albums from iTunes as i really like the artist, and they don't get the recognition they deserve. But due to the DRM imposed on the mp3's by Apple, i couldn't move the songs onto my new iPhone. So i download them from torrents and now i can put them anywhere. I've already paid for them but i can't do what i want to do with them. Is that right? No, of course it's not. And because i downloaded torrents it makes me a criminal in the eyes of the RIAA.
It's like buying a car that only YOU are allowed to drive, at certain times of the day, in a certain way, and only in your home country. Or someone down a back alley will give you a car for free, that anyone can drive, you can freely do whatever the hell you want with it.
DRM doesn't work. Surely these people must see it by now. Surely EA must realise this? - inactive, on 10/02/2008, -0/+6One thing I would like to say here is TCPA (Trusted Computing Platform Alliance). Don't be fooled into thinking DRM is the only evil out there. This article mentions rootkits, and with good reason. Sony, if you remember, was taken to court over their usage of such measures; but you need to examine why.
Sony, like other companies, know there are major vulnerabilities in their hard-coded security measures. And as a result, they tried to implement software to prevent any client side attacks on their software. They actually implemented what is essentially a hacking methodology to control user activities.
This is of course completely unacceptable. However, it was only a precursor to what could happen. Trusted Computing has already found it way into various computers under the guise of "added" security. But it is a stepping stone for a hardware reinforcement of copyright laws. It's current form is no longer "as" controversial, but everyone worried about DRM, hell anyone who uses a computer, need to study TCPA.
Here are some links explaining:
http://www.lafkon.net/tc/ http://www.eff.org/wp/meditations-trusted-computin ... http://www.eff.org/wp/trusted-computing-promise-an ... http://domino.research.ibm.com/comm/research_proje ...
Just as a shocker, here are the companies who make up the Trusted Computing Group:
https://www.trustedcomputinggroup.org/about/member ...
Promoter
* AMD
* Fujitsu Limited
* Hewlett-Packard
* IBM
* Infineon
* Intel Corporation
* Lenovo Holdings Limited
* Microsoft
* Seagate Technology
* Sun Microsystems, Inc.
* Wave Systems
Contributor
* American Megatrends, Inc.
* Aruba Networks
* Atmel
* AuthenTec, Inc.
* Broadcom Corporation
* BSI
* Certicom Corp.
* Cinterion Wireless Modules GmbH
* Citrix Systems, Inc
* Decru
* Dell, Inc.
* DPHI, Inc.
* Emulex Corporation
* Enterasys Networks
* Ericsson Mobile Platforms AB
* ETRI
* Extreme Networks
* France Telecom Group
* Freescale Semiconductor
* Fuji Xerox
* Fujitsu Siemens Computers
* Gemalto NV
* General Dynamics C4 Systems
* Giesecke & Devrient
* Green Hills Software, Inc.
* HID Global
* Hitachi, Ltd.
* Huawei Technologies Co., Ltd.
* Infoblox
* Insyde Software Corp.
* InterDigital Communications, LLC
* ITE Tech Inc.
* Juniper Networks, Inc.
* Lancope, Inc.
* Lexar Media, Inc.
* Lexmark International
* LSI Corporation
* Marvell Semiconductor, Inc.
* McAfee, Inc.
* Mobile Armor, Inc.
* nCipher
* NEC
* Nokia
* Nokia Siemens Networks GmbH & Co. KG
* Nortel
* NTRU Cryptosystems, Inc.
* NVIDIA
* NXP Semiconductors
* Oxford Semiconductor
* Panasonic
* Phoenix
* PMC-Sierra
* Renesas Technology Corp.
* Ricoh Company LTD
* RSA, The Security Division of EMC
* Samsung Electronics Co.
* SanDisk Corporation
* SMSC
* Sony Corporation
* Spansion LLC
* STEC
* StillSecure
* STMicroelectronics
* Symantec
* Symbian Ltd
* The Boeing Company
* Toshiba Corporation
* Trapeze Networks, Inc.
* Unisys
* UPEK, Inc.
* Utimaco Safeware AG
* VMware, Inc.
* Vodafone Group Services LTD
* Western Digital
Adopter
* AltEll Ltd.
* Apani Networks
* ArcSight, Inc.
* AUCONET GmbH
* Avenda Systems
* BigFix Inc.
* Bioscrypt Inc.
* Bit9, Inc.
* Blue Ridge Networks
* BlueCat Networks
* BlueRISC, Inc.
* Bradford Networks
* CMS Products
* ConSentry Networks
* CPR Tools, Inc.
* Credant Technologies
* Cryptomathic Ltd.
* CryptoMill Technologies LTD
* ForeScout Technologies
* Great Bay Software, Inc
* Hangzhou Synochip Technology Co., Ltd.
* High Density Devices
* Hirsch Electronics
* ICT Economic Impact, Ltd.
* Identity Engines
* IDEX ASA
* Insight International Corp
* Link-A-Media Devices
* Lockdown Networks
* Lumeta Corporation
* Mazu Networks
* Mirage Networks
* MoSys, Inc.
* Motorola Inc.
* Nanjing Byosoft, Ltd.
* nSolutions, Inc.
* Nuvoton Technology
* Penza Research Electrotechnical Institute (FGUP "PNIEI")
* Q1 Labs
* Rohati Systems
* SafeBoot
* Safend LTD.
* Shavlik Technologies, LLC
* SignaCert, Inc.
* SkyRecon Systems
* Softex, Inc.
* Stonewood Electronics Ltd.
* Thales Communication
* Trust Digital
* ULINK Technology Inc.
* UNETsystem
* Valicore Technologies, Inc.
* ViaSat, Inc.
* Vormetric Inc.
* WinMagic Inc - inactive, on 10/02/2008, -0/+6DRM should be forgotten because it never has, and never will work. Not to mention is is also a flagrant violation of our consumer rights.
When I got to the store an buy something, it is mine. If I buy certain music etc online, we are basically renting it.
Face it, if I want something for real, I will buy it. If if feed us garbage, expect the suckers to pay for it who dont know any better, the rest of us will go to Pirate Bay or similar to get our cleaned copies. - RandomLife, on 10/02/2008, -0/+6I actually bought Spore first day it came out. I did not even know about SecuROM until I saw the hidden folder in my computer and started investigating. I asked EA why they hidden it, not even mentioning it in the T&S that I had to agree to.
Last Friday, my HD fried and I decided not to re-contaminate my computer. I downloaded Spore without the DRM and will try and re-sell my copy.
That's what DRM gets you. - captainstumpy, on 10/02/2008, -0/+5Yet isn't DRM sort of piracy in and of itself? If I buy a product, common sense tells me that it should be _mine_. Nobody should be able to tell me what I can use that product on/with or how many times I can use it. If you're going to paint it black and white I'd rather be an avid supporter of piracy (where things hold actual value) than a supporter of DRM (where value and ownership are inconsistent blurs corresponding to various distributors).
- bincoder, on 10/02/2008, -0/+5Or peeps could do like I did and mod their things (like my car radio/cd player) to accept and play plain old fashioned DRM free mp3 files.
A little solder, a little google, some wire. Problem solved.
No DRM for me.
And I could care less how 'the industry' feels about it.
They can pry my soldering iron from my cold, dead hands when hell freezes over. - inactive, on 10/02/2008, -0/+5As enough are paying for it still evidently, it needs said again
- FredFredrickson, on 10/02/2008, -0/+4I switched over to Amazon a while back - growing library, fast downloads, and best of all - no DRM.
- DeathfireD, on 10/02/2008, -2/+6...except CD is the standard for selling music and tape is not anymore. There is no standard MP3 player therefor itunes should allow other player support. But realistically speaking that wont ever happen since Mac wants to make money and I don't blame them.
- Geft, on 10/02/2008, -0/+4Agreed. They should have chosen to provide incentives for paying users.
- l33tmike, on 10/02/2008, -1/+5No - it only makes piracy one step easier - i.e. no encoding from DRM to non DRM / physical media to datafile
- NJank, on 10/02/2008, -0/+4as a follow-up:
DRM is a business choice akin to that use of the proprietary socket. They choose to put it on the item and limit the choices of the consumer. It is then the consumer's choice whether or not to buy the item and lock themselves into the limited option set. Now, the item may be very high quality (technical, usability, etc.) and that quality is enough to convince a large market share to buy into the lock-in model. Sure, some people will figure out how to make an adapter for that socket, or rip out the socket and solder on their own standard friendly socket, but the majority won't.
What's really fun is when the company gets enough clout to declare all socket adapters/replacements illegal. Then, you've broken the free market model. - dekuscrub, on 10/02/2008, -0/+4Consumers will always gravitate towards the better product. The DRM infested material is a crippled version of what people want.
Free/illegal downloads actually give people a SUPERIOR product (no DRM). This is what the RIAA/MPAA doesn't understand. It's not just about "free." It's about the quality of the product. - Bertitude, on 10/02/2008, -0/+4indeed. DRM serves to cause the regular non-techie joes who drop their Ipod in the toilet on tuesday and pick up that nice Zune thing friday to have a cow because their stuff won't play.
There is another article on how much the publishers (ie people who produce the product) get paid. they still get nothing 9 out of every 99 cents the rest goes into labels and itunes.
Question tho if there were no labels in between artists and itunes what would the artists/publishers earn - mithrasinvictus, on 10/02/2008, -0/+4Its like those annoying anti piracy messages you have to sit through each time you want to watch a movie. It only bothers legitimate consumers, pirates get the version without all that crap.
With software, the bundled copy protection, in many ways, acts like spyware with the same security and stability risks to your system. - inactive, on 10/02/2008, -0/+4Yes, but Spore is a huge example of what DRM can lead to.
- abbathdoom, on 10/02/2008, -0/+4I think the biggest issue with DRM is that the pirate version is actually the superior version. It's not like back in the old days were a bootleg video tape probably wasn't going to be as good as a proper video, now if you get the genuine article then you are getting the inferior product. Legalities aside, these corporations need to realise that consumers are only going to pay for the genuine article if its the better product.
- mithrasinvictus, on 10/02/2008, -1/+4I'll give you the "try before you buy" argument but napster and everything since have become successful because there was demand for easily accessible digital music while the RIAA did everything in their power to prevent that. (mainly because they wanted us to keep buying the overpriced album cd's padded with crap songs)
Their luddite response made piracy into what it is today, now they have to compete with it. (competing on price is impossible so they should at least try to make it as user friendly) - mithrasinvictus, on 10/02/2008, -0/+3For software:
I have no problem with typing in a serial number or plugging in a USB key. But when they install software that secretly runs in the background or limits the amount of hardware i can purchase while using the software they have clearly overstepped their limit.
For music:
All the songs are already out there for anyone to download so DRM is pointless to protect copyright, it only protects apple and microsoft's device market. If the RIAA had started selling mp3 songs for a reasonable price back in the napster time there would be much less piracy today.
For both:
DRM can and will always be cracked. All the money wasted on DRM increases the price and hassle for the consumer and makes pirating even more appealing. - matx, on 10/02/2008, -1/+4What if you invented a new kind of hard drive. However it does not making any improvements on any other hard drive on the market today. All you did was put your own proprietary socket on the back.
Then, you said to those who bought your hard drive, they had to buy your cables, motherboard, ram, etc to use this hard drive.
Then, your company goes bust. So those who's bought your hardware can never upgrade or buy any more hardware compatible with the hard drive.
I don't think many people are going to want to buy it.
Same with DRM. If your being force to use certain hardware and software, no one will want it. It already happened with microsoft, yahoo and EA. What if they decide to no longer support the encoding that makes your files work. You would have to rebuy your music again if apple goes bust and you can no longer listen to your music. - Meocross, on 10/02/2008, -0/+3And yet why are they not getting bashed as much as EA/Sony? it is because they know when to back the f*** off.
- TheFuzzyOne, on 10/02/2008, -0/+2And what does DRM have to do with that? DRM doesn't hurt people who get their stuff for free. DRM only hurts the paying customer.
- TheApocalypse, on 10/02/2008, -0/+2For me there is no argument DRM is an attack on the rights of consumers, period. Why?
BECAUSE SOMETHING THAT CAN BE REPRODUCED INFINITELY FOR FREE HAS NO INHERENT MONETARY VALUE!!!
The solution for the labels and the movie studios is to CUT COSTS and be waaaaaay more selective in what products they choose to promote. Most people will pay for a quality product, and the ones that don't were not customers in the first place. What they really should be looking for is control over who and how their content is being distributed, not whether they got their 60 cents on the dollar for Brittney Spears latest single.
DRM free sources of music like Amazon, that offer special content and daily deals is the ONLY way to go when it comes to media. Cut mp3 album prices in half, offering exclusive content and people will go to any legal place you point them. Why? Because the average consumer is far more likely to spend a few bucks on Amazon than give any information to "VIRUSWAITINGTOHAPPEN.COM" when it comes to downloads. - inactive, on 10/02/2008, -0/+2I'll agree they have backed off a bit, but then again they did try to pass legislation. So it's still a serious threat.
- Butterfly9, on 10/02/2008, -1/+3I don't think Pirating will ever stop. where there will there is a way. I will Pirate and keep on Pirating it best way to stick to the man. As much I like sticking to the man, there are a lot content worth the money. I would love give credit the artist. I think the best way is to put something nice like donation button. It would be a lot better then a lock and key.
They should think of it a the same intent as the person that made bit torrent. To help people with free program and data, if you want you can toss a few dollars there way... instead of fighting the idea of free infomation - Technopundit, on 10/02/2008, -0/+2If Steve Jobs is so great, can he eat a carrot big enough to choke himself with?
- savocado, on 10/02/2008, -4/+63 words - download for free!
- rabid3rabbit8, on 10/02/2008, -0/+2The guy above you.
- directrix13, on 10/02/2008, -2/+4Amazon sells DRM free MP3s. It doesn't get any better than that. Provide some proof to your retarded claim, or shut the hell up dude. If they ever did change models or whatever, then Amazon would cease to be a good choice. They are the best choice right now.
- inactive, on 10/02/2008, -0/+2In fact it needs to be said even -- more -- these days. Companies seem to be getting worse with it.
- Fhwqhgads, on 10/02/2008, -1/+3don't feed trolls.
- identitymatrix, on 10/02/2008, -0/+2DRM is bound to fail in the long run. On the internet people take and share and distribute and spread concepts, music, movies, games and all sorts of intellectual works imaginable without hesitation or regard. If someone creates something and it is good or thought provoking or outrageous, it will circulate the internet and become extremely popular in a short amount of time. If your game is the number one on all the torrent sites, that is a sign of huge success - you have touched or influenced thousands of peoples lives. Only crappy and pointless works gets pushed to the side and forgotten.
Once people realize they cannot have a widely popular game/music/movie and have a profit, they will have to make a choice - choose a more lucrative profession, or continue to create/compose because they love what they do. The people that only make games/music/movies for the money *cough EA,RIAA,MPAA cough* will likely lose interest and find some other way to get money from people, while the people who love what they do will continue to create music/games/movies and naturally will be excited when it hits the top of the torrent sites and gets known throughout the world.
Another way of putting it - monetary profits may be nice, but they are short term and in 30 years no one will care about how much money you made. However if your work is good enough to spread throughout the internet your game/music/movie could last forever. - TheFuzzyOne, on 10/02/2008, -0/+1I'm going to save this post, as it's the best explanation of DRM I've ever seen.
- bashfulczar, on 10/02/2008, -0/+1I WANT THAT JACKET WHERE CAN I GET THAT JACKET.
- jbond, on 10/04/2008, -0/+1Just Say No To DRM
m'kay? - inactive, on 10/02/2008, -1/+2@benotago
Digital media is not the same as physical media. Do some research before throwing out these ***** claims.
@Fhwqhgads
Good advice, I'll stop here. - Meocross, on 10/02/2008, -0/+1are you serious? IMEEM.COM!
- svivian, on 10/02/2008, -0/+1I'm glad spore went to the dogs, I never understood the hype behind the "game". It's just an updated version of tamagotchis. Welcome back, 1990's!
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